Yet you disregard multiple character's motivations just to state how we don't understand any characters?
We understand Micchy. We know his goals, yet you make up some bullshit statement of their destination doesn't matter just to disregard any points about him?
You're disregarding valid points by making up a bullshit argument to make the characters sound poorly written.

So, does that make Haruto just as bad, because they focused more on his goal to save Koyumi rather than his actions to do so?

We know their goals, as I said, but we don't know what drives them too those goals, which I said, and a you're telling me that is not important to know? And with such vitriol, too.

And like Kouta, Haruto made sense because he was such a nice guy (amongst other things already listed as you're like the eighth instance of bring him up for no real reason), it was enough. Maybe Kaito, even Sid can slip under the net in a similarly thin layer of understanding but someone as disgustingly despicable as Micchy at least deserves explanation.

Because it's not important. We know their goals. We see their actions to achieve those goals. Why should we slow the show down just to turn all the characters to the camera and to spout their motivations?

Haruto is brought up because he's disgustingly simple of a character, but suddenly spouting "Protect Koyumi" for 50 episodes is somehow more complex of a character than Micchy's shifting desires of protecting his friends, to following his brother but not wanting to lose his friends, to keeping his friends in the dark, to finding Kouta as an obstacle over all, to losing his crush on Mai, solely because he didn't stop an episode and monologue for 10 minutes about it?

I'm not a even a big fan of Gaim, but my vitriol stems from you taking the barest of character traits we're presented while disregarding everything else that occurs, then call the characters weak.

What are you even talking about anymore?

What valid point? All you've done is cover-up the hypocrisy in your logic by stating they should be put on a higher pedestal than all of the poorly developed characters in Wizard because they're riders, even though that fact is completely arbitrary, and nothing in recent Rider shows has suggested that Riders are inherently more important than non-Rider characters.

So the franchise being Kamen Rider, named after their protagonists, and the suits and powers are what are used to advertise the series, would still not suggest to you that the Riders are the most important part of their shows?

So like what you do with Haruto every single time then?

Also, we clearly look for different things in our shows, I like something with more, not less and there is nothing wrong with asking more no matter the genre. Especially a series hyped as "the reason Rider should just quit now". I don't feel nearly as complacent in what we have as you do, I don't believe what we have is enough, not for something this hyped.

Everybody here acknowledges that Riders are the most marketable and enticing part of the franchise. But it doesn't mean that their individual characters, in respect to the story, should be held up to a higher standard than any other character. Riders don't have to do anything but be cool and look cool unless the plot requires them to be explored further. And correction; each Kamen Rider series is named after a singular Rider, not him and his supporting cast of Riders.


It's just a silly argument overall. It's like arguing that Dean Thomas from Harry Potter should be looked at more critically than Harry's Aunt and Uncle because he's a wizard and the entire franchise is about wizardry.

If this is the kind of response I am getting, I am inclined to agree.

And yet notice how I'm not incorrect in my description?
It's a basic and poor argument, but you fall back on it time and time again.

You're the one coming up with BS reasoning to cover up your obvious bias for Wizard. If you like Wizard, that's fine but the same fanboyism you condemn with Gaim is the same fanboyism you are displaying for Wizard.

But you are incorrect about Haruto?

I've given valid in show reasons for why Haruto is great, you've made up fan theories about characters and claim them truth. Also fanboyism is a little strong for me on Wizard, I just think it's become a punching bag for people who don't really know what they are talking about and it's a legitimately great series that deserves a chance for people who have been put off.

In what ways?

When did he do that?

In every way and every post.

In every way? In EVERY post? Okay. That's just a childish lie on both accounts.

Within this thread, obviously.

Shock and awe. Someone disagreed with you while you cry about how you can't possibly be wrong.
Surely that is not
Fuck it. Done caring. Blocked.

I don't even know what is going on any more?

Fan theories? For God's sake, Locke, anybody whose even been paying attention to the plot sees the progression that Micchy has gone through, even people who don't like the show or don't like the character. Calling it a fan theory just because it doesn't fit in with your preconceived opinion of the character is just childish.

