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TokuNation
(https://www.tokunation.com/forums/index.php)
- Tokusatsu Show Discussion
(https://www.tokunation.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=20)
- - What are you watching? (Kamen Rider Edition)
(https://www.tokunation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49)
I don't think Kiva's gonna end up being one of my favorites, really....but I don't dislike it. Jiro's probably my favorite character though, yeah. Well either him or Franken-dude, even though he barely appears.
I think the thing that really annoys me the most (for some reason) is the Wonderful Azorobics Organization. Not the characters in it, they're alright, though Nago can become unbearable at times. I dunno why. Maybe it's cause they're not an organization really? More like a Fangire Public Defense Club. I just find that set up sort of odd. |
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Kiva 30 and 31
Well. Kengo's startign to whine. For understandable reasons but...I'm guessing ! this is when he starts acting like a prick? And Nago found out that Wateru was Kiva! ...And he seems pretty chill with it. But, hey! Maybe he'll start to lighten up and-Oh, nope. Still a douche. Anyway, Yuri and Megumi finally get to use IXA. And it was pretty awesome. Yuri has a nice smile, dunno why I never noticed before the scene where Megumi was staring at her picture. Sorta odd how Yuri can just sort of laugh at Otoya, Jiro and the other monsters just goofing off like everything was normal. It's not like...y'know. Jiro had a breakdown and almost killed them or anything. Still, I guess they're all friends now. So it's all good. And Mio's fangire form appears as she attacks Kiva! And it's....a flower? I dunno. I didn't figure out that Rok was supposed to be a lion for the longest time. And speaking of him, finally he kicks the bucket. His death(s) reminded me of something from Ghostbusters or something. Quote:
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Well, you could argue that when she's around everyone; she's not going to say "Hey! Wataru! You should transform into Kiva!" |
I do recall wondering for a long time if Shizuka knew that Wataru was Kiva. I liked Shiuzka, I felt bad when she disappeared for a long time.
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On a similar note with Kuuga, that I forgot to ramble about, I thought it was kinda weird that Godai's identity had no repercussions.
Due to the uncertainty around the ULs, no one really trusted Kuuga even with him saving people, especially after Gold Red Kuuga could make enemies pop like nukes so a big part of the series has been trying to keep Godai's identity a secret, even if he himself refused too. But then over the course of a single episode, an episode where they had grown fearful over Kuuga, they all learnt Godai was Kuuga and went: http://th06.deviantart.net/fs70/200H...ld-d5xeirg.png |
episode 49 of kabuto
so the natives would go so low that they would turn every human being into a native. that is the most idiotic plan ever. they had to know it was going to backfire at some point. but besides that it was a nice happy ending to it all and i loved kabuto all together. |
ALSO since I'm near the final stretch of Kuuga now, anyone wanna recommend me what to watch next?
I really wanna watch something similar to Kuuga, in terms of it feeling like a real world, populated by actual people where things actually matter but I'd rather it was a bit more upbeat with more polished fight sequences. |
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I tried Agito before and was advised against it by a reliable source. Will check out Fourze though!
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It stops being as goofy, but "A more serious turn" is a straight up lie. |
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Taking a break from Den-O and watching the last few eps of Kuuga.
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And Fourze's not a bad show, but it's about as diametrically opposed to Kuuga as possible within the Rider franchise. Be prepared for some major mood whiplash. |
Oh yeah. That is one of the other things that nagged me about Kiva - I did kind of want to know who, in the end, really did know Wataru was Kiva and how they all felt about it. Ah well.
Kengo being such a massive prick never made sense. Have fun with him while he is. I didn't. :| I also wouldn't call Fourze "serious" ever. It... matures, perhaps. But it's still all light-hearted fun. |
Mood changes aren't a problem, like I say I want to keep Kuuga's 'real world where stuff matters' feel but I don't really want another series as bitter and depressing as Kuuga.
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Right so I checked out the first episode of Fourze and man there was a lot to like.
I couldn't tell you why but I love high school settings and sci-fi is my favourite genre aside from horror, hell I have a Blade Runner tattoo, so mixing that all together was really enjoyable for me. Plus, usual shit Kamen Rider CGI aside, Fourze looked cool, the monster looked cool, the fight was very polished flashy and fun and they actually convinced me for once that the actual character is inside the suit. Even if it is a character I'm not particularly fond of. Also I wanted to question where Gen got the other switches but then...chainsaw leg...that is all. |
I just finished Fourze, and I loved it. It has it's serious moments. I'd say it reminded me a lot of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, which for most of the first three seasons were fun, but rarely all that serious, with a couple of obvious exceptions. Fourze even has a prom episode that reminded me of the Buffy S3 Prom episode.
