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06-28-2020, 10:51 PM | #941 |
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My main memory of Faiz pre-watching this show is the movie he's in with Kamen Rider X. (It's a Gaim one, I think? I'm pretty sure it's the one where Shotaro and Kaito chase a corgi, which is the most important detail in the film.) I dimly recall there being a thing on the wiki where they mention that Takumi's memory from the movie, a flashback to someone's death, was changed from how it happened on the show. So, I figured that post-series canon is... fluid. Still, it didn't really detract from the show, thinking Takumi was alive. I sort-of always assume the title hero survives on a kids' superhero show? I mean, Ghost died about twenty times on his show and still was alive at the end! But also thanks for reminding me there's a spin off of Drive staring Shinnouske, Takumi, and Yuuto, that seems really fun, so I might watch that now.
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06-28-2020, 11:03 PM | #942 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
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Drive's got good movies! I hope you enjoy rewatching it! I'm also sorry that you're liking to spend much of tomorrow asking Who's That Guy.
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06-29-2020, 01:18 AM | #943 |
Filthy SU/FE Trash
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 572
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unfortunately Faiz is a show with great ideas on paper but murky at best execution (so 90% of Innoue's works outside of Jetman) especially towards the end, IT honestly feels like Innoue didn't understand what made Jetman(His carrer defining work, the show he more or less tries to make everything he does this show included) good tbfh though given some reviews I've seen of it I kinda want to watch it too see if it holds up or if it really is a show you like when your younger because "it's dark it's cool it's not power rangers" but call bulls--t on as you get older" which this show is the epitome of. If it's your first toku show outside of Power Rangers you'll think it's the best thing on Earth especially if your younger because dark tone, edge, absolutely no happy thoughts here whatsoever. However when you get older you realize tone isn't everything that makes a story good Even if I prefer when shows take themselves seriously this show takes itself WAY Too seriously, everyone here is an asshole or idiot or both 90% of the plot only happens because people don't tell each other shit. The Only 2 likable characters are Yuka and Kiba and Yuka dies because MUH EDGE and then Kiba turns into a fucking idiot who turns evil for no real rhyme or reason and the ending felt rushed like it felt like they planned the Takumi vs kiba fight for the final episode but then nothing else after Blaster's debut.
Fortunately after Kuuga(which I haven't seen but doesn't sound like something I'd enjoy) and 3 not so great outings you get too what's IMO the best Rider series of the 2000's BE WARNED Though the first few episodes aren't very great unless you like memes then oh boy your in for a treat, but once you get past them it becomes amazing(people say Gaim is the Ryuki of the 2010's but honestly IMO it takes more queues from Blade) also another Warning this show's ending is EASILY the most divisive ending of any Rider series you either like it or not and there's very little inbetween Last edited by Mmicb0b; 06-29-2020 at 01:00 PM.. |
06-29-2020, 01:59 AM | #944 |
Ex-Weather Three leader
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,506
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Can we expect Blade reviews after this or for a change of pace some other franchise i.e. Ultraman or Super Sentai.
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06-29-2020, 02:13 AM | #945 |
take me to space
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,406
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Awooooaaaagggeereettghhh!!! That was my excited yell at reading you covering the final episoide. You ReOpened My Eyes For This Final Faiz.
