More monster riders!
 

In 555, Faiz was the Wolf Orphenoch

In Blade, Hajime/Chalice was the Joker

In OOO, Eiji/OOO became a Greeed after being injected with two more purple core medals

Anyways, if Kiva was rewritten, it should be like Devil May Cry. I mean after Bishop released the Fangire within Wataru, his Emperor Kiva eyes were just rainbow. Why can't they just transform Wataru's body into its true Fangire form!?

In W, Kirihiko should join the good guys since he was a Dopant. If he'd had survived, he would've watched over the heroes and his sister. In fact, he'd be given a new Nasca memory.

In Fourze, they should've added a zodiarts rider. Another Chalice. He'd challenge his ideals that friendship with everyone is stupid. In fact, he should be the one responsible for killing Gentaro's parents by accident during training with Gamou. His hatred for Gentaro would be a facade to cover his guilt.

In Wizard, Section Zero should've had a mage of their own. Beast was fine. But how about a mage who is actually a Phantom. Haruto is like Dante with a mix of sword & gun like Blade & Garren, so this would be like Vergil. But in his case, his weapon will be a mix of staff and arrow shooting bow like Leangle & Chalice.

I'm not a fan of the little sagas Gaim uses, since the shifting antagonists make it hard to actually see them as that large a threat. Every time a villain is starting to become someone I think the characters need to fear, boom. New character comes in and usurps their position.
"But Micchy--"
Has had to resort to constant backstabbing. As an antagonist, yes, it works, but as a villain, it just makes him dull to watch as his actions are actually rather predictable at this point (Not helped that he monologues to himself all the time, so it's hard for him to throw off the audience with his next plan)...

Predictable?! Micchy almosts MURDERS Kouta in Cold-Blood way and I like they put a saga to let us know which arc we are now. Wizard got me confuse because it go so many filler episode.

He will literally speak his plan aloud to no one. His actions are detestable, but if you didn't see them coming, you need to pay a little more attention.

Do you remember when Gen Urobuchi referred Zangetsu as "Ouja" of Gaim and everyone thought Takatora was a bad guy but they were wrong about him. Gen Urobuchi actually referred Micchy as "Ouja" of Gaim

Micchy is very similar to Takeshi Asakara as both of them have evil laugh and have no one to support him.

Yeah.

Micchy is Ouja of Gaim

If you don't like him. When get used to him. He's Ouja of Gaim. Remember that!

What are you talking about?

I guess that's the point though.
http://tokusatsunetwork.com/2014/06/...ugi/#more-3875

But unlike Micchy, Ouja actually killed people and was worth being feared. Its also the fact that Kouta has the Kachidoki and Kiwami lockseeds so Micchy is LITERALLY no threat to the main Rider( and Kaito some extent because Lemon is stronger then Melon). At least in Ryuki, the main characters came in a few close calls with Ouja. Asakura killed 3 or 4 people throughout his entire run in Ryuki. Micchy? Zilch.

Don't fucking even begin to compare the two.

Ouja was terrible, though.

Yeah no kidding.

Micchy's actually a good character.

Throw in another special.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bqdla6JCYAIwlom.jpg

I don't think Micchy really has to be a direct threat to Kouta. What's dangerous about Micchy is not his combat prowess, but the fact that the ONLY one who hasn't been fooled by his antics is Kaito, whose loner attitude prevents that from happening. He's an EXPERT manipulator and while he's certainly not beating any of the Riders on this show in a one-on-one, he's on good terms with practically anybody who matters.

The way I see it, Micchy is Kamen Rider's version of Iago. He doesn't have to be the best fighter, because he can easily get others to fight for him and if not, he knows how to break their spirits and destroy them.

I think the Ouja comparison is quite valid, given that both are probably the most immoral Riders in their respective series. Micchy is willing to off people if they strip away his control, while Ouja is willing to off people if they try to take away his freedom.

I get what they are doing with Micchy, but manipulation doesn't translate all that well to this genre especially for a character as clichéd and telegraphed as Micchy is. I'd sooner take Xaviax's brand of manipulation than Micchy's.

While I don't like Dragon knight, I do have to agree with Locke that Xaviax's manipulation was a really good part of the show, even if the dudes he recruited were incompetent and bland. Xaviax actually had a plan. What has Micchy's plan been? He's exposited everything BUT his overall goal.

That is half my problem with the Riders in this show, and the sheer quantity of them. Despite being this late in the game, we know nothing about any of them.

Kaito's a dick.
Kouta's a cool dude.
Micchy's a snake.
Sid is slimy.
And so on, and so on.

Like shouldn't we know a little more about them by this point? Shouldn't the long games be clearer? I'm still wondering why Jonouchi is apparently Gen's favourite Rider that "we'd all love" considering the sheer amount of nothing he's brought to the show so far.

"We know nothing about any of them?"... Have you just not been paying attention?

Your sarcasm is especially hilarious as you've backed up nothing in your post, firstly proving my point and secondly you come across as a total ass while doing it. Congratulations.

Eh. I'm just too lazy to elaborate. No harm was meant, really.

