Neat! Thanks! What did you think of the episode?

Sure! But at this point, after one episode, the approach of Yuuto is very much the approach of first-episode Kiriya. You said "He's a jerk to Ryotaro because he wants Ryotaro to think that he's this awesome badass who totally knows what's going on and who's way cooler than that Den-O loser," and that's almost entirely Kiriya's first storyline! They're both characters who are scared of looking vulnerable in front of people they want to befriend, so they go hilariously far into the opposite direction by looking like a contemptuous villain.

Like, I'm sure there'll be a ton of differences down the line. We're talking about a character designed by Inoue versus a character designed by Kobayashi. If I asked those two writers to pour me a bowl of cereal, I'd probably be handed a crepe with Froot Loops inside and some addictively sweet Froot Loop-flavored milk. They work different ways, and these shows are trying to do different things. But the introduction, the exterior of Yuuto and Kiriya, that part is very similar.

As a rule, I’m holding off on opinions until both episodes have been watched by you.

Okay! Got it!

Yuuto is like Kyosuke here, but with opposite reception. Yuuto was hated before he even made his debut, as his actor Yuichi Nakamura had annoyed so many people with his portrayal of Kyosuke Hibiki and fans feared a repeat performance. Yuuto's acting is really similar to Kyosuke here, but Yuuto is more of a jerk based on circumstances rather than being based on pettiness, and has redeeming side, but not shown now. Aside from Yuichi Nakamura (there's a Japanese VA with the exact same name as him too) went from a show with Oni to a show with Owner, there's also a resemblance between Hibiki and Momotaros and that led to some memes as well, with this also being referenced in later shows.

Yuuto also has spoiled part of his personality where he acts like a child when things don't go his way or putting many sugars in coffee before tasting it. Like common rival characters in fiction, he's also someone who looks down on trivial things like friendship, or has his own toxic way to process it (dominating them), berating Ryotaro or Deneb for suggesting that to him. I got the vibe of Makoto in Ghost for Yuuto, that from what the others like Ryotaro said, he used to be a kinder guy in the past, and circumstances likely happen that turned Yuuto into irritating jerk right now. For him having sharp edge, probably it's not a new development? Yuuto being spoiled is like Ryutaros, and the other Imagins are jerks as well except Kintaros. Deneb seems to be another Imagin who is just generally nice like Kintaros.

But what if it's not for dumb reasons and just character flaw (like the mindset about Faiz)? Yuuto inflicting that to Ryotaro and Airi is probably in-character, for him being irritating jerk who (likely pretends, or trying to harden himself into that) tries to not care for others and is strictly focused on the mission, likely considering feelings or such as weakness that gets in the way, including compassion like Ryotaro's that can lead into protecting people and disrupting the flow of time.

In this episode, there's a change where usually Imagins attack people to grant the contract holder's wish, this time, the Imagin attacks the contract holder instead to get their wish.

Yuuto continues the formula of secondary Rider, the cutthroat anti-hero compared to the primary Rider's ideal hero. Yuuto is focused on protecting the flow of time, and will try to ignore anything else for it, including protecting people, including making sacrifices to save the future, and also can use dishonest methods to get the job done at this time. Also for both comments nice catch of the comparisons between 2 things in the episode.

Yeah, Deneb has a lot of Jiiya in him, where he's trying to provide guidance for someone he cares about while being subservient to him. It definitely can lead to a spoiled character, but hopefully Yuuto can turn out as well as Tsurugi did, rather than how Kyosuke did.

The Makoto comparison is interesting, but I think this show is doing it in reverse? There may be a twist coming for the whole Yuuto/Sakurai story, but currently it seems like they're telling us that Yuuto eventually becomes the kind Sakurai at some point in the future. Even though Ryotaro knows him as a good man, this version is still the abrasive teenager.

This is exactly the same problem I have with Yuto's introduction. He's not an inherently bad character and I actually like his interactions with Deneb. I mean, Deneb is a ninja Imagin, of course I like him! It's just that Yuto is such a big story character and in a show titled Kamen Rider Den-O where plot is secondary to characters, I think that can be intrusive. The subplot with him and Airi is like the Yui and Kanzaki subplot in Ryuki. It's very important and yet very dull. I don't know why Kobayashi keeps doing this.

Exception: The coffee scene. That was humorous!

I mentioned before in the Hibiki thread that I prefer Kiriya out of Nakamura's two a**hole characters. I just think that Kiriya fits in to that show more, as an obstacle to the harmony and a catalyst for Shounen's development. Yuto probably has more personal qualities but I don't like how much the show focuses on him at the expense of everybody else. Like you said, Ryoutarou trying to keep the truth from Airi just slows everything down to a drag.

Yeah, my favorite Yuuto scenes were all of the non-Ryotaro ones! The coffee scene, the Deneb brawl, the shopping trip... those were great! He's a fun character to see running around, where he's trying to present a version of himself that people will respect, but it's all transparent and off-putting. Adding in Deneb as the part of him that is trying to course-correct, the tiny sliver of self-awareness and vulnerability, that's all great. And then all of the Ryotaro scenes were just:

YUUTO: I have a terrible secret.
RYOTARO: Can you tell me your terrible secret?
YUUTO: UGH, why do you have to keep pestering me about my terrible secret?

