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Kamen Rider Die watches Masked Rider Ryuki
Hello. Welcome. Alternately, welcome back.
It's been a weird couple weeks without watching Kamen Rider. (Plenty of talking about and thinking about Kamen Rider, though, I wasn't comatose.) I like to take a little break after bingeing a series, to let my brain reset a bit and maybe address some non-watching-Kamen-Rider parts of my life I've let linger. It makes for a strange mental process, that decompression. The first few days, it's like getting outside after being cooped up indoors too long. You're just enjoying the freedom to move around, breathing in the air, not feeling like you've got something to do. It's relaxing, almost liberating. You've got all this time back, and you can apply it towards so many things that you've neglected. Cleaning gets done, projects get tackled, even movies and TV shows you've been putting off can get watched. It's like you found a third day in the weekend. But, there's this turn for me, after the first week. Major stuff is completed, the big stuff I've been putting off. Then, it's just free time ahead until I start up the next series. That free time, though... the reflex is to fill it with watching Kamen Rider. I have to keep forcing myself to do other things, watch other shows, find other distractions. But it's not really choosing to do those things, it's choosing to do those things because I'm not watching Kamen Rider. The time off, it starts to feel like a punishment, that I'm depriving myself of what I want for some unclear reason. Why aren't I watching Kamen Rider? Because I thought I needed a couple weeks off? Why? Why not just one week off? Why am I having this argument with myself when I could be watching Kamen Rider? Well, now I am. Break-time is over, let's get back to work. Let's watch Masked Rider Ryuki. First, some preamble, a little bit of disclaimer, I'll try and make it brief(er than that weird confession about how I've gotten maybe actual addicted to watching Kamen Rider). If you've not read one of these before, my name is Kamen Rider Die, and this is going to be a thread where I watch Masked Rider Ryuki for the first time and talk about it. (There'll also be a one-off thing on my Riderversary, March 16th, it's not a Ryuki thing but it'll probably land here for my convenience.) I've been a Kamen Rider fan for only a couple of years, since 2018, and I've watched Ex-Aid, Amazons, W, OOO, Fourze, Wizard, Gaim, and Drive. I've been on the boards since last September, where I've watched and talked about Ghost, the Ex-Aid movies, Build, Kuuga, and Agito. I really like doing these little discussions, seeing what folks make of these shows. This is all very freeform, I don't want to keep anyone from having fun on the TokuNation boards. I've only really got a few guidelines for these threads: ON SPOILERS FOR ME: The big one. I haven't watched Ryuki before, and I desperately want to enjoy it episode by episode. I get that most people reading this thread will have already seen Ryuki before. (I think of these, sometimes, as like a commentary track. Why would you ever listen to those first?) I ask that you please not talk about stuff that hasn't happened yet for me on the show. Like, don't even hint at things, because then my brain starts expecting things and that sucks. Also, I do plan on watching Faiz through Decade, Zi-O, and Zero-One in the future, so please don't mention anything from those shows. The eventual "Kamen Rider Die watches Whatever” thread thanks you in advance. FOR YOU: Because I'm a hypocrite, I will probably spoil things from shows I've watched before in this thread. If you haven't watched any of the shows I listed in the paragraph a few up from here, consider this a spoiler warning. (Also, man, watch OOO! It's great! You can do it in a couple days because you won't want to stop!) ON TONE SERIOUS ANALYSIS: I will take this show maybe weirdly seriously. I enjoy the action and monsters, I dig the effects and the merchandise, but I love the storytelling. There's always a crazy amount going on under the hood of these shows, and I genuinely lose sleep thinking about some of it. These threads exist mostly because I needed to get all of these Kamen Rider thoughts out of my head so I could live some semblance of a normal adult life. (Or a reasonable facsimile, I got good days and bad y'all.) These posts might get borderline evangelical about what a show is doing right, and occasionally long-winded and unsparing in the criticism when it all goes wrong. Just, like, get ready for me to get weird about themes and motifs and stuff. DONE STUPIDLY: But, I mean, I'm not doing this as a job, I'm doing this for fun, and this is still a superhero show designed to get Japanese children to beg their parents for toys. It's not Infinite Jest or whatever. While I will take this show very seriously, I will take it seriously in some incredibly dumb ways. I will, especially in the early-going, make up stupid names for characters if I can't remember their real names. I will create running jokes about random stuff because it entertains me. I will try to balance scholarly insight with