At this point as much as I love Micchy, even I have to admit, he should probably get thrown into the juicer. Personally though, I'd love to see him take over Yggasdrill and then get killed.

Add me to the crowd that is ready for Micchy's story to end. I think he'd sell out anyone to save himself. Look at how quickly he started working against Kouta. I think that tendency should be his downfall, and sooner rather than later.

So, this is still the fun, JUICY! show about dancing and fruit puns, right?

Yeah, this was another good one. The show is getting really, really dark, but it still isn't a simple good vs. evil thing as you can clearly see where Yggdrasil is coming from and what they're planning is an evil of necessity, not one of malice. We are in hardcore "ends justify the means" territory here. I tend to side with Kouta's idealism here, but at the same time it's kind of hard to see what he's trying to fight for here since there's currently no other available option than what Yggdrasil wants to do. I assume this dude Kaito is looking for may be part of the less genocide-y solution.

Also, Mai needs to ask to make sure that an obvious emergency shelter isn't a dance stage? God, I hope no one has ever trusted her with scissors.

Nah, Kusaka would be a dick right to your face. Micchy is worse because he hides it behind a friendly facade. He's also a much better character because it's still possible, if increasingly difficult, to sympathize with him.

Mai's complete and utter blandness is really fun. Kinda reminds me of Daisy from Great Gatsby, whose entire place in the story could be summed up as 'isn't actually worth it'. I hope Micchy doesn't burn the world down BEFORE he realises how worth it she isn't.

I don't find her blandness fun at all. I find her utterly annoying.

I was being sarcastic :lol

On a scale from 1 to Kristen Stewart, How bland is she?

I'd give her an eight.

Chick who plays Laurel on Arrow.

I know, what happened to her? She was so good as Ruby on Supernatural.

Because Laurel was a horrible character. Hrad to work with that.

I mean hell, the Arrow might as well be called "everyone shits on Laurel."

I didn't get that far into Arrow to be fair, I thought it was so overrated.

Season one was pretty good, but season two has been amazing. It's really rare to see a modern network show that is willing to advance its ongoing plots so quickly but satisfyingly. It's like they actually don't want to horribly draw everything out.

But, um, yeah. Gaim. New deco on the mix suit. Woo.

Watched the subs last night, OH SHIT this show doesn't ever let up. Project Ark....planning to essentially murder 6 billion people is cold and something I never expected to hear in a show made for children. You think they could use those resources to manufacture more belts but I'm guessing Yggdrasil ran the numbers and it didn't work out. And of course Kouta's been broken now that he knows about Yuuya, interested to see if/how he can get back on his feet. My only small issue is that I expected Kouta to not only try out Peach against Takatora but also make a grab for his Lock Seed. But that's trivial.

I assumed the whole six billion thing is simply because if they only have ten years 'til Earth is fucked then they can only produce one billion belts in that time. And although cold and soulless, I guess it's logical to go with the numbers you've got and not let an army of six billion monsters grow in the meantime. It'd be nice to be young and naive like Kouta (which is what he is, no doubt about it) but playing the hero isn't usually worth the risk in the real world, and although this ISN'T the real world, Gaim is one of the most realistically, and wonderfully, ground series I've ever seen. Isn't it better to save one in seven, than risk overreaching and saving no one?

When I first watched the episode I was all DAMN SON but I'm honestly not sure whether Yggadrasill are "evil" or simply making the complex, grey area decisions that real world leaders make in real conflicts. And sometimes those leaders have to make choices that don't get them any friends.

I give props to both Yggadrasill but also the writers for making such a fantastically complex set of "villains". Give me one of your drivers and I'll happily do what you need for the greater good.

Thing is, we're only believing what Yggdrasil has told us.

There could be, and probably is, another option to stopping the forest.

Yggdrasil's only for the "greater good" because they claim their methods are the ONLY methods. Don't believe everything they say. Just because they haven't found another option, doesn't mean there isn't another option.

That sucks. The second season has been AWESOME. Mostly because they dropped the soap drama from season 1, and it's much more action focused. It's gotten a lot smarter, and feels less like Smallville-style "real life drama" except with superheroes running around, and more like an actual comic book adaptation. (except it's original but y'know...)

And they finally gave him a fucking mask.

I'm just sticking with the winning team, got nothing to gain by trying to be a hero.

Except, you know, saving everyone?

How quick to give up without even considering that just maybe Yggdrasil doesn't know everything?

I'm with Kaito here, this ain't a world saving, cutting the world down to a seventh will give us a chance to start again. Who knows, the new world could be better than this one.

What a defeatist attitude.

See the problem is, fictional characters thinking like that is okay, because it's fake. But man, life must suck super hard if you just want to blow up the world.

Or it would be barbaric hellhole full of people with a survival of the fittest mentality, running rampant with monsters.

Tons of innocent people would die, especially people with disabilities and children. All because they more than likely wouldn't receive a driver or wouldn't' be 'strong' enough.

Yeah, I think I'm on Kouta's side with this one.

What a ridiculous post, I expected better from you bro. You do realise this is a TV show, right? I can indulge in my sides differently than if this was a real life polling system.

Do I think the world needs changing? Yeah. So I'm gonna side with the characters trying to fix it - unless it comes out that they were never trying too in the first place but this show generally isn't that shallow.

Yggdrasil's up for debate, but Kaito definitely doesn't care about fixing the world though. He just wants to forge a world where the strong survive and the weak perish.

Yup, and even for Yggdrasil, only Takatora seems actually concerned for the survival of humanity. The rest are just riding on that excuse, they actually don't seem concerned at all.

