I like that your way of refuting my praise is to point out that you merely thought about it for an entire day before having a brilliant read on it.

...I honestly can't tell if you're really this humble, or if this is a gag, and I'm not sure which would make me madder.

So, the thing that I think makes the Tsukasa/Natsumi relationship land so well is that it's of a slightly different duration than we've seen in other Heisei shows. Most of the dynamics in the other shows are either long-term relationships where the main character has a warm relationship with the other character (Wataru/Shizuka, Ryotaro/Airi, Asumu/Hitomi), or relationships that only start in the first episode and are all prickly and weird (Wataru/Megumi, Ryotaro/Hana, Asumu/Akira). The Tsukasa/Natsumi relationship is right in the middle, since he's only been hanging around for a little while. It's new enough that she can lose her temper at his quirks, but established enough that they can have little nicknames and friendly banter.

The two of them... it's right in this sweet spot of Antagonism and Affection, you know? Good energy.

I didn't know that the Decade talk here would involve various different people, I thought it's all Zatyme. I guess this is called "TokuNation watches for a reason".

Oh, so the Onodera debut, although it got better at the end (even it's due to him learning more of heroism), wasn't really well-received here (I refer for Die here, of course Fish wouldn't resonate with this for obvious reasons). Actually I was kinda afraid that, especially with Kuuga bashing here (yes it was probably joking due to it contrasting with the reply to Enchilada645, but sorry it did gave me a wrong impression at first because bashing people for liking different stuff commonly happens in fandom and they mean it - hence the "unpopular opinion" start), Onodera will be hailed here as "the right way to handle Godai, give him an actual humanizing trait in relatable motive like impressing a girl instead of turning them into typical goody-two-shoes", I've seen that happened to someone like Superman here for example, but instead, the response here seems to be similar to Kotaro from Den-O? But otherwise yes, iirc, not being able to get Odagiri back was the reason that this is a brand new Kuuga story, as well as any other seasons who gets revisited. The video games also separate Godai and Onodera (both of their first names are Yusuke! in this thread I gotta refer to original Kuuga as Godai then) at times like Battride War.

For Onodera's motive, well, I think this is a mistake people commonly do, to only judge character's morals by motive alone, like if they don't fight for altruistic reasons then that character "isn't even a hero", but an even worse case of this (not done here, but an example) is when someone claims to have noble motivation despite doing bad things, they're hailed as "doubtful hero". It should be obvious that the former is still much better than the latter despite the motivation. Actions define the hero/villain archetype, and characterization determines the traditional/anti label. So it doesn't matter if he's abrasive or only does it for approval, he's still a hero if he regularly saves peoples lives by fighting monsters. Doing it for un-heroic reasons just makes him an anti-hero (of course morally grey hero wouldn't suit original Kuuga other than being its own entity).

Now I see what I'd expect more of Tsukasa here, he had several real dick moves, and he's appropriately called "Dickeido" by some of the fans, like him constantly pouring water at the coffee without stopping, and dismissing people he finds boring like Onodera's motive (I know Onodera deserves to be called out, but I think Tsukasa just offends there by condemning someone as being boring - he offends others just that it happens to be someone deserving). I'd wonder though what would Tsukasa react to someone more like Godai there, actually the likes of those are what people like audience going to bash as being boring more - they unwittingly making opposite comparison (to some audience) for Tsukasa here. And for Tsukasa's dick acts, I guess him being baffled for the Gamio's assault and wanting to save the world there shows his standards, that even a jerk like him would have limits, and that's required to assign him as the main hero (like many of secondary Riders being one of the main casts), albeit obviously anti-hero as what Androzani24 talked about him dirtying his hands to accomplish that. I'd think the mystery part, for Tsukasa knowing everything, it's down to the production team instead of Tsukasa "playing New Game+" to not actually make a scene of working out towards the mystery, just going instantly to the results of Tsukasa figuring everything out. Tsukasa learning Grongi language is probably an interesting method to implement, the reverse of monsters learning human language.

At first I thought they were actual siblings (like Die here, and was confused of Tsukasa claiming he fights for his crush) and it'd be combination of several Kuuga characters like being one/several of the Kuuga's cops (not only Ichijou) as long as Minori (Godai's little sister). As the female Ichijou, there'd be an opposite here from what I get as well, as in Kuuga, it was Godai who had an influence to others and drawing them in; the others being the more reluctant one, albeit briefly (Ichijou was only reluctant at first 3 episodes), but in Decade as seen in the dying scene, Yashiro was the one to draw in and push Onodera, the one who is more reluctant, as he almost retired when Yashiro is dying. The term "onore Decade" exists for a reason like the messing with original series, but at least in this scene, aside from that inspiring words scene can be hated due to it being treated as cheesy or that some want the series to not showcase preaching, regarding the talk about Onodera and heroism here, it at least shows that, despite Onodera contributes likely far more compared to the police force, doesn't mean that he's necessarily the most heroic for being the one who saves the world, it can be the others that are more heroic instead, but has less power/scientific intelligence to contribute as much as Onodera like Yashiro here.

True, Decade's high point would be the effects/action, I saw a footage before and it seems that Decade has stellar special effects, and like the discussion for episode 1 before. It's Decade's thing in general to have the previous Riders turn into their assists, not only Kuuga to Gouram here - as I've known in video games like Climax Heroes. But actually, the one that I hate the most for Onodera is actually not character but the Rider stuff, the fact that they watered down Kuuga power wise, like base Decade going toe to toe with Ultimate Kuuga before at the Hell Bros fight. I think as I said in Fish's Kuuga thread, Kuuga Ultimate form is my favorite implementation of the final form in the franchise, with the power upgrade being distinct from previous Kuuga's already devastating attack, only used against the final threat so it won't look like a fool like being jobbed, and knowing the escalating power, it's justified that Godai would only use basic attacks against Daguva in the final fight, but even then, basic attacks are still enough to put him down showing his power as well.

Though I wouldn't like Kuuga (as a Rider)'s handling here, I'd give more free pass to the threats as it wouldn't be exactly the same unlike Riders who are pseudo-return from the past series, it'd just mean that Decade's A.R Worlds have far less threat than the original series ones, with the final threat on the Kuuga A.R World being a "mere" Gamio, someone who doesn't seem to be nearly as threatening as Daguva (at least on his own), as he's put down only by 2 base Riders fighting him, Decade and Onodera Kuuga, even if Decade is an anniversary Rider. Though obviously Gamio would have the same goal of prolonging conflict among humans, and he even excuses his as human wanting conflicts - I̶'̶m̶ ̶k̶n̶i̶d̶a̶ ̶s̶c̶a̶r̶e̶d̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶c̶o̶m̶m̶u̶n̶i̶t̶i̶e̶s̶ ̶l̶i̶k̶e̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶s̶ ̶t̶r̶y̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶"̶f̶o̶l̶l̶o̶w̶ ̶h̶i̶s̶ ̶e̶x̶a̶m̶p̶l̶e̶"̶ ̶t̶o̶o̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶i̶n̶c̶i̶t̶e̶ ̶c̶o̶n̶f̶l̶i̶c̶t̶s̶ ̶s̶o̶ ̶i̶t̶'̶l̶l̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶"̶f̶u̶n̶"̶,̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶r̶e̶ ̶a̶r̶e̶ ̶j̶u̶s̶t̶ ̶n̶o̶ ̶s̶u̶p̶e̶r̶p̶o̶w̶e̶r̶s̶ ̶i̶r̶l̶ ̶(̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶G̶a̶m̶i̶o̶ ̶w̶o̶r̶k̶e̶d̶ ̶o̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶b̶y̶ ̶t̶u̶r̶n̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶m̶ ̶i̶n̶t̶o̶ ̶G̶r̶o̶n̶g̶i̶s̶)̶. Other than Yashiro's final moment being favorite scene talk here, I also like that they didn't hold back of making Yashiro die here, I'm not usually talking or praising something like this - but for the stakes of the threat that can happen, though for others, it'd be still too easy solution that, Gamio died, all of what he left disappears too, erasing all of the impacts at once.

