I guess I feel like how it all traces back from Otoya's womanizer trait. As a womanizer, who actually values women, Otoya inherently views all women as treasures and allies himself with any of them. His demeanor to women can put them off (or instantly charm them), but he entertains all women, and protects them when they're in danger. And I thought most of Otoya's scenes are him interacting with Yuri and caring for her, which is ofc a woman, which is the womanizer trait above, albeit doubly affectionate as she's the one he had chance to build a meaningful relationship with, his affection to Yuri doubles even more so. He also spent his time at odds with Jirou, which is another man (though he's a monster, but fighting Fangires), and the only reason they can temporarily team up is, again, woman, which is Yuri. I guess his relationship with Jirou finally changes for the better in this episode as he became honorer of Otoya's promise, but I guess this shows how different the treatment to women and men for Otoya, where men can need long dispute, tension, and various difficulties interacting with Otoya before finally bonding with him (albeit it's not one-sided, the vicious Jirou takes part of it as well), while women would just need to get used to and tolerate Otoya's antics. Probably yeah he's little better of a man than he was before, and you admit that he's never going to be like Ryotaro here, but the thing is I catch refering to him as "champion of justice" before as treating him equal to the likes of Ryotaro.

Well I don't think that Nago actually fell in love with Maya, unless Nago's going tsundere with him only being in denial for his love to Maya, which will mean yeah it's all sudden to me too. What I think is that Nago already had the burning passion (hatred) to exterminate all Fangires, so I'd think it's redundant for Nago to get 'playful' side to be passionate. I also kinda want to show that passionate doesn't mean you have to act flamboyant or something, which they don't here. Like how I despise educational insitute equating passionate for shouting your lungs out (and doesn't take it well when a student doesn't shout it loud).

Otoya was already a warrior actually before, well I mean about fighting skills, as he fights off men to take away their women. I guess Maya should really meet with Kengo... he thinks Kiva or IXA's performance in fighting as a rock, which is a form of music, and a form of art. Though I feel like I was left hanging on Tanahashi's fate... what Nago's doing was, sending a shockwave to separate Tanahashi from the Fangire? I also thought Tanahashi's beef comes from how Maya never come again.. how about that part for Maya coming again or not?

I thought Kengo and Wataru's training is, like Nago, a plot that went from A to A.... as Wataru's already a Kiva, and dunno if it's a problem to reveal Kiva identity to Kengo. It's shown that fighting as Fangire Hunter with Aozora organization can temporarily delay the Fangires, but doesn't really make an impact to the Fangires, as seen in Yuri or Megumi always needing help from the Riders, and of course it'll be worse for someone like Kengo doing it. Dunno what you refer as Rising IXA's dance... but I thought it's just how the finisher work, firing an orange beam then Rider Kicking it.

There are a lot of Champions Of Justice in this franchise that are also sort of terrible people (Ex-Aid! Almost the entire cast!), so I guess I didn't think that I was implying that Otoya had suddenly become a shining beacon of altruistic service or anything. He can fight for justice as IXA and still have problems.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/nagohno.png

Nago certainly thinks he fell in love with Maya!

Rising IXA does a little dance move after he detonates the Fangire, a little shoulder-shimmy to bask in his success.

For the Kengo/Wataru part... I mean, it's such a minor element of the episode that I really didn't mind that it was irrelevant. It gives Kengo and Wataru a bit of screentime together again, it pulls Kengo deeper into W.A.K.E.U.P., it allows for a slightly different type of action scene, and it lets the show flip that scene around when Megumi is back. It's doing a few small things well, even if it's not doing any big things.

I'm not surprised to hear that there are scenes cut from this episode, given how so much of it feels incomplete. I still read a lot of the X-Men comics and this episode reminds me of what's probably my least favorite book in the current line-up: Excalibur (I feel like I may have made this comparison in another one of the KRD Watches... threads, so if this sounds familiar just skip to the next paragraph). Part of that is subject matter, as the comic deals with what is easily the dumbest and most uninteresting part of the current status quo, but mostly it's a structure thing. Most issues of that comic feel like they have panels missing, meaning it often feels like we skip over important moments that would better connect the narrative. I got a lot of those vibes from this episode, with Nago getting his butt kicked by Yuri ending with him kidnapping her being the worst example.

Honestly, my biggest issue with this one is that I don't really like Nago very much and while it's fun to see him get smacked around by far more interesting characters, it doesn't make for the most compelling story. The stuff with Maya, Otoya, and Yuri is pretty good, though. The show does a much better job of selling Maya as a partner for Otoya than it ever did with Yuri (mostly because their relationship isn't built on a foundation of worn-down resistance).

And respect to everyone involved in that final scene, especially Saki Kagami. It's a big risk to just let a naked baby hang out on your fancy set, much less to pick him up and hold him. I wouldn't do that without at least a drop cloth and probably a poncho.

I had to go back and watch that transition twice, because I completely could not understand what was happening. For those who don't remember, the chain of events is:

-Nago tries to punch Yuri
-Yuri catches his punch, just like Otoya did, and proceeds to beat the crap out of him
-Cut to Mal d'Amour, where Otoya is informed via phone call that Yuri is being held hostage
-Cut back to a handcuffed Yuri being menaced by a badly-beaten Nago

As a logical progression of events, it's sorely lacking. My assumption is that, in a largely one-side fight (Yuri is blemish-free), Nago managed to get his handcuffs on Yuri. But it's mostly unaddressed onscreen, and almost all of the denouement suffers from the same problem. Like, is Kengo officially a member of W.A.K.E.U.P., even though the story where he was inducted never happened? Stories where characters rewrite history usually need more time spent on the details than other stories, and this one somehow spent less.

