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View Poll Results: Do you want Toku to become more mainstream? | |||
Yes, more people would be great! | 52 | 46.43% | |
No, a smaller fandom is best. | 25 | 22.32% | |
I'm fine either way. | 35 | 31.25% | |
Voters: 112. This poll is closed |
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07-02-2021, 12:03 PM | #81 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 112
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Quote:
Not on board with the "PR-Is-Bad-For-International-Toku-Representation" interpretation, but I also don't want PR to be the catch-all regarding Toku as it's only one aspect and an outlier. I want Toku to go up in understanding and popularity, so that you can see franchises like Kamen Rider get the love and respect of more common manga/anime franchises like My Hero Academia or Dragon Ball. We're seeing MHA figures on Walmart shelves and that's not considered atypical these days! We're also (occasionally) seeing more Ultraman on shelves (usually just the MEGOs and series sets, but still). That's a level of commendable representation cause while MHA and Ultraman are still relatively niche, they're not total unknowns and can share space with more recognizable franchises like Superman or Avengers. What is concerning is whether or not it will keep its acquired momentum and if it can remain true to itself without the meddling of Western corporations and Western nitpickers who judge what they don't understand.
Netflix Reveals List Of Its U.S. Subscribers’ 10 “Most Traveled To” Destinations Netflix Unveils Its Most-Watched International Series & Films In America So I don't understand why toku fans would be against tokusatsu shows not getting more mainstream if there is clear evidence of non-English international shows being watched on Netflix by US audiences of all race and ethnicities. Also I got this from Forbes for anyone skeptical of my K-dramas are gaining popularity in the US amongst non-Asian audiences: Forbes article: Korean Drama Lovers In The U.S. Are Very Fond Of Romantic Comedies And yes non-romance K-drama are getting attention too in the US as I'll quote from Forbes: Quote:
Other popular dramas that were not distinctly in the romantic comedy genre included A Korean Odyssey/Hwayugi, Mr. Sunshine, Arthdal Chronicles, Sky Castle, Angel’s Last Mission: Love, My ID is Gangnam Beauty, and Guardian: The Lonely and Great God
Last edited by mdo7; 07-02-2021 at 12:04 PM.. Reason: want to add stuff. |
07-02-2021, 05:45 PM | #82 |
Alias: ZeroEnchiladas
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,574
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See, and this is a curious question here. I think the thing is, when it comes to Tokusatsu, the reason I entered it, is because it scratches a certain itch that I've had for the longest while. And also it has to do with how I grew up.
The thing is, I could really care less about drama's in general? Like no matter what country they're from, I don't really find myself engaging with them for two main reasons. 1. Tokusatsu shows like Ultraman, Garo, Sentai, Rider, Metal Hero, minor ones, they just scratch the itch of Superhero shows. See the thing is while mostly growing up, the live action hero shows I loved were Power Rangers. So that influenced me greatly and while I did enjoy the MCU as I got older, I still had a soft spot for what I thought were super cool live action heroes via Power Rangers. So the general Tokusatsu medium in general is built for exactly that purpose. 2. I've just grown out of the need of wanting to watch any kind of normal broadcast television show aside from the Food Network/Travel Channel. You see I wasn't a kid who could really go out often or hang out with friends outside school, allergies and stuff like asthma sort of made me a bit of a weak kid. Also didn't help on how like shackled I was to the house. So what's a kid or young teen to do on the weekends and summer, especially when dial-up internet is the best you've got back then, than to just watch television. I consumed a lot of shows, and I mean a lot, cartoons, sitcoms, drama's, tv movies, etc. I consumed so much that by the time 2008 came around, I was mostly just sticking to the Food Network/Travel Channel because normal television was just boring to me. So I'd like to say that's why I'm not too interested in drama shows of any kind and why I like Tokusatsu exclusively. |
07-02-2021, 05:52 PM | #83 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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I'm... unclear what debate is going on here, at the moment?
The thread title is "Do you want Tokusatsu to become mainstream", but we're going back and forth between "why do Toku people not watch K-dramas" and "Is PR good international Toku representation"? I dunno, a bit confused here...
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07-02-2021, 06:49 PM | #84 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 112
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Quote:
See, and this is a curious question here. I think the thing is, when it comes to Tokusatsu, the reason I entered it, is because it scratches a certain itch that I've had for the longest while. And also it has to do with how I grew up.
The thing is, I could really care less about drama's in general? Like no matter what country they're from, I don't really find myself engaging with them for two main reasons. 1. Tokusatsu shows like Ultraman, Garo, Sentai, Rider, Metal Hero, minor ones, they just scratch the itch of Superhero shows. See the thing is while mostly growing up, the live action hero shows I loved were Power Rangers. So that influenced me greatly and while I did enjoy the MCU as I got older, I still had a soft spot for what I thought were super cool live action heroes via Power Rangers. So the general Tokusatsu medium in general is built for exactly that purpose. Quote:
I'm... unclear what debate is going on here, at the moment?