For the Tendou-Tsukasa common comparison (at least to audience, and later since ep. 26 Decade's main writer is Yonemura - I don't know if this'd count as spoiler though), I'd find it a probably missing opportunity to make the Hopper brothers like, probably bring up Tendou regarding Decade, like the resemblance to him or irrational jealousy or such. Their other use and their flaw being a downfall is neat though.

So you'd appreciate Haruto too. I mean he's not one of the more well-liked protagonist AFAIK, being frequently seen as boring, having "no personality", etc. where while those 2 are divisive but gains biggest praise I've seen (plz don't gloat over that while putting down others... ~). I do want Haruto to remind that being confident and stylish (or being 'competent') doesn't mean you have to possess unpleasant traits like being arrogant, or such; Haruto has similar moral compass as most of other main Riders while oozing confidence. And yes, I've read too that there are those who don't like Haruto and thinks to "fix" him you gotta make him smug and cocky like those 2, and though you'd prefer Onodera here, I'm afraid of Onodera being considered as a way to "fix Godai", which is similar to the "fix talk" for Haruto there.

Well, I'd think both Tsukasa and Tendou are the type who mostly focuses in only the saving people/the world part, so I'd not think "helping out" 100% fit to describe here. Like saving the world is just one out of a wide range of good morals out there, someone can do that yet fail in other moral deeds. I'd think the term helping out would cover many morally good trait and deeds in addition to “saving people”, like Die said the franchise is about "helping others psychologically", and KR has showcased many of that typically in most other main Riders, but CMIIW in this response I want to talk.

That'd be very surprising of someone so minor being appeared before as a character not even named iirc, both died too but in opposite way. And for Tsukasa's action, I guess breaking the law isn't necessarily questionable, but what Tsukasa did was a case of something questionable enough. For other things, it's something similar to Tendou as well before in Kabuto ep. 3, he too barged into a police station and assaulted several of them to do the job by taking the Worm of the weak (impersonating Yuki) which was held there.

I'd think that, the part of "you can tell they care about each other quite a bit", it's something that is expected from KR as well in any of the protagonist side casts, not just the dysfunctional part. The only few times that this is not a case is (cmiiw, iirc) when a villain is dragged into the protagonist side casts for common goal, not them being redeemed, like Kuroto in Ex-Aid.

I've talked about this before, but I'd think that Ryotaro/Hana doesn't fit into it being "all prickly" (they are an example of those starting at first episode though); Hana is all hostile and aggressive to the Taros Imagins, but for Ryotaro never showed any meanness towards him (to humans in general mostly too) even when guiding him, she sits with him, talks to him, and tries to help, without something like putting him down or such. For the other 2 example, it fits, with Megumi making condescending remarks that put down Wataru, though very briefly for Asumu/Akira (it's like Godai/Ichijou, Ichijou being hostile only at first 3 episode).

I don't think anybody can praise Kuuga like #1 (or rather, #2 and #4) fan Fish Sandwich can. You'll definitely be seeing a lot more contributors here as a dozen people have been meticulously selected for each arc.

Anyway, as one of many who started with Decade, Onodera Yuusuke was also my first Kuuga and to this day the one who I most associate with that suit. It helps that unlike most of the AU Riders, he's not just a guest in Tsukasa's show, he's a main character as well. The major thing he lacks compared to Godai is that thumbs up gesture and the friendly attitude that it symbolizes. Not everybody can be as selfless as Godai. But they don't have to be! I don't hold any resentment towards Yuusuke for not being exactly like Godai. Honestly, I think it's a great message to the kids that anybody can be Kuuga, as long as they have the will to fight for justice and freedom. That goes for other Riders as well.

So I previously brought up my currently Blade-less Heisei Rider Ranking in the Kiva thread and I thought maybe this would be a good opportunity to elaborate on that. Kuuga is ranked 18/19. It's not that I dislike it or anything like that, I generally enjoyed it, but something had to go there. It's a very classic take on the superhero concept and modernization of the Kamen Rider themes, but the conflict feels very raw between this ideal hero and these Unidentified Lifeforms whose entire motivation is simply to do evil stuff for entertainment. I think that most of the quality of this show, outside of the action, is instead the powerful effect that Godai's wisdom and empathy has on other people. It's thanks to Kuuga's foundation of heroism that the Heisei Rider Era was able to grow in to something bigger. It's the legend that started it all.

In (Onodera) Yuusuke's case, he's also the start of his own legend, which is an important part of Tsukasa's story. Similar to Godai, Yuusuke also has a positive influence on the people around him and that's not just a part of his personality but also a legacy of Yashiro who gave him the courage to be a hero. As others have pointed out, their relationship is like Godai and Ichijo, except here the Ichijo counterpart dies, unfortunately, and that motivates Yuusuke to be the kind of hero she wanted him to be. It's through Tsukasa's exposure to him, as a person who now has a clear future and something he wants to fight for, that maybe he can also get closer to figuring out his place in the world. Yuusuke may not be the same Kuuga as the one who started the legend of the Heisei Rider Era, but I think he's the right Yuusuke for this specific story.

I think this was maybe where I was coming from? This is Onodera's origin story, and it's mostly about him really becoming Kuuga. When he decides to fight to protect smiles, that's the moment he becomes a true hero, rather than just someone who enjoys fighting and/or is trying to impress a girl.

That's just a total Legend Rider thing, though, isn't it? A character gets a Final Form at the end of their series that is practically earth-shattering in its power, then six months later that form is barely sufficient to keep up with the newest Rider.

For this series, I think you can squint a little and see it as Onodera only recently being able to tap into all of Kuuga's power, and not really having the full force of any of them yet. Maybe now that he's embraced his role as Kuuga, he'll be able to harness more of that power?

Yeah, there's an easy calm to Godai that Onodera replaces with a kind of nervy exuberance, and I think that can come off a little more relatable? Godai felt almost unattainable, in his coolness, and Onodera is more normal in his flaws. It's hard to enjoy at first, if you're used to Godai, but Onodera's build-up to becoming Kuuga is nicely cathartic.

'Power Levels' are tenuous at best in the majority of Rider shows, and basically do not exist in crossover stuff. It's best to just not worry about it

It just occurred to me that I still forgot to mention one tiny little detail in these episodes that I loved, which is how they deliberately set up the numbers of the Grongi so that Decade ends up being Unidentified Lifeform #10, which is a super obvious bit to do, but that's exactly why I'm glad they didn't pass up that opportunity.

Also, while Tsukasa and Newsuke might be worlds apart in terms of their personalities, their actors Masahiro Inoue and Ryouta Murai have common ground in that they're both certified Rider nerds. I even dug up some random interview with Murai where he says he watched Kuuga through to prepare for his role and ended up plowing through the whole show in 3 days because he found it that interesting, which I naturally have to respect.

There was a really good episode of Shinkenger about something exactly like this, and it kind of blew my mind when I watched it to the point where I still think about it a ton. This doesn't really have anything to do with the topic of the thread, by the way; I just like thinking about Shinkenger.