(Also, I'd say that Children of the Atom is the worst of the current X-Men books. Vita Ayala is my least-favorite writer for that line. CotA and New Mutants are basically unreadable.)

I'm pretty sure Yuri let herself get cuffed so Nago would let his guard down. Otoya played along, throwing him the IXA Knuckle, trusting that Yuri would catch it.

The other thing that bugs me about this? Who called the cafe to report on the kidnapping?

(I don't even remember about CotA half the time. New Mutants would be fine by me if the art wasn't so smudgy; I can't hate any comic where Honey Badger is part of the main cast. Honestly, the line as a whole isn't doing a ton for me. With X-Factor cancelled I'm mostly just here for Hellions and to see if there's any payoff on Marauders' tease that Rachel and Kitty will be stepping out of the subtext closet and into explicit canon.)

Yeah, but why go to all that trouble when she appeared perfectly capable of kicking Nago's ass on her own? Why get captured if you're just going to beat Nago up again? Was Yuri just trying to include Otoya more? Is punching Nago, like, a date?

I'm pretty sure that was just Nago. He knew they all met at Mal d'Amour, because some things never change, and he hoped to trade Yuri for the IXA Knuckle -slash- draw Otoya out in the hopes of beating him up and taking the Knuckle.

I'm not sure what it says about my mental state today that I considered that, but then was all "how would Nago even know about that place?"

Yeah, it was an opportunity to show how in sync Yuri and Otoya are now and to make Nago's defeat more humiliating than it would've been if Yuri just beat him up on her own. That would've been too easy.

He's actually there in the beginning of the episode, too! It's when he's talking to Shima, Yuri, and Otoya, where he's trying to explain to them that he has traveled from the future via a Time Door inside a Dragon Cathedral, and he needs to prevent Otoya from stopping a deadly Fangire. Somehow, Nago's rude and unconvincing demands come off as rude, unconvincing, and demanding, so he just falls back to stalking Otoya.

Also, the team of W.A.K.E.U.P.86 hear Nago's story of time travel and basically go Hilarious But We Only Believe In Monsters Not Science-Fiction. They've seen a lot of weird stuff over the last 28 weeks, but they are not willing to believe Nago. I can't imagine why.

I think I'd believe that more if Otoya had done it, though. Yuri always strikes me as someone who takes fights seriously. I didn't think she'd be willing to string Nago along, just to make his defeat more humiliating.

...although, Megumi had to learn it from somebody, right?

Maybe Otoya has started to imprint on Yuri to give her a playful heart as well?

EDIT: 600th post, yay!

With Nago's mission to change the past completed with surprisingly little trouble, the show sees fit to introduce a song it loves almost as much as Supernova. Just in case the regular version of Individual-System wasn't already enough Nago-y goodness for you, it's Fight for Justice!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxooA1gN3Ik

It's just such a pleasant title, isn't it? You know a guy is really heroic when he feels the need to announce his own righteousness right in the title of his character song. While part of the point of TETRA-FANG was to have Kouji Seto singing most of the songs, there are a still decent assortment of tunes done in-character by the other actors, and in this case, we have Keisuke Katou singing as Keisuke Nago all about how great everyone's favorite button-happy manhunter/vampire slayer is.

I really love Fight for Justice. Individual-System already worked as a theme for Nago, and yet this version justifies its existence by being Maximum Nago. You've got the guy himself on the mic, a more dramatic (and maybe less fun) sound, and lyrics that are delivered with all the blunt force you'd expect from a man who's generally not one to mince words. Like so many songs from Kiva, it seriously feels like getting to know the entire character in just a few minutes. The very first lines of this one, translated sort of literally, are "If there is darkness in this world, I will set the trap called light", and the specific wording there is so perfect – reducing light to just being a tool in Nago's arsenal; a mere object in his self-satisfied quest against what he defines as evil. And then the whole rest of the song just keeps going at that level, with stuff like him throwing indirect shade at Wataru by calling destiny an excuse for weaklings, or proudly boasting in the chorus that his titular fight for justice isn't for the sake of others. It even makes the tiniest bit of room for a little acknowledgement that Nago's moral crusade may just be a way to distract himself from his own frustrating imperfections!

Yes, Fight for Justice is a truly excellent summation of Nago's personality up to this point... although maybe he's turning a bit of a corner here?

I'll say right now, I distinctly remember watching this episode the first time and reacting to Nago's mention of his playful heart with little more than a "...huh?", so I totally understand your frustrations with that central plotline, Die. Looking back at the episode, I feel like part of the problem is that, like I mentioned up above, it's remarkably straightforward. There was a half-second skimming back through the first part where I almost assumed, even having seen the episodes before, that there would be some twist where it turns out Nago himself was the Ixa in the past who caused the accident, because that just made sense in my head as the direction to take the story. But instead, it's seriously as simple as Otoya telling Nago to go fall for a woman to get stronger, him doing that, rewriting history, and then leaving. I don't think it's exactly flawed in its construction, but it feels like a script that needed some extra spark to it somewhere. A little more meat.

That being said... this is a pretty iconic set of Kiva episodes for me? (It was even a specific plot I knew happened before starting the show, which helps.) I guess I'm just a sucker for Nago, but, if you remember when I said Kiva has "cute problems" sometimes? A story like this kinda falls into that category. I can't help but look at this two-parter and just fondly be like "that's our Nago-san!", you know? Again, it's confusing when he asks everyone to observe his playful heart as though kicking off a wall exactly once was some great romantic stunt, but it's also adorable. Like, fine, I'll meet the story halfway. Him pulling off the finishing move because he learned to loosen up is even a legitimately great bookend in theory! There's a lot in here that's not thought out the best, for sure, but none of that is in a super frustrating way, which is at least something, I guess.

