Wait-wait-wait-wait, I was suffering through Wizard when I noticed the intro changed, obviously advertising a movie...

...with W in it.

You all explain right now. WHY DID NO ONE TELL ME AND WHERE DO I FIND IT WHAT'S IT CALLED IS IT ON YOUTUBE WHAT KIND OF MOVIE IS IT?

Oh yeah, the Wizard episode is about a sweets maker. He's a bit of a task master, but this is the second episode of the arc and so far he's not that big of a jerk. He actually DOESN'T blame anyone rashly for his problems, and isn't despairing that quickly.

Speaking of, how many people despair in this show? Seems kind of lame that all these phantoms exist and we never see any of these jerk-butts die. Granted the villains suck just as much shit, so I don't want them winning at all, but still.

You mean the OOO x Fourze movie? It features a couple of cameos by Philip, Shotaro and W. Sadly, they're in it far too little, but it's a really enjoyable movie, if you like OOO and/or Fourze.


Megamax, I think it's called?

I'm pretty sure it's advertising Movie War Ultimatum.
I don't recall if it's been subbed, yet, though...

He said he's watching Wizard, so it'd be Ultimatum, not Megamax.

Wait, is that what's being advertised? Why is OOO/Fourze being advertised in Wizard's opening?

But the footage I saw showed scenes not in Megamax, and Accel was there.

Oh, I'm not quite there yet in Wizard (stopped so I could finish Fourze). I haven't seen it then, especially if it's not been subbed yet.

How do the films work? I'm a Power Rangers fan more than I am a Kamen Rider/Sentai fan, so am I missing out on half the stories by not watching these films, are these films even canon or what?

Pre-Decade, the only series with a canon movie was Den-O. The rest were all alternate universes.

From Decade and onward, the movies are all canon to their series.

It depends, but just about everything after W's (including W) movies are in-canon, so yeah they require viewing for the full story.

And am I actually missing out if I don't watch the films like do they actually further the characters or stories or are they just another adventure for the characters?

It varies from movie to movie, really.
Decade's was a proper resolution for his show, Double's was fairly important, OOO was just another adventure, Fourze...Netted him a rarely used power that goes unexplained if you don't watch his movie, and we'll see if Wizard's movie is important or not in 4 months :lol

Back to Carbon Rider Willard for a sec, even teh Phantoms are dumb. Wizzy uses his Hurricane dragon wings, and he's all like "you can fly too!?" Um, he was flying before. He can always fly in regular Hurricane mode. That's what Hurricane does! That's how he chased you there!

Also what, he used the shrink ring to... punch him and make him fall. Which he could have done better at normal size. Even the fights in this show make no sense.

Sorry to double-post, but man these phantoms are dumb. Medusa is the worst villain ever. Lizard man has Wizard basically fucked and surrendering, then she knocks the hostage away. Seriosuly, all Lizard had to do was tell him to de-henshin and then Medusa could kill him easily! Add to that, instead of the two of them teaming up on Wizard and getting him out of the picture, she makes them run away just so that they can later despair one gate. ONE gate, out of the possible hundreds running around! Hell, they could just despair her afterwards. After Wizard is dead, change Lizard man into that guy, showing her he's dead, and boom! Insta-Phantom: just add heartbreak. Instead we get insta-deadPhantom: just add stupidity.

God this show is dumb in a new and exciting way. The plot is still decent, Hairytoes is still meh/okay/tolerable/neat, the secondary losers are on the backburner for now, but everyone else is about as smart as food not wrapped in bacon, which is to say: not smart. Not even the fights are any good anymore.

Wizard is far better than OOO, which I thought was decent, so Wizard is far from dumb. Medusa is no worse than Mezool and Gamel, who were absolutely useless.

Man, why do I keep comparing Wizard with OOO? I guess it is probably because OOO is the only post-Decade series I was mildly disappointed with.

Than why is Lizard man currently farting around in human form instead of just changing into his Phantom form and instantly despairing the girl?

Literally, he has the power to achieve his goal at any time he wants, and he wastes time like a chump, just maing it easier for Wizard to beat him and save her.

But Mezool and Gamel were not the only freaking villains in the show. They were hugely downplayed compared to Uva and Catface, who were much better villains even if I didn't like them.

Who else have we got in Wizard? Not-at-all-Wiseman and oh-God-make-him-shut-up-Phoenix.

OOO wipes the floor with Wizard in every possible way so far. Wizard is meandering, wheras even OOO in it's slow, musical-medals portion had some semblance of progression. This is just waiting for a Phantom, get a new ring with an even worse-looking form, wait for a Phantom, etc. Eiji was ten million times the character that Hairytoes is, Ankh was better than... well there's no real comparrison unless you want to use Shampoo, which is an easy win for OOO. Literally Wizard has done nothing better than OOO. It's either matched it or is worse.