(And for the record, just that "New Game+" comment alone was at least as clever as anything I said about those episodes.)

I'm super happy to see an Onodera fan club going in this thread, by the way? I always like to think that every character or show or whatever is somebody's favorite, so it genuinely warms my heart to see affection for a character I've always had the (mistaken?) impression was a little unpopular?

Oh! And here's a fun story! I know Die has poked fun at me in the past for always calling Yuusuke "Yuusuke" instead of Godai, and the reason I started doing that was actually specifically because I remember always seeing people differentiate the two Kuugas as above, which always felt backwards to me, because Yuusuke's name was Yuusuke well before Newsuke's was. It kind of became about more than that over time for me, though, and it was pretty vindicating to do all that Kuuga research and find out both Takatera and Arakawa call him Yuusuke too.

A very nice touch! There are times where I wonder if the people making Decade really get the shows they're paying homage to, but doing that with the Grongi numbers is a cute detail.

Well I've noticed that Yuusuke is a little unpopular, so we're probably in the minority of people who like him. It makes sense that this thread would bring in all his fans who love to have the opportunity to talk about how great and underrated he is, the same way that the Hibiki thread revealed that everybody really loves the Oonamazu arc.

I guess I just call Godai Godai for the same reason I call Tendo, Kusaka and Terui by their surnames, since that's how they're typically addressed by other characters. But I can definitely respect that you call him Yuusuke due to that personal connection you feel with him, since I also make exceptions like that for certain characters who I connect with, like Ryuuga who everybody else calls Banjyou. He's always going to be Ryuuga to me.

Hibiki and his AU counterpart on the other hand.... How do we even distinguish them by name?

You mean Hibiki and Depressed Sokichi Banba? :p

Yeah, I guess that's one way to do it. :lol

FYI Onodera is Ishinomori's real surname.

I totally forgot the Hell Brothers popped up in the Kuuga world.

If you wish for it, and you believe in them; the Hell Brothers can pop up anywhere you want them to

Joining me for these Kiva-themed Decade episodes is a fan with the largest amount of Kamen Rider trivia I've ever encountered, Androzani84!

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KAMEN RIDER DIE: Thanks for being a part of this Decade project! In a little bit we're going to watch some Kiva-themed Decade episodes - the least controversial of all Kamen Rider series to pay homage to - but first, I wanted to chat with you about how we got to be in a place where we could be two people talking about toku on TokuNation. Can you tell me a little about how you discovered the tokusatsu genre? What was your entryway into this world of superheroes and superhero merchandise?

ANDROZANI84: Well, my entry into tokusatsu isn’t that glamorous. Watched Power Rangers as a kid, got back into it through a parody on YouTube, discovered it came from this thing called Super Sentai, found a place I could check it out and from there, I found out about similar shows and that’s how I got here.
As for TokuNation, I don’t remember the exact details. I just found it online one day and hung around for months, before signing up to share an interesting thought and from there I just hung around.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: So, lemme delve into some of that. What was your first Power Rangers show? Do you remember?

ANDROZANI84: It was either Dino Thunder or Ninja Storm. I got DVDs for both around the same time, but I don’t remember which I watched first.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Do you remember what made you get into it as a kid? Were you a big fan of superheroes otherwise?

ANDROZANI84: Not particularly. I just got into it because I thought it was “cool”. Most of my interests back then weren’t really consistent (they still aren’t).

KAMEN RIDER DIE: No? Did you end up sticking with Power Rangers after you discovered Sentai shows?

ANDROZANI84: Somewhat. But it’s one of my more downplayed interests.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: The Super Sentai shows eclipsed it for you?

ANDROZANI84: Some did. But given that I tend to get new Sentai episodes more than new PR episodes, it became a bit more omnipresent in my mind

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Sure! I can see how a steady stream of Sentai would make it a bigger part of your fandom. Do you remember which Sentai show really hooked you on the Japanese versions? Was there a series that helped wean you off of Power Rangers?

ANDROZANI84: I can’t say there was. Though I think the show that got me hooked on Sentai in its own right was Liveman, the 1988 season.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Wow! That's a deep dive, relative to Power Rangers and etc. Why Liveman? Were you just going through all the series and that one was a good one, or were you pointed towards that show specifically?

ANDROZANI84: The first answer.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Tell me a little bit about Liveman, then. What about that show worked for you?

ANDROZANI84: I’d say it was the fact it managed to remain optimistic while having a few bleak moments with some degree of success. And there were some fairly good episode of the week plots as well.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Nice! Sounds like the sort of show anyone would get hooked on. With all of that toku watching, what led you to Kamen Rider? Any particular show or character that caught your eye?

ANDROZANI84: Well my first real exposure to Kamen Rider was Engine Sentai Go-Onger vs Gekiranger, which featured a trailer for the 2009 SHT shows (Shinkenger and Decade) at the end. And at some point, I decided to check out the first Super Hero Taisen film, and then soon after the Ninninger vs Drive special. I didn’t get in there fully until I saw the KR Zi-O was featuring some guest stars I’d recognise as one-off riders. And as a milestone show themed around time travel, it appealed to me a bit too much.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: This sort of answer always interests me: you got into the franchise through an anniversary celebration? Were you able to follow everything? I feel like a ton of the Legend Riders stuff would've been too perplexing to really enjoy. How were you able to follow it all?

ANDROZANI84: Well early on, there wasn’t a lot being referenced directly (aside from a few quirks and settings) and by the time I got to the second half, I’d caught up on a few more shows progress wise (so in short, I went from not knowing why the red and blue guy was saying “best match” about two random things to knowing who the guy with the blue streak in his hair talking about “shinigami party time” was)

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I admire that speed and dedication! Being the sort of fan who follows multiple franchises across multiple continents, it's only natural that you'd find your way to a toku fan site. You said that you stumbled upon TokuNation, and you lurked for a while before you started posting. What made you start interacting with folks on the board, do you think?

ANDROZANI84: Well like I said, I had an interesting point to make, so I made it. And then I found myself with more to say and I became a regular enough presence to be considered a veteran after only 2 years.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: And we're all grateful for your expertise and encyclopedic memory! Where do you find yourself hanging out on the boards? Any specific aspects of the fandom you're more interested in discussing?

ANDROZANI84: Well I’m more of a show discussion guy, but I do post in the fanfiction thread fairly frequently (mostly because fanfiction is one of my hobbies) I’ve also done some news articles if no-one else has covered the news.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: What about the merch? I know you've gotten yourself a decent collection of roleplay items.

ANDROZANI84: Well that was something that I started collecting when I found at least two separate local sellers at a big convention and picked up some stuff there (even if it did result in a bill of over 200). Before that, I got a Zodiarts switch off Amazon since it was a reasonable price for a 7 year old item.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Roleplay stuff is sort of a blindspot for me, so let me ask you some follow-up questions. Do you try to go deep on an individual show (every Shift Car, for example), or do you just get a couple things for each series (the main Henshin devices for a Rider show and that's it)?

ANDROZANI84: I mostly stick to a few easily sourceable things, but KR Saber and Zenkaiger have been where I go all in on collecting (for the former, I got the Swordriver, the three emblems for it, the Wonder Combos for each emblem, the Kenzan gear [the sword and the regular belt], the first quarter power ups and the Xross Saber. For the latter, I got both transformation items, the regular storage belt and the two main robots.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: That sounds very fun. I'll sometimes see people's roleplay collections and get a little envious. Then I'll realize I've got no space (and less money) for another collection in my life, so I'll be content with my envy.
On the topic of slightly negative emotions that need to be tamped down in order to function, let's talk about Kamen Rider Kiva! Kiva was on your shortlist of shows you were interested in discussing. Can you talk about why you listed Kiva as an option? What about that series caused a reaction?