absurdist humor. It's, again, it's going to get weird. I don't know. That's not for everyone, is I guess how I want to warn you. ON PARTICIPATION BE THE ONE: Honestly, these posts are largely intended as conversation starters, jumping-off points. I like to get these thoughts out there, into the world, out of my brain, but the real fun for me is talking about those thoughts with other fans. My thoughts, it's like a first draft of a way to talk about these shows. Everyone jumping in with their thoughts, their analysis, what they found in the show, those are the revisions and notes and improvements that really make something interesting. That's what I love. I love reading what other people think about these shows, so please, if you've got a thought on Ryuki, share it. BE THE LIGHT: I want these threads to be fun and welcoming. If you ever feel like I'm being unfair to this show, or unwelcoming to other fans, please let me know publicly or privately. I don't ever want these things to be a drag on the fandom. I love this fandom! You folks are the best! I think that's everything? It's time, maybe? Time for Masked Rider Ryuki? Let's do it! Ryuki! WE'RE DOING THIS, EVERYBODY! oh also i didn't tell shout factory to pull those original kamen rider episodes just so we'd all have time to talk about ryuki for the next couple of days okay you're just being paranoid https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki00.png |
MASKED RIDER RYUKI EPISODES 1 - 2
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki01.png God damn, that is a show that does a lot right in its first story. What I want out of a first story, the really big thing, is why does this Kamen Rider fight for justice. Specifically, what is this show trying to say about heroism. I'm going to be watching a year-long story about a man (or men, or maybe one woman every ten years or so) dispensing justice through the application of explosive kicking, but the why of it is what keeps me engaged. Every Rider comes at their mission slightly differently, and the shows' themes differ to match them. Like, What The Show Is About to me, it's not that they're doctors, or in high school, or fighting one type of monster or another, it's that they're using monster fights as a metaphor for learning your limitations, or surviving the redefinition that comes with adolescence, or all of the themes that have been applied through Kamen Rider shows. That, like... that's the stuff I wanted to know about Ryuki, not how he gets his powers or what the villains are like. (That stuff was great, though, and I'll get to it.) I loved that Ryuki quickly, cleanly, and smartly put forward what the deal is with Shinji's heroism. Best of all, it's from lessons we see him learn in this story. If Shinji just said Here's My Deal in some clunky exposition, I'd've been disappointed. Having Reiko tell him that investigation isn't about solving mysteries, or acclaim, it's about establishing the truth, about dispelling fear with discovery, that allows the world to build the hero. And then you've got a crying child, immediately followed by Yui saying that it's not that she's trying to save her brother, it's that it's impossible to live with the pain of not having an answer to his disappearance. Taking that idea of investigation, and leveraging it as a way to save lives by putting minds at ease, that's a great way to tie everything from the first two episodes together. There's not this day-job Story A and monster-destroying Story B, it's all thematically linked, it's all About the same thing. And, yeah, it's taking that theme and growing Shinji right in front of us. Shinji's great, by the way. He starts great, and gets better. I love that his first scene is getting decked by a stranger because he's so intent on righting wrongs that he jumps in when he should hang back. I think it's a smart choice, making him a more proactive character, since that separates him from Shouichi in, like, the first second. (I wish, more than anything, that looking at Shinji didn't remind me so much of Spooky Man from Agito. They have the same luxurious head of hair! It's almost all I can see!) Shinji's a goofy, aggressive, leaps-before-he-looks protagonist in the first episode, and I'd've been fine with that if that was where he stayed for a bit. But no, the show's too smart for that, and we just right away get Reiko chastising him for ignoring the human cost of what's going on. He's not a perfect hero, he's not fully-formed, and that's a really nice change from Kuuga and Agito. Those Riders, they were kind-of the thing that didn't change on their shows, the rock that wouldn't move. With Shinji, there's already things he's learning about the world he lives in, the ramifications of actions, the (motif!) ways his choices reflect on himself and others. He's forced to consider new truths, and he's becoming a better hero. I'm excited to see where his journey takes him. That journey, by the way, is going to look gorgeous. I love the Ryuki suit. I think red is always a great choice for Rider suits. Wizard's maybe my favorite base suits, so a heavy red with neutral accents? On board. The grill to the eyes is a nice