I personally place OOO leagues ahead of Wizard.
Everything about Wizard just disappoints me.

OOO simply giving a reason why the villains don't just go full on beast mode against Eiji (Missing most of their cores and not having enough Cell Medals) makes them better than Wizard's Phoenix and Medusa (Who have proven that they're stronger than Haruto, but don't attack him directly and get him out of the way because...Because).

The villains are the weakest aspect of Wizard in my opinion, I never really felt they were any dumber than most Toku villains but my God were they bland.

Their human forms usually had quirks and gimmicks and they were really cool characters and then they'd go phantom mode, maybe throw a few punches and that was the end of them unless they have a spear which is the only weapon the Phantoms use apparently.

It's like the opposite of Kuuga with extremely flashy Riders and extremely bland villains.

I feel they're dumber.
In Fourze, they needed Fourze to aggravate the Zodiarts to find Horoscopes, initially (This sentence makes sense when you watch Fourze :lol)
In OOO, they were severely weakened due to losing most of their medals.
In Double, they never considered Double to be a threat.

The other series tended to give better reasons. In Wizard, the titular character is a gigantic wrench in their plans that could have been solved by a double team with Medusa and Phoenix that never happened because Wiseman.

They haven't explained it yet. There is that hypothesis circulating that perhaps a Wizard is needed to obtain the Philosopher's Stone, which is why Wiseman needs Haruto alive.

Let's systematically break down every aspect of both shows to show where Whee-zort needs improvement at this point, (where I'm watching) shall we?

-The main guy. Haruto doesn't come close to the level of character, character backstory, motivation or charm of Eiji.

-Plot. The story is a reactionary situation with no obvious plans for the villains besides "make more Phantoms" which they suck at. OOO had the Greeed fighting for core medals and making yummies for cell medals, which they were reasonably effective at. (one good thing about musical medals was that at least it meant the villains achieved something real now and again) We were also seeing actual character interactions and story amongst the villains in OOO at this point.

-Gimmick and action. The forms are boring and basic in Wizard, as well as just way too freaking samey for "achieved" forms. OOO combos were all different looking and had different powers and uses.

-Everyone else. The secondary cast for the hero was quite good in OOO, with the mysterious benefactor on one hand, Ankh on the other, and Hina and the diner lady just kinda shootin' the shit in the background. Brotou was wicked, Ankh was great. Here we have Stinko the world's shittiest detective; Shampoo the human stomach ulser, Kyomi the... Hina of the show, and that guy who makes the rings. Oh, and the donut cart thing and it's barely-there assistant.

-Chumps 'o' the week. The yummy parents are presented as greedy (sometimes) people who learn their lesson through tough love. The one staht are suppsoed to be sympathetic are truely sympathetic, unlike all the gates who we're supposed to feel sorry for but can really go jump off a bridge.

-Uh... Oh, and white Wizard. Or "that guy who's there sometimes."

Seems like OOO ticks all the boxes while Wizard doodles a picture of a cat at the bottom of the page.

Which makes not a damn bit of sense at this point since the Phantoms rather obviously want him out of the picture.

Oh good, I have retcons and contrivances to look forward to.

Nailed it.

Also in OOO they were fighting eachother a lot because they're all greedy assholes, and much liek the Decepticons of any given show, had pretty interesting in-fights. They gave it their best shot at teamwork, but honestly once they dropped the pretenses of workign togther they were more successful for the most part. And in W, they didn't know who he was for most of the time and, no flies on W here but, he never permanently halted their plans, and when he did, well, they fought plenty. Also the villains in W were real people who were public figures and couldn't just run out in the middle of a crowd and transform to fight. (until the end when they didn't give a shit. See; the villains developed over time!)

The only reason I'm not gonna agree with this yet is because honestly we know basically NOTHING about how the Wizard Universe actually works yet, this close to the end of the series.

Is suppressing your Phantom really that big a deal? How does that allow you to use magic rings? What are the magic rings? What is the Sabbat? How does the Philosophers stone fit in?

It's unlikely but it still has so much left to answer that it could all make sense by the end.

But yeah I'm not a big fan of Wizard's forms either and it sounds like I really need to watch OOO.

Kuuga 24: So everyone knows Godai is number four now, since when?

Other than that, when'd the cops get so dumb in this show? "Let us gather all of the ULs targets in the same place!" fantastic idea, you're a cop and can see nothing wrong with this?

Also the Penis Form got the most subtle upgrade I had to rewind to make sure anything had actually changed. Even the super forms in this series are unspectacular, he basically just had exactly the same fight that he got when he had his first penis transformation.