Every scene he has with Ryotaro in this episode is just this Simpsons gif:

https://media.giphy.com/media/3orif1...VYRy/giphy.gif

Yeah, time'll tell (sorry), but Kiriya was most instantly impactful to the themes of Hibiki, while Yuuto is more instantly impactful to the plot of Den-O. Yuuto, for all of his delightful terribleness, doesn't currently feel any different than a fifth Imagin on the DenLiner would.

KAMEN RIDER DEN-O EPISODE 20 - "I'M WARNING YOU NOW”

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den20a1.png
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den20b1.png

One of my favorite things about the structure of Den-O is how the various Contract Imagin the heroes use are really just aspects of a personality. One of the themes of the show is that we have all of these things inside of us, all of these parts of who we are, and we need to figure out how to best utilize them in order to live a worthwhile life.

Like, Ryotaro's Imagin are all characters on the show, but they also represent parts of him that he's buried, or that he's obscured in some way. Momo is his passion, Ura is his cunning, Kin is his bravery, Ryu is his protectiveness. How he balances the powers of the Imagin to detonate monsters is really just a metaphor for how we each get through a day. How we juggle all of these impulses.

The best part, to me, is how the show is clear that these impulses can be good and bad. Momo is passionate, which is something Ryotaro could stand to be more of, but Momo's passion can have him acting rashly and causing problems. Ura's cunning is helpful for solving problems and overcoming obstacles, but it's easy to see how it could become lying for its own sake. Kin's bravery is necessary for staring down an impossible situation and surviving it, but it can also make someone feel invulnerable and interject themselves into problems that don't need their attention. And Ryu's innocent devotion to Airi spotlights Ryotaro's commitment to family, which can also be twisted into overprotectiveness.

The thing is, the show's been telling that story for its run so far, and they usually come at it as Bad Trait > Good Trait > Neutral Trait. We see Momo act rashly, then we see Momo's rashness as a way towards victory, and we realize that emotions and drives are more about how their used. But it's almost always Bad before it's anything else.

So it's nice to get this Yuuto/Deneb story that has a jerk human and a good Imagin, giving us an inversion of the typical formula. It's a story where we get to see a team that's both more effective, and more unhappy.

If the main Imagin are the parts of Ryotaro that he has trouble expressing, it is delightful to see through Deneb that Yuuto's buried emotions are Politeness and Empathy. Whole scenes of Deneb trying to make a good first impression, trying to push Yuuto into being a better person, trying to let more kindness into the world... fantastic. And it's still following the No Good Or Bad Traits thing by showing how Deneb's deference and obsequiousness can create barriers to Yuuto's success in combat, in life-or-death situations. There's a time for politeness, and A Jellyfish Imagination Monster From The End Of Time Is Trying To Kill You is maybe not it. Maybe!

It's a great episode for showcasing the Yuuto/Deneb team. It's dead-on Den-O storytelling, but completely flipped around. It's about a kind, heroic Imagin trying to harness the power of a petulant, disruptive human, and how the balance of Kindness and Pragmatism finds success. It's a very fun story to tell.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den20c1.png

THE BAGGAGE CAR

-Sort of shocked that this show would have the guts to do an on-the-nose Buried Past story as the monster plot in a two-parter that is largely concerned with the Sakurai of the past. Bold! I think it worked okay as a parallel to the Airi/Sakurai plot that's more in the foreground lately, plus I just thought it was sweet? It's this very minor story about a guy whose fiance died, and about how him living a happy life is honoring her more than clinging to the past, and about how hard it can be to move on from grief. I just liked it.

-Naomi and Ura's synchronized choreography in the background of Owner's ZeroLiner exposition is maybe the main Den-O Thing that I'll remember after I've forgotten everything else from this series (a month after I finish watching it). It's just two actors screwing around while Very Serious Plot Things happen in the foreground, and I love it.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/clue.gif

KAMEN RIDER DEN-O EPISODE 20 - "I'M WARNING YOU NOW”

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den20a2.png
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den20b2.png

I sort of can't believe that an episode almost entirely devoted to showing off the Cool New Rider ends with the show going Yeah But Den-O's Cooler. Like, you guys! Hell of a swerve!

I think it works, though. It works because it's totally underplayed. It works because Yuuto has a bunch of incredibly valid points, but the show just goes So? at the end. It's an ending that only works if you value Ryotaro more than you value being right, and I guess I do!

I mean, this episode is all about showing you Yuuto's process and hearing his side of things. We get to see him interact with Deneb for the opening scene. We get to see him run down Ryotaro verbally, to question the effectiveness of a Den-O that doesn't put Defend The Timeline first. We get to see Yuuto question the story's victim, only hearing at the end of the story that the guy already told it to Ryotaro. Everything in this episode is putting us in the headspace to agree with Yuuto. This becomes his show, and Den-O is the unreliable Secondary.

Even when we're into the second-half of the episode, with Sword Form trying to stop a monster in 2006, Ryotaro is still doing the Wrong Thing. Instead of chasing down the monster, he puts Momo on hold to check on the stunned couple. He's more invested in saving these two than he is in stopping the monster.