touch, giving a more battle-ready, less maybe-monster look to the suit. I don't know that I can get more into why it works for me? It's, I kind-of think suit preferences are largely subjective, something that works for you or it doesn't. Ryuki and Knight, they really work for me. They seem easy enough to move around in, and already have a couple color schemes that work with the basic breastplate-and-grill aesthetic. I can see a bunch more designs spinning off of the Ryuki template. All the Mirror World stuff, so good. I laughed when I saw that they just flipped the image in post, that's how they create a reversed world. Hilarious, and brilliant. It's one of those cheap ideas Kamen Rider will have that's so dumb it's smart. You don't need a ton of effects, just shoot it and flip it. Honest to god, I love it. It's spooky and corny all at once, and that's maybe where I want Kamen Rider to live. The only other major thing I wanted to mention, at least of the big stuff from this first story, is that for a franchise that just spent two years intertwining Kamen Riders with the police, sometimes to the degree that it felt like a Kamen Rider was guest-starring in a weekly police procedural, I love that not only is this show about investigative reporters, but that the case they just cracked was about police corruption. I don't know if it was on purpose, but I can totally see a whiteboard from the planning of Ryuki that says NO MORE COP STORIES real big. Still, even if it was by accident, the fact that the first non-cop team we've had in the Heisei era is a group of independent journalists, following the truth without caring what authorities think, that's a statement about where this show wants its storytelling to go. This was fun, this first story. Super solid, all the way around. (Well, the spider CG was, uh, unpleasant to look at, but complaining about that would be like complaining that they said Henshin. It's a part of the franchise!) I really like Shinji as a lead, and I think the supporting crew of Reiko, Yui, and Ren is pretty intriguing. I've been looking forward to Ryuki for a while, and this start did not let me down. Excited to watch more! https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki02.png |
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I've recently come to terms with Ryuki being a series that while very well-made and good at what it does, is just not really for me and what it was saying didn't resonate too well; so I probably won't have an awful lot to say (I tend to only like talking about stuff like this when it's A) something I love or like, or B) Hey Here's This Interesting Production Fun Fact!)
And Ryuki does have a fair few of the latter, but there's actually a lot in these early episodes I genuinely enjoy so I'll be sticking around for a hot second! The big thing I love is very early on so I'll say when you get there, but for now I also felt this was a super strong introduction especially when contrasted against Kuuga and Agito's strong willingness to stick to basics and simplicity. There's hardly anything wrong with that (the fact I love both those shows probably says that I don't think there's anything wrong with that), and in fact I think it's something Kamen Rider tends to do best; but when Kamen Rider isn't doing it it's something that's interesting to look at. And I've got little to add to what you said because you basically summed it up: it just gets right in there, tells you what Shinji and everything else is about, and has some neat subversions with police corruption and all the rest of it! Double super agree on the suits too. Ryuki himself I feel is pretty good but, like, in a 7/10 sort of way? Great aspects but I've seen better main suits. But Knight? Holy Spooky Man that's some top 10 Kamen Rider design material right there! It's like if Batman was a knight but, like, the designer was a god who was able to take two awesome yet incredibly conflicting concepts and make them work together! The colour scheme is on-point for how basic it is; the theming is subtle yet clear; the armour and visor are just so -crisp- and well-balanced in a way that feels like a way better version of Ryuki! I could gush about this design forever, it's just wonderful! |
Oh man. I need to finish watching Ryuki. I've only seen the first few episodes before switching my attention to Mirai Sentai Timeranger. I've heard some good things about it, and I really love the kickass designs. Also, I was born while it was airing, so bonus.
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Ryuki is second only to Build in my ranking, so I'm very excited to see watch it. Ryuki gets off to a fantastic start, all the characters have really strong introductions that give you a clear idea of who they are and what they believe in, what they're fighting for. Shinji, Ren and Yui make an especially strong trio, all balencing each other out. And that's not even getting into the plot. The mystery of the mirror world goes in some crazy directions! Overall, you've got a lot of exciting stuff coming up!
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I saw Dragon Knight on CW. How close did they keep to this show?