I wouldn't say it has the same real world affecting stuff that Kuuga has, until toward the end of the show when we learn that if the horoscope's goals are reached it will destroy all of Japan. My main complaint with it is that there is too little repercussion for people using the switches. 2 or 3 former switch users return and we get to see them deal with it, but mostly, the switch disappears and yay everybody is fine! But it was a lot of fun, and unlike Kuuga, where I only cared about Godai and Ichijo, I ended up liking all of the characters in Fourze, quite a lot (again, reminded me of Buffy). Even JK, who I expected to hate the entire time, he had some real great moments. They all did, and those character moments are a large part of why I think the show worked for me. The switch gimmick itself? Well, meh. I didn't mind the O-Medals, I LOVE W's Gaia Memories, the switches are just there for me. There are a lot of switches that should be totally useless, but I think the show did fine in justifying their existence. There are plenty that we only see once, but that's fine, if you have a chainsaw leg, and wolverine-type claws, why would ever go back to something like net? he does mainly get them out of hammerspace, but that's fine with me. It's amusing at times, certainly, but it never bothered me. |
Check out the Fourze movie. Lots of former Switch users show up in it.
Also, you have to remember that these are teens, and teens make dumb decisions based primarily on emotion. While you have to hold them accountable for their choices, there has to be some give (Additionally, the switches alter their judgment). As for the switches, not counting the movie (Which made a point to use all 41), I think the only one that was used once in series was Medical (Maybe Camera, too). As for the hammer space thing, eh. OOO never explained where Eiji put the medals (More often than not, we see Eiji just insert new medals without being show him removing the first ones). I'm glad you enjoyed Fourze. It's goofy and silly, and while there are some serious moments, it doesn't have a complete tonal shift and keeps the lighthearted tone until the end. |
Oh, I LOVED that Fourze movie. might be the best KR movie I've seen. I liked all the characters that came back. What I meant was, we don't see them again ever having to deal with their bad choices of the past. There are a couple of instances of it, but for the most part, they're 'cured' and become Gentaro's friends, so they can come back in the movie.
But dealing with the consequences of using a swtich, that we only see a couple of times. Medical was used twice in the episode where Scorpion stings Gentaro and later again in the episode where Meteor makes a deal with Ares. I guess my point wasn't really supposed to be that some switches are under used, it's more that why would you use them again when you have some of the others. After Magnet states appears, he uses it in the next 5 story arcs, even when it's apparent that Elek or Fire is almost always going to be a better choice. Similarly, anytime he uses Pen instead of Chainsaw or Spike - well, that's a bad example because I think they did a great job of making Pen useful. Water. Why would you ever use Water when you could use Chainsaw (aside from being in Cosmic states when you can mix it with freeze)? Anyway, don't get me wrong, Fourze is probably in my top 3 or 4 KR shows. My complaints aren't meant to be taken as true negatives, just some things that I think could have improved the show, but I'm very happy with how it turned out. Even my hope that Yuuki would turn out to be a Horoscope came true, if not exactly the way I wanted, it was a good story in itself. I just would have loved it more if she had ALWAYS been a Horoscope, or had become one by choice. But oh well, I liked how that arc played as well. |
So Fourze isn't quite the upbeat Kuuga I was looking for after all then? Any one have any other recommendations?
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It's not a dark as Kuuga, and I can see people saying it's not as serious. But it is a lot of fun, and I would say it feels genuine to me. If you enjoyed the first episode, stick with it for a while.
I can't remember if you've mentioned it in the past, have you tried Double? I feel that one is a really good mix of serious and silly, but I would also say Fourze really is too. |
Yeah I didn't like W and the whole thread exploded and no one has left me alone about it :lol
But okay! When Kuuga is over, over to Fourze I go. |
So is Kuuga really suggesting that Kuuga himself may be the main villain? I mean it's kinda been hinted at all along but if they do go through with this it's either gonna be awesome or completely stupid.
That aside I have no idea what is going on any more, the Bat dude shoved some Power Rangers logo thing into his stomach and that made him change clothes but then there is a Greguru, whatever that is and eh... It should be awesome to see two UL fight but I have no context for anything because even the code which is given subtitles in Japanese, isn't translated by the subbers. I may as well watch these episodes raw half the time. And yeah yeah stop complaining about free stuff but if you're gonna sub a show, why only sub half of it? |
Ok, I couldn't remember who it was that caused that little ruckus. Well, you're difficult to read then. You didn't like W, but you liked the first episode of Fourze?
Granted, I do feel the Fourze started out stronger than W did. It took W around 10 episodes or so to become really strong, but once it did, I thought it was all amazing. I liked it from the beginning, but the early episodes are definitely weak, and I didn't feel that way for Fourze. But maybe others do, maybe it's too fresh in my mind, I don't know. |
Did you ever try OOO, Locke?
I still find it hard to believe you didn't like W, especially since you watched Wizard and thought Fourze's first episode was good. Was W the first Kamen Rider series you watched? Maybe now that you've seen more KR you should try and revisit it? Maybe now that you have a greater idea of KR overall? It's just so weird that you like highschool drama and "everyone in the show is a useless tool" drama but not smooth jazz buddycop detective drama. |
I can't be the only person that thought it was neat the Gurongi spoke a different language, such that it wasn't translated for us, and thought the mystery of what they were saying was effective?
I also loved OOO, but if I had to choose, I might have enjoyed Fourze more. But OOO is really strong, the OOO/Fourze movie is really good (unlike the OOO portion of the W movie, which as everyone knows was pretty much crap). I definitely recommend OOO as well. |
I just seems like, from everything Locke is telling us he wants to see, OOO fits the bill nearly perfect.
