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08-25-2019, 02:54 PM | #41 |
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It's great that Rider history is back to what it was before Zi-O. Sad thing is, Kenzaki and Hajime are back to being Undead again.
Last edited by IndigoArms; 08-25-2019 at 03:03 PM.. |
08-25-2019, 03:42 PM | #42 |
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Well, that was stupid but at least it's over now.
Good to see that Build's finale is still getting work. I assumed it was going to enjoy retirement, yet here it was again for an encore performance. I haven't posted any Zi-O reactions in awhile because I fell behind and it took a few weeks to muster up the enthusiasm to actually watch the show but I figure I'll lay down some final thoughts. Zi-O wasn't Ghost-teir bad, but it was not a good show. It had some really high peaks (Agito) and some lows (Kiva), but on the whole it was just really bland and mediocre. Most of the characters were underdeveloped and uninteresting, with a lot of abrupt objective changes and unexplored motivations (seriously, why did Woz betray the rebels to follow Zi-O? This was never explained). I enjoyed Woz because it was hard not to and Sougo grew on me, but the Time Jackers, Tsukoyomi, and especially Geiz never did anything to grow on me as characters. This was a show that I watched primarily to see the returning faces and that was rarely rewarding because most were effectively playing different characters. The show's real bright spot was the point where they stopped erasing past shows and started bringing in the modern versions of these characters (Blade, Agito, etc.). That's still not really to the show's own credit, though, as fanservice and plot are not the same thing. As far as the finale itself goes, it barely made coherent sense. Like I and several others have said, it was ripped largely from Build. The parts that were uniquely Zi-O didn't make a ton of sense, though. I know that Tsukuyomi, as a character, was only slightly deeper than a small puddle, but I doubt anyone would seriously think she'd betray her friends (apart from that time when she randomly decided that Sougo had to die for two episodes). Zi-O finally turns into Oma Zi-O by... just doing it? There was no explanation at all for that. Grand Zi-O got curbstomped (again), Geiz died, and then the new belt just manifested out of nowhere. I liked the bit where Chekhov's Watchmaker finally paid off, but the actual Oma transformation came out of nowhere. Oh well, at least all of the Heisei Riders are back on their own separate worlds again, even though W through Ex-Aid were explicitly shown to coexist on numerous occasions. Hooray for whatever. Really need some expanding lore of royal family and ohma/woz, but like always they never give it to us and this series desperately needed more exposition. Pretty much ohma= all 2ndard and another ride watches, so it dwarfs grand and perhaps movie light version of ohma. The whole series is about him accepting ohma and rewrite history. We're next at square 1 with woz stalking. Vcinema and movie war might need some retcon, out if canon, or build level memory restoration. Out of all Heisei riders, only w manage to squeeze its vcinemas and movies together canon wise in nice smooth package. Last edited by VoidinToku; 08-25-2019 at 03:46 PM.. |
08-25-2019, 03:51 PM | #43 |
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Faiz and kaiza are dead like kiba. Damn, they cut the henshin poses. Did sougo cross slap tap side of the belt or just cross gesture. The same with final finisher. Like it or not, ohma zio stomp exaid, kuuga, dark kiva raw power wise and its gallery of technique is near infinite above decade and diend combine. Schwartz is just such a wild card obstacle. So his entire plan is force sougo to become ohma then steal shi power when he's still insecure and inexperience. I'm curious about the royal family world. Is it another decade shocker or ghost gangma family vibe? Tsuki and geiz transcend time and gets written by sougo as his bffs. It's weird he wipe his own memories as well.
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08-25-2019, 04:09 PM | #44 |
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Location: Belgium
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That was a stupid plan....If he wanted Zi-O to become Ohma while being inexperienced and unsecure, It would have to be at Ohma Day...not at the end of the series. Schwartz is such a wasted character...
Also, have I said that Shirakura needs to be gone from Kamen Rider for good? Yes I did...And I'm saying it again. Everytime that guy was in something, that thing become utter trash. |
08-25-2019, 04:39 PM | #45 |
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You know, I wouldn't even mind the reset ending if the context of it was juuuuust a little different. I get the sense I'm suppose to feel like Sougo is 'sacrificing' his great dream of becoming a king in order to make the world a better place and bring his friends back, but it really fell flat for me.
