I'm so excited for you to start Ryuki. It's one of my favorites. It's a hell of a ride

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And that's a wrap on Masked Rider Agito!

It was a fascinating series, I thought. I know people are always like, You Have To Watch Kuuga At Some Point, but I feel like Agito is way more interesting, for both its successes and its failures. It has this sometimes-exhilarating, sometimes-infuriating way of reaching for something unique or idiosyncratic and just knocking it out of the park, but half-assing and underwhelming on, like, basic Kamen Rider stuff. I've never seen a more intriguing mix of genius and ineptitude.

Where it succeeded, for me, was in the small moments. The character beats, seeing any combination of characters playing off of each other, that was great. And any story that kept the scale small, focused with precision on a character or two, I thought those stories were this show at its best. All of the new flavors this series brought to the Kuuga template, the warmth and humor especially, it created a Kamen Rider show that felt incredibly fresh. I cared so much about these weird nerds, and I'd watch them in just about any kind of show.

It's just, the basics, man. There are some fundamental expectations that a Kamen Rider series should be able to meet, and I think that's where Agito really dropped the ball. A lot of the stuff in the beginning, the weird structure with the dials where Spooky Man's DNA pops out, no one ever explains where that came from or why it worked the way it did. The storm that engulfed the Akatsuki-gou, the appearance of Agito Jesus, why he was dead, I don't think anyone even tried to explain that stuff. But there was all this time spent tying up backstory about characters who were dead before the show even started, so, why wasn't time spent on this show's established mysteries? Why was all of the Unknown stuff left so placeholder and vague, when that's nominally what the point of the show is, Agito overcoming this specific threat? And so much of the show was just a monster shows up, a whole bunch of other stories, and then Agito defeats the monster. And, like, I really enjoyed that "a whole bunch of other stories" part! But I don't think it's weird to expect the Agito Fights A Monster stuff to also be worth watching? I wonder sometimes if the character stuff was really that good, or it just seems better compared to the shrug of a villain we got.

Everything Spooky Man did felt perfunctory, rarely exciting or intense. It was like the monster stuff was an obligation the show felt disinterested in, so they rushed through or skipped over it as much as they could get away with. I'll remember little moments, Hikawa and Shouichi eating ice cream, but I don't know if there's a fight or a monster or a villain scheme (outside of Kino's) in this show that sticks in my brain. It's all adequate, in so much as there are monsters and a Masked Rider fights roughly one each episode, but that part of the show never seemed able to meet the ambitions of the character storytelling.

(The one thing I don't get about Spooky Man's plan, and I kind-of love that the show never gave him another name so I don't ever have to stop calling him the Spooky Man, is why Scorpio to alter and inflict terror with. Why not Gemini? Gemini's all about duality, about humanity showing one face but hiding another. If people are going to be murdered by doppelgangers, or as a result of their hidden fears/desires, why not use Gemini and make it thematically coherent? There are more than enough stars in that constellation to make a big, imposing X. It's such a weird choice for this show to make.)

But, hey, I don't want this to sound like I didn't like Agito. I really did. I think it's sweet and kind in a way that Kamen Rider series rarely are. It's just that the things I'll remember fondly will definitely be taking up space with the things that I felt underwhelmed by.

How did Agito work as a series for all of you? I think, maybe more than any other Kamen Rider series, I'd love to continue to unpack what worked and what didn't on this one. I'll go through moments where I love it, and that'll be followed by a moment where I... not hate it, but can see more of its flaws. Super interested in what everyone else got out of this show. Don't be shy!

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Anyway, that's all I've got in my head right now about Agito. Thanks for hanging out and talking about it, or just following along. I don't know if this was... I'm not sure I made a lot of sense, or was any good on this one. Felt less confident, especially in the later episodes. Felt like I wasn't really getting my arms around it, or couldn't explain my thoughts that clearly. I don't know. Complicated feelings about these write-ups, which I guess is appropriate for Masked Rider Agito.

I'll be on a bit of a break before starting up Ryuki. I'll still be around the boards, for sure, but I gotta catch up on some non-watching-Kamen-Rider parts of my life for a few weeks. I'm going to lose four or five days to the C2E2 convention next week, so that don't help. Mostly I've got to recharge my brain, rest it up, to be able to really try and appreciate Ryuki. I'm very excited to start it in mid-March. Hope to see folks back on the boards for Kamen Rider Die watches Masked Rider Ryuki!

