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11-22-2018, 08:12 PM | #11 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,503
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Terrible protagonist.
Demon king!? Cmon!!! I’d rather a true hero!!! |
11-22-2018, 08:22 PM | #12 |
Hmm....
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,813
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I love Sougo so far. I think he is Takeru Tenkuji Ver. 2.0 with better character and personality......
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11-22-2018, 09:12 PM | #13 |
Omnipresent Historian
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: In the now.
Posts: 707
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Personally I like the plot progression that's been done, each episode has been a little bit forward and highlights a lot in subtle ways by using the cameos. It's not overt like other series have been with twists and turns, but it doesn't need to be. The character build itself is the climax twist. The looming shadow of the growth of now to Oma. And I'm sure Decade coming up will bring some interesting shake ups too. But it really hasn't strayed from any other formula previous riders have used, whether it's blade with their ep3, or so on. The show has the same tempo beats others have had, but in a different implementation. A more gradual character focus that humanizes the perspective more to an authentic degree, while maintaining flair in other ways.
They've been explaining the time jackers and woz along the way. Subtle and gradual, but all the details are there in show outside of the .5 episodes. Though the .5 episodes do make it easier to know what you may have missed. But the show really assume audiences are smart and doesn't treat them like they are dumb, and that's refreshing in how it's so subtle natural character growth. Characters aren't completely stationary, they've grown from where they were since episode 1, with many even attempting to fight against their own changing thoughts and feelings(as we're seeing with Geiz now). It's very gradual and beautiful in that regard. But the carry over back to the looming shadow of Oma should be coming back up as we get to Decade and what sets that in motion. Ruler vs Ruler. So far, this show has been as good as any other Rider show, but in different ways. You can't really compare them because they all have their own emphasis and messages of their time. And right now in particular, Zi-O is the exact kind of humanizing commentary of what makes a good ruler that's needed. Last edited by Librarian; 11-22-2018 at 09:22 PM.. |
11-23-2018, 03:35 AM | #14 |
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Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,301
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It's 11 episodes in and literally, nothing has happened. We don't anything about the Time Jackers or Woz(who also feel the same and just feel like plot devices to make monsters) Sougo, Geiz and Tsukuyomi feel exactly the same as they did from the start and show no growth. Oma Zi-O storyline hasn't been revisited at all and it's just so bland. As an anniversary series, I'm not impressed so far. The cameos are done at expense of the story telling
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Other Kamen Rider seasons started slow too. I hated Gaim until they stopped doing the dumb dance off competitions and watched almost 30 episodes of Kabuto before it got better. I'm not expecting too much from zi-o as I have low expectations for it. Erasing history of the rider after defeating the another rider is dumb. Why are they even making the Kamen Rider Build: A New World story if everyone in Build loses their powers?
speak for drive or even recent sentai aside from kyuranger. it's not as bad as ghost because of all the fan services. there's just no thril or enthusiasm/passion in the story arcs aside from nodding cameos, Easter eggs, and as well as replicating the tone of the original series. The opening and the apocalypse prologue made the series intriguing. However, the end result is lacking like Ahs. Absolute no tension at all. The female lead this time looks like she can serious be very capable and helpful, but she get sidelined as kind of a damsel. I have a hard time believing a last guy like zio can defeat Geiz multiple times with ease despite never being athletic at all. Geiz is suppose to be some post apocalyptic war soldier, but he get bested by Zio in brain and skill every week. I guess the twist is zio isn't "human" human. The another riders are pathetically weak. It's the same boring and predictable formula. So far, I can say 1-14 will be replicating the tone and referring to the original rider series they're paying tribute for the week. The fights are limited by merchandises being shoehorned in it like extra ride watches for no reason such as the secondary ones, extra forms, and Dan. It's like they made the ,5 episodes to justify the reality or their laziness and factors that ruin zio in a very comedic and meta way. Having the toku alumni returns so casually without being thenselves are bad fan services even if they pay attention to details to make the riders losing their powers and memories wearing the same clothes on the same set as when their series was still airing. I get they don't want to rehash decade fully, so instead of being a destroyer, zio just "steal" their power and memories making him the sole rider. I'm more intrigued about how Q2 will shake things up. It might be a pity that the collectible might be render useless. I have a feeling Ohma Zio might go Thanos. Geiz might have stolen some