Takumi and Kiba's final showdown. Even though Ryuki was the show all about riders fighting one another, I can't help but feel it's Faiz's final episode that we have to thank for things like Gaim vs Baron. I super didn't like Yuuji's turn in the last few episodes either, but in this episode, I was able to come around just enough to enjoy the climax of it. It really is all thanks to that conversation he and Takumi have, facing each other off just before transforming. Yuuji asks once again, a little angry, sad and incredulous all at once at why Takumi is so insistent on protecting humanity. You could read that as either him being frustrated that Takumi won't listen, or maybe him being sad that this person he considers a friend just doesn't understand the world like he thinks he does. I lean towards the more compelling and emotional interpretation of course. The actual physical fight is only so-and-so, but it's fine because all the emotions are there. The most key moment for me, as small as it is, is when Super Horsepower brings down his sword on Faiz Blaster, who just utters Kiba's name once, just stands there and takes it before firing away. You already mentioned the screen thing in depth but it is really good, like the kind of cheesy melodrama visual that is kinda a lot but I was totally into it. The last lines shared before Takumi walks off is a great punctuation mark to the whole thing. It's so great, that when I look back on this episode from now on, I will only think about this climax between the two main characters! ...I kinda have to, of course, because what the heck even happened afterwards? The show certainly doesn't say so. Remember how the Orphnoch King was going to like, kill all humans, but if stopped then all Orphnochs would die? Well of course you remember because that's been the big dramatic point the show has been driving in for the last few episodes. And then that just. Doesn't happen. Like, they didn't find a solution, they didn't even overcome it with the power of friendship or anything. The plot just stops existing. There is no rationalisation I can come up with, even as a personal handwave, for how Takumi's last Rider Kick leads to any of the scenes that comes afterwards. I remember the plane analogy you said, and thinking it was funny how you mentioned that the plane has to land. Because when it comes to Faiz's plot... It doesn't just not land, it is simply never to be seen again. I'm pretty sure Faiz's last episode left a lot of people feeling sour, confused or hollow precisely because those last scenes are so weird that they forget everything that happened before it. But! After many years of stewing on it on and off, and thanks to some insight from both others who have watched this show and to this very thread, I am much more willing to just brush all that aside and focus on how much I appreciated the Takumi and Kiba aspect of the last episode. I mean, it's objectively a bad thing that all the story stuff in the last five episodes or so can be so easily brushed off, but that it's an option also speaks to the strength of the characters, I think!? Anyhow, I heard there's a new show airing next week. Kamen Rider Brave? You might want to check your mail though, I heard someone got you a DVD of that movie you didn't get to catch in theatres a few months back. |
06-29-2020, 04:42 AM | #946 |
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Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,290
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I cannot tell you how happy I was to see this episode do the work. I honestly didn’t know if they remembered how to make an episode like this, that ticked along with surface pleasures while simultaneously excavating all this thematic gold. It's a relief, to know that Faiz ended as well as I’d’ve hoped. They made a bunch of choices I don’t think I’ll ever love, in service of an ending I adored.
The ends did justify the means. Quote:
unfortunately Faiz is a show with great ideas on paper but murky at best execution (so 90% of Innoue's works outside of Jetman) especially towards the end, IT honestly feels like Innoue didn't understand what made Jetman(His carrer defining work, the show he more or less tries to make everything he does this show included) good tbfh though given some reviews I've seen of it I kinda want to watch it too see if it holds up or if it really is a show you like when your younger because "it's dark it's cool it's not power rangers" but call bulls--t on as you get older" which this show is the epitome of if it's your first toku show outside of Power Rangers you'll think it's the best thing on Earth especially if your younger because dark tone, edge, absolutely no happy thoughts here whatsoever. However when you get older you realize tone isn't everything that makes a story good Even if I prefer when shows take themselves seriously this show takes itself WAY Too seriously, everyone here is an asshole or idiot or both 90% of the plot only happens because people don't tell each other shit. The Only 2 likable characters are Yuka and Kiba and Yuka dies because MUH EDGE and then Kiba turns into a fucking idiot who turns evil for no real rhyme or reason and the ending felt rushed like they planned the Kiba vs Takumi fight but then nothing else.
Fortunately after Kuuga(which I haven't seen but doesn't sound like something I'd enjoy) and 3 not so great outings you get too what's IMO the best Rider series of the 2000's BE WARNED Though the first few episodes aren't very great unless you like memes then oh boy your in for a treat, but once you get past them it becomes amazing(people say Gaim is the Ryuki of the 2010's but honestly IMO it takes more queues from Blade) also another Warning this show's ending is EASILY the most divisive ending of any Rider series you either like or not and there's very little inbetween Quote:
I really like your take on the ending. This is one of the parts of Faiz that gets a lot of scorn. The popular opinion is that it isn't an ending: the Orphenoch King and Kageyama are still alive and Takumi is still dying (or maybe died? Curious to see your take on that). In a lot of ways it feels like the show is leaving a lot of sequel hooks that never get picked up on because Blade is wholly unrelated to it. I can't lie and say it's one of my favorites, but I get all of your points and they do go a long way to re-contextualizing it. The show was all about the characters and it is a satisfying resolution for them.
I'll still say this about the ending, though: I want a spin-off show about Mari, Keitaro, and Kaido breaking into secure facilities with laundry equipment.