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I just... for me, I like the shows where the primary Rider is the second Rider we meet. (Not that I don't like it the other way around; OOO is still my favorite Rider series.) I find it a much easier way to introduce the plot and stakes of the series, to treat the primary Rider as the POV and let him ask all of the questions about the world that the audience would ask, and have another Rider around to answer those questions. It just makes the world feel more fleshed-out, that it wasn't waiting for this one guy for the story to start. Plus, using the primary Rider as the POV, it centers the show more as a Kamen Rider show, not just a show with Kamen Riders in it. And, yeah, Kamen Rider Batman is a great design mandate. I really like how the cape is optional, so the show can deploy it in cinematic moments, but leave it off for fights. Smart! Quote:
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MASKED RIDER RYUKI EPISODE 3
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki03a.png God, it must suck to be Ren at this point in the show. I imagine he's been at this for a bit, partnering with Yui to save people from monsters. But in walks Shinji, falling ass-backwards into this volatile situation, and he's blowing up monsters that had Knight on the ropes, pulling Yui's focus, making demands, and basically establishing himself as The Real Protagonist. How demoralizing must that be, to feel so overshadowed and disregarded? How much would you loathe and resent Shinji's effortless charm, selfless heroism, demigod-like locks, and impenetrable plot armor? Just think about it. God, it must be humiliating and infuriating, all at once. Anway, not what I really wanted to talk about from this one. Just a thought I had rattling around. This was a good post-premiere episode. A little slow, a little exposition-y, but with some fun snap to it. The opening Ryuki/Knight fight was excellent. Trick Vent was awesome, and had a killer mix of practical and special effects. The first part, where the one Knight steps out from behind the other Knight, they shot that flawlessly. (The one shot where you can see the taped-on squib real prominent on Ryuki's chest, a little less laudable!) It's a well-choreographed fight, showing how Knight's experience is more valuable than Ryuki's raw power, and another way the show is focused on building out Ryuki as a hero. Despite what second-paragraph Kamen Rider Die might've said (that guy is the worst), things don't come that easy to Shinji, and he learns through this episode how to be a better monster-exploder thanks to the beating Knight handed him. It's nice to see that dramatized. Shinji has to fight smarter, not harder, to win against the monsters, and that feels sort-of rare in Kamen Rider? I'd like to see it more often, I guess. Speaking of monsters, I really dig the Mirror World setup for the monsters. I think that's a solid hook, the way the monsters are there, but not there. How they can interact with you, but you can't with them. It's a bit modern-day Doctor Who, the way things like reflections are weaponized, how the everyday becomes otherworldly. That's a fun kids-show conceit. It's nice to see more of an emphasis on suits this episode, moving away from the premiere's CG spider. The CG in this series so far, uh... you know, they're trying real hard. Like, the Mirrormovers or whatever, the ride machines, those things look great on set. They look like five pounds of boiled ass during the launch sequence. The computer effects, they do those designs, like, negative favors. Also, man, for how little transporting they do, the show seems in love with Riders getting up out of them. It's like they move about six feet, then it's a half-minute of them slowly being disengaged. Could be wrong, but this feels like the first shot in a war to minimize the riding in Kamen Rider. Plot-wise, yeah, a bit of exposition in this one, not much else that was memorable. (Pacing for this one is weird, in that it's very fight heavy coming off of the premiere with not a lot of dialogue scenes of any weight. Only really realized that in retrospect.) Yui's brother Shiro shows up to Freddy Foreshadowing a vague warning/threat about destroying other Riders, and Yui tells us how she could detect mirror monsters as a kid and that Shiro (maybe?) created the Card Decks. It's not pivotal information, and there's not a lot Yui can do to really ground it emotionally at this point (we just met her!), but the show doesn't overly dwell on it. Mostly, it's nice to not have to see Shiro in a reflective surface for twelve episodes before someone finally tells us who he is. Like the motivation and thematic stuff from the first story, it's nice to lock this down before it gets irritating. So, a solid enough episode. Hit the beats, really delivered on the action, but maybe not enough character interaction for my tastes. https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki03b.png |
So, it has begun. *gets out popcorn from microwave*
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The first "Tatakae!" You'll hear that word quite a bit! I forgot to mention in my first post, but Reiko kicks ass. She's one of my favorite girls in KR.
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OK here we go for the first episodes....BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE! And wow you immediately like Shinji from the beginning....he's kind of quite overlooked among the Rider protagonists.