ride watches from him and the time jackers might cause him to lose his watches in the future, so he probably will be a early mid season threat if they're not saving him for the end like Lupin. I don't see him being the actual main villain since toku always change the storyline to be lighter at the last minute with cop out plot armor without repercussion or redemption nowadays. I'm eager to see a backstory for the new future riders(possible neo-fruit riders like) even if their designs are too bland and knock off Ghost like. Oh, I forgot the time jackers existed as the true villains. Kabuto like Hibiki and maybe Blade, some actually prefer the first half of the series before other writers kicks in and focus in making the hell bro trios the joke. They even ran out of budget for clock up and the finale. Kabuto is not getting much love nowadays despite being the 35th anniversary series with very subtle references and tributes. However, along with W, Deno, Kuuga, and maybe kiva/drive, the series really launch their career and they capitalizing on it.mlclb Kind of feel the inner joke about faiz actor got nothing better to do from the .5 web or net episodes. He looked kind of gastly like someone on med during Gaim movies. |
11-23-2018, 03:38 AM | #15 |
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Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,301
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Quote:
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Personally I like the plot progression that's been done, each episode has been a little bit forward and highlights a lot in subtle ways by using the cameos. It's not overt like other series have been with twists and turns, but it doesn't need to be. The character build itself is the climax twist. The looming shadow of the growth of now to Oma. And I'm sure Decade coming up will bring some interesting shake ups too. But it really hasn't strayed from any other formula previous riders have used, whether it's blade with their ep3, or so on. The show has the same tempo beats others have had, but in a different implementation. A more gradual character focus that humanizes the perspective more to an authentic degree, while maintaining flair in other ways.
They've been explaining the time jackers and woz along the way. Subtle and gradual, but all the details are there in show outside of the .5 episodes. Though the .5 episodes do make it easier to know what you may have missed. But the show really assume audiences are smart and doesn't treat them like they are dumb, and that's refreshing in how it's so subtle natural character growth. Characters aren't completely stationary, they've grown from where they were since episode 1, with many even attempting to fight against their own changing thoughts and feelings(as we're seeing with Geiz now). It's very gradual and beautiful in that regard. But the carry over back to the looming shadow of Oma should be coming back up as we get to Decade and what sets that in motion. Ruler vs Ruler. So far, this show has been as good as any other Rider show, but in different ways. You can't really compare them because they all have their own emphasis and messages of their time. And right now in particular, Zi-O is the exact kind of humanizing commentary of what makes a good ruler that's needed. I think they might go rebirth or last jedi if they want to upset viewers. Another theory I have is the grand paradox. Everything that happened up to this point is going according to history. The time jacker, woz, and tsukiyomi as well as Geiz are the ones that created zio. totally unintentionally for the time travelers, but it's ohma zio plan. With time machine flying around everywhere that can travel to even showa and feudal as well as prehistoric era, he probably spare Geiz because he's one of the contributing factor to his success. It's so forced they chose to settle on 2018 and hesitate to kill him. The time jacker could easily do the job. If this was written during the older days, Geiz would become an another rider and be a major foe like baron. I hope Overlord Gaim will be back and not just a one off. He's pretty much kiva from decade in a way. Looks like decade will be the only one defying the memory and power wipe. Ghost and Kuuga seems to be the "final" wave of another riders according to scans and toys catalogue. Deno could be for the movie and temp for build, but the bigger problem is their existence. There might be a gag with people thinking Sento is an actor for Heisei Gen Final. I don't think there will be a last minute Jo cameo reveal. I prefer kabuto being unaffected just because he's the self center Ksbuto. Last edited by VoidinToku; 11-23-2018 at 03:55 AM.. |
11-23-2018, 10:28 AM | #16 |
天心の英雄たち
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Maryland
Posts: 939
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It feels sort of gimmicky and rushed. I like the 'other Rider' designs, (Build and Fourze 'others' were fantastic.)
But I'm not hooked on the story like I have been for other Rider series. I'm pretty much just tuning in to see bright costumes beat on each other. The story isn't really going anywhere and each couple episodes sort of feel like a reprise of previous episodes. Like it's all just a gimmick to get Zi-O fighting 'Other Riders'. I don't dislike it, I haven't disliked any of the Rider shows. But some are really well done and interesting, and some are just....colorful characters, fighting. For me so far this one is firmly in the shallow end of the pool. |
11-23-2018, 10:36 PM | #17 |
The Immortal King Tasty
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Every diner you've ever been to.