I expected better from you. "Bro."

So quick to just take what you're told as truth. Yggdrasil could be lying completely. I mean hell, did they not basically admit that to Kaito?

Worse. He wants a world where his deffinition of strong survive.

Kaito's views of who is weak and strong are ridiculously arbitrary. He's easily the stupidest character in this show. And an awful actor. That braindead loser thinks he was weak because as a child he couldn't stop a mega corperation.

Yeah, think about kids. Infants.

You just assume everyone in Zawame is able-bodied?

They may be lying, but with what we got so far, they also provide the best option.

Exactly, it's abhorrent and inhuman, but it's the only plan the cast has right now.

I'm in the boat of siding with Yggdrasil as well. They have a plan and though incredibly evil and damn near monstrous, they have a plan that does make sense. Kouta's plan? Well his plan is just fight as per usual. Regardless if they're lying or not, I'd rather be on the team of a people with a concrete plan, then on the team of somebody who keeps changing his thoughts and ideas every other week.

And with 23 episodes left, why would you think that will ever remain the ONLY plan?

Spoiler alert guys: They WON'T blow up the city and kill everyone in it. Sorry, but you know that's not gonna happen, yet obviously they're gonna beat helheim somehow. So, yeah, gonna side with "logic" over "kill everyone because HOW DARE YOU EVER CONSIDER AN ALTERNATIVE!"

Or they could party like it's 1999.

... That's okay, I know where the door is.

*Leaves.*

I never said that, Kouta and gang will find another solution, hopefully in time, I'm just talking about the present, where the company that has spent years studying and fighting the Inves wasn't able to come up with anything better.

Kouta doesn't change his ideals every week. They remain the same, and he evaluates Yggdrasil based on what has been revealed to him. While he may change his plans frequently, that's because Yggdrasil takes time to reveal things to him. He's not flip-floppy with his principles.

I guess what it all comes down to is whether you think ends justify the means, and I'm on the side that says it isn't worth buying the lives of 1 billion people over 6 billion. I think Project Ark is a good idea, but I don't think their planned genocide is.

So place me firmly on Kouta's side. :)

Exactly. I love Kouta as a character, but in a story like this fighting for the sake of vague idealism is pretty darn useless. He has no real goal, or no real grasp of the wider picture. We obviously know he'll save the day in the end, but it spoils the fun for everyone if we accept that and have no fun along the way.

So as we stand, I'm gonna stand with Yggadrasill, and their logical but totally cruel plan, sorry guys.

Getting back to Micchy I'm shocked no one remembers that they are fates worse than death. Keep in mind that people like Dragon Mystery tend to have ironic fates befall them at some point, namely during the endgame.

I'll wait until we have more info before picking a side. As someone who nearly went mad learning about Type MOON lore it pays to get more intell before settling on a viewpoint.

No, you said that you'd side with Yggdrasil because they have the best plan.

For now.

That's a very short-term idea. It seems like "what's best" doesn't factor. You just want to be on the winning team at all times, not the team who's won.


You just want to pick the opposite side because it's not the "typical." Rather than do what's right, you want to just make a statement. I mean, if Takatora pushed that button this ep, even though we know one day Gaim will win, Yggdrasil would've seemed really fucking stupid, wouldn't they?

My opinion is that Urobuchi is actually making a statement of hope against crushing torrents of despair. Although this goes beyond just impassioned logic and into more philosophical or even religious debate.

I know Kouta will come up with something but realistically Yggdrasil should be able to come up with a better plan than a regualr civilian with only a few weeks of experience with the Inves and Hellheim.

I don't care about the winning team, Kouta will win, I just find their plan more reliable than continue to fight withouth the slightest idea if there's any way to solve it.

Exactly. I mean let's think about it, Kouta got his Sengoku Driver by chance, and became a Rider to help fuel his and his friends' own gain. Now he fights for what exactly? Against Yggadrasill? Sort of. He just argues with them mostly. He isn't fighting to stop them, or even inform people about what's actually going on. He just stands there with a thumb up his ass going "Durrr Yggadrasill is bad cause they lied, gave us a game for research, and came up with a plan to stop our world be destroyed." Is genocide a good thing? No it isn't. But it's better then walking around acting all sour because adult businessmen are acting like adult businessmen who have though about every option possible, and while the end result isn't ideal, it's better then nothing.

Hey at the beginning we didn't even know about project ark, or Helhiem or all of that, now as for DJ Shagara's who will Helhiem choose, could be the next arc/movie. And Zawame might blow up, who knows? Nobody this show is unpredictable.

And there is nothing wrong with this, but the Butcher seems to be trying (at least by toku standards) to make this feel like a real world, with fleshed living people in it. There is no clear good or bad, everyone has their own personal interests and everyone still has at least one more card on the table to play.

That is why I refuse to write off Yggadrasill as purely evil, we know in this show it isn't that simple. And similarly Kouta is a man to rally behind, but the show itself points out the naivety of his character and also the pitfalls of such idealism.

Although we may personally decide who are heroes, and who aren't, I think the show has struck a surprisingly complex balance of only condemning one side as much as the other. That is what I love about this show.

And he always goes in half cocked, too, never forget that. His battle is entirely reactionary, and he's fighting against an organisation that has all the facts, even if the audience may not. Your breakdown of his characterisation has hit the nail on the head, and minus fighting with the Energy Riders, what else has he actually done to try and tackle them? It isn't like he's creating a revolution. Because he believes that people are better off not knowing? Then he's no different from his enemy...