I want to say that, though Shinji gets the spotlight of his kindness and heroism that he wants to become a Rider to protect people from monsters knowing the reasons between disappearence, I also have to give it to Yui too in this department. Keep in mind this is all when Shinji is a stranger to her, but it's implied maybe she's the one who instructs Ren to take the unconscious Shinji to Atori (her home practically, probably Ren would leave him there otherwise), tried to give him a comfortable and warm atmosphere there (like those smiles), explaining everything necessary she can, and tries to make sure he's safe before leaving even by defying her close friend (Ren); even with him insisting to take on Dragreder, she reminds if Dragreder attacks first, insisting 100% he's safe. Then she didn't really mind to smash the window to save him (or probably just to prevent Ren doing morally questionable things, but then again it still gives her tremendous moral compass points). She gives that much to a stranger, in contrast to...well...her 13 Riders self... I'd like to know what she thinks about Shinji after becoming Rider ("most people wouldn't do that, I'm sure he's..."), but Ren cockblocks that... Also even if Ren is totally a douche next to her, did Ren even realize that he unknowingly helps Shinji out? He asked if he didn't make a contract with a monster yet, told him that even as a Rider he can't last forever in Mirror World, and that he only can return in the place where he entered Mirror World before, and running over to him after he returns. Ryuki is totally a horror. Many have died to a monster throughout the episodes. Being a Rider totally sucks in this world. Stay in Blank form, you are totally powerless. Make a contract with a monster, you're strong enough to fight, but you're in constant threat to your monster who'll eat you if you don't fulfill its requirements. Though I feel that, being a Rider actually can extend your survival in Mirror Monster world at least before more psychotic Riders appear. because you can detect monster presences, henshin and fight back, and even in Blank Form, you can at least escape when being pulled there. I have to wonder how tf Yui and Ren took the unconscious Shinji to Atori tho... His bike seems to only fit with 2 people, and carrying unconscious person as extra?? Quote:
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I'm looking forward to seeing your thoughts on this one. Ryuki was a show that I wasn't too hot on the first time through, but after the second watch it rose a lot in my opinion. It's a good show and in many ways it was the first show that really created a lot of the elements that later Heisei Rider series would adopt.
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I don't think I've mentioned this yet in these threads, but Ryuki was the show I burned through start to finish in a couple weeks while catching up on OOO (which was around halfway through airing at the time), so I consider it my "first" Rider series just as much, if not more. I'll tell you upfront, I adore Ryuki. There's no way I could watch this show and not become immediately hooked on the franchise. Those first episodes in particular are definitely real strong, especially in how they establish Shinji's character.
Going back to Kuuga, Rider shows tend to do this thing where the hero gets to define their mission statement in the second episode, and the way Ryuki does it is wonderful. I love just how active Shinji is in making the choice to become a Rider. He's made more than aware of the danger he's getting into, but he ultimately refuses to walk away from the chance to save people from the Mirror Monsters. It's such a great way to build the audience's respect for his character, who initially seems like nothing but a goofball. One other thing about it I've been telling myself I have to bring up to you if you didn't catch was the specific way Shinji realizes why he can't walk away: Reiko's dialogue about how many people are affected when just one person disappears. That line hangs over the series in ways you won't be able to realize yet, and is something that sticks out a lot more on a rewatch. Something to keep in mind going forward. Or backward, really. Simply framing the stakes of losing a life on such a personal level is just plain neat in its own right, and may or may not make an interesting contrast with the way Kuuga and Agito handled monster casualties? Also, some other thoughts I can't think of a way to connect to each other: - Yes, the designs are great! One particularly cool touch is that elements of the traditional Rider head were spread out among the main Riders, such as Ryuki getting the big bug eyes. The cool thing about that, in turn, is that it visually informs you about the characters' personalities. Riders in Ryuki by and large only have visors, so Ryuki's huge eyes, which are straight up bulging, fit the image of a naive, wide-eyed idealist. He looks a bit friendlier and more heroic. Meanwhile, Knight actually has eyes on his helmet design too, but they're small, and hide so deep within the visor, I straight up didn't notice them for like a dozen episodes back when I watched the show. Which is simultaneously a great contrast, the mystery man with a lot of layers, but also something that implies there's maybe more similarities between the two than there might appear at a glance. Oh, and the suits look cool or whatever, I guess. Yeah, that too. - That CG spider is rough, but I believe it's literally the very first ever instance of Kamen Rider doing an all-CG, big ol' monster like that, so it represents an important step forward for what they could pull off with the special effects, and as such it makes sense they'd want to show that off right in the premiere. I mean, Ryuki and Knight's personal monsters ain't exactly done practically. - One quick thing about the Mirror World scenes. Don't underestimate the importance of that ambient sound! It lends an eerie, otherworldy emptiness to the location, while practically serving to always let the viewer know where they are. It's especially neat whenever the show is cutting back and forth between it and the normal world. |
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Yui is 100% the brains of this outfit. Nothing about Ren tells me he'd be safe running things solo. Also, minor thing. While spoiler text works on the boards, it, uh, it doesn't carry over to notification emails I get. Like, at all. So, uh, maybe we cool it on spoiler text? Thanks! Quote:
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Tell me that them portraying Dragreder like this would not make Ryuki 20% better. |
Just have to say that I’m 13 episodes into this show and so far, I’m NOT enjoying this.
