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05-29-2020, 12:08 PM | #11 |
Standing By
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 2,105
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I would put the subplots I don't like in 2 categories: Bad Premise and Bad Execution.
Bad Premise: ZX not getting his own show or movie Overlords in Agito Agito's summer movie Hibiki's summer movie Hell Bros in Kabuto Zeronos' memory problem in Den-O Time Travel in Kiva Super Hero War The first 9 episodes and final arc of Gaim Cinema in Battride War 2 Super Movie War Genesis Bad Execution: Kiriko and Ryouko arc in X Unidentified Lifeform #0 in Kuuga Mirror World in Ryuki Armed Saber arc in Hibiki Decade's "finale" Tajadol Combo's debut in OOO Post-finale arc of Wizard Drive's non-existent cameo in Gaim Nira arc in Drive Ghost's summer movie Kamen Rider Chronicle arc in EX-Aid Amazons Season 2 Time Travel in Zi-O Competition arc in Zero One I can't complain about Double Riders, Skyrider, Super-1, Black (RX), Shin, ZO or Blade until I watch them. And I can't find much to complain about Faiz, W, Fourze or Build. These shows must be pretty great to have almost nothing bad to think of.
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心 と 刃 Last edited by Sh Ranger; 05-29-2020 at 12:12 PM.. |
05-29-2020, 12:17 PM | #12 |
Monster Enthusiast
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Canadia
Posts: 516
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can i cut evolt from build
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05-29-2020, 01:04 PM | #13 |
Avi by @CSarracenian
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 4,186
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Every arc outside of the Dark Kitchen Knife tournament in Kabuto will now be removed
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05-29-2020, 01:09 PM | #14 |
Dai Shogun
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Germany
Posts: 7,529
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05-29-2020, 02:02 PM | #15 |
Alias: ZeroEnchiladas
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,585
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I know this is about Arc's but I am shocked that in this thread, someone remembered Cinema of all villains.
Given you know he's Game Exclusive and stuff. Shame him as the final boss is lame given he just possesses Bujin Gaim. Now if only that game had come out when Drive was like in it's post quarter 1 stuff. Then we could have had Cinema possessing Lupin as a final boss because man do those two's aesthetics work well together. Oh right this was about cutting out subplots/arcs and stuff huh? I mean to be honest, I wouldn't cut it out but I'd love to just structurally change the Competition Arc from 01 into something more interesting. That's one Arc I feel people genuinely unite in saying that it wasn't the best. |
05-29-2020, 02:08 PM | #16 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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I'm pretty adamant in that in concept it was an extremely important thing for Zero-One to do, but half the time it wasn't able to make it interesting and it certainly dragged it out a little too much.
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05-29-2020, 02:49 PM | #17 |
Alias: ZeroEnchiladas
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,585
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Yeah, honestly like the end goal, what happened in the aftermath, it was definitely important and that's why I enjoyed the series post that because it feels like that's what the arc was leading to. It's just, yeah, got way dragged out. Like it definitely is important, but it could have been structured and handled way better.
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05-29-2020, 03:08 PM | #18 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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Quote:
Yeah, honestly like the end goal, what happened in the aftermath, it was definitely important and that's why I enjoyed the series post that because it feels like that's what the arc was leading to. It's just, yeah, got way dragged out. Like it definitely is important, but it could have been structured and handled way better.
Like, Zero-One is very much a series about the advancement of technology and AI, and what role it plays in society as well as what role society plays in reaction to that. It's about a few other things but this is what's relevant to the positives I'm talking about here: if you're going to make your series about that, it's very important to showcase the sort of industries and careers that advanced AI and robotics would be relevant in -- especially when your target audience is pretty young and they need to be presented with a lot of different ideas. Zero-One's first arc was extremely effective at this and I think a lot of people would agree on that, but the introduction of ZAIA and Gai Amatsu presents a new spin on that: advanced robotics and AI may be useful in many different industries, but how necessary are they when humanity can do the same job, and can they even do jobs better than humanity in the first place? And there's a fair few instances where the show is very effective at providing commentary on this idea. The courtroom episodes effectively showed Bingo providing something extremely important and relevant to the job that no human could possibly do (finding and examining evidence in real-time while still making the case for your defendant, in such a way that a human would effectively have to be in two places at once). The fire brigade episodes took yet another unique take on the idea -- sure, it showed something Humagears could do that would either be impossible or incredibly difficult for a human to do (extremely heavy-duty lifting and heightened endurance), but it also very much begged the question does it even matter if they can do something different, highlighting how Humagears are just like people and what matters the most isn't just what 119 Nosuke could bring to the job, it was his very human spirit and courage. Both of these were excellent examples in progressing the themes of the series within the context of its new stakes and questions, and furthered the idea of how thin the line was between robot and human to begin with. But on the other hand, the flower-arranging episodes didn't have much of interest to offer -- which while you may argue is fine for an introduction to the tournament arc, it was not nearly interesting or engaging enough to warrant being a 2-parter and could also easily have had something else going on with other characters in the background. Similarly, I really don't know what positives the real estate 2-parter really did for the tournament arc, very much feeling like an even less interesting repeat of the flower-arranging episodes. Kamen Rider has an issue in general with strictly following a 2-episode structure, and Zero-One's tournament arc showcases that at its worst. If these were actually 5 episodes I don't think many would have an issue with it; but it was effectively stretched out over the course of multiple months and it's very easy to get sick of it given both those circumstances and about half of the arc not being interesting in its own right. Which is a shame, because as I said; I really feel that what it did do right was incredibly important, dare I say necessary to the advances of the show's themes and messages and what questions it was presenting to the audience.
