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03-01-2012, 10:25 AM | #21 |
Kawaii 5-0
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Cardiff, United Kingdom
Posts: 12,851
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I won't deny that TV-Nihon need to translate more things in their subs, but arguably some groups should translate less. I had a flick through HON's Dairanger to see if I preferred it over Nihon's, and was instantly put off by the fact Ryuusei-Oh was translated as "Dragon Star King" or whatever.
Okay I get that its Japanese, but at the same time it packs far more of a punch than the English translation. Gurren Lagann probably wouldn't have been as exciting if everyone had been calling it "Crimson Face" all the way through. But it all comes down to preference. The magic of softsubs is that if you don't like something you can just edit it yourself, and TV-N should really embrace that. Its true that the viewer shouldn't HAVE to edit the subs themselves, but its nice to have the option. Its better have the choice of two kinds of subtitles than just being stuck with the one
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03-01-2012, 03:50 PM | #22 |
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Quote:
I won't deny that TV-Nihon need to translate more things in their subs, but arguably some groups should translate less. I had a flick through HON's Dairanger to see if I preferred it over Nihon's, and was instantly put off by the fact Ryuusei-Oh was translated as "Dragon Star King" or whatever.
Okay I get that its Japanese, but at the same time it packs far more of a punch than the English translation. Gurren Lagann probably wouldn't have been as exciting if everyone had been calling it "Crimson Face" all the way through. But it all comes down to preference. The magic of softsubs is that if you don't like something you can just edit it yourself, and TV-N should really embrace that. Its true that the viewer shouldn't HAVE to edit the subs themselves, but its nice to have the option. Its better have the choice of two kinds of subtitles than just being stuck with the one I don't think it has anything to do with being exciting. I think it has to do with how you and others view and hear the Japanese language. Again it comes back to your favorite shows are Japanese, so the Japanese words sound cooler. The problem with that is that translations should be done in order to have a person with ZERO knowledge of the source language, to understand what is being said. "You coffee-tach-sama's with your kisama one sans" doesn't sound cool to me. It's just gibberish. Yeah I know what the Japanese language is, but I should have to pause the show to look up what some random words are that a translator was either to lazy to translate or didn't have the Japanese language knowledge to translate in the first place. If people enjoy half done translations with gaudy karaoke and giant spinning colored letters.. that's great. What ever makes you happy. But IMO, that kind of subbing does a disservice to the shows that we are trying to watch. It becomes more about typesetters showing off and so called translators trying to show how SUPER COOL Japanese words are.. Rather than the show itself. I am really glad the days of anime sub groups having giant group name logos plastered over the shows title.. Well I am glad the majority of anime groups have stopped doing that. Those logo's t-n puts at the start of each show are, IMO, insulting. T-N shouldn't be the focus of those shows. The show, the shows actors, producers etc should be the focus. And one last thing. I tend to agree with you that the viewer shouldn't have to edit a script, but neither should a viewer be forced into pausing a show to look up words that were not translated.
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03-01-2012, 04:05 PM | #23 |
Tokusatsu Hero
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 5,525
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Maybe if I'd started watching these earlier I'd have experienced TVN's problems with not translating words that really should be and be on your side wholeheartedly. But I'm not.
I do agree, though, that the examples you gave present a good argument. All they really do anymore is keep honorifics, which I'm just used to from anime and manga. Yes, that's a complacancy you probably don't agree with, but you'll have to deal with it. But what I can't stand is changing a proper noun - a name of anything is its name no matter where you are. If a sub group changes a mecha's name or god forbid a person's name in their subs ("Brotou"...), they are doing something very wrong. And that's one of the main reasons I don't like some of the other random subs I've looked at in the past year or so I've been actively watching Sentai and Kamen Rider. |
03-01-2012, 05:02 PM | #24 |
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Quote:
Maybe if I'd started watching these earlier I'd have experienced TVN's problems with not translating words that really should be and be on your side wholeheartedly. But I'm not.
I do agree, though, that the examples you gave present a good argument. All they really do anymore is keep honorifics, which I'm just used to from anime and manga. Yes, that's a complacancy you probably don't agree with, but you'll have to deal with it. But what I can't stand is changing a proper noun - a name of anything is its name no matter where you are. If a sub group changes a mecha's name or god forbid a person's name in their subs ("Brotou"...), they are doing something very wrong. And that's one of the main reasons I don't like some of the other random subs I've looked at in the past year or so I've been actively watching Sentai and Kamen Rider.
