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04-16-2020, 04:46 PM | #441 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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Most of this stuff is over my head, but I am sincerely excited to get through all of these series so that, when a character makes a movie appearance, I'll be able to connect better with their story. It's tough sometimes, knowing how much I've got to watch in order to be looped in, but I think it's for the best that I do so.
I guess the only real roadblock I'm going to have when it comes to getting all the way current is the Kamen Rider Aqua stuff. I may to have to hold off on Zi-O and Zero-One and stuff for just a few decades, so I can get the most out of the OOO/Fourze movie first. It's just, I want to do this right, you know?
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04-16-2020, 08:14 PM | #442 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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MASKED RIDER RYUKI EPISODE 35
Mostly really liked this episode, but not entirely. There's some really clever twists, as well as a HUGE change to a major character, but there's a decision early in this episode that threw me in a way that soured me some on this episode. I don't know why they didn't bring the Ryuki vs Knight battle to some kind of a conclusion. It's a choice, and, short of killing off one of the two main characters with fifteen episodes left to go, the only choice they could make. Fight's got to end without someone dying. It's just, I'm shocked that there was zero effort made into showing why the fight stopped. Did their time run out? Did Ryuki have Knight on the ropes and split? Were they both too battered to continue? To have a fight this big, this important, be left to the viewer's imagination... man, I don't get it. I don't know why you wouldn't spend a few more shots tightening that resolution up some. Weird choice. Unfulfilling choice. The rest of the episode was pretty strong, though. In contrast to the big Hero Fight, the rest of the battles had some thought put into them, some smart ways to leverage characterization to conclude a fight. The Zolda vs Ouja one, so great. Of course Kitaoka had a plan the whole time. Of course he wasn't going to fight Asakura unless he had some advantage. Using the police to corner Asakura, in a specially chosen reflection-less alleyway, it's a genius move. It's nice to see that Kitaoka cunning brought to bear in non-murderous ways (although I'm sure he's betting on Asakura being devoured by one-to-three monsters), to make his successes feel more laudable. I like not feeling a little conflicted about cheering him on. It's good to have him winning in ways that aren't completely scummy. Also, he didn't murder anyone, which makes him more heroic than Ren. So, yeah, this is the one where Ren Murders Someone. (Right upfront: I don't think Kamen Rider Boss/Shiro is really dead. Don't buy it, not for a second. That said, the issue isn't whether someone died, it's whether Ren murdered someone, which he absolutely did.) It's been a long road to get here, with a lot of twists and turns. There've been times where it seemed like Ren would kill every other Rider without blinking an eye, and there've been times where it seemed like he'd given up on trying to be a killer. Now, after fighting Shinji to a standstill (allegedly!), and finding every other Rider taking a personal day, he's got no one left to fight but Shiro. It's suicide, but he's going to do it anyway. Ren's a lot like Shinji at this point in the story. Shinji's plan in this one is to maybe find Shiro, maybe fight Shiro, destroy the Mirror World, something. He doesn't have a good plan, so he goes with his bad plan. Ren's got that same mentality here. As Yui points out, there's no pathway to victory for Ren. Even if he becomes a killer, there're too many Riders left to kill and not enough time to save Eri. It's pointless. But Ren's like Shinji, he can't ever do nothing. Ren can't concede defeat, can't abandon Yui to failure. He'll attack his best friend, try to become a killer, even throw his life away fighting a nearly-all-backhand godlike Rider, just to feel like he's doing something. He needs to try, always, at any cost. But, unlike Shinji, who more-or-less lucks into a way to save Ren by learning of the existence of the Second Secret Science Society aka Kamen Rider Tiger, Ren uses strategy and tactics to defeat Kamen Rider Boss. No, not defeat, murder. He murders him. It's a point of no return for Ren. It's the biggest decision this show has made, to spend 30-odd episodes telling us that Ren killing someone is The Line, and then crossing that line. It's shot perfectly, with Ren's triumph being framed as the eradication of his soul, of a psychic wound that's likely fatal. And, cherry on top, it was probably all for nothing, as a tear-streaked Eri opens her eyes in the hospital. Ren became a killer to save Eri, who didn't need saving after all. All his efforts did was make him a man she's ashamed of. So pyrrhic. So perfect.
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Currently working on: Go-Busters is next! Archive of previous shows on KamenRiderDie.com! Last edited by Kamen Rider Die; 07-29-2023 at 01:22 PM.. |
04-16-2020, 10:58 PM | #443 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,290
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Quote:
It’s a choice, and, short of killing off one of the two main characters with fifteen episodes left to go, the only choice they could make. Fight’s got to end without someone dying. It’s just, I’m shocked that there was zero effort made into showing why the fight stopped. Did their time run out? Did Ryuki have Knight on the ropes and split? Were they both too battered to continue? To have a fight this big, this important, be left to the viewer’s imagination… man, I don’t get it. I don’t know why you wouldn't spend a few more shots tightening that resolution up some. Weird choice. Unfulfilling choice.
Quote:
The rest of the episode was pretty strong, though. In contrast to the big Hero Fight, the rest of the battles had some thought put into them, some smart ways to leverage characterization to conclude a fight. The Zolda vs Ouja one, so great. Of course Kitaoka had a plan the whole time. Of course he wasn’t going to fight Asakura unless he had some advantage. Using the police to corner Asakura, in a specially chosen reflection-less alleyway, it’s a genius move. It’s nice to see that Kitaoka cunning brought to bear in non-murderous ways (although I’m sure he’s betting on Asakura being devoured by one-to-three monsters), to make his successes feel more laudable. I like not feeling a little conflicted about cheering him on. It’s good to have him winning in ways that aren’t completely scummy. Also, he didn’t murder anyone, which makes him more heroic than Ren.