The core problem for me in this story is that it's about Nago recognizing some shortcoming in himself and making a change because of it, yet Nago is a character that is literally designed to never question his choices or interrogate his motivations. Telling a story that hinges on him not only getting where he went wrong, but conveying that to an audience is... I mean, you'd have an easier time telling a story about Nago having a pathological fear of buttons. You have to nearly reinvent the character to do it how this story tried, and it's a bit of an unforced error.

Because, honestly? There's maybe one thing they could've done that, if not salvaged it, then created a bit more follow-through on its intentions. I think it needed someone in 2008 (Megumi, most likely) to have a tiny scene with Nago where he expresses his thoughts on what the hell happened in 1986. Some way to hear him explain why he fell for Maya, what specifically about her got to him, and what it unlocked in his heart. I don't know, something to try and communicate what he was feeling, because What Nago Is Feeling is almost the entire point of this episode! But Nago hates feelings! And he also hates talking about feelings! They picked an incredibly tough story to tell with Nago, and it just needed a bit more attention to crack it.

(Like, I don't even think this was a script that needed another pass or two; this thing is busted on an almost molecular level. If they wanted to do a story where Nago Gets His Groove Back and learns to see some humanity in Fangires, I don't think this was the way to go about it.)

Classic Inoue move of flipping the script I guess.

Well, that's the thing: the instinct of doing a story where Nago has to go on a solo journey of self-discovery (basically) is right on. Nago's, again, built to have zero internality or self-reflection. In a series where everyone's confronted by their past or their destiny, Nago exists outside of that in a permanent now. He doesn't question his past choices, and he's certain that everything he does is divinely ordained to succeed. He's the guy that is almost biologically incapable of second-guessing himself or feeling the need to change tactics. So, yeah, the idea of Nago Learns Something About Himself is a good idea for a story because it seems like a terrible idea for a story.

It's just, this one ended up being constructed in a way that couldn't overcome its limitations. The idea was good! The approach was bad.

KAMEN RIDER KIVA: QUEEN OF THE CASTLE IN THE DEMON WORLD

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/queen0.png

Thanks to DreamSword for providing me with a way to legally and respectfully watch these Net Movies with English subtitles! Toei makes it so easy to keep up with their franchises!

EPISODE 1 - "KURENAI WATARU'S HIDDEN SIDE?!"

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/queen1.png

I had to triple-check to make sure these movies were released before the movie, and that the movie was released after Episode 27. There's even an ad at the end of the episode promoting the movie as Coming Soon, but I still don't think I'm watching this right, because Takoto? He's a guy in this? And everyone knows him? Except I've watched 28 episodes of Kiva and I completely don't know him?

I assume he's a movie guy, since he's talking about monsters that'll probably also be in the movie. It's weird that he's just hanging around with absolutely no explanation outside of the aforementioned monsters and Kengo calling him New Guy, but what the hell. It's a Net Movie. None of this is intended to do anything other than goof around.

Like, Yuri and Otoya are in the present! Otoya is acting chummy and calling Wataru his son! By any definition, that is the culmination of the entire Kiva series, and it's tossed in here as a gag. They have taken something that almost entirely resolves the core dilemma of the title hero, and flung it into a mess-around movie tie-in. That is like discovering a gold nugget and using it to prop a window open. It's too valuable to be wasted!

But this was a funny episode, and it's all probably AU stuff anyway, so I'm not going to complain more about it. It's all good for a laugh, with Wataru slowly becoming more confident as a performer (he's performing stand-up comedy for a high school festival for some reason?!?!) while the rest of the cast mugs in overblown reactions. It's relaxing, for its very very low stakes. None of it makes any sense, but it's all in good fun.

EPISODE 2 - "HIDDEN BATTLE IN CASTLE DORAN?!"

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/queen2.png

I can't imagine watching this show and then watching Hibiki for the first time. I know some people did. There've been a few people who talked about coming into the franchise through Kiva, and then watching other series. But, like, after experiencing Jiro in this series, in this special, I can't ever take Zanki seriously again. This is like when actors play their famous characters in parodies on Saturday Night Live or whatever. Jiro in this is like Zanki As A Joke. Jiro's all cool and calm, while also being completely unhinged. He's able to be detached and mysterious during the few seconds where he's not bouncing in his seat, sniffing playing cards, or trying to distract an opponent by shouting that there is someone behind them. He's beyond ridiculous in this episode.

It is one of my favorite Kiva things to date, and he's a big reason why.

Like, it is the Arms Monsters challenging Wataru to Hell's Old Maid, where the loser is sent to Hell. (Truth in advertising, at least.) It is utterly bonkers, and perfectly calibrated. It's joyous and hilarious, letting the weird rivalry from the 2008 Arms Monsters Perpetual Game Night rope in Wataru, and keeps a sustained level of tension that dwarfs anything in the series to date. I was probably more invested in Hell's Old Maid than any single fight this show has put on, and I'm not even joking a little. This was, maybe, everything I want in a Kamen Rider special. It was delightful.

EPISODE 3 - "NAGO KEISUKE'S HIDDEN SIDE?!"

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/queen3.png

I mean, of course Nago is a train fanatic. It's a mode of transportation that takes careful planning, runs in a predictable pattern, ferries people in a largely impersonal way, and does not conform to individual requests or pleas. Of course Nago is a train fanatic.