None of the characters are resonating with me at all. Shinji comes off as a very generic guy, REN comes off as an insufferable asshole, ORE Journal strike me as a VERY bad attempt at comic relief (at least Metalder knew to get rid of the bad comic relief when it became clear they weren’t working. Unfortunately, Ore are here for the whole shebang) and I’ll talk about the other characters I have opinions on when they’re introduced. But moving away from my wittering, I think I’ll share this bit of trivia, cribbed from TV Tropes. Quote:
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That paragraph from tvtropes is verging on spoilers. EDIT: well, one spoiler anyhow about the nature of the movie.
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For me, I think there's some interesting shading to the characters that elevates them from stock types. Shinji's role as Kamen Rider Novice is fun to watch, with him getting a little more well-rounded with each episode. Ren, I think the fact that he seems to be a good-natured dismissive asshole is kind of great (like, his rivalry with Shinji seems to almost make him laugh?), and the ORE Journal scenes haven't worn out their welcome with me yet. (Those gags are nowhere near as abysmal and mistimed as the curry shop scenes from Kuuga. That's, like, the low bar any comedy in Kamen Rider has to clear for me to be able to tolerate it.) Sorry that you're having trouble connecting with the characters. Maybe they'll start to work for you soon? Curious how you're enjoying the other parts of the show. To my eye, the fights are lot more dynamic and entertaining than Agito's were. The pacing also seems a little bit more considered, with a decent amount of plot movement already. And, yeah, this show definitely added in a lot of what I consider "modern Kamen Rider". Kuuga was too raw for me to enjoy, and Agito was compelling for how much heart they added to the formula, but Ryuki is very much to my tastes when it comes to Kamen Rider. Thanks for giving your thoughts on it! |
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A hero who was a hopeless everyman with a penchant for obnoxious snoring was so out there after an entire era of cool, reliable big brother types, and two shows straight of seemingly perfect saints. I think you can really tell from the way he's portrayed just how much fun the show was having with the chance to play around with the tropes that come with a character like Shjnji, and I think that makes him still stand out fairly well, no matter how ubiquitous his archetype is. |
MASKED RIDER RYUKI EPISODE 4
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki04a.png https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki04b.png I wish this episode didn't feel so much like it was ticking things off of a checklist. Like, this is totally the Two Riders Join Forces episode. The beats of it are pretty predictable in a superheroes-fight-but-then-team-up way, and I'm not sure the execution feels unique enough, even this early in its establishment as a Kamen Rider Thing. Shinji and Ren start the episode as rivals, and end the episode as two men who intensely dislike each other but probably won't try to kill each other for a little bit. It's an improvement, for sure. I'll give the show credit, in that it's basically the second ever Rider show to have to team up two Riders, so it shouldn't feel as stock as it does, but it's still got too many weird echoes with Agito. There's a little too much of Shinji coming off as a Shouichi-ish I'm Fighting To Protect People And Don't Understand Personal Boundaries, while Ren's repping hard for Ryo's team of Life Is Pain. Shinji's aggression and suspicion is unique, as is Ren's take-charge way of getting Shinji to quit, but it didn't feel like more than the obligatory team-up to me. It played like Mean Rider and Nice Rider had to find some way to work together, and I felt like I just saw a bunch of that in the second half of Agito. Like, I knew the destination, and the journey didn't feel personal enough. It completely doesn't help that Shinji kind-of comes off like an asshole in this one. He immediately assumes that Ren is trying to kill children, despite only having a contract monster for a minute. And he dismisses the There Are Other Monsters theory with a certainty that feels radically unearned. (He's supremely confident in his brand-new abilities. I'm a little shocked he doesn't activate an Um Actually Vent during a fight!) Worse, he goes to Yui and tells her that the man she's fought with is untrustworthy, according to a man she just met yesterday, and he's stunned that she doesn't just go along with it. There's a... maybe there's an innocence, a forthrightness that the show's trying to imbue Shinji with, some way of contrasting him with the taciturn and withholding Ren, but it feels like the show shoots WAY past that to land on Shinji Knows Best About Everything. It's not a good look! Things end fine, though. The scene with Ren and Shinji is the by-nowadays-standard What Are You Fighting For argument Riders have as, like, their way of saying hello. (They also do the Rider Handshake, aka A Punch In The Face.) Ren's a character that has a mysterious but undoubtedly compelling reason to fight and die (and kill?) as a Kamen Rider, while Shinji's still a bit in that questing phase, defining himself more in the moment with his choices, rather than a larger rock-solid ethos. Previously, he was swayed by Reiko and Yui's desperation to get to the truth of all of the disappearances, to help heal the people left behind. Now, it's Ren reminding Shinji that heroism isn't his exclusively, that you can disagree with people who want the same things as you. They end in a good place, pissing each other off and making Yui question letting these two idiots get close to her. That expression of hers when she realizes this is her life now! Priceless. https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki04c.png https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki04d.png |