ANDROZANI84: Well Kiva is a personal favourite and Decade was kind of my full introduction to it (beyond a few brief appearance of the suit elsewhere), and someone commented that he was surprised by how much of a drastically different AU it was to the original, which had just come out last year, and that got me to check it out. So I basically thought it would be fun to be able to do something of a compare and contrast. Plus, the Kiva episodes are the end of the introductory arc to the series, with the dynamics until our secondary shows up being fully established and I thought it might be good to analyse who effectively it comes across.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Makes sense to me! For the actual Kiva series, any parts of that you remember more fondly than others? Favorite characters, or favorite storylines?

ANDROZANI84: Well for moments I remember, I’d say it would be the “Otoya possession” and “Nago in ‘86” two-parters, mostly for allowing the formulae to be played with. For favourite characters, I’m definitely fond of where both Maya and Yuri go as the series goes on. And my favourite storyline would probably be episodes 44-6, purely for how it wraps up the ‘86 plot line and paves the way for the end of the ‘08 plot line.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I'm with you 100% on Maya and Yuri. I don't know if anything on that show topped the two of them detonating Rook across the decades.
Speaking of decades! ANDROZANI84! Wake up! The world's our stage, and it's time to watch some Decade episodes!

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KAMEN RIDER DECADE EPISODE 4 - “SECOND MOVEMENT: KIVA THE PRINCE”

A tuxedo and a pink (magenta?) violin case tells us that we’re in the World of Kiva! It’s a world where Fangires and humans coexist, but that dream of coexistence hides a nightmare under the surface. While Onodera works to convince a very small Wataru to lead the Fangires away from violence, Tsukasa more or less gives himself over to violence, executing Fangires and brawling with special guest star Kamen Rider Kaixa. It… these guys are not really getting how teamwork goes. That division gives a new Fangire the chance to steal the throne, putting Fangires on a path to destroy humanity!

KAMEN RIDER DECADE EPISODE 5 - “THE BITING KING’S QUALIFICATIONS”

Wee Wataru runs from his defeat, willing to let humanity be destroyed since that’s what monsters do. It’s Onodera who saves the day, giving a Worthy Of Kuuga pep talk that reframes the situation around friendship and believing in yourself. Tsukasa is sort of around enough to maybe get the bullet points, while not totally seeing how they might apply to his role as multiversal savior/destroyer. With Wee Wataru restored to power, our Team leaves the World of Kiva with a new set of cards, a new tiny bat lady, and more threats from Mysterious Fisherman!

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https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/.../decade04a.png

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Look at him! Look at our tiny new Wataru (...Wee Wataru?) in his classic home. I was definitely not prepared for this depressed 10-year old to be our Kiva, considering we just saw Classic Wataru only three episodes earlier. Initial thoughts on our petulant prince?

ANDROZANI84: Well coming off Kiva directly in terms of shows, Decade would have to do something drastically different to stand out for Kiva. The kid works alright, he’s got a good actor behind him (which is very difficult with child characters) and he does work as a younger, more inexperienced AR counterpart.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Yeah, he was a really good actor, and not even just for his age. He's got to balance a lot of tricky emotions (anger, sadness, hope, fear), and do it all in a way that doesn't alienate the audience. I feel like he hit the bullseye.

ANDROZANI84: Plus he has to spend scenes with just the suit actors, which can be very tricky to pull off

KAMEN RIDER DIE: He was grounded in an interesting way, I thought. He played things small and sad, which is the exact right tone for this story. It never became, like, histrionic or whatever. It was just this kid, in a world he was sure he was going to let down.
I thought that part was the most interesting switch-up between Classic and Wee, how the story is centered so fully on a protagonist who fundamentally doesn't believe in the heroic expectations being thrust upon him. Like, that was Classic Wataru's story for maybe two episodes, and the rest was pretty fully about his certainty that humans and Fangires could co-exist. Did that shift in narrative work for you? Did it still feel enough like a Kiva story?

ANDROZANI84: Yeah, the divide between humans and Fangires, while obviously truncated for the purposes of this two-parter, did suitably echo Kiva proper, even with this being the one official televised Kiva storyline without the involvement of Inoue and Takebe (the producer).

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I think it helped some to have access to so much Kiva stuff: all of the monster suits, the throne room set, the Kurenai house interior and exterior, a bucket of rose petals, etc. Way more than last story's Kuuga Around The Edges approach, this one felt like they dropped us entirely into a Kiva episode.

ANDROZANI84: Yeah, the most that took me out of it was the voice doubles for the court. While Bishop sounded near dead-on and Rook didn’t live long enough to register either way, Garulu, Bashaa and Dogga’s replacements sounded pretty off. At least we got Kivat’s VA.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: And Puppet Hands came back! But yeah, I'm awful at picking out foreign language voice actors, but even I was like That Ain't Jiro. I'd imagine someone who's way more dialed into the VA part of the show would find the replacements distracting.

ANDROZANI84: I mean, if you’re watching Decade, you do have to expect a few replacements. It makes the ones who do come back (ie. Kaixa) stand out more (and can be excused with the alternate universe concept, which is Marvel’s reasoning for why What If has a few replacement VAs)

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Sure, but part of me's like... I get not being able to have someone on set, but how tough would it be to get Ramon's actor to record an afternoon's worth of lines somewhere in post? How hard could that be?

ANDROZANI84: Well if I recall correctly, the two Toei anniversary shows based on returning actors do rely on ones who were (at the time) still working and able/willing/affordable enough to come back.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: And that's fair. I don't want to make it sound like reuniting ten years worth of actors was some cake-walk. People could be unavailable for any number of reasons, and I don't want to get mad at a show for that. Especially when that show told such a fun Onodera story!

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/.../decade04b.png

KAMEN RIDER DIE: While this is nominally a Kiva story, it was WAY more of an Onodera story to me. It's about the specific outlook he brings to this series, how his Kuuga-y need to protect smiles fills in the gaps of Tsukasa's I'm Not Here To Make Friends pragmatism. It's all in how these two treat Wee Wataru: Onodera is kind, attentive, and present. Tsukasa is gruff, dismissive, and vaguely-to-intensely threatening. As the first story in Decade with Onodera as part of the Team, how'd you like this story?

ANDROZANI84: He definitely strikes me as the one who handles the people side of things (Tsukasa is the guy who gets things done, Natsumi is the one trying to make sense of this, Grandpa is the friendly old coot and Kivara is an almost literal vamp).
And it is nice to see him working hard to typify and help someone he barely knows after being sent to a strange place. It’s something most people would probably turn down.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I mean, my all-time favorite Kuuga stories are the ones where Godai has to help a kid through a tough time in a non-superhero way, so this was maybe more of what I love from Kuuga than the actual Kuuga spotlight story. Onodera is SO KUUGA in this story. He's got this amazing rapport with this kid, where he's giving Wee Wataru all of the support (emotional and physical) he needs to make the right decision, but Onodera won't ever force Wee Wataru to make that decision. It's got to be that kid's choice, no matter the cost. I really love that type of story, and I thought the Onodera actor 1000% delivered in those emotional scenes.