Otherwise, like, Takato is just off-brand Kabuto, isn't he? The look and demeanor scream TENDOU at such an impossibly high volume that I had to check and make sure it wasn't the same actor somehow. (It's not, in case I wasn't the only person to suffer from this delusion.) He's fun, though, with his merciless use of Nago's embarrassing past to squeeze our resident button aficionado (AficioNago?) in an emotional vise. It's all very funny, even if it's just Takoto Remembers Something Even More Pathetic About Nago for the entire runtime. Seeing Nago lose his shit over teenage love letters and bouts of blubbering is incredibly funny, for almost all of the same reasons the Jiro stuff worked in the previous episode. It's these stoic men of mystery that become lunatics for childish reasons, and it's never not a comedy jackpot.

EPISODE 4 - "CAFE OTOYA D'AMOUR"

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/queen4.png

I didn't love this one!

A lot of it is the weird optics of having a mother and daughter shoot through a series of fetish costumes suggested by the mom's boyfriend. That is... even for Kiva, that is intensely problematic. (There's also a bit where Yuri and Megumi bicker over which of them is the better/cuter maid in Otoya's maid cafe, and they try and settle it by feeding him.) It's a super duper weird and uncomfortable short.

It's also not particularly funny? It's just the gag of the two women dressed up in a goofy costume, Takoto points out that it wouldn't work as a business, and then we move on. The costumes themselves aren't really funny or clever (maid, butler, "singing", cheerleader, ninja), and then the end is just Otoya screwing up an order and getting freeze blasted by Takoto (who has a white Kivat?!), the end. There're really no jokes outside of Otoya being a creep and the two women alternately feuding and acquiescing, so it's like... that happened! Okay! I kind of wish it hadn't!

EPISODE 5 - "THE QUEEN ARRIVES"

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/queen5.png

Yay! Shizuka!

I don't have any complaints about this perfect conclusion. Having an all-powerful Shizuka obliterate the terrible men in Wataru's life is probably going to make the actual series finale seem weak and unconvincing by comparison. I could not wipe the smile off my face during this episode, from Nago's decision to frame Wataru not being at his home 24/7 in case Nago needed him as a failure of character that necessitated a full accounting of Wataru's shortcomings; to the conclusion, where a colossal Shizuka squares off against Kiva... before it's all revealed to be a bad dream of Wataru's.

OR IS IT?!

(It probably is.)

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/queen6.png

Well to start with, since Fish totally missed my prompt and put up the wrong version of the song, I’ll correct that oversight with Nago’s actual new song, “Don’t Lose Yourself”.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=dwVgcxh4dhw

As for the net movies, I haven’t seen them yet (I’ve only just seen Faiz’s HBV), but I will say I’m familiar with the guy playing Takato. He’s a guy named Shouma Yamamoto and I can give you three things about him.

1. He goes on to play a different, much larger role in the series proper.

2. After Kiva, he’s mostly been a voice actor and most of his Tokusatsu contributions have been to dubs of non-Japanese Toku like Kyoryuger Brave and Kamen Rider Dragon Knight, so don’t expect to see him again after Kiva.

3. As for what he’s like as a VA in general… I’ve only seen three shows he was in and two of them were dubbed, so I can’t really give a good impression.

i cant believe this guy kept you up all night watching net movies

I'm pretty sure I know which one, since we just got to meet Taiga (Baby Form) in Episode 28, and Takoto is only a few years older than Wataru. (He's Nago's age, which puts him at generally the right age to be the kid that protected Wataru in the flashback scene.)

Honestly, I got a ton of sleep! I watched these movies, wrote 'em up, can't remember the next part, and then slept 'til noon. I'm going to attribute my exhaustion-sleep to how great these Net Movies were, and how they left me too weakened by greatness to get up at a reasonable hour.

I would aggressively argue this point. He may not have done anything else with Kamen Rider, but he's got a good amount of tokusatsu screen acting under his belt. He was the male lead in Cutie Honey the Live and one of the title characters in Shougeki Gouraigan, both Toshiki Inoue series. He also plays Tsubasa/Makai Knight Dan in several Garo projects.

I’ll confess, I’m not too familiar with Tokusatsu outside of the big 4 (my main expertise is the live action Sailor Moon, Ryukendo and the ChouSeiShin trilogy). So I didn’t really know about Yamamoto’s other live action roles.

I actually went back and watched the Net Movies in their entirety for the heck of it, which was fun, but, and maybe this is to be expected, I didn't find any super notable uses of the show's BGM. That's fine for me, though, because this makes a great excuse to look backwards and share that sick melody that accompanies Wataru's very first transformation back in the premiere!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ur53IpAidU8

Like, I really didn't want to forget this one. I've seen people say Wataru's simple power walk is one of the coolest entrances a Rider's ever gotten, and with musical accompaniment like that, it's not surprising. I hadn't really locked in this whole gimmick I'm doing for the thread at the start, or I would've posted this back then. I was hoping the show would use this track again afterwards, but uh, as far as I know, it just kinda hasn't so far, and I'm sick of waiting!

I mean, as someone who watched Kiva and Hibiki essentially back-to-back, it was pretty hard to take Zanki seriously.

The Net Movies didn't help, no doubt. That card game was certainly a highlight. Overall, I'd say my opinions on each episode line up pretty neatly with yours. There are high points and there are low points, but I'll never not be happy Net Movies exist, even when it's in their primitive original form here. I think my favorite joke in the whole thing – that's probably just a legit mistake – is that when Wataru transforms into Kiva offscreen (to save that nonexistent budget) in the last episode, Ixa's transformation sound plays for some reason. Again, probably simple human error rather than anything intentional, but it fits the tone of a Net Movie really well!