Androzani: Shinji's generic
Fish: Shinji was fresh Die: Shinji is Agito I just love these threads sometimes |
Oh yeah, Shinji was definitely a bit stupid in that episode with being dead certain that Ren was trying to kill kids and refusing to accept other possibilities. Honestly, Shinji's a bit of an idiot overall. Like Ryuga though, he's a well meaning idiot, and he gets better over time. He's like a big dumb puppy
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That feel when....your supposedly most morally upstanding character....gets called out by their misbehaving (though like how I elaborate from my post from yesterday, I also think Yui is also the most morally upstanding too in the series), like Kiriya lecturing Emu in Ex-Aid. So you also think Shinji's an asshole here for accusing Ren, well I'm kinda someone who will do what Shinji does if someone's that much asshole, like thuggish such as Ren. Also so this is what people mean about "balancing" for the trio, when Ren misbehaves, Yui acts, but when Shinji, the people she defended from him before also misbehaves, she also goes for him. No bias, perfectly balanced, as all things should be. I will also bring out our discussion earlier from the Ghost watch thread which also corresponds well to this moment (as why Yui thinks Shinji is more untrustworthy). Ren's goal is more immediate and personal, while Shinji's seemed less so. With Ren, it's clear what he was fighting for and the lengths he'd go to, there was a clarity to his actions and an energy to the performance that really popped in those early days. Shinji was nice for the sake of being nice, but didn't have a clear agenda, which wasn't as easy to understand. First time Shinji and Yui refer to each other by name, where did they learn that, they never introduced themselves to each other. Probably Shinji hearing Ren calls her, and I guess for Yui, when Shinji gave his ORE Journal card to Ren? Also speaking of hearing someone else's name, how did you miss the RON! RON! RON! moment?!! Another case of Shinji Knows Best About Everything, assumes what he hears is right and going along with it. Quote:
Also Yui already kinda did this in previous episode, just not with them both at once. I'm a bit confused, she says the restaurant is closed, but why they can get in and sip tea and/or eat (dunno if Atori has full lunches, the previous episode only gave cookies)? Quote:
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Mostly, though, I like the stuff with Ren from that story a lot more. The actor makes so many smart decisions. He could go over the top, make it seem like Ren's going to eviscerate Shinji, but there's just this feeling I get that Ren think's it's hilarious how ill-equipped and out-of-his-depth Shinji is. I can see Ren thinking, "Holy shit, this dude is going to get himself immediately killed, I have got to see this." Like, he's annoyed at Shinji while Shinji is slowly winning him over. That chemistry, the grudging acceptance that Ren feels himself doling out, it's so solid. That shit, it's totally earned. I don't at all believe in Shinji's dumb choices in the episode when it comes to Ren, but I completely believe in Ren's change(-ish) of heart. |
Ren and Shinji are two of the best bros in all of Kamen Rider. Like Sento/Banjou tier.
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So honestly, I really liked what Episode 4 did with Shinji because it feels like a natural response someone would do if they're trying to help but had given it zero thought. Maybe the leap to 'the guy kills children' seems a little far, but also Shinji's ran into Ren about... four times by now, and half those times Ren's tried to kill him without remorse, so y'know. Don't think that'd give me the best of definitely-doesn't-kill-children vibes either! He sees a dude that's not just an asshole but an asshole predisposed to murder, and he's not comfortable with someone innocent being around him. He went about it clunkily, but that's what made it so natural to me; this whole episode was just really nice at tackling something ("Ren What The Fuck") that both Shinji and audience would be feeling and dispels those assumptions well. |
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Goddamnit, I knew that quote would get someone defending Shinji in that episode. I just assumed it'd be Fish Sandwich? I guess it says something about where my loyalties lay on the spectrum of Tortured Rider to Earnest Friendly Rider that I didn't see Shinji's side of things so much as I thought he owed Ren a thank you for not killing him every time he had the chance. Ren didn't feel proprietary or cruel in those scenes, he seemed like a dude who wasn't going let some Level 0 jerk-off tell him how to detonate monsters. The joke is, like I posted elsewhere, it's completely in character for Shinji to stick his nose in where it doesn't belong. Like, my goddamn signature image right now! It's about how Shinji can't keep out of other people's business! I just didn't think it came off at all cute or charmingly misguided here. It felt invasive, intrusive. I didn't like that look on Shinji, because I know he means well. This one maybe warranted a stronger response from Yui and/or some legit regret from Shinji. |
I think I will give many thoughts about Ryuki, possibly even for each episode (instead of arc). I think currently this place is the only one to discuss Ryuki currently and the only place to share my thoughts (Not to be attention seeking but I hope most of my thoughts are responded).