And then it's the first appearance of Zeronos: a stunning sequence of Henshins, catchphrases, form changes, hilarious non-boasts (Deneb doesn't want that monster to think the Vega chestpiece is a functioning head! He doesn't want to deceive the rampaging Jellyfish Imagin), and badass finishers. In an episode built to say Yuuto Is Right, that whole fight was the goddamn exclamation mark.

But he's not right. Or, he is, Yuuto was more effective than Ryotaro, but it doesn't matter? It's not about Most Effective or Least Effective. It's not a contest. It's about personal responsibility, and being the best version of yourself that you can be. Yuuto's metrics for success aren't Ryotaro's, and that's fine. Ryotaro is going to keep doing what he feels is right. He might do it badly, but as long as he's doing his best he can be proud of himself. He's going to help that couple. He's going to save Sakurai for Airi. Because that's what he thinks is right.

And Hana knows that Ryotaro's heroism being rooted in empathy, in the small picture of a grieving would-be husband looking for closure, that's what gives Den-O the power to save the day. The two of them digging up that time capsule and delivering it to that guy, to viewing that as the real victory of the episode, such a fantastic ending. To do a whole story about a new, better Rider who you then immediately see as second-best… surprisingly great story to tell.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den20c2.png

THE BAGGAGE CAR

-The past-portion of this story took place fifteen years ago today! Happy Zeronos Debut Day, I guess! Let's all celebrate by getting mad at the people who care about us!

-Love that Zeronos suit, by the way. Super glad I ordered that new Seihou before I watched this show, 'cause I'm definitely going to want him on display. It's a little funny that he needed to be green, since that's about the only color that Den-O didn't end up using, but I think it works. I mean, I'm sure it's accidental, but having the envious Rider be green is a nice touch. The giant sword is great in Altair Form, and the Reassuring Shoulder Guns of Vega Form crack me up. Very cool suit, and a terrific fight sequence to introduce it.

Let me say this to start these are both very insightful and intelligent posts that not only make me appreciate den-o more, but also Kamen Rider in general more.

But also why did you divide these into two posts? what compelled you to do that?

(also expect a lot of bad jokes from me)

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/twice1.png
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/twice2.png

Dunno! Felt like it? There were really two big things I wanted to talk about: The Deneb/Yuuto partnership (ha ha, I put Deneb first without even thinking about it, hilarious), and the way the episode that was all about how cool Yuuto was became about how much cooler Ryotaro is. Didn't feel right to make one of those the lead and not the other, so I did both!

Also, I maybe took a cue from Ryotaro's attitude from the episode and decided to just do what I thought was right, even if it's only to make me feel like I was true to myself. Unlike all the other times, where I rigidly followed the rules and conformed to people's expectations...?

(Also also, I love how you can see in these screencaps how little Yuuto cares about how emotionally damaging it is for this guy to recount his story. He just wants to know where the monster is going to strike next! You can cry about your shattered life later, dude!)

-nods- -nods- That's fair, you do you mate.

Doing unnecessary things on these threads because it makes me happy is my Lucky Star!

This is what popped into my brain when you said "Lucky Star"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8hp2IkI2es

One thing that sticks with me about Zeronos is the cow nosies his belt makes. Ever since I first heard the belt in D-Video Special: Kamen Rider Yongou, I’ve wondered why his belt had such a bizarre sound effect (it’s certainly doesn’t seem obvious just looking at him).

In terms of the episode plot, this is another one that displays how little the Imagin actually care for being decent in granting their wishes, given how JellyFrieza essentially bullies the guy into saying he’s found the right capsule after little work. Not really sure if I have opinions on that.

So Zeronos and Deneb. There are two sets of motifs behind these two, one of them which I will share way later when you get through 20 more so episodes. The other one that I can share right now is that Yuuto/Zeronos and Deneb are based off of the Japanese lore of Ushiwakamaru(pronounced ooh-shi-wakamaru) vs Benkei. It is about how the hulking Benkei tried to take down Ushiwakamaru so that he can be the 1000th opponent he defeated and take his weapon to add to his collection, but Ushiwakamaru nimbly dodged his attacks to the point where Benkei gave up in the end. There is also a children's song about it but seems like the actual incident is still pending on whether it actually went down like that. Think of it as Kraven vs Spidey but Kraven eventually went on to be his humble servant after admitting defeat.
Now this song has historical ties in that it is based off specifically on Yoshitsune and Benkei, two historic figures from the 12th century. Yoshitsune was a commander and Benkei was a warrior monk who went on to serve Yoshitsune, and Yoshitsune had another name he went by when he was younger and that was Ushiwakamaru. In relations to that the reason Zeronos is based off a bull is because the ushi in Ushiwakamaru means bovine.
Respectufully Deneb is Benkei, and as Androzani84 pointed out previously he is also based off Karasu Tengu as well. The reason these two are Deneb's motif is because in fictional folklore Benkei is known to have ties with Karasu Tengu in fictional lore such as folklore and myths, etc.

I'll say this to start! I have to actively restrain myself from starting every thought I have about Den-O with this catchphrase, because Zeronos is my favorite secondary Rider ever! You'll notice in retrospect I even did so when talking about Kiriya for the first time in the Hibiki thread.

(Also: this is kinda the same deal as Asakura being "vexed" where TV-Nihon's clunky translation is something people like me are attached to because of how distinct it is. The phrase is the title of episode 20, so you can see how much the subs you're using having cleaned up that sort of thing.)