What would have made the drama at the end work for me is if Sougo decided that to save his friends, he would erase himself from time, but then Woz interferes with his own power. Sougo would be all 'no Woz lemme do this' and Woz is like 'no waga maoh you deserve better'. Considering all the other nonsense that has happened in this show, I'm certain most people could accept that he can just do that. The end result is that instead of Sougo's initial intention to just erase himself, it ends up making it so that Sougo still exists just without his memories like everyone else thanks to Woz, but Woz himself just continues to live in this world with no place for him, basically making him like Sento and Banjou in Build's finale. Secondly, that even makes even less sense that Woz can just fix everything you can't just band-aid that sort of logic. It'd make more sense for Woz to sacrifice himself for his Ma-oh kinda like Phillip did for Shotaro in Double. I think they pulled off Sougo's development in the end even if it was rushed late. Sougo realised how lonely being a king was from his older self and how tired and alone he sounded. So he chose his friends instead of his lifelong dream. It's about the journey to the conclusion, if you ask me. Quote:
Well, here we are. The official end of the Heisei era.
No matter how much you try to change the context, the "merging worlds" plot is way too close visually and conceptually to Build's finale last year. You get this feeling that you've seen it all before. The justification for it is kind of convoluted too. Tsukuyomi and Schwarz's world is disappearing because it lacks a Kamen Rider, so by turning Tsukuyomi into a Rider they manage to create a Rider world and can merge it with Zi-O's. Tsukasa even mentions that the world they are currently inhabiting is Zi-O's world. This just complicates the time travel aspect of the show in a way that's just ridiculously convoluted and I'm not even going to get into it. Speaking of Tsukuyomi, obviously we weren't going to get anything substantial from her Rider form but it was still disappointing to see just how little screentime it got. Oh and Geiz's death. Great acting, mind you, it seemed like a scene that was planned to happen but they couldn't fit it in logically. Geiz comes out of nowhere to take that hit and Schwarz waits patiently for like 4 minutes while Sougo says his goodbyes. It just doesn't feel earned at all. And then Sougo just resets the whole timeline/splits the whole Rider universe back into their respective worlds? The continuity is just... bah why should I even care at this point. The epilogue is boring. The time reset storyline has been done before and it's been done better. Build last year was better. Even Ryuki was better. Here it really lacks impact. . I get that Oma Zi-O's powers were not only to destroy but to also create, so that would explain why Tsukuyomi and Geiz can exist as students in the new timeline, but like all time-reset stories, it cheapens their big death scenes significantly. This is more a personal disappointment but I am bummed that we never got any returning actors from Kuuga. Here would have been a perfect place to have that cameo. As a finale to Zi-O it has its own set of problems, but as the end of the entire Heisei era in a show dedicated to bringing back legends? I know its a tall order but it could have been a lot more bombastic? Like I wanted to see an all-out Rider war. The return of the 20 main suits. The future Riders - would have been cool to see them contribute in the final battle instead of being forgotten about. Maybe some more legend faces in a montage like they did for Gokaiger? The main thing that kept me and many others invested in this show was the anniversary element of it. They tried with the core Zi-O story but it definitely isn't enough and it shows really badly here. There's no excitement, nothing to get hyped over. Well, except Oma Zi-O. I suspected a time reset ending after the build arc after all this being about time travel and Gokaiger being anniversary season that ended up reverting to status quo. So it was clearly bound to happen and I think they did this again because they heard ppl were happy about Build's ending because they were happy about Build overall. I will maintain this finale is better than Build's due to the action and character development but Build had better build-up. I think they were trying to do a spider-verse storyline where the Kamen riders were the Spider-totems of each world and I liked that logic to make Tsukuyomi a Kamen Rider. Love her design but that betrayal and death was pointless. Like at least show Schwartz gullibly giving her power back to give it some reason y'know. I feel they were trying to copy the deaths off Build and to make Sougo feel alone but only Geiz should have died. That scene was well pulled off tho' Is it me or was I the