ANDROZANI84: Yeah. Sure, he may have lost twice to the bad guy posse, but points for trying.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: He didn't even mind being briefly devoured by a tiny prince. Onodera is a friendly, easy-going guy!

ANDROZANI84: Amen to that

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Tsukasa, however... hoo boy.

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/.../decade04c.png

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I liked how there's an equal amount of light and dark in this story about Kiva, and how Decade uses its two Riders to get at those feelings. Onodera is the part of Kiva that's optimistic and human, where the world is only a little bit of work away from having room for everyone. Tsukasa is the part of Kiva that will always be aware of its differences, be convinced it's going to all fall apart.

ANDROZANI84: It’s best shown with how they enter the main conflict. Tsukasa transforms and goes in guns blazing without hearing everything, while Yusuke just shows up and volunteers to help after it gets explained to him.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Yeah, this whole story for Tsukasa is about everyone telling him what he is, and that he's bad. It's mirrored by Wee Wataru's story, where he's convinced he can't be friends with humans. They're both characters who have internalized negative judgments, and find it easier to live down to failure than work hard for acceptance.

ANDROZANI84: And it’s the fact that Wataru accepts his darker side that allows Tsukasa to do likewise and get the Kiva cards.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Wee Wataru becomes okay with his own doubts, while vowing to work hard to overcome them. It's not something Tsukasa can fully embrace yet, but there's that little scene he has with Natsumi, where he seems to feel less okay with being seen as a destroyer than he maybe let on. There's an inkling that he'd like to maybe not be called a Devil on every world he goes to.
How are you liking Tsukasa at this point in the series? Do you feel like he's a solid enough lead?

ANDROZANI84: I mean, he does have a fairly functional arc (trying to find his place in the infinite realities), but I’m not going to be naming him a favourite just yet.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Is it that he didn't enjoy the chocolate fondue as much as the other characters?

ANDROZANI84: Well it’s more the fact he’s still struggling with guys like Kaixa and the Hoppers, given he can one-shot guys like the Rook. At least with Wee Wataru, you could argue he’s holding back by using Kuuga for the duration of the fight

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Ha ha, yeah, Rook did not exactly live up to his reputation here. Speaking of that Kuuga fight, though!

https://kamenriderdie.com/images/kr/.../decade04d.png

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I didn't think most of the action in this story was anything special (the final fight against the Fangire was pretty forgettable), but this Kuuga Forms vs Kiva Forms fight! Oh man! So amazing! How'd you like it?

ANDROZANI84: Well I like that they’re comparing and contrasting the equivalent transformations (eg. Titan form vs Dogga). Though I do wonder how Dogga felt forcibly being turned into a sword and a rod

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I never thought the weapon forms of the Fangires had feelings/thoughts. A little horrifying if true, but, like: Final Form Ride. I don't know. I don't know if they're aware of themselves in those forms! God, I hope not!
Still, I liked how this fight felt like it was for the fans. Who Would Win In A Fight is the most ancient fandom discussion, and doing the Kiva Forms Vs Kuuga Forms part was a blast. It's all those little deep cuts and references getting moments in the sun. A fight like this is so irrelevant to the story being told (Decade and Kiva are basically in two parallel stories after this), but it's real, real fun to watch.

ANDROZANI84: You could say the same thing about Kusaka’s appearance.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I could, but the Kiva forms are based on the Kuuga forms, so it feels more like a deep cut than just Kaixa showing up. Did that feel as resonant to you, Kusaka tugging at his collar and trying to murder a Rider?

ANDROZANI84: Not really. But that’s more because this was my second/third season when watching for the first time (I forget at what point I started watching Drive). But in general, it is more fanservice than anything symbolic

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I guess? That part filtered into Mysterious Fisherman's weird conflict with Decade, so it felt a little less referential than the form change stuff.
I think that covers everything I had in my brain from these episodes of Decade. Anything you were looking to discuss? Any cool trivia to share?

ANDROZANI84: Well since this is a Kiva thing, I prepared my usual Fact Fangire-le, as I promised earlier.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: I am ready for it!

ANDROZANI84: Beetle Fangire

True name: Atonement of the Garden Divided, the International Dateline" (贖罪の園を分断する、日付変更線, Shokuzai no Sono o Bundan suru, Hizukehenkōsen)

Human identity: none

Rank: King

Class: Insect

Main actor: Mansaku Ikeiuchi

KAMEN RIDER DIE: So, okay, let's talk about Wee Wataru's pops. I don't know if that story, the generational part of the plot, worked even a little? It felt ENORMOUSLY tacked on for me.

ANDROZANI84: Yeah, it’s pretty much taking out the “father and son” aspect that’s pretty much Kiva’s “thing” and replacing it with a generic “cycle of revenge” story. The two don’t even get a personal moment.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: They don't! And that's a huge problem!

ANDROZANI84: It’s also hard to care for the guy when we don’t even get a name for him. And he brazenly murders the Arms Monsters midway through the episode.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: And his whole plan... so, is he trying to motivate his son to be better than him? Or was that just a happy accident? I can't tell if he's doing this FOR Wee Wataru or IN SPITE of him. The dad's motivations in this story are impossible to track.

ANDROZANI84: And on that note, I’ve got nothing left to talk about the episode, so I’ll simply say “thanks for having me” and sign off until I comment on the next two-parter.

KAMEN RIDER DIE: Thanks! And our trip through different realities takes us to the World of Ryuki next. Dragons! Mirrors! Legal-- legal drama? Okay! We'll cover all that and more as TOKUNATION WATCHES KAMEN RIDER DECADE continues its Journey through the Decade!

Die, I'm pretty sure you got some things mixed up here, but considering the thread this is in, I guess we can brush it off by saying that this, too, is all Decade's fault. :p

Anyway, Kid Wataru is ~maybe~ my favorite AU Rider from Decade? The story these episodes told with him, I remember finding it really character-driven and engaging in a way I liked, and it held up rewatching it. They aren't as bombastic as the Kuuga arc, but they're way more well-rounded, I think.

(I also fundamentally like the order they chose here: Kuuga followed by Kiva. It makes sense to both of them early for different reasons, and in Kiva's case, there's the benefit of them still having whole sets lying around to add authenticity.)

These episodes also have the version of Newsuke I remembered, who actually does feel like Kuuga, albeit without the serenity Yuusuke had, which really just fits the idea of a guy who's character arc is about growing into that name all the more. Really good episodes for the guy, and like with Wataru, I recall being endeared to Newsuke quite a bit thanks to this story. Running around helping some kid just because is so fundamentally Kuuga it's probably the thing that made me forget he started out as kind of a jerk.

Ah yes Kiva! The first series to win me purely based on aesthetics. The idea of all these classic movie monsters as the basis for Kiva's power, the stained glass look of the Fangire... and the hints at what Kiva's plot could possibly be about (Still consider Kiva one of my favorite Telenovela's ever) and Kiva signed me up from minute one as a possible choice to dive into Heisei. And eventually through pure aesthetics he managed to stand out and become one of the three shows I chose.

Cause yeah, as mentioned, they really went out of their way to make this feel like Kiva, bringing back the various sets from the series, alongside just minor touches like the stock footage and rose petals? Real good stuff.

Anyway I really thought this was a good showing for Onodera, cause I legitimately was put off by his first appearance when we started Kuuga's world. I remember liking him so I was wondering if I was wrong, but him with AU Wataru here, that's one of the reasons I enjoyed him. Also AU Wataru, for being a kid actor, and knowing how bad those can get, is actually really good! I really enjoyed my brief time with him.