Anyways, yeah, Yuuto – love that guy! I could make an extremely long list filled with all the reasons why, because they're as numerous and complex as his weirdly thorough design motifs as Zeronos, but, as a quick sampler of some of those reasons:

- Zeronos' weirdly thorough design motifs, one of which Sunred just explained to you, the other of which will be more relevant in the next episode, and both of which hold clear thematic significance to Yuuto's character and his relationships with other members of the cast. One of the things I find most endlessly fascinating about Kamen Rider is how hard Toei and PLEX and all them always go on packing as much story and personality as they can into all these aesthetically appealing suits, and Zeronos goes even harder than most. I didn't even know about the Benkei/Ushiwakamaru thing until a few years ago.

- Zeronos would turn out to be the final secondary Rider with Makoto Itou as his suit actor, and he consistently turned in a heck of a performance. Zeronos is insanely active, selling you on those boasts of strength by casually flipping over his opponents and swinging around that ridiculously huge sword like it was just a tiny dagger or something. He's so cool.

- Naturally the sword itself – the ZeroGasher, in contrast to Ryoutarou's DenGasher – is also a huge favorite of mine. It's a big cool hero sword that turns into a sweet crossbow. What's not to love?

- Oh, and speaking of which, the way he contrasts Den-O and Ryoutarou specifically, as characters, is great. It's the typical primary/secondary Rider dynamic, but delivered in a more nuanced way that really goes to show what I love so much about Kobayashi's writing. Ryoutarou and Yuuto are natural opposites with plenty of mutual tension between them, but they aren't really at each other's throats all the time, either. It's a dynamic that brings out a lot more spine from Ryoutarou (I love him quoting the present-day Sakurai at him in 20), while also showing layers to Yuuto by framing his constant antagonism as him simply being extraordinarily bad at making friends.

- And, perhaps most importantly of all:

These episodes definitely do a great job reminding the viewer that Den-O is still the star in the end, and don't get me wrong, those guys are still great, but Zeronos being added to the mix is where the show really takes off for me, and I'll have yet more effusive things to say about him as you go along.

Wait, that's purely a TVN thing? It fits so well with Asakura's' character that that legitimately surprises me.

The specific word choice is. "Vexing" is an oddly highbrow sounding way for Asakura to express his frustration. I think イライラする is a lot more crass than that, and I've honestly never been sure why TV-N handled it the way they did. By comparison, "I'll say this to start" is just the usual problem of being overly literal and direct.

Well, the bull motif is pretty constant for Zeronos. The ZeroLiner, for sure, but the way the two bull heads swing over the front of the helmet to form the eyes for Altair Form as well.

Yeah, the longer the series goes, the more the MOTW Imagin are shown to be impatient in their desire to stop running errands and start ruining lives. They are as excited to get to the second part of these stories as the viewers probably are!

Neat! Thanks! What did you think of this episode!

One of my favorite things about this story, and the way it comes at the Primary/Secondary rivalry, is that Yuuto is a dick, but Zeronos isn't. All of the weirdly antagonistic and insulting stuff Yuuto does and says to Ryotaro, that stops when it's time for Zeronos to go to work. Yuuto's issue with Ryotaro is that he doesn't take his job as Den-O seriously enough, which means Yuuto's not going to waste time showing up Ryotaro or risk a loss by belittling him. That distinction... I like it. I like that division between Hard-Working Hero and Annoying Brat.

Feel like Jiiya can be biased to Tsurugi (not in demeaning way, but still can make Tsurugi get away scot free for his problems) even if he can soften him, while Deneb has more concern for others (albeit he does tell that Yuuto isn't a bad person). I was mainly comparing Deneb to Kintaros, as he's another Imagin without malicious traits. And about Makoto, "Ryotaro knows him as a good man, this version is still the abrasive teenager", well my point was that same goes for Makoto, "Takeru and Akari knew him as a caring friend, this current version is still the aggressive hostile man".

And probably, Imagins in the contract holders of the week is a representation of the potential worst side of the contract holders? That if they have enough powers and no moral, they'll do what the Imagins do to get their wish right? Kobayashi's shows all dealing with wishes, Ryuki with a war that grants the winner a wish, Den-O with wish-granting Imagins, and OOO with Greeed feeding off human desire. And for the Imagins except Kin (it represents Ryotaro's moral too then?) having negative traits... that would qualify for Ryotaro too... right? Like you said there, Momotaros turning him into a violent misfit, Urataros turning him into manipulative jerk, Ryutaros turning him into a trigger-happy spoiled man (him insisting to kill a contract holder). They represent Ryotaro's trait taken to the extremes.

Yeah, this one's an inversion where the human is worse and the monster is better. Deneb is like you said, probably the soft side of Yuuto that is stated by Nogami siblings, and likely if this Yuuto still has it, something that he tries to push away, like Kobayashi's previous secondary Rider Ren. And actually, contrary to popular belief, like what you talk here about balance of kindness and pragmatism, Yuuto's personality of being adverse to something like friendship or feelings, viewing those as weakness, is actually detrimental, because they can eventually lack the efficiency due to them pushing others away, without any support needed to overcome the odds, or that they can make things worse too (just like if kindness is taken too far), just like Tsurugi, pushing away others because of self-righteousness and is intolerant to others' views (like Yuuto to Den-O in this fight), it can just cause a civil war between protagonists, hindering their effectiveness a lot (either reduced bad guy fighters, or harmed allies that turned into actual dead weight against foes). And for you saying Deneb barrier-ing Yuuto's success in combat, I don't think I'll agree on that, Deneb doesn't like hold back on the Imagin or something, he just fights and eliminates them as usual.