Thanks again!

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Congrats for going through what is a good show called Agito. :rock:
You are gonna need the break. Ryuki is a different ballgame compared to Kuuga and Agito. I expect you to go MCU Aunt May-at-the-end-of-Homecoming on us during certain moments. :lolol

Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. Kuuga and Agito, I was curious about them because they seemed so primordial. Ryuki, that's a show that looks a lot more like the Kamen Rider I've watched, and it's by the writer of my favorite Kamen Rider. (FavOOOrite Kamen Rider? Sorry.)

Thanks! I am looking forward to having more strong feelings about Kamen Rider in the near future!

I somehow managed to forget the whole "don't let go!" bit, but I'm happy to say the "I'm going to live too" ending bit has always been one of the parts of Agito that I remember vividly. Part of it is that honestly, Shouichi is not the guy I go to for heroic speeches, so any time he did one, I found them sort of adorably embarrassing. The more important part is that it's just a really killer moment to end the penultimate episode of your hero show on. So many other Rider shows go for the darkest hour, and leave on that question of "how are things possibly gonna get better next week?", but Agito, true to itself as ever, goes the exact opposite direction, having this big triumphant crescendo, hyping you up just as much by reversing the question, so you're now asking "how hard are the Riders gonna mop the floor with the bad guys next week?".

Disruption is a good way to put it. Movement in the figurative sense. Something being forced out of the position it was previously in. Hence, change. I wasn't sure how well I explained myself, so I'm glad you got something out of that. :lol

Wait, not to ruin the moment, but did we forget about this? There probably isn't that much to talk about with it, being a random side thing and all, but did you at least watch it? You're usually extremely thorough about getting everything together to watch (we didn't even have to tell you about the special!), so I'd have trouble believing it skipped your mind.

Okay, the dog was Count Zero, yeah, that's a good takeaway from the thread. Amazon had an Emperor Zero already, too, so I don't blame Switchblade for that line of thinking.

But I think the real lesson to be learned here is that we as a fandom need to get together and put a stop to this horrible nightmare reality where Agito and Blade have become "those shows no one talks about". When did this happen? It feels like just yesterday I was writing my Ghost thread, where the two examples I gave of excellent Rider shows were exactly those two. I don't think I even mentioned Kuuga anywhere in there! When I got into Rider, I remember hearing about how awesome Agito was fairly regularly, but apparently now nobody can shut up about Kuuga for long enough to give it the time of day? Kuuga's great too, but it's no wonder it would let someone down after hearing about it like it was the only Rider show you'd ever want to watch.

I propose that going forward, we all attempt to steer conversations about Kamen Rider toward Agito at any given opportunity. Most times, this will be easy. Other times, it will appear difficult, but clever thinking will allow you to get around any potential obstacles. For example:

"Hey, what's your least favorite Rider series?"
"Well, I can tell you it's definitely not Agito. That show slaps!"

See? Easy as can be! Just follow these basic guidelines, and soon enough, we can live in a world where new Rider fans don't have to live ignorant of the greatness that is Agito. :p

That's funny. I was actually going to tell you before even reading this bit that this is easily my favorite thread you've done so far. The fun you were having with the series was super apparent in every post, and from the very start, you showed a great grasp on the bigger picture of what Agito was "about" before the series even started laying it on thick. We even got epic overarching plot threads like Nijou's eventual redemption and revival as some guy named "Hikawa". If you're worried you weren't explaining yourself well enough, or anything like that, don't be.

Yeah, it made for some unusual pacing, but I think it was the right choice. As someone who honestly was not that into the Spooky Man season-long plot by the end, I was happy to treat Defeating The Season-Long Villain And Saving Humanity as, like, a splashy epilogue. This was a show that said everything it needed to say by the penultimate episode. I'm glad they had room for a crowd-pleasing Big Hero episode though. For me, it was the best of both worlds.

NOBODY HAD IT AND I LOOKED EVERYWHERE. I wanted to watch it real bad! TV Nihon didn't have it, and Nyaa didn't have it, and those are the two places I definitely do not get Kamen Rider from because I respect the law. If someone knows where to watch it, let me know! I don't mind going back to these threads if there's more stuff I didn't get to talk about! *cough*BuildNewWorldKamenRiderGreaseProbablyThisWeekend*cough* My goodness! The air in here is so dry!