The thread title is "Do you want Tokusatsu to become mainstream", but we're going back and forth between "why do Toku people not watch K-dramas" and "Is PR good international Toku representation"? I dunno, a bit confused here... Let me explain, the problem is that people in the US are watching more foreign-language international TV dramas on streaming (thanks to Netflix, Amazon Prime Video, etc...). Yet tokusatsu's fanbase in the US has not jumped during the same time that Korean TV dramas, and other non-English foreign language international TV dramas (that does include non-toku Japanese language TV dramas) are getting. Netflix has been picking up K-dramas, and foreign language TV dramas for the last few years. After the last post in 2018, I've noticed and saw Netflix (and other streaming providers) picking up more and more foreign language dramas. You don't see Netflix, Amazon Prime Video, Disney+, or HBO Max picking up tokusatsu (not counting Netflix's Ultraman CG anime series, nor the Kamen Rider Amazon re-imagining on Prime Video). I'm talking about Netflix not picking up any obscure or lesser well-known tokusatsu shows. I don't see Netflix or Amazon Prime Video picking up any simulcast toku shows, yet I'm seeing Netflix since 2017/2018 simulcast Korean TV dramas, but not tokusatsu or anime, doesn't it bother you or anyone in toku fandom? I'm kinda surprised that GARO has not been made avaliable on streaming like Netflix where it could get big audiences on there. Yes, it really bother me that tokusatsu fans aren't being alarmed about people watching non-toku foreign language shows (ie: K-dramas, wuxia C-drama, European TV dramas, etc....) on streaming like Netflix, Prime Video, HBO Max, etc.... Also, when Netflix (or any streaming provider) viewers in the US are watching fantasy/sci-fi K-dramas and wuxia C-dramas that borderline to tokusatsu territory and not branching out to tokusatsu shows like Ultraman or Kamen Rider, doesn't it bother you that K-dramas and wuxia C-dramas are taking away potential fans of tokusatsu. That's why I revive this topic it's because this topic need attention due to new evidence of American audiences watching more foreign TV shows/dramas on streaming. I forgot to include this article from Deadline Hollywood from Dec 2020, and let me quote this article: Quote:
Finally, as Netflix continues to ramp up its international commissioning strategy, it’s clear that English-language viewers are interested in watching shows with subtitles. The Platform, Barbarians and France’s Rogue City were the most popular foreign-language shows, while it saw a big jump in Korean drama, up 100% in the U.S. with Kingdom’s second season and The King: Eternal Monarch becoming its most popular favorite K-dramas.
I expect someone that watched fantasy/sci-fi K-drama like Kingdom, Arthdal Chronicles, or School Nurse Files or even fantasy wuxia dramas like Legend of Fuyao, or Ice Fantasy to have branch out to Kamen Rider, or Ultraman or Super Sentai. I don't see any of that. I don't see any overlap between tokusatsu fans nor K-dramas, wuxia drama, and European drama fans. I don't even see toku fans helping fans of Ice Fantasy to migrate to Ultraman or Kamen Rider. That's why I revive this topic yesterday because of the new evidence of US English-speaking audiences watching foreign TV dramas on Netflix, and other streaming sites. I expected people on this forum and this thread to have a debate and trying to figure out why are the same English-speaking audiences that are watching foreign TV dramas which include sci-fi/fantasy K-dramas, and wuxia C-dramas aren't branching out or discovering tokusatsu shows. And nobody on this forum or any toku circle can't answer or debate why tokusatsu aren't getting the same love or gaining general audiences that non-toku and fantasy/sci-fi foreign-language TV dramas that borderline to tokusatsu are getting today. The topic is do you want tokusatsu to be mainstream and majority of you said yes. But now seeing new evidence that English-speaking audiences are watching more foreign-language TV dramas and films, this is a good time to revive this topic and try to figure out why the same people that watch fantasy/sci-fi K-dramas and wuxia C-dramas on Netflix, and Prime Video aren't branching out to tokusatsu shows. Do you understand, or get it? Doesn't it bother you that fantasy/sci-fi K-dramas, wuxia C-dramas, and other sci-fi or fantasy non-English language TV dramas are getting more fans and general audience then Kamen Rider, Last edited by mdo7; 07-02-2021 at 06:56 PM.. |
07-02-2021, 07:00 PM | #85 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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Quote:
Netflix has been picking up K-dramas, and foreign language TV dramas for the last few years. After the last post in 2018, I've noticed and saw Netflix (and other streaming providers) picking up more and more foreign language dramas. You don't see Netflix, Amazon Prime Video, Disney+, or HBO Max picking up tokusatsu (not counting Netflix's Ultraman CG anime series, nor the Kamen Rider Amazon re-imagining on Prime Video). I'm talking about Netflix not picking up any obscure or lesser well-known tokusatsu shows. I don't see Netflix or Amazon Prime Video picking up any simulcast toku shows, yet I'm seeing Netflix since 2017/2018 simulcast Korean TV dramas, but not tokusatsu or anime, doesn't it bother you or anyone in toku fandom?