Well, with Den-O setting being based on time travel, like the dog before, this situation can potentially be changed by saving the fiancee, as the time travel rule here is the usual change the past change the future type. But this will lead into the argument of, saving others or changing the flow of time (which is like Ryotaro vs Yuuto at this point) which I wonder which changes are small enough to not change the flow of time, including before where the dog is saved by Ryotaro, where this one is just like Tetsuo one, improving the condition of someone griefing based on the past, and giving him a closure needed to push forward.

I wish that Ryotaro checking the contract holder and Den-O fighting monsters can be utilized more strategically like, Ryotaro and the Imagins are more than 1 being, I wonder if the Imagins can fight and hold off the monsters by themselves, while Ryotaro goes to check the contract holders. They're going to the battlefield by possessing Ryotaro either in human form or as one of Den-O's forms.

Don't think that Zeronos' finisher is that cool, well I just had tight marking of Rider's finishers. Zeronos' default form seems to still possess Deneb's traits like the green color, and most importantly, it's strong enough to fight off monsters unlike Plat Form. Deneb taking part of Zeronos instead turns it into new form, Vega form.

Yeah, like above I said, Yuuto's not right. And wouldn't talk about Yuuto being more effective than Ryotaro either, pushing away friends would deride them of the supports needed if one can't overcome the odds, or create an infighting between allies like Tsurugi, fighting off allies because of you disagreeing with them, which will just injure and tire out both allies, rendering them too weak against the actual foes. Yuuto is solely focused on only protefcting the flow of time, without (at least on surface) care for other things, so of course his way will accomplish his goals as it's only for protecting the flow of the time, but will it be the right way and improve the situation, creating the best outcome for everyone else? Not necessarily. Ryotaro doing what he thinks the right isn't bound by rule, like the changing the flow of time part, and that reminds me of Yusuke who "borrows" a police bike as his sense of right and wrong doesn't have much to do with the law. Hana also previously asked Ryotaro about his choices that can potentially change the time flow, but Hana is a hostile figure to the Imagins, but total opposite to Ryotaro, especially with the actual proof of Ryotaro's action making the situation better for others while keeping the time flow same, Hana's full support of Ryotaro also includes his actions here.

Ah! This reminds me of several more things I love about Zeronos:

- Having Altair Form be something he can access entirely on his own further illustrates the difference between Yuuto and Ryoutarou, with the former not needing to borrow anyone else's strength; while Den-O is basically powered entirely by friendship, because the latter is incapable of doing anything himself. It really nicely reflects the difference in personality between the two that Vega Form is an option for Zeronos, while also having him arguably be less flexible overall.

- It's been said several times in here already that Den-O set the formula Rider would start employing from around Double to Wizard, and one of the things I love about that era of secondary Riders, that I think really started with Zeronos, is how they're like a watered down version of the main guy in some ways. Accel only has one Memory; Birth uses Cell Medals; Meteor relies on martial arts rather than a wide array of Switches; and Beast gets cute little shoulder capes instead of actual new forms. That sort of thing. With Zeronos, he's only got the one Imagin (you might say it's a case of quality over quantity for Yuuto~), and instead of the fancy modern contactless train pass, his are just plain cards he jams into the belt. It's a simple thing, but I don't know, I just find it really neat.

(Also, I'm now half-seriously wondering if I should numbering these? Seems like I've got a lot of 'em in me!) :p

I think Kin's bravery and commitment have been shown to have negative sides? His tendency to needlessly self-sacrifice instead looking for a better solution, or how his need to offer assistance can lead to him butting in where he's not needed. He means well, more so than the other Imagin (mostly), but he's still something that needs to find the proper balance.

Pretty sure this story says that the fiance knew she was sick before burying the time capsule, so there's really nothing extra Ryotaro could've done in the past to save her.

To date, none of Ryotaro's Imagin have be shown to be able to exist physically in the real world. The second they get knocked out of possessing him, the end up back on the DenLiner. It looks like only Zeronos gets to have a helper on the battlefield!

Yeah, Vega Form feels different from any of Den-O's forms. When Ryotaro calls on the Imagin, it's because he believes in them. When Yuuto calls on Deneb, it's because he's stopped believing in himself. It shows in the way the two humans communicate with their Imagin when they're teaming up to fight a monster. With Ryotaro, it's guidance and pep-talks. With Yuuto, it's frustration and resentment.

KAMEN RIDER DEN-O EPISODE 21 - "FIGHTING STYLE”

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den21a.png
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den21b.png

This show! When it leaves aside the overarching horseshit about destroyed timelines and displaced fiances, and settles in for an internally-generated and insanely comedic look at jealousy and resolving rivalries, it is absolutely unbeatable. The more this show focuses on a half-dozen weirdos trying to express themselves, the better it is.