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And btw, what I mean for "I also have to give it to Yui too in this department" before is that her kindness and heroism rivals Shinji's, as the topic before was about how Shinji takes spotlight with his heroism, not about how she's smarter/more sensible. Quote:
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MASKED RIDER RYUKI EPISODES 5 - 6
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki05.png I feel like we’re getting into the meat of the season with this story. This is what I was expecting from Ryuki. Cutting to the chase (NOT SORRY), it’s the debut and demise of Kamen Rider Scissors! He’s an interesting antagonist, part savvy operator and part lucky recipient of some terribly misguided optimism from Shinji. Him being a Kamen Rider, it definitely creates a more morally ambiguous landscape, and puts Shinji’s (naive?) belief in Kamen Riders’ intrinsic heroism in a tougher spot. I liked the whole thing Scissors had going on. The twist of him being a cop, of leveraging people’s trust to get away with literal murder, that was a nice choice in a show that already displays a healthy skepticism regarding authority figures. (Goddamn Reiko, with that bullshit “Oh, I always trust the police” when Scissors tells her to stay out of it. She’s the best! Maybe the only smart person in this episode besides Ren!) Scissors has a demeanor that, like Ren’s, makes the whole Rider Battle thing feel more terrifying for how unemotional they are about a duel to the death. I’ve seen people get more worked up over Pokemon battles. These two are just like Oh I Guess It’s Time To See Which Of Us Will Die. Knight attacking Ryuki in the second episode had that same thing, and I really like it. It plays into Shinji’s confusion and anger, that they’d kill one another and not seem to care. I like what Scissors’ arrival (and departure!) means for the show. I like how the simplistic Blow Up Monsters gets complicated by bad Riders and contracts and Shiro’s commands and whatever is waiting at the end of the battle. Shinji’s tried to take a stand for Rider Shall Not Harm Rider, and he’s seen just how untenable that stance is. Other Riders may put his friends in danger to get what they want, and the only way to keep them safe may be by destroying them. It’s not going to be an easy road. We got to see a bit of how each of the two main Riders are going to approach it, to some clever results. Shinji wanted to stop Scissors’ villainy, but didn’t want to kill him. Ren mostly didn’t care about Scissors’ villainy, but did want to kill him. (Neither of them were cool with Scissors’ kidnapping Yui, but A, that was really on Shinji, what was he even thinking volunteering that info to a total stranger I mean there’s trying to make connections and then there’s shit that we teach children are you a child Shinji I thought you were a grown-ass man why would you tell a guy you just fought personal information about people who can’t defend themselves what were you thiiiiinnnkkkkkiiiinnngggg, and B, Scissors’ just walked it off with a mea culpa that was pretty goddamn funny.) The idea of the more experienced Ren being all Kill Riders No Matter What and the powerful but naive Shinji being all Maybe We Don’t Have To Kill Them, there’s a show that that dynamic reminds me of, especially how much I enjoy the mentor character’s dynamic with the series star, but it’s name and who wrote it is totally escaping me right now. So, yeah, strong couple episodes! A little darker, not much jokes in this one, and no one seems to know how to lock a door for some reason (Yui just leaves the tea shop unlocked when she goes off with Scissors?), but it’s a real strong introduction to the part of the show I was maybe most looking forward to. I want to see a bunch of Riders fight and I want to see the star of the show feel super conflicted about that. Pretty into it! Oh, and I know that I was clear on the No Spoilers thing, but I’ve got to know: Is Reiko’s eyepatch a plot point that’ll come back, or some behind-the-scenes thing with the actor? When she’s wearing it at the beginning of this story, I honest-to-god thought I’d missed her get monster-attacked in the last episode. https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki06a.png https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/ryuki/ryuki06b.png |
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