Kiva Arrow is also one of my favorite Final Form Rides purely because of how it functions, pulling back and the chain breaking to reveal the arrow. And also it isn't just a straight up redo of an older concept like Kuuga becoming Gouram is. But yeah I will admit, given the flash at the end of the Kuuga Arc, Kiva's ended relatively tame in all honesty.

Also Tsukasa can play the violin! Is there anything he can't do? He speaks and understands Grongi, plays Violin, feels like a real winner to me.

Anyway Ryuki's up next and is probably my absolute favorite of the AR World Concepts, and that's the most I'll say for now.

I really felt this like arc in particular was a statement of intent of the AR World riders? That they're not just quick and easy replacements. Because like, from episode 1; they have the actor for Wataru Kurenai right there! As an actual character! And they... do not use him for this episode, and in fact go out of their way to make his 'replacement' very obviously different by making him a child. This is the AR Rider choice that stood out to me the most as their being intentionally distinct characters and that they were doing something with this idea, rather than just waving it off as 'well we can't get the old one back so just do whatever'.

Seeing kid Wataru morph into fully-sized Kiva was wild. I also like Decade's duel with Kiva, with him swapping with Kuuga's forms to match Kiva's alternate forms. Kinda makes me realize how similar the two were.

Very neat we'll also see Decade do the same to match another rider, but with Kiva's gear soon.

Two years prior to this show, Arashi Fukasawa who played Wataru/Kiva was Jan/Geki Red in Gekiranger in an episode where Geki Red became a child(and Geki Blue a Baby) due to the MOTW's attack if I recall(also, he later reprised the role in a flashback scene for a later episode). So seeing him come back was a surprise to me two years after. While I loved his portrayal as the boy king who is unsure of his position as a monarch, I do think these episodes suffer from bad placement. Reason being Onodera suddenly being this big brother figure felt a little rushed? I think if these two episodes were say 10 and 11 it would have solved that problem for me. Not bad.
Side note, It is now confirmed that Decade's most horrible and unique ability is... have other riders experience body horror. It's kinda messed up when you think about it. He makes them twist and turn just so he can use them as weapons. I mean he does have the courtesy to revert them to their normal state after, but still, kinda messed up. :lolol

Weetaru.

I appreciate that Decade went with Kiva for its second AU. There are a lot of younger viewers who wouldn't be familiar with Kuuga, but bringing back the show that was on last month is a good way to really highlight the fact that this isn't your very slightly younger self's Kiva. It was a smart decision.

I like the take on Weetaru (sticking with it and looking forward to seven more portmanteaus to join him and the Yusuke one I'll be dusting off soon enough). He's basically a cross between Wataru and Taiga, which is a new but recognizable spin on Kiva. There are two broad approaches that Decade takes to its worlds and I always prefer the ones that feel like they tie into the original series' plot or themes. We'll definitely be seeing some cases where the homage feels like it was written by someone who'd never watched the show they were paying tribute to.

On the other hand, Kiva's FFR is probably the most random of them all. I get that not every Rider has something associated with them that could be an alternate configuration of an action figure, but "Kiva = bow and arrow?" feels incredibly random.

I love how all of the un-transformations were shot to make it look like that wasn't a full-sized adult the entire time.

Yeah, I guess the bat being a winged animal maybe has something to do with it. Personally I was expecting a battle axe or a scythe.

I mean, sure, the unobservant Kiva viewer may say that it was Megumi who teamed up with Yuri to defeat Rook across the decades. They may even point out that Maya doesn't even appear in that episode. But, Fish, I thought you were the kind of true fan who recognized what Inoue was really doing in that story. It's Maya's influence that gave Otoya the inner strength to help Yuri defeat Rook in the 80s, while Megumi was part of a diffused effort in 2008. Pretty big mistake for you to make! I thought you were better than this.

Apropos of nothing, let me announce a CONTEST I'll be running for the rest of this thread. Buried in these episode posts, I will intentionally misname characters. (It's always intentional! I don't know why you'd think otherwise!) Whoever collects the most instances of these purely intentional "mistakes", and posts them in this thread, will win a prize. Either:

-For folks in the United States, I will ship out a tokusatsu prize pack. Some stuff from my store, maybe some unopened figures from my collection, probably some toku stuff made by local artists. It'll be fun, but probably nothing that's going to make you feel like I went to too much trouble.

-For folks outside the U.S. or folks in the U.S. that would prefer not to have anything shipped out, you will get a digital good of equivalent value.

You can't enter until I post the THREAD WRAP-UP post, and we'll let the contest run for a week so people can dig up the very carefully placed and totally known to me misnaming "errors". Fish just totally spoiled the contest by pointing out the first one, and I know for a fact there's a second one. Uh, I mean, I know exactly how many there will be! At least two, though!

(These are instances where the wrong proper name is used, not when I make up some dumb name. Calling Megumi "Maya" is a valid entry. Calling Wataru "Wee Wataru" is not.)

Good luck, everybody!

Yeah, and it's also this nice look at how fundamentally different Kuuga and Kiva were as shows, how divergent the attitudes of the writers were. Seeing Kuuga try to win over a Kiva character... I mean, Kuuga's definitely going to get briefly chewed on for his trouble! This is an Inoue world! That's the cause and effect of trying to help people!

I also liked the Kiva Arrow (is it seriously not called "kivarrow", how did they miss that), and the presentation of it all was very cool. The Wake Up leg-piece breaking open to be the arrowhead is awesome, full stop.

There's also this tiny bit of comedy beforehand that I wasn't expecting. Just as Decade is about to open up Kiva's back, Kiva turns around to see what he's doing back there. There's a beat as Decade looks at Kiva, like he's been caught, and then Decade slaps Kiva's shoulder and says "Eyes front." It's this minor but crucial acknowledgement that Final Form Ride is so weird and gross.

Agreed! They really swung for the fences on this story, as far as not really giving a shit how much they pulled from Kiva. They took the parts they needed (duality, societal isolation, overcoming judgment, Arms Monsters) and then jettisoned the rest (romance, IXA, siblings). It's the strength of this approach, to reshape what they're homaging for maximum Decade effectiveness.

Part of wishes they'd gone the Tiny Den-O route from that Den-O movie, but I imagine that those fights would Decade look like way too much of a dick. Funny to think about, though! And definitely not out of character for Tsukasa at this point in the show!

I guess? I think some of it is a necessary course-correction from how mostly unheroic Onodera is Episodes 2 and 3. He needs to be at least moderately Kuuga-y, or it's hard to care if he joins the team. Also, helping out some kid is, like, the lowest-hanging fruit of being a Kamen Rider. Even Gills helped out a kid, and... like, Gills.

It's so gross.

I sincerely thought the mopey prince was Taiga. I thought this was going to be a story where Tiny Taiga became Kiva. Finding out it was a Wee Wataru was a little surprising!

Dropping in late, but when am I ever on time. :p

So for the first episode, as I said in my previous post, really hooked me in with how they presented Decade, then journeying through the decade (pun intended) showing us a sneak peek of what's been in each one of these Kamen Rider shows that our heroes faced, it sold me to the series as a whole, and showed off some really cool suits, those being of the Heisei mains. And might I add, the music was sensational, having that dramatic pre-apocalyptic theme, which is used every time Decade says his iconic catchphrase, to that jazzy guitar theme as his transformation theme were all fantastic. There's one more theme that sticks out to me, but I'll wait for the episode it appears in, first.