I mean, god do I not care about parsing out the mysteries of Yuuto and Hana. It's a mix of contradictory theories, serious looks, pregnant pauses, and unresolved questions. It is Exhibit A in why I generally don't expend any brainpower on Kamen Rider series mysteries. They'll tell me when it's time for me to know, and every scene that addresses it prior to that point is something to be suffered through. The episode clearly shares my sense of aggrieved disinterest, since the choreography in the early exposition is jaw-droppingly clever and distracting.

Like, I couldn't be less interested in the equivocations of Owner, but that whole choreographed routine he did with Ryuta! WHAT! The bit where Ryuta drops the cane onto Owner's ankle, and Owner kicks it up into his own hand?! The whole thing would be needlessly showy, if it weren't for so much of the dialogue being a boring recitation of Time Nonsense. As it is, the weird posing and dancing was the best part of that scene!

Everything after that is non-stop greatness, though. After an overly-seasoned meal of otherwise bland meat, here's a nearly episode-length dessert.

There's a plot in here (Ryuta is jealous of Yuuto's history with Airi), and maybe a theme (disciplining children?), but it's all so secondary to how unrelentingly fun this episode is. It's both ludicrously funny and thrillingly adventurous, a combo that I have no defense against.

The comedy is mostly Deneb-related and, yeah: maybe the best character on the show? His pure-heartedness and too-trusting nature makes him an amazing comedy partner for the perpetually grumpy and accusatory Yuuto. Having a plot where Deneb dresses up in a tiger costume so a vendor can take a nap, and that's an episode-long runner... insane. That is lightning in a bottle, and I can only imagine how thrilled the production team was when they saw the first cut of this episode. Literally every Deneb gag in this killed. The physical comedy never stopped cracking me up, with the pinnacle being this gif that I will probably laugh at forever:

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/...stigerform.gif

The DenLiner Imagin don't fare much worse, comedically, since it's the Grown-Ups trying to wrangle Ryuta and it does not go well. The escalation of Ryuta's drawings covering more and more of the floor, and the Imagin treating them like hot lava... it's just more expert choreography in an episode already brimming over with it.

Which, yeah, that's why the Gun Form vs Altair Form fight is so good! There's so much fluidity to each fighter's moves, and the editing really lets the stunt performers show off. Cuts are spread out to really sell how serious this fight is, how it's potentially fatal to Zeronos. You get these disorienting shots from Den-O and these desperate swings from Zeronos, tense dodges and strategic reversals. Just a nail-biting action finish to a consistently entertaining episode.

This one was a real winner. I don't have a lick of interest in Hana's lost timeline (and I like Hana!) or Yuuto's mysterious history (and I like Yuuto!), but when this episode put that stuff to bed and just relaxed, I was having a great time. Fun-ass show, you guys.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den21c.png

THE BAGGAGE CAR

- ...I just want to watch that gif again.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/...stigerform.gif

Look all I really remember about this episode is Ryutaros and his flunkies aggressively breakdancing at Yuuto and if you don't understand why that's the best thing ever then you're not as real Kamen Rider fan.

Den-O definitely works more as a series of standalone vignettes more than it does as an overarching plot (you’ll get more fuel for this fire later on). Just a shame it can’t commit to either.

Anyway, time for a look at our two-in-one Imagin’s VA.

Koji Ochai

Notable Anime roles: Reuben in Stitch, Tetsu Trudge in Yu-Gi-Oh! 5Ds, Celestino Chaldini in Yuri on Ice.

Notable Tokusatsu roles: Black Knight BullBlack in Seijuu Sentai Gingaman.

Notable dubbing roles: Douglas J. Needles in Back to the Future Part II, Papa Midnite in Constantine, Aladeen in the Dictator, Wheelie in the Transformers film series, Ben 10,000 in the Ben 10 franchise, Tommy Oliver in Moghty Morphin Power Rangers.

Plot aside my biggest focus at the time was Zeronos himself. It was two years after Hibiki so I was genuinely shocked to see Nakamura the actor come back for more, which also lead to curiosity. First impression I got was Kyosuke 2.0 but now with a personal babysitter. :lolol
The Zeronos suit I instantly fell in love with it. I like how Altair form is the rider form being more agile yet strong while Vega form feels like the heavy duty masked form in a sense. Which reminds me, this was our second green kamen rider to be of the bovine kind since Zolda(and our third green bovine hero if you include super sentai's Magi Green from Magiranger, Ohranger's green ranger had a green bull robot but his motif was not a bull so that does not count).

Yeah, if I recall it was after this show he switched to stunt doubling and went to a agency called Takeshi Racing which mostly handles automobile-related stunts for tokusatsu. I thought he was wanting to be more of a traditional actor but seems like this was why. He later quit showbiz in whole to be a judo therapist but recently seems to have participated in Dogengers alongside Seiji Takaiwa and Katsuhiro Suzuki who played Hiromu/Red Buster and Mondo/Kamen Rider Quiz.

He is also in terms of suit color a polar opposite to Sword Form, red contrasting green and all.

A little shocked that the Seihou Gun Form figure didn't come with pivotal, character-defining accessories like Ryuta's dance crew, Dance Dance Ryutalution. Another failure from Bandai!

That's just the nature of the beast? A year-long Kamen Rider series always has to balance one-off stories with longform narratives. You can't ever just do one or the other, even if you're a show that's more successful at one type. Making a goofy, fast-paced MOTW show that never grows its mythology is going to get stale, so we do need some big Plot stuff to push the characters into new situations.