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I remember OOO being far more goofy than W was, for the first many episodes. It seemed sillier. Not to say that Fourze doesn't have that, but I feel the silliness in Fourze makes the characters that silly more endearing, whereas in OOO it was just so random and strange as to stand out more.
But mabye I'm also remembering it poorly. So I don't know. Try a few Fourzes out, then try a few OOO out, see which has your attention more? |
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I personally didn't like the fights, too much reliance on bad CGI and I personally found the choreography very clunky. MY OPINION. I also wasn't a big fan of the story, I just didn't think it gelled very well with Tokuness but then neither does Kuuga. And I thought the monster designs were rubbish. Quote:
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Comparring, say, the Sweets Dopant to... Weather, (or even guys like Arms or Gene, which was a monster intentionally meant to look aloof and unimposing, but still looked cooler than T-rex or Anamallacarpet) you can deffinitely see how different the monster designs became and evolved. They became much less ridiculous and sleeker. W is a series that almost tries to go camp very early before realising it's much better at telling a more.... I don't want to say serious or mature since thsoe words have morphed into a different meaning on the internet, but I more focused and deliberate story. By the time the first movie happens (about episode 16 I believe) the contrast between the story told at the beginning and at that point is noticable. There's less overt filler and more serious character study and forward plot motion. If I had to compare the tonal shift, I'd say W reminds me a lot of Batman The Animated Series in that if you look at that show, it's got a bit of camp and really silly episodes (Christmas with the Joker, anyone?) before it gets to the point fans remember it being. (Two-Face) I mean, without spoiling anything should you one day decide to revisit it, the stuff with Skull and the backstory of W gets really, REALLY good. The plot gets a lot more developed very quickly. I'm glad you like OOO, it's my third favourite show. (sometimes second) |
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Most of the Dopant designs ARE rubbish. But W isn't, and Accel certainly isn't. And some of them are really good, like Nasca, and of course, Skull. the Fangires of Kiva and the Imagin of Den-O are far better designs, in general, of course just like there are winners in W, there are losers in Kiva and Den-O. And of course, there is NO BETTER Rider design than Kiva. If those are your only criteria for enjoying a show though, I think you're going to have a rough time with all the Kamen Rider shows. I know people have told you to lower your expectations about things, and I may have as well. I don't want to come off saying you need to do that, but keep in mind that sometimes these suits are awkward, or in Kiva's case, downright heavy, it can be difficult to pull off some poses. There are reasons why the giant mech fights in Sentai look like dudes in cardboard suits with all the mobility of a G1 Transformer. I would say the fighting is better in Fourze. I get the impression that Shotaro is only semi trained in fighting, if that, unlike Skull. Whereas Gentaro fights out of suit quite a bit, and gives the impression that he is more trained. And then Meteor clearly has more training, so his fights are even better that Fourzes. I don't remember how Eiji was in OOO proper, but in the Megamax movie, I felt like they really let Eiji and Ankh fight a lot out of suit, and it was very convincing to me. Quote:
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Why do you bring up bad CGI as a point against Double when, quite literally, you've brought up bad CGI every time you talk about KR?
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I'm really bad at ranking shows. I love Den-O and Kiva and W and OOO and Fourze and Kuuga, but trying to rank them all with each other is hard, because as mentioned, a lot of the Dopant designs suck, so do i discount W? Almost all the designs in Kiva are awesome, but it does have weaker story points, so is it worse than W, or better? Having most recently finished Fourze, it's the one that feel the strongest to me, overall (and the Zodiarts designs were mainly really good), but I felt that way when I finished Den-O months ago too. Do I really like Fourze more, or is it just freshest in my mind? Momotaros and Ankh are both great characters, sometimes for the same reasons, so is OOO or Den-O better? I don't know! end rant |
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Also, Ryan: I'm also bad at ranking shows, but W will lways be my favourite because of two things: W himself and Skull. Shotaro and Philip make the show, and the genuine partnership and comradrie between them is more genuine and badass than any duo of any series I've seen. Even Ryoutaro and Momo, because while Momo was awesome, Ryoutaro was always the obvious weak link. Shotaro and Philip are the two-in-one detective, it's not just a tagline. Those two are the ultimate pair. And then Skull, well, let's just say that I'm still furious that he never got a full movie but Eternal, that movie-exclusive villain with the face of an old woman did. Such injustice. Which is not to say W doesn't have other awesome stuff like Accel, the really interesting dynamic of the villains, or the amazing rider designs, but those two aspects are what firmly cement it as #1 for me abovee all the other series, even though most of them are good. |
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And I dunno what it was about W, it was just like the fights had no punch, the physical fighting seemed to pad out the fights rather than serve a purpose sorta like how in a wrestling match they just slap each other until one of them does a finisher. And you could say that is true of ALL fights in this genre and I'd agree but when Kuuga is say, getting thrown through walls or blown up or whatever else I at least can assume he is getting his ass kicked. A lot of the fights from W that I remember basically involved people wailing on each other til W did the correct Memory Combo to finish the job. |
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