The Kuuga arc, fitting how the first major arc is the first Heisei season, introduced the AR Yuusuke (or as Die might like to call him, Palmtree head), who, having recently seen the first two episodes of the original Kuuga, isn't quite as interesting as Odagiri, but is still to me, an enjoyable character on his own, and can see some of the similarities to his predecessor, he even watched all of Kuuga to prepare himself for Decade, even knowing he could never "replace" Odagiri.

Tsukasa kind of felt like those stinking genius Anime protagonists here, which at first kind of bothered me, but began to warm up to with his shrewd personality, for lack of a better term. He acted like a jerk being all, "isn't it obvious," which eventually I found kind of funny, but still a little off. Now, seeing his finisher for the first time was perhaps the greatest, stupidest thing ever, seeing him jump up into the air and smash through holographic cards before blasting right through the enemy. It was that moment, I knew I was going to like this series.

In context of the story, some of Tsukasa's actions feel like he read the script before arriving in the world, which isn't a trait I particularly enjoy, but getting around that, the action and worlds were still fun to explore. AR Kuuga's story was pretty well done for only two episodes, and kind of fitting for him to be the Secondary in this Anniversary, and I really enjoyed him throughout. I find the supporting cast's quirks to be between fun and "what?," Natsume (Summer Mandarin) being of the latter, acting as a moral compass to Tsukasa, to Grandpa (I don't remember his name) who sometimes bounces from one to another. The "road trip" format, is pretty clever, though mostly blends the magic painting world approach with the canvases, and I love how Tsukasa always has a weird role in the world he's visiting, complete with a makeover.

I originally planned to re-watch the first two episodes to refresh my memories, but haven't had time, so I'm just taking everything I can remember about this show the first time I saw it (2017?), and I'll post my thoughts on the Kiva arc at a later date, because I don't like going on for too long.

I once typoed Mio as Maya in the Kiva thread, but eventually I noticed and edited it. Somewhere around Episode 39, I think?

Agreed. Starting from the beginning then moving to something more contemporary. Those worlds also introduce two of the main characters with Yuusuke followed by Kivaala.

I know right! It's crazy how people can watch this arc with Yuusuke being a great friend to Wataru and they still think he's not fit to wear that suit. This arc, even more than the Kuuga arc, is exactly why he's a Kuuga in his own right, just a little rough around the edges but I think that makes his dynamic with Tsukasa and the others more interesting. He may not be the Secondary Rider and seldom henshins but he's got that very complimentary personality similar to Takumi and Kiba.

He can do whatever the world he's passing through needs him to do.

I love the characters' awareness of that. It turns what would otherwise be a very disturbing merchandise thing (well actually it is either way) in to a fortnightly joke to see how the Rider reacts in confusion and horror to being temporarily mutilated. The way Decade totally understates it by saying, "this will tickle a little", that's very in-character for him as well. He just wants to keep them calm so he can get it over with as quickly as possible.

Now time for some of my own thoughts about the World of Kiva and what better place to start than the surprise return of the man we all love (to hate), Kusaka! There's something familiar about stadium where Decade fights Kaixa, do you all remember? That's the same place where Kaixa first used his Kaixa Pointer to perform the Golden Smash on the Rabbit Orphenoch! I think the choice to use this set has to be deliberate as a reference to that fight. It's almost a shame that Die didn't start this thread 3 weeks later, cause then we'd be discussing this on Kaixa Day!

The premise of this arc also shows how imaginative these worlds can get. The World of Kuuga wasn't too different to the original. But in the World of Kiva, there's a law that enforces equal rights between humans and Fangires and anybody who breaks that law is therefore evil. That's totally the opposite of how it was in the show. Wataru's patrilineal and matrilineal lines are also reversed, with his father being the Fangire King and his mother being a dead human.

Kiva is 7/19 in my Heisei Rider Ranking and all my relevant opinions are now documented in that thread. So how does the World of Kiva compare? Well, I think [insert surname] Wataru (the wiki was no help here) is a sympathetic character, of course nowhere as memorable or present as Yuusuke. Nevertheless, he lived by his belief in the benevolent law and never succumbed to his Fangire instincts, so I think Kurenai Wataru would be proud of that.

The return of Spider Fangire was nice as well, maybe he's not such a creep in this world. Unfortunately, the Wolfen, Merfolk and Franken races are extinct here since Wataru's father just committed a triple genocide, so that sucks. Other than that, it seems like a pretty good place to live. Kivat has a little sister who may or may not be exclusive to this world and I think she's a very adorable addition to Team Decade! After all my praise about Yuusuke, my only complaint about him is that he's not generous enough to indulge her a little blood sometimes. Is his heart so cold? :p

I still love thinking of Tsukasa as various types of Kamen Rider fans. In Episode 3, he's very much the long-time fan that needs to ruin everything that's about to happen in the story because he's too enthusiastic to let you get there yourself. He's a walking spoiler! He's maybe actually the Devil!

Yeah, that tiny bat... a little creepy? A little? There's the kissy noise she makes when she bites Mysterious Fisherman's finger, which went on a little long for me. But then there's, like, the face Mysterious Fisherman makes when she's ASMRing his finger, and... I mean, you don't get much more Homage To Kiva than that tableau! Really nailed how Inoue would've approached it! Bullseye!

So, one little thing that's sort of frustrating about the Beetle Fangire's design. He absorbs the Arms Monsters into little shields on his torso and shoulders, and it allows him to transform into DoGaBaKi, but Garulu is on his chest while Dogga is one of the shoulders, which is completely backwards, and I'll never understand why they chose to do it that way. Did they just want Garulu front and center because he was the most important one?

I think the episode does a great job of explaining this, actually, by having Newsuke make a point that he sees Wataru as being in the same position he was in the previous arc – somebody who needs a friend to help them out. He has a specific motivation for his heroism here, that's also kept fairly simple (it's basically just Paying It Forward), and he doesn't really do anything more complicated to go about that than just refusing to leave Wataru alone.

The show was no help to the wiki! This version of Wataru has no surname, for whatever reason.

Oh, this reminds me of an entirely different thing about the episode that I felt was super Kiva-y: the death scene for Wataru's dad, with Tsukasa playing the violin and everything. The melodramatic, wistful tone of it was straight out of that show. It's not enough to die in Kiva; you have to die gloriously.

That scene alone makes me feel like that was the sole reason for Tsukasa carrying around and knowing how to play the violin as his like talent for this world. Like yeah he does it a bunch of other times, but it feels like the entire decision to have him do it, was because they wanted that scene primarily.

Also helps that, like Otoya and Wataru, Tsukasa only knows the one violin piece.

To be fair, maybe in the World of Kiva that is the only piece of music. Like, that's just Music, the end, full stop.

I forgot you-know-who had a gimmick of summoning the most psychotic Riders to try and kill Decade.

I guess one thing I can also appreciate about the show is that even when the secondary Rider didn't actually appear in their respective AR World they did end up making cameos.
The gender-flips in the AR worlds is kind of interesting (I think we have maybe one or two more coming).
As an anime fan, Kivala being voiced by Miyuki Sawasahiro is pretty awesome.

It is a monarchy after all. Maybe the former Kiva was behind it. :lolol

Sure, just pointing out the term that I feel is frequently misused or overlooked in ambiguity discussion, and where I think it's false (or too simplified) to immediately jump to the claim of "not a hero at all" (anti-hero is a subcategory of hero), though of course when he's fighting to impress a girl he's nowhere comparable in moral to most main Riders as it's ambiguity even if the actions are heroic (.. not the one in this series).