It was a good idea to bring the conflict closer to home for Godai at least but that is all I got. I really enjoyed the opening ten episodes and I was really hoping these new forms would rekindle my love for the series, but minus maybe the Godai death arc (excluding the underwhelming return battle), I've not really enjoyed this series in a while.

Hopefully the other upgraded forms are more interesting, since the Penis Form was probably the most boring base form in the first place.

That's not a good sign.

When a show fails to even hint at answering questions until the last minute, I can't help but think of those eventual answers as cheap retcons. Especially when it's questions that are so huge and open. You should know something about how the universe works by the last ten episodes.

I would seriously give it a good effort. I was not a fan of the designs when I first glanced them, and didn't think I would like the show when I saw clips and shit. But I did. A lot. It damn near perfectly balances comedy and drama, and has a really good story that only slightly makes me tilt my head at the end. (and it's technical stuff, not even actual thematic flaws) The entire story around OOO is great, and Eiji is one of my top riders. It is flawed, and you should know that going it. But in my opinion, the flaws are easily outweighed.

Doesn't help that I just got a model kit of OOO today, and putting TaToBa togther really makes me want the other forms. (which don't exist as models FUUUUUUUUU-) So I'm exceptionally OOO-giddy today.

It was doing okay for a while but then Wizard has basically been pure filler for like the last month. As I've said before I watched like thirty episodes of Wizard over a week and the show flows very nicely as a whole unit but it isn't until you slow down and have to soak up each moment in much more detail that you realise just how much time the show wastes on pointless shit.

I'm gonna go get the opening OOO episode now.

Oh man, then if I'm already having problems with Wizard now.

But yeah, you should. But don't take my praise as infallible testament. Like I said, OOO is not perfect in my opinion (then again I consider VERY few things perfect) and it, obviously, doesn't hit it's full stride right out of the gate. HOWEVER, it is a series that I felt started very strong and stayed above or at the level all the way through, so no "you only have to watch 3/5ths to get to the good part" here.

Also it manages to have a singing driver that doesn't sound ridiculous. Shabadoobie-shut-the-hell-up Wizard driver. I'll take "Ta-To-Ba, tatoba TaToBa!" over that anyday.

That's actually a problem I've encountered when watching OOO, which I saw as it aired :lol
What I thought was long and meandering only felt that way because it took a month to get through.
So 88 minutes, barely a movie's run time, was spread out over 4 weeks, which is why if felt a lot longer than it actually was.

Sometimes a show just works better when you can marathon it.

OOO is probably my personal favorite KR. It's not perfect, but nothing is. It has a nice start and gets really good early on, but this is all in my opinion.

I wonder if I'd like OOO as much if I was forced to take a week break between every episode?

Oh well, we don't need to wory about that I guess.

Yeah, I know not a lot of people like Wizard but it was my first Japanese Rider series and I had nothing to compare it too. It was loud, flashy and fun - there were obvious problems along the way, a lot of them, but it really swept me up into it all. I certainly enjoyed it more than Kuuga, which seems to have two bad arcs for every fantastic one.

Also, you're one of the few people where I agree with your opinion the majority of the time, so I take your recommendation as a pretty high appraisal.

Yeah there are some shows that just work better in marathons and others that work better in bursts. It's funny to find that out especially now we no longer are a slave to broadcasts minus the most current series.

OOO, to me, is great fun. I think that's the perfect way to describe it. The characters are fun, the story is fun and intriguing. Yeah, great fun is a good descriptor.

So opening episode of OOO.

It was so batshit insane I was laughing my head off, so yeah fun is about right. His suit is really really cool as well. I guess who ever made this played a lot of Sonic at the time. I really dunno how I'm gonna go back to Kuuga after all that flash.

That said the show has weird villains when you consider the fact that Kamen Rider exists to manipulate greed and sell as much plastic crap as possible.

Glad you liked it. OOO was the first Rider i watched and yea it is ironic when u think about the greed and the fact the whole show exists to sell toys :lol. Which reminds me, anyone got an extra TaToBa SHF.? :lol

Personally, I think OOO is a good show, but it tends to be overrated. It has some great characters and a good setting, but the villains are mostly shit.

I would definitely say it's better than Wizard, though. Wizard I'd rank about on par with Fourze - they're both decent shows, but with some serious flaws. With Fourze it was it's horrible pacing and total lack of villain motivation until the last three episodes. With Wizard it's the equally horrible pacing and total waste of a supporting cast. That said, I think Haruto is one of the best Riders of the Heisei era and easily the best since Shotaro. It's just a pity that he's stuck in a show that would rather focus on wacky comedy hijinks when he clearly belongs in a much more serious and darker show.