It wasn't an oversight! But it does seem to be a misunderstanding? The two versions of Individual-System that are used in the show are the ones I posted, debuting in exactly the episodes I posted them after. And rest assured I haven't forgotten about the songs that never made it to TV, either.

I did laugh incredibly hard at Kivat pushing Wataru back into the hallway and closing the door so the Henshin could be as cheap as possible. The pulled the same kind of gag when Riki transforms into a Frankenbury, where the whole thing is done off of Wataru's very long reaction shot.

I think I love that kind of cheap-o DIY energy more than a million hours of CGI. Like, Shizuka dangling vegan noodles in front of Otoya as a torture! Yes! And it probably cost them 200 yen and took 30 minutes to make!

I love Net-Movies so much.

That's fine. Two of those are really obscure shows and I'm not sure I'd recommend Shougeki Gouraigan unless you're really into Inoue's sense of humor and/or boobs.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/...s/gotohell.gif

ha ha ha ha ha ha

oh my god

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

i don't think i can finish this movie

there're only nine minutes left, but i am laughing way too hard

It's THE BEST

I did not realize that was a plot point in the movie

Ah yes, one of my favorite power-up phrases

KAMEN RIDER KIVA: KING OF THE CASTLE IN THE DEMON WORLD

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/kivamoviea.png

This was one that... I had some problems with it. There are a weirdly high amount of little things that bothered me, stuff that was added in the shift to a movie that I found slightly baffling. But I ended up really enjoying it for reasons that I'm not sure I can even quantify. (I am also writing this incredibly late at night again. My scheduling this week for this thread has been abysmal.)

Some of it's just, like... look at that screencap! It's a movie where Wataru spends time with his dad. It's basically that simple. There's some incredible work done in giving the audience the emotional beats that feel widescreen and epic (Megumi and Yuri both kick ass as IXA!!!), rather than a billion Riders or some massive fight scene or whatever. It's really just a vehicle to give you some Parent/Child bonding across a toku landscape, and I'm not sure pointing out its flaws really tells the whole story.

In fairness, though: there are some flaws!

As much as I love the Wataru/Otoya story here, there's really not a lot to it. The opening parts play like a sweeter version of the recent Nago two-parter, as Otoya refuses to entertain Wataru's claims and they brawl in a classic Heroic Misunderstanding way. Once Otoya believes it, though, it's all weirdly played at the exact same level as the Net-Movies? Otoya loudly loves and supports his son, and Wataru unfailingly supports his dad. There's no friction in their story once they're both in 2008, which means there's almost no arc to their story for about 45 minutes. It's very sweet, and it arguably works better than having the two of them at each other's throats for a whole movie, but it makes everything in their relationship seem too easy. A lot of what Wataru is struggling with in Kamen Rider Kiva is how he fits in with his father's legacy, and what parts of him are passed down. So to have a movie like this dropped into the middle of the show's run that pretty much says Daddy Loves You No Matter What... this is going to make watching some of the Wataru scenes in Kiva a little less fun, even if this movie is non-canonical. (It has to be non-canonical.)

The other big thing is that, like, what the hell is even the deal with Takoto? His character only makes the slightest amount of sense if you watched the third Net-Movie, where it's revealed that Takoto was friends with Nago back when Nago was an overly-emotional crybaby. Because in the movie? There's no details about this dude at all. He shows up, Nago shrinks like he's trying to will himself out of Takoto's eyeline, and we're never told why. And this is the big adversary for IXA! There's nothing to key into for their rivalry or their friendship or any of it. Beyond that, he's a guy that has a belt for some reason, and betrays them for some reason, and it's all sort of shrugged at. (I believe the movie's answers to both of these mysteries are "another group made a Kiva belt somehow”, like that's just an easy thing to reproduce; and "that's just the type of guy Takoto is”, which, what? He's well-known for betraying people to immortal monsters who want to subjugate humanity? I thought he was the ace agent for a big monster-hunting agency? I feel like Most Likely To Betray Humanity should be a disqualifying trait!) He's a guy that has almost zero character, zero appreciable motivation, and dies in a fight that never really made any sense.

Otherwise, my gripes are fairly trivial. I don't know why there's a whole thing about Wataru going back to high school, since the only benefit it has (beyond some funny gags) is introducing Natsuki, and I feel like they could've done that some other way. Everyone knows Wataru is Kiva, but that's probably changed to make the story flow faster. All of the 2008 stuff with the Arms Monsters, who Wataru somehow already knows. Just little stuff.

(Well?€? there's also Otoya hanging out with his son in 2008, but I'd rather not wade into that plot at all if I can avoid it. It's a minefield. I didn't think it was nearly as problematic as describing it would make it sound, but describing it makes it sound intensely problematic, so no thanks. There is some maybe genuine bonding in it, though.)

Almost none of what I just talked about matters to me, though. It's a movie all about trying to find the value in who your parents were, no matter the baggage. It's not really a movie about Fathers and Sons, it's a movie about children trying to understand their parents. There's a sweetness to that being a theme for a giant toku movie (toku movies always go more vertical than their corresponding TV shows; look at how Shima is climbing a wall for his mission briefing with Nago!), and I liked how the movie used Natsuki's totally minor story to embrace its universality. We got to see Wataru and Otoya play a song together on stage. How am I not going to enjoy a movie that ends like that?