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http://ultramanknightsgameblog.blogspot.com/ Last edited by Drakkhen; 03-01-2012 at 05:05 PM.. |
03-01-2012, 05:54 PM | #25 |
Kawaii 5-0
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Cardiff, United Kingdom
Posts: 12,851
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Quote:
Don't take this as me attacking your opinion because I'm not, but that part about things sounding better in Japanese.. That IMO is what is holding back subbing. People think that the Japanese language is some how cooler because their favorite shows are in Japanese. The Japanese language is just another language. I mean a lot of us rag on Engrish that the Japanese use in their shows. They think that Engrish sounds cooler, so they use it.
I don't think it has anything to do with being exciting. I think it has to do with how you and others view and hear the Japanese language. Again it comes back to your favorite shows are Japanese, so the Japanese words sound cooler. The problem with that is that translations should be done in order to have a person with ZERO knowledge of the source language, to understand what is being said. "You coffee-tach-sama's with your kisama one sans" doesn't sound cool to me. It's just gibberish. Yeah I know what the Japanese language is, but I should have to pause the show to look up what some random words are that a translator was either to lazy to translate or didn't have the Japanese language knowledge to translate in the first place. Quote:
If people enjoy half done translations with gaudy karaoke and giant spinning colored letters.. that's great. What ever makes you happy. But IMO, that kind of subbing does a disservice to the shows that we are trying to watch. It becomes more about typesetters showing off and so called translators trying to show how SUPER COOL Japanese words are.. Rather than the show itself.
I am really glad the days of anime sub groups having giant group name logos plastered over the shows title.. Well I am glad the majority of anime groups have stopped doing that. Those logo's t-n puts at the start of each show are, IMO, insulting. T-N shouldn't be the focus of those shows. The show, the shows actors, producers etc should be the focus. And one last thing. I tend to agree with you that the viewer shouldn't have to edit a script, but neither should a viewer be forced into pausing a show to look up words that were not translated.
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03-01-2012, 06:55 PM | #26 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 205
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Don't get me wrong. For a long time, even now at times, I love the sound of an attack yelled in Japanese. When I first heard Ohred scream CHORIKI HENSHIN.. Well you can imagine how damn excited I was. I was very pleased many years later to learn what he said. The English Translation.
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03-02-2012, 04:41 PM | #27 |
New Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Moore, Oklahoma, USA
Posts: 18
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TV Nihon isn't just trying to translate they're also trying to teach the japanese language and culture.
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03-02-2012, 04:57 PM | #28 |
Uchu Kaiju
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1,669
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Eh. I don't mind the karaoke on the TVH subs I have watched (Boukenger and Gokaiger) because so far in what I have seen its limited to the Romanized Japanese text during the opening and closing credits. And then they have the translation on the bottom so it's all good. And when they don't translate a Japanese name of an attack or proper noun in the main subtitle track, they typically put it on the top (this has been true of several characters from Dark Shadow in Boukenger as well as several attacks in Gokaiger). So I don't sweat either of those techniques.
The stuff like sama and mou and the rest is annoying, though. Just translate it. But I am getting the sub for free, so I really can't complain too loudly. I don't mind the title splash or putting their names in the credits, because honestly I don't find it overly intrusive and the subbers deserve some recognition for their work. At least that's the thoughts of a lifelong tokusatsu fan who knows no Japanese besides a few trivial words and the names of dozens of monsters.
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03-02-2012, 06:01 PM | #29 |
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Quote:
The stuff like sama and mou and the rest is annoying, though. Just translate it. But I am getting the sub for free, so I really can't complain too loudly. I don't mind the title splash or putting their names in the credits, because honestly I don't find it overly intrusive and the subbers deserve some recognition for their work. At least that's the thoughts of a lifelong tokusatsu fan who knows no Japanese besides a few trivial words and the names of dozens of monsters. The subbers shouldn't be getting the kind of recognition t-n wants for their work. The subs should be about the show and the show only. Yeah this is my opinion, but it is one shared by a great many people. T-N puts their own names on the credits, but they don't bother translating the Japanese credits of the ACTUAL people that did the show in the first place?
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03-02-2012, 09:02 PM | #30 |
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Lexington, Ky
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While it is extremely ridiculous for TVN to credit themselves, at the same time, I could care less about the people who actually did the show Nihon shouldn't pat themselves on the back with their own names in credit sequences. We know whose doing the subbing so we don't need a reminder with every episode. But honestly I don't need the actual credits translated either. Those names honestly don't mean much to me and whoever the people are that are credited won't change my opinion of the show in general or the episode in question. That's of course all personal preference. I'm sure there are plenty of people who would appreciate that bit to be translated but for me it isn't necessary.
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