.... Do you understand, or get it? Doesn't it bother you that fantasy/sci-fi K-dramas, wuxia C-dramas, and other sci-fi or fantasy non-English language TV dramas are getting more fans and general audience then Kamen Rider, The dramas you're talking about are generally aimed at adult or young adult audiences and are a prime target for larger streaming platforms to latch onto as something to broaden said platforms for potential audiences to find interest in. And that's simply harder to do with shows that are made for children, most with the primary interest of selling toys. It just wouldn't even cross the mind of anyone in the business of this to look at shows marketed at the ~7 year old audience over actual material for their older audiences. There's exceptions to this of course, there's Tokusatsu that is indeed made for an adult audience... and those actually have come to said streaming platforms! Garo's the exception, but I'd be willing to bet it doesn't have the same money behind it that giants like Kamen Rider and Ultraman do. I think this very clearly shows the obvious reason and divide here; an adult-aimed show like Amazons is not just instantly thrown on worldwide platforms but is even partly made with that in mind, while the likes of Ex-Aid and Zyuohger... just wouldn't be considered at all. For executives to think there is any money at all at bringing these kids' shows worldwide, they're going to need a lot of convincing; and that's where recent efforts like Tokushoutsu and Mill Creek have come in. It really is just as simple as that, there's not much more to it.
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07-02-2021, 07:06 PM | #86 |
Alias: ZeroEnchiladas
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,574
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I feel like also the answer is, the people bringing Tokusatsu shows to America already have platforms their using that isn't Netflix.
Also Garo is streaming somewhere, it's Streaming on HIDIVE. It's only the Kraken Releases but it is streaming somewhere. Heck, Juspion got licensed by Discotek and is on Crunchyroll as we speak. So there's definitely people interested in picking certain things up. That being said Ultraman's probably the biggest example, with the Blu-Ray Sets, Movie Spree, and Tokushoutsu deals it has going on. Rider while not heavy, is still slowly but surely putting out series on streaming. Really the only one not really moving forward is Sentai but for well, a lot of complex reasons given well, Power Rangers and Hasbro. |
07-02-2021, 07:09 PM | #87 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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It's definitely a shame because the Sentai DVDs SHOUT were putting out seemed to be doing well? At least, I have to imagine they were to keep putting them out and even dipping into pre-Zyuranger seasons
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07-02-2021, 07:19 PM | #88 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 112
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And that's simply harder to do with shows that are made for children, most with the primary interest of selling toys. It just wouldn't even cross the mind of anyone in the business of this to look at shows marketed at the ~7 year old audience over actual material for their older audiences.
Quote:
There's exceptions to this of course, there's Tokusatsu that is indeed made for an adult audience... and those actually have come to said streaming platforms! Garo's the exception, but I'd be willing to bet it doesn't have the same money behind it that giants like Kamen Rider and Ultraman do. I think this very clearly shows the obvious reason and divide here; an adult-aimed show like Amazons is not just instantly thrown on worldwide platforms but is even partly made with that in mind, while the likes of Ex-Aid and Zyuohger... just wouldn't be considered at all.
As I said, I would've loved it if Netflix can pick up the simulcast streaming right for Kikai Sentai Zenkaiger for worldwide audiences, or Netflix was given the worldwide streaming right to stream Ultraman Z. I mean come on we have evidence that people in the US can handle sci-fi/fantasy TV dramas not in English. |
07-02-2021, 07:24 PM | #89 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 112
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Quote:
I feel like also the answer is, the people bringing Tokusatsu shows to America already have platforms their using that isn't Netflix.
Also Garo is streaming somewhere, it's Streaming on HIDIVE. It's only the Kraken Releases but it is streaming somewhere. Heck, Juspion got licensed by Discotek and is on Crunchyroll as we speak. So there's definitely people interested in picking certain things up. That being said Ultraman's probably the biggest example, with the Blu-Ray Sets, Movie Spree, and Tokushoutsu deals it has going on. Rider while not heavy, is still slowly but surely putting out series on streaming. Really the only one not really moving forward is Sentai but for well, a lot of complex reasons given well, Power Rangers and Hasbro. Hell, I've seen Netflix picking up obscure random K-dramas (and old Taiwanese dramas from early 2000's), and those dramas can get more audiences then any of the tokusatsu shows you mention. The only way obscure tokusatsu can get more audiences like K-dramas, wuxia C-dramas are getting is to put them on streaming sites that a lot of people watched and Netflix is one of them. I guarantee if Netflix has GARO on their streaming catalog, GARO would get a lot of English-speaking audiences from people that watch fantasy/sci-fi K-dramas and Wuxia C-dramas. Last edited by mdo7; 07-02-2021 at 07:27 PM.. |
07-02-2021, 07:29 PM | #90 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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I'm referring to Amazons and ULTRAMAN, which you also mentioned previously
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