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05-06-2022, 12:09 AM | #961 |
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I love how in spite of getting beaten in his debut (Black) Woz still is smug as he wasn’t aiming to defeat Geiz, just slowing him down. It’s a type of debut I don’t normally see where it is not about shilling forms but about what it means for characters and how it used to affect the plot. Tsukasa playing judge is interesting. We've seen him as a resigned executioner and devious mastermind but never as one toa actively judge the worth of a world, And for all of his bluster Tsukasa is trying to aim for a brighter future for all. Also, the final scene with the ZI-O bike with 47 seconds of screen time is the least used bike in not just Heisei but Kamen Rider history lol. Seeing Sougo and Geiz beaten up limping to each other for a “final fight” that there hearts aren’t really in it the empty parking lot, the early snow, how anxious Geiz is contrasting with how determined and resigned Sougo and his admittance as Sougo is his friend at the (unneeded) arrival of Another ZI-O and that barrage of all the Rider Armors wa sso cool since this was essentially a graduation from these form. The combination of Shippu speed in almost clock-up like manner comboed off ZI-O II future sight was great. But in the aftermath Sougo trying to move on with Hiryuu but him voutsinas the Another ZI-O watch refuses to break is a perfect symbolism. But it;s that final scene with all three as Tsukuyomi reunites with Sougo and Geiz it’s was so simple they didn’t have to fight after a dozen or so episodes of saying it will at the end of the day if the two warriors hearts aren't in it then don’t fight. And all we can do is laugh together at how silly we were.
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05-06-2022, 12:19 AM | #962 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
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I know it?s just technobabble with no real scientific basis but it thematically links with how Geiz is burdened with a guilt that threatens to tear him up from the inside up on his journey to be a terminator. Also Woz apparently bleeds pages and this only time this ever happens?!?!
Tsukasa loves to play into his Destroyer of Worlds legend, but there's no chance he was actually going to destroy Zi-O's world. Tsukasa always works best as a semi-skeptical audience surrogate: the guy who walks into a show and goes What Story Are You Even Trying To Tell. He just wants Zi-O's complicated backstory to either starting paying dividends, or get out of the way.
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05-06-2022, 02:39 AM | #963 |
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So fun fact, this arc was originally going to be a tribute to Amazons, since Shirakura wanted to do one at some point and Bandai went along enough to include lights for all three Amazon Riders in the Ziku Driver. But Toei vetoed it, on account of Amazons not being something you want to directly expose your kids to (At least the Teen Titans Go movie never gets any further than referencing Deadpool. I say from experience that kids are likely to miss stuff like that), so all we get is this “humans being wiped out by savage monsters in a world full of asshole heroes” premise.
Also, Hiryu. More on him later. |
05-06-2022, 04:16 AM | #964 |
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KAMEN RIDER ZI-O EPISODE 41 - ?2019 - WORLD RESET?
It makes sense to do it now. Some of it's because we went right from the high of Grand Zi-O?s 45-minute debut scene (rough estimate) to fighting Oma Zi-O in the Misery Fields of 2068. We had a hero who thought he was ready to claim victory, so he needs a taste of ultimate defeat. We can?t have Sougo thinking he?s wrapped everything up just because he?s collected enough roleplay items to access the endgame content, can we? We gotta humble him a bit. Quote:
There?s not a ton of stuff to dissect from this episode, since it?s a Darkest Timeline story. (It?s mostly just everyone forgetting Sougo, except for the part where they think he?s a villain.) Hiryuu?s back as Another Zi-O, and he?s just as laughably forgettable as last time. He ruined the world because he hates Sougo and can?t get over his anger, which is? I guess it?s a motivation? It lacks a sense of scale, which has always been my problem with Hiryuu. He?s mad about some accident Sougo survived from when they were both on a bus together a decade ago, and that?s all the show ever seems to come up with for him? It should read as intensely personal yet universal ? the loss of both parents for reasons that are impossible to define ? but there?s so little specificity to Hiryuu, so little sense of what he?s like when he?s not sneering at Sougo?s existence, that it?s difficult to feel any emotions about him besides Apathy. You might as well have a melon with a frowny-face drawn on it plunged onto the end of a broom, and had the Time Jackers make that thing Another Zi-O. Just waving some scowling melon-broom at Sougo while Woz cheers it on. Might work better for me!