only one who saw the smokescreen that Sougo stepped out of before going Oma-Zio? It was clear Schwartz thought Zi-0 died in the blast because the smoke gave them cover. And oh gods, no. Do you know how many rider wars we've had now in how many movies now? We even had one in the Edo era, for pete's sake. (Tho' the most interesting) we don't need Kamen Rider Taisen again or Gokaiger 2. Rather be show be unique than a ripoff but I will say the tributes could have been done better Gokaiger-style with the theme songs always in BGM instead of once or twice. That'd have helped it way more. Zi-0 was fun goofy show with very loose time travel rules for a show and established that from the beginning. I think it was kinda clever to hide the slipshod mishmash of worlds into a plot point and use the Kamen riders as Totems. It'd have been cool to see the Kamen riders work together in a new way like Gentaro monitoring space and Kouta trying to fight the chaos of the time stream instead of just rider kicking the umpteenth time but actors don't seem to come back as much for Kamen rider sadly. Still better than build tho' It got repetitive for a long time. Whereas Zi-0 had surprises and curveballs along the way, good or bad. That's why I'd take it over a show where you know what's coming. |
08-26-2019, 12:56 AM | #46 |
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Join Date: Oct 2017
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I don't dislike Zi-O, but objectively you can't compare it to Build in terms of structure and plot/character development. Build felt written from ep1 to ep49 as one big thing (felt, not said it was) and every character felt like having a past that led them there. While Zi-O felt more like "so what are we going to tell this week ? oh yeah what about we go that way" and every character past is "they lived until now yo". Just ask a random person to choose 1 single episode every 10 episodes of Zi-O (random numbers like I don't know : ep 1, ep 13, ep 28, ep 34, ep 45 etc...), and you can lose the guy because he will have a hard time figuring where we are in the show. Just take the Geiz element "i want to kill you" => ""ok I tolerate you now" => "ok you're my friend somehow" => "no, I want to kill you again" => "i don't remember you" => "i'm dying for you". or the sudden and random Tsukasa appearances all along the show. You would lose anyone not sympathizing with the franchise I'm not sure someone doing the same with Build would be lost the same way. For sure they would not understand everything (like suddenly Sento being referred as Katsuragi sometimes), but they would probably feel that some things happened in between and not just randomly shifted just like in Zi-O. And they would probably be able to guess where we are. Last edited by Omnikaiser; 08-26-2019 at 01:00 AM.. |
08-26-2019, 01:35 AM | #47 |
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Awesome finale, but definitely was too rushed. It could've benefited having 2-3 more episodes.
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08-26-2019, 04:00 AM | #48 |
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Even if it is just 49 episodes that they have explained the prequel to episode 1 on how OmaZio got his godly power in the first place; and how Alpina and Swartz are part of a royal family who can control and freeze time be all that powerful, no explanations at all were given for these. Why does Swartz wanted to be more powerful than Alpina when he's the eldest and even got Decade's power., these two could have been the Decade and Bishium siblings in another timeline or that they really were Oma's offsprings.
Last edited by manoletian; 08-26-2019 at 08:14 AM.. |
08-26-2019, 04:41 AM | #49 |
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Quote:
Even if it is just 49 episodes that they have explained the prequel to episode 1 on how OmaZio got his godly power int he first place; and how Alpina and Swartz are part of a royal family who can control and freeze time be all that powerful, no explanations at all were given for these.
- Where the Time Jackers came from - Why they were so invested in dealing with Oma Zi-O - Why they had Time Mazine's that looked like Ghost's Iguana thing and Kiva's Dragon Castle - What the hell is the background of Swartz and Alphina outside of WE COME FROM A FAMILY THAT CAN CONTROL TIME |
08-26-2019, 05:08 AM | #50 |
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Stuff Zi-O didn't bother explaining:
- Where the Time Jackers came from - Why they were so invested in dealing with Oma Zi-O - Why they had Time Mazine's that looked like Ghost's Iguana thing and Kiva's Dragon Castle - What the hell is the background of Swartz and Alphina outside of WE COME FROM A FAMILY THAT CAN CONTROL TIME What the flying fuck were the DaiMazines? |
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