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/kivamovieb.png

Oh! And I loved how the movie shoveled in all of the Den-O voice actors (and Naomi, I think) in cameo roles. They're all very funny in how they tip their hand (Kin's quote on the chalkboard, Ura and Ryuta doing their catchphrases), but the absolute best cameo was, naturally, Momo:

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/kivamoviec.png
https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/kivamovied.png

Best part of the movie by far for me is Kamen Rider Arc being this super huge vampire man, and the super goofy voice of his belt.

Apparently, while they were in the present, Yuri and Otoya collaborated with Megumi and Nago on a hit record

https://youtube.com/watch?v=GPHdSyfi4GA

And here we get Kiva Flight Style, an action figure of which brought this movie to someone’s attention. It’s also that additional sound effect in the toy I not too subtly told you meant Wataru would turn into a monster.

I too got a chuckle out of Arc Kivat’s power up mode being accessed via his face falling off.

I’m sure dreamcastegirl can fill you in on who’s playing the Medusa Legendorga’s human form, so I’ll just say that both of 3H’s artificial Kivats (K.I.V.A.Ts?) are voiced by Norio Wakamoto, a voice actor who Kivat’s VA, Tomikazu Sugita, is known for his impression of.

And a bit of lore behind Rey Kivat (Takato’s belt) is that it was made by capturing and dissecting a Yeti (which are a sub species of giants in this universe).

One thing I love from this movie was the sequence of Wataru fighting alongside the Arms Monsters and going through each of his appropriate forms in the process.

I fell asleep the last time I watched this movie, however, this was what I was vaguely arm-waving and gesturing at when you first started speaking about Kiva; the moment here between Megumi and Yuri. I found this sequence really sad and really touching, and I was annoyed that it got me like it did. I know it might just be my own personal set of issues aligning perfectly with the moment to produce an emotional reaction, but I forgive a lot of Kiva's clumsiness for this alone.

It was her! Oshiri Rina as her nickname was whilst at the height of her fame. Make of that what you will. :p

Oh, I really worry about my reputation by this point.

However, having said that: Gal Sone. She was famous for eating contests, and for, well, being a gal. Of course, my absolute favourite moment in her career, is when someone (Tsunku, producer of Morning Musume) decided it would be a great idea to put her in an idol unit with soloist Tokito Ami—whose career he was really obsessively pushing at the time, perhaps at the expense of his duties as producer of Morning Musume, you could say—and Abe Asami, the younger sister of former MoMusu star, Abe Natsumi.

The result was, ah... it was... it was a thing that happened.

Alright, this is gonna be a bit more extravagant than usual, since it's the big movie and all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJKH4XvdMMo

Naturally, the first thing I'm doing is sharing is the movie's theme song, Circle of Life, which is low-key one of my favorite Rider movie songs? There's way too much competition to say I think it like, blows everything else out of the water or something, but it's just a really nice song with a nicely sentimental if stock message about the value of the connections between people that fits Kiva quite well. ...And I guess if you played this at the end of a Ghost movie, it wouldn't *not* fit, either, so there's maybe that.

The song was performed by yet another "limited" group put together for Kiva, Crimson-FANG. ("Crimson" being kurenai in Japanese. If I weren't already writing so much here, I'd launch into a huge rave about how much I love Wataru's name, by the way.) The vocals were provided by Nanase Aikawa, who Rider fans will know from Blade's first opening, further explaining why I like Circle of Life so much. It's also the only vocal song from Kiva to credit Tsuneyoshi Saitou as a composer alongside Shuuhei Naruse, which is neat, although I think that's entirely down to the violin piece from the movie itself being worked in, which is another cool thing about the song. It's a thing only Kiva could really do – having the emotional core of the summer movie be represented by music and then baking that music directly into the film's closing song.

As such, I also went with the "Re-Connection" version here, which includes that violin piece leading into the main song the same way it does in the film itself. Outside of that small difference, the versions are identical. Much like the two versions of the single released for the movie, themed around 2008 and 1986, with the '86 having a stylized Ixa Save Mode on the cover instead of Kiva. (And while this is completely unrelated, I'd really like to mention that the usual forehead gem on Kiva is designed to be identical to the little bolts on Rider #1's belt before I forget? Super neat reminder that Otoya's isn't the only legacy Wataru inherited!) While both versions of the single include the theme song, of course, they're differentiated by a second song from either Wataru or Otoya, With you and With me respectively, which I want to at least mention the titles of, because I find it impressive how much about the difference in attitude between these two characters is reflected in a simple change of pronoun.

But wait, there's still more music to talk about!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8C8azVDm4A

Naturally, the film's soundtrack is only getting used the one time, so I'm going to be sharing a few pieces of that too. First up is Otoya's Love, which is a fantastic example of how Rider movie soundtracks rework the flexible pieces from the show into more specific bits of scoring. This is basically just a very theatrical, gradually building version of the Wake Up theme, used to great effect when Otoya is giving his son a big ol' hug to stop an apocalypse. (...And Die said Inoue wouldn't write something like that.) :p

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuTACf6jZVk

And then finally, there's the self-explanatory Kamen Rider Rey, which is WAY too hardcore of a jam for a dude I care about this little! Thankfully, it's also used when Kiva and the Arms Monsters are all throwing down too, which, less thankfully, is actually the only place it's used in the Director's Cut, and it kind of gets buried in the action, while also lacking the cool build up. I literally would not have thought to link to this if I didn't specifically go listening to the soundtrack on its own and realize how sick it is – an experience that really reminded me why I'm doing this whole shtick to begin with!

*breathes deeply*

Okay, what's left now? Oh right, the movie!