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05-29-2020, 03:15 PM | #19 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 1,464
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Quote:
And there's a fair few instances where the show is very effective at providing commentary on this idea. The courtroom episodes effectively showed Bingo providing something extremely important and relevant to the job that no human could possibly do (finding and examining evidence in real-time while still making the case for your defendant, in such a way that a human would effectively have to be in two places at once). The fire brigade episodes took yet another unique take on the idea -- sure, it showed something Humagears could do that would either be impossible or incredibly difficult for a human to do (extremely heavy-duty lifting and heightened endurance), but it also very much begged the question does it even matter if they can do something different, highlighting how Humagears are just like people and what matters the most isn't just what 119 Nosuke could bring to the job, it was his very human spirit and courage.
Both of these were excellent examples in progressing the themes of the series within the context of its new stakes and questions, and furthered the idea of how thin the line was between robot and human to begin with. But on the other hand, the flower-arranging episodes didn't have much of interest to offer -- which while you may argue is fine for an introduction to the tournament arc, it was not nearly interesting or engaging enough to warrant being a 2-parter and could also easily have had something else going on with other characters in the background. Similarly, I really don't know what positives the real estate 2-parter really did for the tournament arc, very much feeling like an even less interesting repeat of the flower-arranging episodes. |
05-29-2020, 03:31 PM | #20 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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Quote:
Like I said, the flower-arranging story in theory works as an introduction to the arc -- you do actually have a somewhat interesting pull by asking if Humagears are truly capable of understanding, comprehending, and most importantly creating and expressing art beyond just a logical, dictionary definition. Hell, that's right out of the script from Zero-One's first episode -- "A dream isn't something you can just look up in a textbook". The issue is that the episode doesn't seem too interested in doing much with that, which would be fine if you're just presenting the basic idea... but then it goes on to be a 2-parter that also isn't doing much of anything else. So either expand on the idea of how Humagears interact with art; cut it down to a single episode; or - and this is something both me and Fish Sandwich have suggested in the individual episode threads - perhaps do something with your other characters. A specific example I recall bringing up was expanding on Jun Fukuzoe; one of the comedic side-characters and the Vice President aiming for the top of Hiden Intelligence. At the end of the arc when Aruto's leaving Hiden Intelligence, Jun gives a small speech about sticking with the company handed down to him by Hiden no matter what and striving to live by its ideals. That's actually a pretty interesting concept that gives his character more depth and informs many of his previous decisions... and also a concept that was never brought up before, so it kind of feels like it comes out of nowhere. So hey, here's an idea: put it in one of these episodes that otherwise isn't doing much character or thematic work! Work on your side characters so that your cast feels more fleshed out beyond generic stereotypes as the story's getting more intense, and ensure that his moment at the end of this arc has a lot more weight to it as dramatic payoff! It doesn't have to be Jun, of course; a little mini-spotlight on any character would do! Maybe even Yua Yaiba! Gosh, wouldn't it be cool if she got development and backstory and ideals so that her actions don't feel bizarrely out of place and so that maybe her turn-heel later could feel like it means something and wasn't completely pulled out of nowhere? Wouldn't that be cool? Wouldn't it be really goddamn cool if Yua Yaiba, a character a lot of people were excited for and were rooting for for many reasons, actually got a fleshed out complex character and had a reason to work for ZAIA other than because the story said so? Rants aside, really, just do something so that these episodes have a lot more meat on the bones. The structure's fine, but it just doesn't have a lot of substance to it so it either cutting it down, expanding upon the concept or doing character work elsewhere would make them satisfying.
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