Yeah, it's like, I feel like Kuuga is a show you should watch, but Agito is a show you need to watch. It's so weird, the ways it innovates and the ways it frustrates. I'd much rather watch a flawed gem like Agito, that flies higher and plunges lower (why did Hikawa have an unexplained blindness that only lasted for three episodes before disappearing?!?!) than an established Important Show like Kuuga. Kuuga, I mean, it works for you or it doesn't. Agito can do both in the same episode and I find that fascinating.

Thanks! For me, the writing of these, it's in hopes of sparking a discussion. I'm not trying to do this as, like, performance art. I hope by writing these, I'll get a chance to talk with other fans (like you!) about what they think about the show. Doing a write-up, it's like a first draft of my thoughts. The more I get to talk about it, the more I can refine what I'm saying, explain what I'm thinking, really figure out what the show is doing for me. And, hopefully, get introduced to some different perspectives that make me get more out of the show. With this one.. I didn't feel like I was hearing a lot. When that happens, I don't think "Oh, I must've nailed it, hole in one." I think, "Oh, I must be making no sense, this is all garbage from my brain," or, "I am sure everyone else figured this out almost two decades ago, these are not interesting or insightful or even entertaining." I'm glad that they were interesting for some folks, and maybe even had some entertainment hidden deep in there. (I want to be buried with that Houjou Running Away series of screencaps.) I genuinely enjoy talking about Kamen Rider, so I truly appreciate anyone who chimed in. You are all immortal!

Ryuki I think you will like. Gain owes a lot to it, with the large cast of riders and the monsters not being the real antagonists. I will say no more, but I look forward to seeing what you think about it.

I really enjoyed your analysis of the show, especially since Agito is a real favorite of mine. It's definitely one of the unsung heroes of Kamen Rider and I'm hoping this thread got at least a couple of people to check it out who hadn't before.

I'm glad you (mostly) enjoyed it, and I definitely look forward to your thoughts on Ryuki. The first time I watched it was with HK subs and I didn't love it, but I've seen it a few times since and by my 3rd (Tv-Nihon) watching it became another of my favorites.

I'm really looking forward to it! Folks seem real hyped, and that's got me optimistic. I've only seen a few cast shots, and I'm into the idea of a Rider vs Rider show that Gaim was doing a version of. I always want villains (or just antagonists) to have definitive goals, and Riders usually do a great job of that. Ex-Aid, my first love, it had some great stories where Big Bads like Cronus could leverage the regrets of Brave or Snipe to their advantage. That's so much more compelling to me, a conflicted hero/anti-hero, than just some monster of the week. Agito, the main season plot, it really snapped into focus for me with Kino. I would not mind a show's worth of asshole doctors who will fight other Riders, is I guess what I'm saying. Everyone's got a type, I guess.

Thanks! Yeah, it'd be cool if someone got the Agito bug from reading some of these. Getting people excited about something that means a lot to me, that sounds pretty great!

And, really, I did enjoy Agito. Much like Shouichi, the more I stayed in the moment, the more it worked for me. The more I thought back on past events, the worse my present got. Huh. The show is a weirdly self-perpetuating engine of analysis. It is an auto-critique. Masked Rider Agito is Masked Rider Agito's harshest critic!

I think I never had any particular issues with the Unknown for being just 'the force of evil our hero fights' and nothing more because the show never really played them up as being more than that. The focus from the beginning to the end had always been about our the protagonists developed around that stuff and around each other. Plus I've seen 'god wants to destroy all life' in enough JRPGs that I didn't really need any more elaboration to that story.

Anyhow, it was fun reading your various thoughts once again. I'm sure it takes quite a bit of effort to articulate what these shows do for you in a way that's both accurate to how you feel and also meaningful to share, so I think you deserve props for having kept at it so far.

I guess it's just that I've seen enough Kamen Rider shows nail the big emotional moments and the episode-to-episode superhero stuff that it's hard to not feel frustrated when a show doesn't. It's not really what this show was trying to do, it was way more about the connections between characters, but it still felt weird to me when the show couldn't seem to make that part of the story interesting.

Thanks! And, uh, it's not that tough, actually. I'll have a couple things rattling around my head while I watch an episode, and then it all gets vomited out onto the boards. There is, uh, not a lot of structure or planning. I'm glad that people want to talk about it after I say weird things about Kamen Rider!