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I liked Tsukasa being here, though. He has a way of cutting through Sougo?s (very understandable!) self-pity and trying to get that kid to realize that his friendships can?t be taken from him by weird time magic, because he?s still the kid that made those friends. (Tsukasa is living proof of how valuable friendships can be while the universe is trying to undo your existence!) Also, boy, real sad to see him think that him losing all his friends is because he didn?t take on Oma Zi-O even more solo. Sougo! Your powers are not the Time Overlord stuff! They?re your innate empathy and boundless optimism! That is what drew these people to you in the first place! It?s the thing that Hiryuu could never replicate, because he is just a one-dimensional obstacle with a very weird headband!
And obviously Hiryu would never replicate Sougo, he's even worse than Ohma Zi-O after all, and while Sougo did draw people to him, Ohma Zi-O, which is alternate Sougo which'd have the same kindly youth he had, is also alone, everyone hates him for a good reason and is trying to overthrow him, including his younger self. Hiryu not drawing people to him is completely on point as evil version of Zi-O! While current Sougo now had found some keys to prevent himself becoming Ohma Zi-O, by accepting his capacity of evil and being more honest with his feelings instead of not admitting bad situation. Quote:
Also also, I really have to say I'm immediately disappointed that Grand Zi-O's summoning powers have been simplified. Obviously having him do all that 'pluck directly from original series' to the extent he did in the previous episode is unreasonable, but I figured they'd just at most have a suit do a generic move for a second before vanishing. Here, he summons them and they fight like Pokemon, just like Diend does. And while I'm at it, it bugs me that they show Oma Zi-O doing the same thing! One of the reasons I thought Grand Zi-O's powerset was so cool is how it contrasted with how Oma Zi-O fought back in episode 15. Compared to how Oma Zi-O embodied the past riders' powers into himself, Grand Zi-O celebrates their legacy by having them show off for themselves. But no, now they're both just Diend.
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Sougo has one of the most potential broken forms in Kamen Rider and while it doesn't entirely job here... it goes from utilized 75% of it's potential in it's debut to like 10% of it's potential here. Grand Zi-O can do so much... and Sougo is not utilizing it at all and it's honestly really sad. Which is why I'm calling my shot here and just declaring Grand as the second Final Form in a row (Build Genius I glare at you) that wastes any potential it might have.
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05-06-2022, 11:38 AM | #965 |
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Really bad luck that Sougo just happened to summon him against Oma Zi-O though. But when you consider that Oma Zi-O already has an idea how his younger self would act, he probably planned for this to happen and set up this fight specifically to show that Drive is loyal to him, not Sougo. Quote:
There's actually something sinister though, as shown in how Grand Zi-O himself is pulled by Ohma Zi-O to face him, and it shows that's probably what the Riders that are pulled by Grand Zi-O for his finisher or something feels like. It may be spectacle for the viewers, but it's something horrific for the Riders, unless they're likely eager to help, but dunno what was going in those previous Riders in their time. Here Grand Zi-O is on a receiving end of his evolved power via Ohma Zi-O, who is implied that he can pull anyone he wants at any time to his own location or time (it's 2068), adding more paranoia in Ohma Zi-O's power.
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05-06-2022, 12:13 PM | #966 |
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So fun fact, this arc was originally going to be a tribute to Amazons, since Shirakura wanted to do one at some point and Bandai went along enough to include lights for all three Amazon Riders in the Ziku Driver. But Toei vetoed it, on account of Amazons not being something you want to directly expose your kids to (At least the Teen Titans Go movie never gets any further than referencing Deadpool. I say from experience that kids are likely to miss stuff like that), so all we get is this ?humans being wiped out by savage monsters in a world full of asshole heroes? premise.