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06-29-2020, 05:40 AM | #947 |
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Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 2,546
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Worth mentioning is that the originally intended to follow on from the final episode by including a short scene where Takumi meets the new guy, Kazuma Kenzaki, gives him a red-coloured baton and then both do their henshin poses. But for whatever reason, it was never released and we only know about it due to magazine pictures posted years after the fact. https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20181217161532
They did try reviving the idea of a meeting between the two as a short story, but for whatever reason, it was never released and we only know about it due to Blade’s DVD commentary. But the idea of a handoff between heroes wasn’t thrown out entirely. The other fellows adopted it as a yearly tradition. https://youtu.be/3P7_9rFd5Bc |
06-29-2020, 06:25 AM | #948 |
Warrior of Delusions!
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Wait, you dont know either?
Posts: 5,825
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Hey remember two months or so ago when I posted "Look forwards to a series-long trip into the Inoue Zone?" I'm so glad you did. You've not quite convinced me to go watch Faz ("Misunderstandings" is not a thread I enjoy, shame to say), but someone finding a new series to love? That's pretty neat.
Now I just need to finish these 6 episodes of Blade before you finish the entire show, and I'm set to actually *involve* myself in discussions next time!
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06-29-2020, 09:56 AM | #949 |
Standing By
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 2,089
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--2--
The absolute smartest thing this finale did was say that the stuff from 47-49 that sucked? It doesn’t matter. It never mattered. The Ticking Clock is irrelevant, because everyone dies at some point. Sometimes it’s soon, sometimes it’s later, but life ends. The important thing is to cherish what you have, to give it meaning. And, whether that’s fighting to save humanity, spending time with your friends, becoming a private investigator, or just doing laundry, living life is inherently meaningful. Existence is its own reward. Fighting for dominance, fighting for survival, it’s bullshit. It’s a distraction from what you have around you, what you’re better off thinking about. The Orphnoch King is irrelevant, beyond being something to have a fight against. Teruo doesn’t factor into the story at all, permanently transforming into the Orphnoch King early in the episode. As a character, the Orphnoch King isn’t one. He’s a force of nature, a metaphor. He’s all the ways we lose sight of our connections with one another, how we allow our fears to divide us, how we view things like safety and happiness as finite resources, stolen from one person to give to another. With friends at our side, with a refusal to view him as legitimate, he’s easy to defeat. Smart Brain doesn’t really have a role to play. Lucky Clover doesn’t really have a role to play. It’s a story about Takumi and Yuuji, at the end. It’s a story about acceptance. The ethical problem of Takumi having to kill a kid kind of just solves itself conveniently with Teruo being consumed by the matured King, which is still very dark to happen to a kid but at least the King is now an acceptable target. He doesn't appear to be sapient like other Orphenochs, maybe to emphasize his lack of humanity and what it really means to embrace being an Orphenoch and succumb to the amoral will of nature. It's not something a human should strive to be. Smart Brain boasts that Orphenochs are humanity+ which is true anatomically but looking down on humanity for being weak and throwing away their humanity to become stronger doesn't make them more deserving of their existence. Everybody has a right to exist and to fight to protect their existence and fill it with purpose. Quote:
--3--
The Yuuji/Takumi fight is perfect. It’s a perfect fight. Technically, visually, it does everything you want it to. It’s beautifully shot, and, as the clear centerpiece to the episode, it’s given plenty of room to breathe. They do so much with it, and it’s a big reason why this finale worked so well for me. There’s a little bit of build-up, before things get started. It’s them having a human face-off, a final moment to say This One Counts. There won’t be any holding back, and no one’s coming to save them. You see Yuuji’s facade crack for the first time since 46, and it’s crucial to feeling anything for this fight. You need to see some flash of Old Yuuji, some reason to feel conflicted about this final Faiz Fight. It does a great job setting the stage. The battle starts as a Rider battle, Kaixa versus Faiz. There’s clever gimmicks, like Faiz using his Shot to bust out of Kaixa’s Slash. It’s small, as Rider battles go. It’s not a big pyrotechnic extravaganza. It’s measured, though. Longer takes, more meat to the fight. It transitions