Posts: 3,833
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I've been loving Zi-O for what it is ever since it started, but it's definitely not a show that, at least at the moment, I would blame someone for disliking.
It's hard to argue that it hasn't been fairly thin in terms of story and characters, and it doesn't help one bit that this is coming right off of Build, a show that was just about the exact opposite even by the same point Zi-O is at now. Of course, Build is a bit of an outlier, which makes that comparison somewhat unfair, so I'll also point out that even the much-maligned Ghost had already developed its characters more by this point. There's also the more unique problem of how Legend Riders and other guest stars are being handled. While Zi-O is leaps and bounds above something like Super Hero Taisen, it's clear Toei still doesn't have the best grasp on how to get the most out of returning characters (and this goes beyond them not getting to transform, which I don't think is a problem on its own). This is obviously one of the major selling points of the show, so them messing this up at all is obviously going to be disappointing. There are problems specific to individual episodes we could get into, as well, but needless to say, and especially judging by the other responses in the thread, it is NOT any sort of heretical opinion to say Zi-O isn't that good.
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11-23-2018, 11:42 PM | #18 |
Stronger Than You
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: nyet
Posts: 25,326
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I just...Can't bring myself to keep watching Zi-O. I find it so dull and bland. It really feels like the same old same old, except they're using the hook of cameos to pull people in.
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11-23-2018, 11:53 PM | #19 |
Omnipresent Historian
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: In the now.
Posts: 707
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Build is an outlier though, you're right. But it was also more a dive headfirst into full on reveling in the campy nature of toku itself, with some rather heavy themes along the way and other technique tricks in use that more or less feed into simpler audience understandings which helps make it more universally understood. Which isn't surprising, and it is a good show, but it is rather funny in other ways how it's so universally praised. By comparison, Zi-O is more subtle and intricate in different ways with less flash, and more character internal play, but still as much substance, whereas Build relied on flash and known tropes, while delighting in going over the top. Build was probably one of the most formulaic done in recent years though to be blunt. It was clear cut outline/recipe that fed off of blatant tropes and old references. It was essentially cannibalistic otaku fuel, what Miyazaki refers to much of anime as, and in many ways was deliberately intended as such, which to many is what makes it fun, whereas others don't see that and think it's fun for opposite reasons. Build itself was essentially an audience experiment. When you really break it down, every rider series is nuanced in their own ways and focuses. Some lean towards extroverted flair and full on soap opera dynamics, and others lean more internal and gradual character conveyance. It really is a series by series thing. But to say "the characters aren't developed" is inherently wrong. They've been developed and their gradual growth is embedded into the show as its core. The problem to some of this in audience conveyance isn't the show itself not conveying it, because it is, it's in wider areas of the audience, err, well honestly, it's going over their heads abroad while it plays fine in Japanese audience areas that get it and are readily immersed in it everyday as part of their own life. Some of those same issues are a thing in other properties too, and we see it often with comic books themselves. Certain kind of blatant material gets more hyped, when really, that's actually the thinner more trope like simple material. It plays more universal because it's more universal, but at it's core it's essentially "Wacky inflatable flailing arm tube man". Wider audiences are weird like that. And this proves especially true with material that's got different initial intended audiences where things are more played to aspects they know like breathing whereas that goes by in an outsider's notice from not living it day in and day out like they do. It's kind of a typical cinema thing, that's something that happens worldwide. But that is kind of the basics of it in differences. As humans go, the more colorful, wacky, and over the top, the more attention it tends to get. But this also varies series to series in what's needed to tell a certain kind of story. You can't randomly shove in something that doesn't fit to the kind of story you're telling or intrinsically it doesn't make sense, even if the audience itself may get all hyped for the extra flash and the new "wacky inflatable flailing arm tube man." It's one of the main glaring issues to why creatives and fans sometimes clash too. Different fan types, some that get better inter-character dynamics and slow builds, and those that simply don't get it without the "Wacky inflatable flailing arm tube man." It's a difficult truth to swallow for people, but it is indeed true and has been proven time and time again. Last edited by Librarian; 11-23-2018 at 11:56 PM.. |
11-24-2018, 12:18 PM | #20 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 157
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The cast is so boring
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