And I don't hold any strong opinions of Wizard either way, and I do plan to watch it once I'm done watching the rest of the series in my queue, but a lot of your argument has been defending Wizard from the same criticisms that you've been giving to Gaim, with rather flimsy reasoning.

A critical assessment requires that your assessment is not clouded by bias, preconceived ideas or the hype surrounding what you are about to discuss. In a way, you've come out as unprepared to discuss Gaim critically as the fanboys that you berate.

And on top of all of this, you're still forgetting that Gaim isn't even over. It still has 10 episodes at very minimum left. How can you critically assess something when you don't even know how things play out?

Because everything you're claiming the characters are going through, has never been stated by the show itself so until what you say is happening actually plays out all you're doing is reading the piece. A reading of a piece is not fact.

Every episode is as much designed to be viewed on its own, as it is part of a wider unit, so you should be able to have as much discussion one episode in as you can fifty.

OH. You're saying interactions, dramatic tension, and character development has to be monologued, narrated, and spoken to be considered actually relevant? Finally someone who understands good storytelling! I personally find it thrilling to be spoon fed exposition, myself.

Furthermore, if you were expected to understand and fully discuss a series based on a single episode alone - in fact, if you were even ABLE to - it would be boring, repetitive, and I'd hope to god it wouldn't last fifty episodes.

No but it does need to actually happen.

And use some common sense, obviously you aren't going to understand the long game from the first episode, but there should be enough for critical discussion in every episode.

It did happen. You're the only one who isn't seeing this, as this topic shows, in which I'm inclined to believe you are just being stubborn. Micchy even outright states at several points in the story how much it irks him that Kouta and others won't do as he says. It's pretty obvious that control is his main issue, and Takatora says early on that he's tried to control Micchy his entire life, but Micchy has started rebelling, which explains his massive power trip.

Like I said, arrogantly dismissing it as a fan theory, without any real counterpoints doesn't make it invalid.

We're just going in circles, I disagree with you a thousand percent and stand by my genuine criticism of the show until it stops being one. You have your own personal readings of the show? Fine, but I have my genuine criticisms too.

The problem is your "genuine criticisms" are based on flat out lies. I don't care if you don't like the show, I just wish you made a lick of god damn sense while doing it. If you had any ACTUAL genuine, well thought out criticisms, I'd respect them. But as it stands, you don't. Or at least you haven't show us them.
It has nothing to do with "personal readings." It has to do with paying attention, which you clearly aren't doing. Maybe go back and watch every episode again up to this point, then come back and have this conversation once you've actually caught up. Obviously you missed out on some key details the first time around.

I was lying about thinking they are undeveloped? I didn't realise!

I actually enjoy Gaim a lot, I just think it's praised for more than it has actually achieved. It is probably one of the best Rider shows ever made, but there are still massive spaces for improvement and it's not the show that should have Rider "just give up as it's never going to be better than this".

I would like to watch the show again from the start at some point, it does seem like the sort of show that would flow much better in a marathon viewing as opposed to week by week.

Make the teenagers in Faiz feel like teenagers.

Seriously, you got people that age and asides from the angst you got them to do nothing else they do that age! Its really the only Rider show I've seen (asides from maybe Gaim) where it focuses on teenagers' lives rather then adults (Although both are very loose words as the "adults tend to be around 19-20 maybe 25 max if you're Godai). And Fourze is too squeaky clean to count.

I mean there was that two parter where the main characters all liked the wrong person but that never went anywhere except for Mari's stuff. (Which she didn't advance in a relationship, she just got Kusaka and Sawada to creep out over her.) I don't know, have Mari and Yuji in a relationship or something?

The only time I felt they were teenagers was when they were kicking that ball around at the Ryusei school reunion. I could totally see me doing something dumb like that with my friends.

Fourze is too clean to count? Fourze is teenager problems galore and not only that but also shows that most teenager problems are no big deal after they're solved. If you want a show that shows how teenagers really deal with their stuff, then Fourze is just the thing to watch.

Besides, no wonder that the people in Faiz don't act like real people. The writer was Toshiki Inoue after all. That guy is more the person for insane drama then authentic characters.