Sure, they should show Onodera not having full force... but I refer to the Ultimate Kuuga using seemingly a finisher in Ultimate Punch (and the explosion only covers some area), or I guess not harnessing more of the power applies to even finisher? And well... AFAIK many Riders aren't even actual fighters, but they can mow down enemies by sheer super strength alone, like for example Cronus. Even if Onodera isn't an experienced fighter.. I'd think Ultimate Kuuga's power should be enough for him just wildly throwing punch around.

Not exactly a best one... but for "Ryu(u)ga"... that'll always sound as the dark version of Ryuki to me due to it coming much earlier... and Ryuuga is also commonly refered by his surname Banjou like you said. And of course Cross-Z's Rider Kick resembles Ryuga's (the Rider, resembles him more than Ryuki's).

Though this isn't a continuation of Kiva (kinda don't want for anniversary series to give continuation for original series without consent even if getting old actor back), his feels to me, probably how Kiva's epilogue continued, with Wataru becoming King, he'd likely enforce this rule of humans and Fangires co-existing. But Fangires aren't hive mind, they're individuals, like how there can be criminals among humans, there can be criminals among Fangires too like that woman Fangire - btw I like that it lets a woman being used as fodder, as the one who made a crime and got properly punished. For the Garulu, Bassha, and Dogga's replacement, they probably won't be Jiro, Ramon, and Riki - their voice actors are big name though, for instance Garulu's voice actor is Isshin Chiba, of Tekken's Jin.

True, it's probably Onodera trying his hand into becoming more like original Kuuga and helping others in non-superheroic ways. I don't know much about Decade, but yeah there are complaints of Onodera being a jerk but not only for ep. 2-3, but for a series evaluation, so dunno about Onodera in this episode.

For Tsukasa just goes in guns blazing, in comparison to Onodera's role here, I guess this is a reminder that being heroic (coming from previously selfish Onodera) isn't about merely doing superheroics like saving people/world or sacrificing yourself (where Den-O is something that's against this) or stuff, but there are many more morally good trait and deeds; which probably Tsukasa learns as he realizes Wataru's resolve and what qualifies to be a King (actually making the situation better, not invoking bloodlust). Unfortunately, well, one of the nickname for Onodera is "Yuuseless", and I guess iirc that comes from Onodera not actually making use of Kuuga often throughout the series, but that's what I read. Aside from Onodera's action making impact into the King and Kivat, this impacts Natsumi too, who previously was worried about 2 child who got approached by a Fangire (nice gesture though), but turns out that it's a companionship between human and monster.

For Kuuga's fight here, I like that Kuuga and Kiva's form counterparts are used here, the speedy blue form in Dragon against Garulu, the ranged green form in Pegasus against Bassha, the tough purple form in Titan against Dogga. And watching Kiva part just made me realize that Decade had a likely unintentional reference to Kiva, in all of its previous Riders, the A.R. Riders are like the Arm Monsters, both of them turn into Decade's weapons, but AFAIK the A.R. Riders are finisher-exclusive. Then again, it probably can feel like for example, Accel turning into bike or Drive Dimension Cab Tire separating himself.

Now I wonder how did you actually work on this off, like is this a chat or voiceover or such, I don't think that trivia like this are something that can be said.

Getting this from other source but: He was exiled for loving a human woman who gave birth to his half-breed successor, Wataru. He saw the coexistence and peace between the two races as nothing more than a farce for his son's sake. I guess other than the previous Kings in original Kiva series, he had Maya traits to be exiled.

Ah, the Kiva arc! I remember that one better than I remember the Kuuga arc, maybe due to the novelty of a child rider? Maybe due to Kiva just standing out more to me than Kuuga? (Horror monster babysitters! Monsters and humans living togther! Child Rider!) I wonder how children at the time reacted to having 2 Kivas in the space of a month - most of the Kuuga audience had probably ages out of it by then, but Kiva was just the big thing! The kids probably still have their Kivats around to play with!

True! This story was a neat exploration of how badly Wataru's dream could end up. The main differences differences here were that Wee Wataru didn't believe in a world of coexistence, since it would mean he'd need to confront his feelings of isolation and self-loathing; and Wee Wataru doesn't have the robust support system of Wataru, like all of W.A.K.E.U.P.

...yes, I realize I'm saying that Wataru's advantage is the emotional support of Nago. That's how bereft Wee Wataru's life is!

I mean, I got that. The King character is very clear in his exposition. But, like, he's only exposition. He only has a couple non-monster scenes, and they're both just him telling things to Tsukasa. He doesn't ever have a scene with his son, which makes their connection mostly implied. It's tough to care about Wee Wataru's feelings about his family in the way you could about Wataru, or Taiga, or Megumi, or whatever. Like, I don't know if Wee Wataru even mentions his dad in these two episodes? It's all lip service to one of Kiva's dominant themes, and that's disappointing.

I wonder if Decade reignited the collector market at this time. I wonder if there were kids suddenly looking for older action figures and roleplay items. I'm sure someone here knows: were there re-releases of any old merch for this show? How did Decade's merch capitalize on all these Legend Riders?

It's done in text on Discord. This is to make it more accessible for users who don't have the right equipment or don't want to speak.

I knew Figuarts started up around the same time, so I went and checked - it started the year before with the Reboot!Showa Riders and a few Kabuto Riders, but 2009 saw it take off with suits from Den-O (plus the Imagin), Kuuga, Agito, Black, Decade itself, and the remander of Kabuto. And this was when Figuarts didn't cost either an arm or your computer's loading time to order, so I'm told!

As for Decade's toyline, you do have figures of the old Riders, in the form of the Final Form Ride toys, so you too can make Wee Kiva do the splits and turn into a giant bat-bow!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltBwZPP969s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBxPyz728pU

I'm not sure when each specific release came out, but I know the Legend Rider Henshin Belt series - which had started in 2004 - had continued through to 2004; so naturally some stuff must have been released during Decade, too. I'd take a stab and guess that the Den-O and Zeronos belts may have been released around Decade, since they can't have been released much earlier than that?

It's hard to really tell how much Bandai put into legacy toys though, because Decade was partly conceived as a filler line -- in case you haven't heard this before, the reason it has 31 episodes was specifically so that Kamen Rider shows (and toylines) could debut around September instead of February; this is so it wouldn't compete with Super Sentai toylines starting at the same time.

The "main" things were definitely the aforementioned Final Form Ride figures, as well as the Legend Rider belts – basically "gets the job done" versions of all the previous main Heisei Rider's belts (except Kiva and Hibiki, I'd presume for being too recent and too not-a-transformation-device respectively) at cheaper prices than what a DX belt cost by then. Some are more glaringly simplified than others.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKc_8exLkfw

Naturally, there was plenty of other merch involving all the Riders going on as well though, from vinyl figures to candy toy lines and all kind of random stuff. I even went digging a bit through Bandai's rather comprehensive digital catalog (it seriously goes back to Kuuga) to find where Decade-related stuff starts out of curiosity, which I'd link to directly, but I guess the Japanese in the URL is a problem? So hopefully anyone else who's curious is willing to do a bit of digging as well!

Man you cannot just drop that like it's nothing; this is the most insane treasure trove I've ever seen! I was gonna watch more Liveman tonight, but... well, there goes my schedule!

So I'm actually watching Decade now, because I didn't already have a backlog of shows I wanted to do, and the Kiva arc... Decade really does just detonate some innocent Fangire in the first 5 minutes, huh? Other Riders would've had a mult-episode arc about that, Tsukasa.