Their relationship is actually explained right away... in the Director's Cut! Like a lot of Rider films, the theatrical version sacrifices a ton of the connecting tissue and even some of the emotional meat for the sake of getting the runtime down. In this case, I think the difference is maybe more drastic than usual, as there's some good parent-child bonding between Otoya and Wataru AND Yuri and Megumi that's sorely missing, even before mentioning thing like missing bits of exposition.

I say all this because I watched the movie again with the director's cut, of course, only going back to the theatrical one when I got curious why I didn't remember hearing that Rey theme music. Kiva's movie is one I only watched the one time, and it didn't leave a big impression on me at all. Most Rider movies improve on rewatches for me, so I figured this thread was a perfect excuse to give Kiva that shot finally.

It really is a pretty solid flick. I appreciate what it's doing by deliberately distancing itself from the show's canon, giving itself the freedom to just put all the elements where it wants them to deliver this sort of condensed version of Kiva that can toss in a bunch of fanservice-y things viewers are liable to want to see. The cross-era team-up was a natural choice for the big dang movie version, and I appreciate that it also puts a fair amount of spotlight on Megumi and Yuri as well. I think originally, I was maybe sort of hung up on the weird non-continuity (taking things too literally again, basically), but honestly, it's a fairly competent story in terms of representing the overall emotion of Kiva. I think the biggest downside is that none of the action totally wows me? They were clearly challenging themselves with how Kamen Rider Arc was filmed and stuff, but like, despite having a literal big scale last boss, the set-pieces don't always feel huge in terms of how they're shot and everything. Although to be fair, not every summer movie is shot like Paradise Lost or God Speed Love to begin with.

This was my first time seeing this film. I skipped most of the movies when I went through these shows the first time, but I'd gone back and watched all of them eventually except this one, because Kiva. I really regret it because I had a lot of fun with this. It is a really, really weird movie, but still a lot of fun.

I think what I liked most is that it didn't go the Faiz/Kabuto path of an AU or the Ryuki/Blade style of similar but noticeably divergent continuity. There are some small incongruities here, but if you ignore them then this feels like a proper Kiva story. I've always preferred the shows themselves to the films and the films that feel like the setting and characters don't even match the show are always the hardest for me to get into.

Overall, though, I thought the film was kind of a mess. I watched the director's cut, so it was a full 90 minutes and it felt really... well, not "disjointed," per se, but it felt like the movie had trouble remembering what it was doing a lot of the time. There are so many places where it starts going off in some new direction then suddenly remembers something it was supposed to be doing and throws it back in. Violin Girl is easily the most obvious example of this, as she's constantly popping in and out of the story.

My favorite part of the film was probably getting to see the '86 and '08 casts together. Wataru and Otoya had a very different dynamic from Megumi and Yuri, but it was still fun seeing the children get to actually spend time with their parents and the ways that they bounced off of each other. There were some other nice touches, though, like seeing Otoya and Yuri run into the cafe owner again.

The film could be really funny, too. I'm really surprised by how much I laughed. My favorite gag was probably Otoya leaving prison and the film suddenly looking all retro as he tries to play it off as a serious drama, but there were so many other good moments.

My absolute favorite part of this is that Takoto is set up as this big personal rival for Nago and then Nago just fucking disappears for the next hour of the movie.

When you travel forwards in time to hang out with your adult son you have to assert dominance. Law of the time jungle.

"Kamen Rider Arc"? Good to know his name, since I don't think the movie says it even once.

Him and Rey (which I only know because of other posts in this thread, the movie never says his name either) are both decent enough adversaries for our heroes, even if they also feel totally interchangeable. They're just monsters to watch everyone defeat, nothing it's possible to invest in (we are a long way from Kamen Rider Kabuki), but they're also pretty fun monsters to watch get defeated? I didn't care a ton about the action climax of the film, with the dogfighting CGI monstrosities, but Castle Doran becoming a giant, flaming Kiva? To deliver a Rider Kick to Arc that also brands the moon?! Sure, I can be into that.

I definitely didn't care about Arc or Rey as characters, but I really enjoyed them as monsters to be detonated.

Wow, did not get Yeti off of Rey's whole... thing. He just looked like some kind of ice spider? Nice to get some closure on that.

It's really in line with this movie trying to satisfy fans, and doing an Arms Monsters team-up scene (with a returning Kivehicle Booster Rocket that the show hasn't used in over a dozen episodes!) where we also get to see all of those form changes again... it's such a gift. As with nearly everything else in the movie that I loved, I could quibble with the shortcuts (pretty sure the Arms Monsters need to get transformed into weapons by Castle Doran, they don't just do it themselves), but it's such a fun scene in a fun movie that wants you to have fun, so why be that guy? I'm gonna go see Hitman's Wife's Bodyguard tonight. I am not immune to something only being fun to watch.

Megumi and Yuri doing a simultaneous Henshin into IXAs and wiping the floor with a bunch of monsters from mythology was pretty pretty great. I also really dug the playfulness of Yuri casually suggesting that she weighed 10 kilograms less than her daughter, and that little smirk when Megumi calls her out on it. They both come off as more assertive and headstrong than they've been portrayed as lately in Kiva. It feels more like two women who are great at their jobs and know it, which I've missed!

Dang! Good to know. I'm not sure it's anything I'm going to rush to watch (no time, plus I like the movie okay enough in the theatrical version), but I'll probably poke around it during a break. Thanks for the heads-up!

Yeah, fair. The Arms Monster fight is maybe the best one, for how much it lets Kiva's various form changes juggle the monsters by himself, and I really like the visual of Kiva and IXA charging Arc late in the film, but... yeah, most of the fights were Solid But Unexceptional, which is maybe not what you want to say about a higher-budget version of a tokusatsu TV show. Nothing was ever confusing or distracting, but it ended up being a movie where the emotional beats/fan-service just blew it out of the water.