I just feel like the Hana/Sakurai stuff right now is too vague to get excited about, and they'd be better off giving us something more tangible to react to.

Yeah, it's a little weird that they cast Asumu's Rival to play Ryotaro's Rival a couple shows later. Usually, you might push a background/one-off player up to the main cast (Asuna was in a Ghost HBV before Ex-Aid), or cast against type (Dr Maki from OOO is a slimy executive in Amazons). You don't usually just put the same guy in the same role, especially with so little time between shows.

Actually in Super Sentai now that I think about it there were instances where actors would appear as one character and then appear in the next show as someone else. Take Junichi Haruta for example aka Hirose's dad in Blade. During his prime he was the black ranger in a show called Goggle V and in the very next show Dynaman he was that team's black ranger as well.

Not just in Sentai alone, but also looking at both shows' repertoire of actors. A pretty big recent example being the actress of Kanon from Ghost getting to play Sena/Kiramei Pink in Kiramager. Which, sure is a bit of a jump; but they're still core cast members and have similar traits. Sena honestly feels like how Kanon would be when she grew up...

Point is, you usually don't see it in Rider alone; but when you compare other shows you start seeing more crossover than you'd think.

Oh well I was talking about negative side being toxic qualities, and what you talk about Kin isn't one (self-sacrificing to a fault definitely isn't one). But ok I got you, Kin's martyr without a cause tendencies are definitely a flaw too, but a case of selflessness taken to the extreme.

It's unfair to Ryotaro (eh wait what do I expect)... Someone weak is given an useless default Rider Form, basically keeping it stagnant. Someone powerful is given a powerful thing from the start. No balancing on the Rider/wielder choice. The watered down version of the secondary Riders having less items than the primary Riders from Den-O, also sparks a comparison to me between heisei phase 1 Riders to heisei phase 2 Riders, for main Riders.

Well yeah, the worldbuilding in OOO is far more mature and complex than anything Kobayashi's ever written before. Both Ryuki and Den-O has this thing regarding the worldbuilding, not learning all that much and leaving unanswered questions. Den-O is the one that is commonly regarded as this in the community, bad plot but compensated by characters and comedy. Though for you, it's pretty much every phase 1 show as far as I've followed. Just talking about how Den-O is a birth of phase 2 tropes, like all you talk above the baggage car, but has this phase 1 thing that isn't.. your cup of tea (good or not is subjective, like the weird posing being the best part of that scene statement). The Owner seems to have a talent regarding stick of how he can skillfully kicking it up into his hand.

Well, I talked about how before Yuuto's abrasive demeanor can cause unnecessary infighting in team, that I want to use as an example of how being a hardass also isn't always a strength or making you more effective, but this time, it's Ryutaros who creates unnecessary infighting, especially for Zeronos-related reasons, that his transformation amount is limited. Ryutaros' mindset is based on how power is everything, and he's like a child. I guess that also comes as a truth for childs (including me at the past) who is focused only on action parts on everything, I hope this part can may be teach kids something about that.

Yuuto's negative trait shows more here, that as someone who is focused on the mission only, he only cares about that, and he's against helping people even the people in present time, which is what Deneb is doing, and he got abused by Yuuto for that. I've seen similar parts on KR series like Deneb dressing up as tiger though.

As an artist, I approve of the DenLiner residents trying not to step on them, treating them like hot lava, although they regularly walk on the chairs and the tables (do people take care of DenLiner's hygiene?)! I'd have some questions regarding this part, like where do they get more and more papers, but this is a bizzare gag scene which is likely just run on rule of comedy. Someone should come up with an idea to use those drawings as decorations in DenLiner.

Sena is Kirama Green, portrayed by Shinjo Yume. The actress you're referring to, Kudo Mio, portrayed Sayo.

Yeah, my mistake. I love both but "Kiramager girl with a four-letter name starting with S followed by vowel, consonant, vowel" mixes them up a lot in my head!

The power thing... I think it's a just a way for Ryuta to qualify his jealousy? Like, he's furious at Yuuto for having a connection to Airi, and he's looking for a) ways to understand why Airi would be interested in someone other than him or Ryotaro; and b) ways to be more Whatever He's Lacking than Yuuto. When Kin's like Women Like Power, that's all it took for Ryuta to want to prove that he's more powerful than Yuuto. If Kin had said that Women Like Baking, I imagine we'd've gotten a story where Ryuta tries to bake more food than Yuuto and why did I say that now I just want a story where Ryuta goes full Tsurugi on Yuuto and tries to best him in stupid and pointless ways.

"I'm the Imagin who's going to stand at the top of everything, 'kay?"

"Are you impressed by my noblesse oblige? Can't hear you!"

I just figured that, as soon as Naomi saw how much Ryuta's coloring was irritating the other Imagin, she just gave that kid a gigantic stack of blank paper. A good rule of thumb for determining how a situation on the DenLiner got out of hand: Probably Naomi.

KAMEN RIDER DEN-O EPISODE 22 - "AN UNSPEAKABLE FUTURE”

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den22a.png
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den22b.png

So, downsides for this story:

-The fact that Yuuto doesn't really know anything useful, beyond the possibility that Hana's future might possibly maybe exist or might possibly maybe return to existence... man, come on. That is a huge carrot to dangle in front of the audience (the truth about Hana's connection to the ZeroLiner!!!!), only to give a payoff of more questions. Real sour note for this story to end on.