I'm actually a little curious, though. What's your favorite Rider series, Locke?

Pretty level between Wizard and OOO for me. For the longest time I said OOO but the more I defend Wizard, the more I rewatch bits and pieces and think on characters and stuff the more I realise I love it.

I really wish I could see what everyone seems to love about OOO. I tried to give it a shot but I just cannot get into it.

Wizard is probably the bottom of my list, and yet I still feel like I'm one of the only people that really enjoyed it despite that.

He comes across as a total ass?

He pointed out the flaw in your post. We know plenty about all of the characters. Kouta is a hero, but he's not the most intelligent person and believes what he's told too often, and doesn't consider consequences. Hell, he's accepted the Kiwami lock despite the warnings. Kaito is obsessed with strength and what it means, and has his own deffinition about what strength really is, for better or worse. Micchy is ultimately selfish, but his selfishness is not one-dimensional. His scheming was born from him just wanting to keep things the way they were. He's gone from cunning, to self-absorbed, and it's evolving into a full-on villain with nothing to lose and everything to gain. Sid was slimy, but he was also outright villainous. He, much like Micchy, was selfish in his goals, but unlike Micchy lacked any kind of subtlety, which led to his early demise. And so on, and so on. Maybe because historically Kamen Rider has relentlessly drilled every aspect of the show into the viewer's heads due to it's fixed length and often basic stories, but just becasue Gaim doesn't have every character reiterate their arc each episode to pad out the show as most do to make up for the lack of substance, doesn't make it underdevloped. You can overdo just as much as you can underdo.

Just because you whittle them down to one-word descriptors, doesn't make the characters that simple. I could say anything's as simple as I want, doesn't make it true. And biting back at people who call you out for it really paints you in an unfavourable light. If you're going to get snarky, make damn sure you're actually making sense or else people will call you out on being pretentious.

The only one I agree with you on is Gridon, but that really comes across as superficial love on the producton team's part. They like what the character represents, not especially what he is. People find likablity in stuff even if we haven't lived each day of it's life. There is no rule that says every single character needs to be as equally developed for people to like them. It's not hard-wired into the human brain that liking something means it can't be for superficial reasons.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Saying we don't know anything about the characters is just factually wrong.

All of my yes.

Kouta I agree with, some people are just good and therefore Kouta's actions always make perfect sense especially in the kind of reality that toku normally exists in. But I disagree with you a thousand percent on all the others. It especially helps that the down time scenes of Kouta just enjoying himself give him a genuine sense of humanity that convinces me only further of his actions.

Kaito is obsessed with strength, granted, but why is he obsessed with strength? That is my point here. We're very late in the game, and personal motivations, stakes and driving forces are completely missing from him despite him being our QUOTE Secondary Rider UNQUOTE. It isn't even like he gets to be human between the dramatic moments, as most of what he does is scowl, flap his coat and watch Mai swoon at his feet.

Micchy again, we understand his motivations much better than Kaito's granted but in terms of why he goes to such despicable lengths is not something we understand. And sure like Kouta - but the opposite - there exist people who are just bad but he's despicable to the point of insanity. Actually now I think about it the way he always dumps exposition to himself, maybe he is mad... He doesn't feel real to me, because no one is that pantomime villain in real life and nothing in the show convinces me his pantomime routine even fits in the context of this show.

The reasoning for Micchy's actions - namely the lengths he goes too - deserve to be explored, just like Kaito's motivations for why he is such a titanic asshole 90% of the time. I can't believe we're so late in the game, and they're so important to the plot, and I can barely bullet point a few things about them. Kouta is the only one I feel any kind of emotional attachment too, as he's the only character who is both semi realised and actually gets to feel lived in.

But don't worry, the fanboyism is blind for this series right now, and I know we wont agree now. And maybe not in a years time, or two, but eventually every series has a moment where people look back in it - and I mean REALLY look - and realise they were too quick to praise and too slow to criticise. I'll look forward to talking about Gaim then when we can have a real discussion.

I mean, there are plenty of people still blinded by their fanboyism for W. While I'm absolutely loving Gaim, I can sorta see where you're coming from because I never got behind the hype for W, myself.

As for Kaito. I thought they explained that his father's business was erased by Yggdrasill causing his family to become super poor. He was sort of taken aback by the amount of power they had which made him feel weak - something he never wanted to feel again. In favor of "helping others," they destroyed his life, leading to trust issues and lack of teamwork. Ever since, he's had this goal of becoming strong enough to overcome Yggdrasill by himself.

In the case of Micchy, Micchy has lived his entire life without control nor the means to gain control. He has to live a double life because while he wants to go out and dance with his friends, his brother has been forcing him to pursue higher education and imposes his elitism on him.

Micchy outright states that he likes being a Rider because it's given him a degree of control that he's never experienced before. As the plot goes on, that control has been gradually slipping away from him and he's made desperate attempts to gain it back. It becomes increasingly clear that he only cares about his friends in the most selfish way possible; for him they represent a status quo that must be protected at whatever cost possible, which means eliminating those who ruin his vision.