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I mean for sure you did have your experiences with Narutaki in Decade before, but characters can be of different types y'know? Hiryu isn't someone that is meant to be rife with a sense of scale, and it's also ok to make a character that has motives that aren't typical villain grandiose plan, and that also counts as motive, characters meant to be annoying and hatable like him (to see what's coming to him). He's meant to be someone utterly petty, bitter, and spiteful, like how Narutaki blames everything on Decade, even when he's grasping on straws for logical reasons to do so.
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05-06-2022, 05:40 PM | #967 |
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(Fish Sandwich also watched Kamen Rider Zi-O - EP41)
- *Sees this is a Morota episode* - *skims around to immediately find Hiryuu punching Sougo into some water* Man, it really is like every set of episodes this guy has ever directed has at least one moment like this. Dude loves splashing water like Sakamoto loves explosions. Anyways, you can see from my old post that me and this arc kind of got off on a bad foot, but I think I've cooled off some in retrospect. I mean, I definitely still find it somewhat silly that we had a plot thread in this show where Oma Zi-O tells Sougo to collect Watches to become Oma Zi-O and Sougo somehow interpreted that as "collect Watches to NOT become Oma Zi-O", but hey, that got us some of the best episodes of the series, so why bother complaining? Besides that though, I think I just had my expectations set unreasonably high because, well... Quote:
I think that's why I acted like it was some great crime that Mouri was writing this instead of Shimoyama, which is one of the things my perspective has already changed on. In retrospect, I kinda like that both writers got a shot with Another Zi-O? This arc has a very different flavor from Hiryuu's debut, and as I've said before, I enjoy how much variety Zi-O brings to the table. These episodes have a very strong hook for their story, and despite the weirdly pessimistic attitude with which I wrote about it at the time, I can tell you that I was very much looking forward to seeing where it was going. Wait, seriously? I'd kinda like to know more about this, if that's the case? It's really hard to imagine the idea of doing an Amazons arc getting far enough along to even be replaced.
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05-06-2022, 05:59 PM | #968 |
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My source is Zi-O’s Complete Mook. I’ve no idea if there’s more information there, beyond what the comment translating most of the information I’ve been sharing in this thread (the rest of it comes from Tom Constantine’s translation of the Round Table discussion) said.
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05-06-2022, 06:26 PM | #969 |
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I wonder if the idea of an Amazons arc was floated as a general idea pre-series, not for this specific 2-parter, because let's be honest, the Dan Kuroto .5 episode reveals which legend Rider arc went where was as much about filming availability than some grand plan. Being in the Driver... all the main Riders are in the Driver, including all the Showa Riders, I don't think we can take "in the driver" to mean anything more than a vague "Yeah we might include them". But then again, I'm just speculating
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05-06-2022, 06:49 PM | #970 |
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I think Omega, Alpha and Neo are all in the Driver because A) You can kind of consider them all Main Riders? Omega I don't have to make a case for, but Alpha sort of shares the main protagonist role in Season 1 and then Neo is the main character we're following in Season 2. And B) all the Riders of Build and Ex-aid - the two most recent shows - except Mad Rogue are also in there. Amazons is technically both the third most recent show (it debuted during Ghost, ie between Ghost and Ex-Aid's debuts) and also just as recent given Season 2 was during Ex-Aid and the movie came out during Build -- about 5 months prior to the Ziku Driver's release!
I distinctly remember being let down by this arc both not having enough depth to Hiryu to make him an interesting villain and also the way Grand just immediately started sucking. Kind of already been gone over why those are, so just to add something slightly unique onto that... Something I noted at the time that I still agree with is that what specifically disappointed me about Grand here is that in its debut, it was doing something extremely specific -- it wasn't just summoning Riders, it was summoning moments in time, using the full force of a Rider's finisher or what have you when they were beating up a villain. This made it extremely cool and distinguished it from other summoners, was a great visual flair and easter egg hunt, and allowed as well for funny moments like the Momotaros gag. But here... it's just normal summons, which makes Grand just feel like a glorified Diend with nothing more special to him other than that I guess he can also summon their swords. It's not like they don't try to do cool things with the summons, and they do succeed in some places; but it's such a derailment from what Grand initially seemed to be. Also Ohma corrupting Drive resulting in a really fucked up pitched-down version of the car honk was... absurdly funny. Loved it
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