-Similarly, the conflict between Ryotaro and Ryuta is acknowledged, but there's no real solution to it. There's this middle point in the episode, where Ryuta and Ryotaros are at this total impasse, where it seems like the episode is going to have to touch on this again. It's this huge problem, so this story needs to address it. Nope! Isn't really relevant for the rest of the episode, since Ryotaro is able to defeat the story's monster(s) with Rod Form.

-The story with the candy guys is funny, but it doesn't really have any layers to it. They're just two jerks who don't learn any lessons. It's a story that needed some change from them, and it basically doesn't have it?

Upsides:

-It was hilarious and any complaints are irrelevant.

This story... I don't want to say you're wrong to judge it by any metric other than Are You Laughing, but that's sincerely the only way to talk about this story. As long as you're laughing, the story works. It's that binary.

Like... there're points where this episode could've gone darker. Hana's injured by Ryutaros! Yuuto might hold the key to Hana's missing timeline! But the episode might allow for a moment to affirm the stakes, while basically throwing them away when you're not looking. Each new scene resets the story to Extremely Wacky, and anything that'd counteract that gets ignored. Hana's injured, but as soon as she's like I Need To Wear This Tiger Costume To Save My People, the episode stops treating her injury with any seriousness. Ryuta tells Ryotaro that he's still going to try to murder Yuuto, and Ryotaro tells him Literally Over My Dead Body, and then the end of the episode is Ryuta trying to hit Yuuto with Deneb candy and telling Yuuto not to come back. (One of the best gags, incidentally. Deneb shields Yuuto from the thrown candy, and then bows to Ryuta in... apology? Gratitude? It's insane, and I adored it.)

But who cares! Who cares. This is an episode where Deneb produces a basket of apology Deneb candy from under his skirt. This is an episode where Momo's only contribution (he's very grumpy about this story!) is flinging some dude a world-record distance. This is an episode where an imagination monster from the end of time is nearly thwarted by a dude who can't remember that he made a wish, leading to a woefully unenlarged Time Hole. This is an episode where Kin and Uta exist as hourglass ghosts inside an Elephant and Penguin mascot costume, respectively. This is an episode where Rod Form asks a monster if it'd like to be reeled in, and the monster says I'm Not Into That. This is an episode where Deneb's attempt at a catchphrase is that he can't think of a catchphrase.

It's hilarious. It barely works as a story (stakes that go under-addressed, a plot that everyone probably should've walked away from), but it's so unrelentingly funny that to cite any other attribute is like decrying water's inability to be dry. It's funny as shit, and that's more than enough for me tonight.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/deno/den22c.png

THE BAGGAGE CAR

-I really love Vega Form's transformation! The way the cape deploys, the whole thing with the drill flashing open into a star-shape, the Reassuring Shoulder Guns... it's so good. It's easily my favorite form change so far.

-Very weird to have a story where one to two plots are entirely about Airi, and then Airi doesn't make an appearance in the second half. Sort of thought the Ryuta plot could've used her, but nope! I did appreciate Ryotaro telling that kid he'd kill them both if he can't contain him, since it's Ryotaro treating Hana's near-death experience with the appropriate severity. It just feels like the show didn't think of a way to even temporarily defang Ryuta, so we're left with I Guess He Won't Try To Kill Yuuto Today, which... maybe our heroes should aim higher than that? It's a thought!

I'm not sure why, but I'm really amused by how little effort went into developing the contract holder this time. The show knows that its main focus right now is working Yuuto into the cast, so it gives us the bare minimum of a monster of the fortnight plot (speaking of, I always disliked this monster and his weird rabbit brother - not sure why, but I find both to be really obnoxious). That said, I was constantly amused by seeing both him and his boss in full, end of It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World-style traction.

My favorite scene of the episode, though, was the aftermath of Momotaros hurling the random thug, where Ryotaro is trying to transform without falling over. I just love how Yuuto is standing there, realizing that this madness is what he has to work with.

Let's see, other points... I liked the last bit before the credits where Ryotaro stands up to Yuuto over the promise to Hana. I've said before that I really respect Ryotaro's willpower and this was an excellent example of it. And we got to see Naomi outside of the Denliner. That's pretty rare and it's fun to see her get more involved in the story.

Which reminds me, Hiroshi Miyauchi who was Kamen Rider V3 was also acting in sentai shows back-to-back for Gorenger and JAKQ, having played Akira/Aorenger and Shokichi/Big One respectively. And Kenji Ohba of Gavan fame was Shiro/Battle Kenya in Battle Fever J, and the very next year went on to play Daigoro/Denzi Blue in Denziman.

Showa actors went wild with this back in the day!

Don’t really remember much about his episode (doesn’t help that the next couple are ones I have some fairly vivid memories of and have something to talk about for all of them). Though I will point out that unlike DenLiner, ZeroLiner’s two modes don’t have names. They’re simply called Drill Mode and Naginata Mode.

Though I do like that Isurugi gets another moment to shine. Especially considering how little attention the concurrent Sentai series gave to its ancillary mechs.