That said, my favorite action scene in this movie was probably the one where Yuri and Otoya think Wataru is a Fangire, and Wataru is trying to rescue/kidnap the violinist. There's a lot of really fun choreography going on, with Wataru being inside the car and the violinist being outside and Otoya jumping into the car, and it's all entertainingly ridiculous. (Also! I think Takaiwa was one of the cops who got manhandled by our heroes!)

Yeah, this one totally felt like a Phase 2 summer movie. It's nothing that could really fit into the show's continuity (too many little changes and exclusions), but it's everyone you know in the settings that you remember acting like you'd expect. And Otoya's even treated like a goddamn Legend Rider by the cast, so it feels extra Phase 2.

That's how scared he was of Takato! He needed to not be in the same movie as him!

But, yeah, there's definitely some weirder pacing issues in the movie, like you said. It doesn't really cut between plotlines a lot, so when Wataru uses the Time Door to go back to 1986, you are not going to see anything with the rest of the 2008 cast for about twenty minutes. It's fine, since it never really loses track of Wataru/Otoya, which is the main thread of the film, but it's still not great for all of its cast.

KAMEN RIDER KIVA EPISODE 29 - "WHEN THE SAINTS GO MARCHING IN: I AM KING"

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/kiva29a.png

It's Ladies Night at Kamen Rider Kiva!

The men of Kiva take a backseat in this one, to better spotlight the various women of the show. We get little storylines with Mio, Shizuka, Yuri, and Megumi, and it adds up to a decent if slightly unfocused episode.

The Megumi storyline is the best, despite a lot of it coming from out of basically nowhere. Megumi's younger brother (!) shows up to remind her that the three years he promised her (!) to pursue her dreams of being a warrior are just about up, and it's time to come home and work in a dry-goods store (!). It's the most random dilemma Megumi could face, short of Nago telling her she needs to build a ? scale model of the Tokyo Dome or he's going to die of heart failure.

But the thing is, it mostly doesn't matter, this thing with her brother and him bribing W.A.K.E.U.P. to cut her loose. (Shima doesn't seem to care about enforcing the deal, since he already got paid. Quite a racket he's running!) None of that's really the point. The point is about how Megumi feels about her mother.

Back in 1986, Yuri is wondering what it means to be a warrior at peace. She's trying to turn Otoya's house into a home, and it just doesn't feel right. She loves Otoya, but she also loves fighting for justice. She needs to get some closure with Rook, since a lot of her identity is wrapped up in avenging her mother.

Back in 2008, Megumi is feeling like she's letting the memory of her mother down. If only she could take out Rook, she'd feel like she was making her mother proud. Her sense of self-worth is wrapped up in her mother's legacy, and she can't let go of that mission.

It's the same story, obviously. It's two women who feel trapped in their mother's shadow, frustrated by a need to put a pin in a battle that's haunted their family for decades. It's about figuring out where your family ends and you begin. Yuri can't be happy unless she's avenging her mother, and Megumi can't be happy unless she's honoring hers. They're trapped in this uneasy existence, trying to figure out if they're even happy while the world around them makes them question their desires.

I think it does a good job of selling Yuri and Megumi's inability to define their feelings. Megumi wants to finish Rook off to prove she's her mother's daughter, same as Yuri, but they're both unsure that it'd even help them move on. It's an episode where folks are frustrated, but unable to figure out how to make it stop.

It's one of those Question first-halves, you know? We're just introducing problems, and we're nowhere near figuring out how they're going to be resolved. I mean, the battle with Rook in both timelines needs to conclude, but that's almost incidental to fixing Yuri and Megumi's introspection. We'll see if it helps them to keep kicking ass in the next episode!

The other big storyline this episode is Mio and Shizuka, which... uh. It's not... it's not good? It's Shizuka moving from her normal role as Wataru's Mom into a more possessive, jealous role as his would-be girlfriend. It's a pretty gross story, with Shizuka being so awful that the show keeps doing insert shots of her dressed as a devil. It's not subtle! None of this story is subtle!

It's also not really funny or anything. It makes Shizuka entirely unlikable, even if her motivations are sort of relatable. She feels pushed aside by Wataru, and she's not really wrong. She's completely irrelevant to the plot now. Wataru's outgrown whatever caregiving and defense she might've offered, and he's falling for Mio. There's no room in Wataru's romance for Shizuka, and so she's acting out. It's not just her being a possessive brat, it's her trying to keep Wataru in her life, no matter the cost.

It's just a bummer of a plot to watch, though. It makes Shizuka horrible from pretty much nowhere, since there's not really been any build-up for this story. She went from Sweet And Protective to Manipulative And Controlling more or less between episodes. It's all a bit much, and I don't feel like Shizuka deserves this kind of story.

So, yeah, mixed bag of an episode! I'm going to go ahead and say that a spotlight on the women of Kiva is an unqualified good as an idea, even if the execution splits the difference between Compelling and Regrettable. Interested to see what the show ends up saying about the Aso women, and I'm really hoping the show salvages Shizuka's character.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/kiva/kiva29b.png

Shizuka story is fucked up.

I think I’ll just point out the bizarre trivia that as of this episode, Yuri is the female rider who has canonically had the most sex (the male rider with that distinction is Banno from Drive).

And now, on to the fact file for this week.

Warthog Fangire

True name: Propeller Kingdom's Collapse (プロペラ王国の崩壊 Puropera Ōkoku no Hōkai)

Human identity: Abel

Class: Beast

Rank: Pawn aiming to be King

Actor: Akira Kubodera