next into an Oprhnoch battle, Horsepower versus Wolfeyes. It’s more brutal now. Yuuji’s anger is spilling out, screaming himself raw. Takumi switches up into Faiz Blaster, and uses Yuuji’s rage against him. He gets in close with his blaster, taking Yuuji out of his Orphnoch form and giving Takumi a perfect moment to end Yuuji’s life by his own sword. But he stops short. He refuses to kill Yuuji. Not because they were friends. Not because he doesn’t think Yuuji believes every single thing he’s said and done over the last four episodes. Not because Yuuji is good. But because Takumi protects humans. Humans just like Yuuji. And then the episode does the smartest goddamn thing in the whole goddamn series. There’s a screen that the camera’s been shooting through during this moment, slightly obscuring Takumi’s statement. But as he finishes, as he reaffirms his belief that all humans matter, that every life deserves to be lived, he walks through a hole in the screen. He’s liberated, assured. He doesn’t hate himself, question himself. He ‘s freed from the rage and self-doubt, and he walks away. He walks away from Yuuji’s anger and justifications. He leaves Yuuji, trapped on the other side of the screen, screaming and crying at the injustice of it all, at the idea that Takumi won’t sink to his level, won’t validate his bleak worldview. And in doing so, Takumi saves the day. Yuuji ends up joining the fight against the Orphnoch King, proving crucial in ending the King’s threat. And, like, I get it if that turn (or re-turn) doesn’t play for people. But, god, I thought it landed so well. It’s Takumi being the icon to Yuuji that Yuuji always was to Takumi. It’s Takumi finally feeling certain in his choices, in himself. It’s Takumi’s accepting someone, even if he doesn’t agree with them. That idea… it’s kind-of everything I wanted this show to say in the end? One of the best things we can offer one another is a chance to be happy. You do that by giving people support when they want it, and you let them make their own choices. Rigidity, expectations, judgment, these things trap people, leave them angry and scared. Accepting people, letting them feel like they don’t have to be afraid of themselves, that’s a gift we’re all capable of giving each other. Takumi doesn’t win the day by using the Faiz belt or his Orphnoch powers, he wins it by letting someone know that he wants them to have a chance at happiness, wants them to live their life. That’s why he’s a hero. Kiba is still conflicted but in the end, he wants to believe that Takumi's way is right, that the ideal he gave up on was still worth fighting for. Although the final battle against the King isn't quite as epic as Takumi VS Kiba, the location where it happens is awesome! The rarely seen Kamen Rider Stormdrain is an awesome backdrop for any exciting climactic fight. Takumi also appears as illuminated Faiz for the first time. Quote:
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--555--
Team Faiz, though… they’re relaxing, they’re happy. Sure, things were tough for a while there. They’ve been scared. They’ve suffered losses. (RIP Faiz CyKill, also I guess Yuuji) But they’re together, and they’ve earned their happiness. Takumi even has a dream, and of course, it’s Keitaro’s dream. The joke of the beginning of the series became the moral of its ending. Takumi wants the whole world to be happy. Quote:
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My main memory of Faiz pre-watching this show is the movie he's in with Kamen Rider X. (It's a Gaim one, I think? I'm pretty sure it's the one where Shotaro and Kaito chase a corgi, which is the most important detail in the film.) I dimly recall there being a thing on the wiki where they mention that Takumi's memory from the movie, a flashback to someone's death, was changed from how it happened on the show. So, I figured that post-series canon is... fluid.
Still, it didn't really detract from the show, thinking Takumi was alive. I sort-of always assume the title hero survives on a kids' superhero show? I mean, Ghost died about twenty times on his show and still was alive at the end! Kamen Rider 4, which you watched, functions as an epilogue for Takumi, revealing what happened to him after the Final Faiz, giving closure to years of ambiguity. The title, Kamen Rider 4, obviously refers to the eponymous 4 but it could also hint at Faiz's relevance, being the 4th Heisei Rider. Riderman and Kuuga are also "4" but they're not actually relevant to the movie. As you're now aware, the flashback to Kusaka's death in Kamen Rider War was very different to what actually happened which should raise suspicion about the authenticity of Takumi's recollection. Blade is actually the only Heisei Rider season I haven't watched yet. I intend to change that before Die reaches the Day of Oma.
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06-29-2020, 10:26 AM | #950 |
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Blade is actually the only Heisei Rider season I haven't watched yet. I intend to change that before Die reaches the Day of Oma.
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