That was fun experiencing one of my top ten favorite seasons again. God do I love this. I was less active than I thought, but could be because I just would have said, liked that too. I'm just gonna ramble about some things.

First a few things about story details that are interesting, especially connected to the Cross of Fire that were revealed after the series had warped airing in an art book. monster faction name is one of those. They are called the Lords, with their generals are called the El. And of course the names of both the spooky kid and Agito Jesus, the Overlord of Darkness and the Overlord of Light respectively. However, that Overlord of Light name is somewhat misleading since he is an El. So, he I originally subservient to the Overlord of Darkness, betraying him at one point to strengthen humanity, by extension, Agito's powers are connected to the enemy he fought. All of this should have been in the show really, it's actually really nice lore and frames the conflict a bit more. And they are apparently somehow connected to the Linto tribe from Kuuga in a way.

Something else I wanted to ramble on was the theme of Agito. It's interest that you found home to be it, and I can totally see that, for me it kinda struck something else. Humanity is shit, we bicker, we compete, we argue, but when it comes push to shove, humanity will prevail, because we are good. The most defining moment for this was in my opinion when Hojo stormed into the G3 truck and played eyes for Hikawa. He might have a large hate-boner for the guy and be an egotistical prick, but he is still human, and not a monster. He ain't gonna let him die like this. And I think that's a really strong message, that while the world might be cynical and dark, that there is an inherent goodness in humanity and that we will always rise up to the challenge. Works also with the theme of evolution in my opinion.

Anyway, kinda curious how you will like Ryuki and expect me to be far more vocal than anything before. I have a lot to say about Ryuki, and I doubt much of it will be positive. Will be interest to see how you will like my least favorite Rider season.

I think there's definitely a bit of discussion, via the later episodes, about the value of humanity in a world of monsters. How Humanity Deals With Adversity is a main theme of the show, so, yeah, it makes perfect sense to have Hikawa be the Humanity Will Overcome Adversity to Houjou's Nah We Make Decisions Based In Fear. I don't know that the show really comes down one way or the other, definitively (Spooky Man and Truegami got real different predictions about what the future's going to look like), and I like that? I like that it's an ongoing thing, a daily struggle to get better and face challenges. That's a nice way to leave that storyline.

I'm looking forward to the conversation, for sure! Ryuki seems like a real tentpole show for Phase 1, alongside Den-O and Kuuga, so I'm keen to see what makes it so pivotal.

Rewatching Agito, it always amused me how Gills transformation makes it seem like Ryo was summoning Gills, as if Gills was a separate person entirely. It is also quite possibly the cheapest and simplest transformation sequence as well.

I think it's pretty effective, though. It does a lot to sell Gills as not just being Ryou With Powers, but as a more feral, violent lifeform. I never really got onboard with Houjou's primal fear of Agitos when it was viewed through Shouichi's actions and demeanor as Masked Rider Agito, but Gills? The dude who screams so hard that tentacles pop out of him? That dude, yeah, afraid for what might happen to humanity.

The moment I saw Gills on the Toei website circa 2001 I was surprised they managed to pull off a bio-organic rider so well. This was around the time I was into Guyver a bit alongside toku and to me at the time was just perfect. But then Another Agito stole his thunder for me that same year around autumn-ish.:lolol

When are you going to do ryuki?

It was going to be another couple weeks, but since everything I'm watching lately is letting me down (new season of Narcos I had to quit after two episodes, only made it about 15 minutes into that Aladdin film), uh, it's going to be sooner than I'd thought. This Thursday, I think? The 12th? Guess I better start scooping up content...

Thanks for asking! And welcome to the boards! You've just joined a pretty great community.

If you haven't already seen it, then you could always check out Legend Heroes. It's very Kamen Rider esque and if my favorite Toku, even though it was not made in Japan. I don't think that one would disappoint you.

Whoa, that does look pretty great. I think I'm going to keep things pretty Kamen Rider, though, with my toku time, at least until I wrap up the Heisei and Reiwa shows I've not seen. (If only they'd stop making new ones until I catch up! Toei's being kind-of an asshole about this.) Legend Heroes is definitely going on the list for afterwards, though. Thanks for the recommendation!

I love that idea, lol!