So watchin W A to Z

Prdtgy good so far ill probably finish W later tonight, but holy crap did not see Shrouds backstory comin :lol

I wouldn't call OOO overrated. It's not the precious early Heisei series, but I found it more enjoyable than a lot of other KR series.

I think the forms in Wizard rock, and his henshin device is down right awesome. I still think W and Blade have the best devices, but Wizard's is definitely up there. Sure, Wizard is slow moving, but I think that is more because I am watching the episodes as they are compared to marathoning them in a few days like I did with W-Fourze.

Now Shunpei, Rinko, and Koyomi need to just drop dead. Shunpei is one of the worst characters in the entire Kamen Rider series, definitely the worst since the boys in Hibiki. Rinko only occasionally seems to do police work. Koyomi, just stands in the background and maybe has one sentence and that is it. Sadly though, the supporting casts in these shows are getting worse each year.

The Phantoms, on the other hand, are awesome. However, that might attribute to the fact that they are based off mythical beasts, and I am huge into mythology. I thought Phoenix was pretty damn badass, I love Gremlin, and Medusa has a lot of potential. I definitely feel she is going to become the main villain in the last few episodes of the series.

Plot has been fine for me. It isn't amazing, but it is no where near bad. Comparitively, the plots in W, Blade, and Fourze were better, but it is superior to everything that came between Hibiki through Decade except Kiva and OOO.

My biggest issue is that lately, the fights just don't seem as epic. There seems to be a lack of energy and choreography in them.

And come on, the reason they haven't killed Haruto is plot convenience. In the real world, all of the riders (and rangers) would have been killed halfway through the story. That is why I would love to see Toei do something new and surprise everyone by killing off their main heroes at the end of one series and have it continue into the next year with a new cast trying to take back the world. It will never happen, but I wish it would.

on episode 47 of W (so sad to finish this because it as became my favorite next to OOO [granted its the second ive seen :lol])

but, at the end of 46, did anyone (for those that have seen G Gundam) get reminded of Ulube givin Rain to the Dark Gundam with that final scene? :lol

So I finished W

I admit right now, I got teary eyed at Phillip and Shotarou. That was a better endin than OOO, and the "special" finale episode was great, now to watch W and OOO movie war core tomorrow :lol

Just finished watching Wizard Hyper Battle. Weird, but funny :lol

I absolutely love the villains of OOO. I love everyone in OOO.

For the love of all that is holy, skip the OOO portion.

I'd say exactly half the villains in OOO are shit, to the point where I feel as though the shows was intended to follow, well, the interesting ones, and then there was Mezool and Gamel as, I guess just to be there.

They're nowhere bad as idiot "I'm going to smile and cross my arms and that will make me a good villain" Medusa or "Can you tell I've never had an acting gig before this well let me laugh obnoxiously and open my mouth EVEN WIDER" Phoenix. Though I think anytime Kamen Rider gives monsters that are supposed to be monsters human forms it's just dumb, because they look like shitty fanart characters where everyone's skinny and dresses all new-age. Like seriously, why is the tough Gamel in the body of a highschooler? He should be a big, tough brawny guy or, if you want to play on his intelligence, a child. Not jut some punk kid. Ditto Uva who's basically the exact same kind of person in human form, but also a tough monster in his real form. The only one who worked this was Catface, but he was a shithead.

This is what keeps me goign back to Wizard, because I seriously need to understand this. Hairytoes, so far, is a void of a character. He is a sustained vacuum where a character should be. He's beyond bland, has the most paltry of backstories, and his admirable "I want to help people" mentality only goes so far in filling that void. You cna't just be a hero, you have to have some kind of personality. It doesn't need to be silly or overt, just... something besides smile and wave. Even in-suit he's incredibly generic flashy goodguy.

As a comparrison, back when I was watching Black (which I still need to finish) he was your typical heroic guy. He was a lot like Haruto in that teh defining aspect of his character was his heroism. But Black had more than that. He was driven, passionate, hot-blooded. You could tell just by watching him he poured his heart into everything he did. He had not a bit of ego, not a bit of flare. He was a hero and worked himself to the bone to stay one. Haruto is far more of a "I'm a hero but I'm still a cool guy who's a bit silly look at me eat a doughnut!" Which, BTW, I have nothing against the doughnut thing. In fact I wish it wasn't so downplayed. Even being a doughnut-obsessed weirdo is better than what he is now.

Yay!

Yeah, that final Xtreme bit is really tug-at-your-heart-strings-ville.

Yes.

It is just not-making-sense-at-all-ville. The W portion is awesome, though.