The point is not to agree with what he's done or even sympathize with it, but just because the plot doesn't reiterate how Micchy has got to this point every 3 episodes does not mean he doesn't have his reasons.

Really, writing everybody off who disagrees with you as a blind fanboy does not make your point correct.

Only cares about his friends selfishly? He has one friend, Kouta, who he's been trying to kill for a while now because... reasons. So I dunno what show you're watching where it becomes "increasingly clear" that he's doing anything. My whole point is his motivations are increasingly unclear and the only reason he isn't difficult to follow is because he's so one dimensional.

Also why are we talking about plot reiteration every three episodes? We haven't had a single episode exploring this. Yeah we had the scenes of him being a bratty shit at the start, because boo-hiss his brother is successful but "to the man" but then we've had a giant gap of nothing and now he regularly talks to himself and tries to kill his friends. Pretty huge leap.

In a flashback so brief and so long ago, it was at a time when Bravo was still a threat. Considering his place in the story he deserves a bit more than that.

He's trying to kill Kouta because he sees him as a factor, the main factor, that's stripping control away from his life. As irrational as it may be and as much as you may dislike the character, he has reasons, even if they're not sound to people like us, they exist.

The reason I say he cares about his friends selfishly (and yes, he has more than one. There's still all of Team Gaim) is because he only cares about what they do for him, and not their own personal happiness. It's why he doesn't let Mai learn about Yuuya's death, it's why he wouldn't let Kouta transform and it's why he actively tries to cover things up or hide everybody from reality. To 'protect' their happiness, even when in the end, all he's doing is maintaining the status quo for himself.

Again, you can hate him all you want, and I certainly don't blame people for doing so, but his motivation is anything but unclear. His goals do change quite a bit, and his actions are extreme to the point of being completely irrational, I'll give you that, but his motive for pursuing these goals has been fairly consistent.

So you basically agree with everything I said then?

The thing is, his character doesn't NEED to be elaborate. His origins were similarly short and simple because it doesn't NEED to be complex. There's also no point in reiterating his origins more than once. He serves his role in the story all the same.

Who is asking for complexity? All I want is characters that don't feel like cardboard cut outs of human beings.

Probably playing with fire here - probably changing the subject a little, too - but how does Haruto fall in to that category? What makes you get behind the two dimensional characters in Wizard, but not the ones in Gaim?

Haruto was a proactive hero, with great emotional range and an absolute knack for comedic timing. I found him fun and inspiring. Plus from his Underworld, to the football episodes, to PLAIN SUGAR! and the way he plays off of his cast, we don't have some deep understanding by the end but we do get a personal connection to him. Much like we do with Kouta.

Admittedly Wizard's secondary cast were pretty weak, especially Beast who didn't really do anything until the last five episodes outclassing the main Rider of the series in doing so. But the difference is, not every single member of Wizard's supporting cast are Riders and even when some of them do become Riders it's a late game development and not something from the start. This puts different expectations on them, than we do of Gaim's supporting cast where everyone is a Rider near enough.

In that case, maybe you're just expecting a bit much or have higher standards for what a Rider should be. In a particular series like Gaim ANYONE can become a Rider, easily making some less prominent or touched on than others. If you think each of them should have a more important role, why not complain about how Kurokage Trooper #17 has never been in the spotlight?

Here we go...

Are the Kurokage troopers part of the main cast? No, obviously not. Was that even a question?

No. What you said is that his motivations have been unclear. His motivations aren't unclear. He's motivated by a strong desire to maintain status quo, which means lying to his friends and protecting them from information that may ruin their blissful ignorance.

His goals change, but only when new information is available to him. He becomes a rider so he can be like Kouta. He sides with Yggdrasil in order to protect his friends. He sides with Sid so that he can utilize his powers for his own benefit. And he sides with Redyue because he thinks Redyue will let him create his ideal world.

Micchy definitely has reasons for his actions. They're obviously flawed and likely won't produce his desired outcome, but he's the bad guy for a reason. But it's not like his entire character arc has been him committing random acts of backstabbing for no reason.

Bravo and Gridon aren't part of the main cast either, yet you similarly complain that they don't have any character development.

Because they help support his argument. It's a simple tactic, really.

He's arguing that them being Riders means that they should be held to a higher pedestal, yet if we look historically at Rider series with a large number of Riders like this one, this has never been the case. I don't know where this expectation is coming from. And furthermore, the reasons behind the creation of the Sengoku/Genesis Drivers mean that a lot of people can and will become Riders. Being a Rider alone doesn't make a character that special in this series, considering that the original plan was for, what, 1 billion people to get belts?

Motivations to me are as much about the mental and emotional drives as they are the goal on the horizon. Emotionally and mentally, we don't understand Micchy, or Kaito or Sid or.... and so on. They all have tangible goals, granted, but the destination should never be the focus it should be why they are trying to get there.

Comparing Bravo and Jonouchi to the footsoldiers of the season just so you think you can disregard valid points when you have no other way to dispute them is straw man debating at its finest.