Quote:
Ren’s a lot like Shinji at this point in the story. Shinji’s plan in this one is to maybe find Shiro, maybe fight Shiro, destroy the Mirror World, something. He doesn’t have a good plan, so he goes with his bad plan. Ren’s got that same mentality here. As Yui points out, there’s no pathway to victory for Ren. Even if he becomes a killer, there’re too many Riders left to kill and not enough time to save Eri. It’s pointless. But Ren’s like Shinji, he can’t ever do nothing. Ren can’t concede defeat, can’t abandon Yui to failure. He’ll attack his best friend, try to become a killer, even throw his life away fighting a nearly-all-backhand godlike Rider, just to feel like he’s doing something. He needs to try, always, at any cost. But, unlike Shinji, who more-or-less lucks into a way to save Ren by learning of the existence of the Second Secret Science Society aka Kamen Rider Tiger, Ren uses strategy and tactics to defeat Kamen Rider Boss. No, not defeat, murder. He murders him. It’s a point of no return for Ren. It’s the biggest decision this show has made, to spend 30-odd episodes telling us that Ren killing someone is The Line, and then crossing that line. It’s shot perfectly, with Ren’s triumph being framed as the eradication of his soul, of a psychic wound that’s likely fatal.
And, cherry on top, it was probably all for nothing, as a tear-streaked Eri opens her eyes in the hospital. Ren became a killer to save Eri, who didn’t need saving after all. All his efforts did was make him a man she’s ashamed of. So pyrrhic. So perfect. Last edited by DreadBringer; 04-16-2020 at 11:02 PM.. |
04-16-2020, 11:32 PM | #444 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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Quote:
Why do you advocate indirect murders more? I feel like this stance can be applied to Shibaura too. He only indirectly kills and didn't actually have a direct murder so Ren is less human than him too? Ren is also appalled by Kitaoka's asshole moments (while Kitaoka is appalled to Shibaura and Asakura), means Ren's douche has his limits and him constantly calling Kitaoka out means he's still a better person than him.
Killing another Rider - BAD Putting Riders in situations where they kill each other - NOT GREAT, BOB Allowing a Rider to be killed by their Contract Monster - GOTTA READ THE FINE PRINT It's... I feel like Kitaoka at this point isn't killing someone, he's just not saving them, which doesn't feel that terrible to me? Like, Asakura and all the other Riders (well, maybe not Shinji) knew the score when they joined the Rider Battles: you are making a deal with a monster who really wants to eat you. It's a risk every Rider takes, and it's not Kitaoka's fault if that risk goes against Asakura. I mean, I don't know about that. Ren picked that fight. He shouted FIGHT, not Shiro. In fact he's told multiple times to not pick this fight, that he can't win, that he's not powerful enough, that he can't win. Shiro tried to wave him off. Ren started that fight to murder someone, I'm not sure he claim self-defense at any point after that.
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04-17-2020, 12:26 AM | #445 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,290
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Quote:
I guess the levels for me are:
Killing another Rider - BAD Putting Riders in situations where they kill each other - NOT GREAT, BOB Allowing a Rider to be killed by their Contract Monster - GOTTA READ THE FINE PRINT It's... I feel like Kitaoka at this point isn't killing someone, he's just not saving them, which doesn't feel that terrible to me? Like, Asakura and all the other Riders (well, maybe not Shinji) knew the score when they joined the Rider Battles: you are making a deal with a monster who really wants to eat you. It's a risk every Rider takes, and it's not Kitaoka's fault if that risk goes against Asakura. Quote:
I mean, I don't know about that. Ren picked that fight. He shouted FIGHT, not Shiro. In fact he's told multiple times to not pick this fight, that he can't win, that he's not powerful enough, that he can't win. Shiro tried to wave him off. Ren started that fight to murder someone, I'm not sure he claim self-defense at any point after that.
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04-17-2020, 12:31 AM | #446 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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Quote:
But he wants to survive, he wants to live (those 2 are separate from killing someone), and Odin forces himself to actually commit murder, unconsciously, otherwise Odin sword goes to Knight's Deck, the only way to prevent that is stabbing Odin himself, killing in self defense. Ren is as shocked as Shiro that he actually went through that, "unconsciously", realized too late that Ren's lance already impales Odin's Deck.
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04-17-2020, 01:02 AM | #447 |
take me to space
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,406
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The thing I've been most impressed by in this thread is how you get to the end of these episodes with such thrilling cliff-hangers, yet manage to hold off watching the very next episode. I wouldn't be able to help but binge five to ten episodes at a time.
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04-17-2020, 06:50 AM | #448 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 2,547
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Quote:
Most of this stuff is over my head, but I am sincerely excited to get through all of these series so that, when a character makes a movie appearance, I'll be able to connect better with their story. It's tough sometimes, knowing how much I've got to watch in order to be looped in, but I think it's for the best that I do so.
I guess the only real roadblock I'm going to have when it comes to getting all the way current is the Kamen Rider Aqua stuff. I may to have to hold off on Zi-O and Zero-One and stuff for just a few decades, so I can get the most out of the OOO/Fourze movie first. It's just, I want to do this right, you know? |
04-17-2020, 06:51 AM | #449 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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Yeah, like, when watching Ryuki; I felt it was just so well-constructed and paced that it was something I couldn't help but keep on watching. A lot of Rider shows especially due to being ~50 episodes I often lose motivation for constantly watching and I have to take breaks, but Ryuki was one of those series that I just had to keep watching
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04-17-2020, 07:28 AM | #450 |
Warrior of Delusions!
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Wait, you dont know either?
Posts: 5,825
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Hehe Kamen Rider Society.
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Check out my occasional ramblings! https://akibamusings.blogspot.com/
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