MASKED RIDER AGITO HYPER BATTLE VIDEO - THREE GREAT RIDERS

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Well, I’ve just spent some time watching WandaVision, a TV show about an all-powerful character who manipulates reality and kidnaps people to paper over their own sense of helplessness amid a world of constant dangers, so now let me take a nice long drink of water before starting to enjoy this 19-year old Agito short that is going to be a nice breath of uncomplicatedly fresh air…

...

...

...

Okay, so, that didn’t work out so great.

Yep, some slight similarities between this goofy-ass clipshow and a harrowing exploration of a woman’s grief, and I found them to be equally enjoyable.

It’s an HBV, so there’s really not a ton to unpack. (The Build and Faiz ones are, like, the only ones I can recall getting at larger themes. Speaking of HBVs, did anyone watch that recent Gaim Gaiden, the Bravo/Guridon one? Same deal, where it’s just this thin as hell plot and a few new suits, but with the troubling addition of nostalgia as an alternative to character growth. Didn’t love it!) It’s mostly an excuse to have the three main Riders (sorry, recently-killed Another Agito) be weird around each other and desperately avoid being seen as functional heroes, something that could not be more Inoue if it tried.

It’s a fun conceit, all three heroes putting their friends over as the Strongest Rider so that they can bail on this story. (The correct answer to Tele-pi’s dilemma, of course, is Leangle. Failing that, G3 but only when Houjou is piloting it.) I liked the touch of Hikawa immediately being okay with admitting he’s not that great, which is Hikawa’s eternal opening gambit. The escalation of Shouicihi’s Aw Shucks humility at actually being incredibly cool, yes, and I missed it so much. He’s the Sweetest Rider, and that’s not worth nothing. Ryou’s tendency to appear and disappear from this story, ceding a ton of the narrative to the Shouichi/Hikawa partnership, reminds me of the way most of Agito’s stories broke down: specifically, Ryou’s mostly parallel storylines and his occasional appearances for a group fight. Him being Incredibly Tortured in his monologue and then having Tele-pi’s reaction be OH MY GOD THAT IS THE BEST probably mirrored how the younger audience was viewing Gills’ unending torment and one-foot-in-front-of-the-other pragmatism.

As always with these early-Heisei HBVs, it’s nice to finally get names for all of these parts of Agito? The forms and gear and moves? (“Gills Feeler”, though… could’ve lived a happy life never knowing that!) It’s all said so casually here, like DUH everyone knows it’s called the Gills Heel Claw, dummy. It would’ve been nice to know these things as I was watching Agito? Ah, well. Hard to get mad about it now, you know?

It’s a cute little story, this one. The action is minor, the canonicity is questionable, and the new content is brief, but I had a good time with it. Building a story around Riders recounting their awesome abilities while throwing their friends under the bus to avoid an embarrassing hat? Sure, why not. At least Tele-pi let them all leave in the end! Not every traumatized god-like character would!

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While I haven’t seen this video, I can feel you about the “shorter video productions with little to no plot” thing. It’s the one thing I’m dreading about Inoue’s “Zi-O vs Decade/Decade vs Zi-O” two-part special (though it seems there is one guest character shared between the two, so I’m probably just worrying for nothing)

Speaking of the “names only revealed here” thing, I’ve got a pair of fan comics that basically poke fun at that (Den-O gets confused upon learning his finishing move is called “Extreme Slash”, Kuuga gets confused upon learning his blue transformation is called “Dragon Form”). I might share it with you sometime.

I watched this recently and adored it. It's just a good, what, 15 minutes of the Agito characters being Agito characters to each other? It's all you need really!

Frankly I think it's hilarious how all the characters are trying to shoehorn in the 'cool' names for all these things in this HBV when they're obviously not meant to be called anything in the show itself.

Please do! I'd love to read it!

As much as they were always going to say that all three Riders are great, Gills' explanation of his horrifying biology and inescapable sorrow was something that felt a little apples-to-oranges for me.

I was vaguely reminded of a Red Dwarf joke I've forgot the exact phrasing and provenance of. (Nope, found it, Timeslides.) Who's the real Strongest Rider? Agito, with his form changes and catastrophic finishers? G3-X, with his cool armor and mechanized weaponry? Or Gills, with... with what he's got?

The names thing... I get that, at this point, things were still relatively serious in the TV show about mutants who fought other mutants. There was that inherited Kuuga tone, where Gills is too much of a cosmic punching bag to come up with cool names for his moves, and Shouichi's headspace as Agito precludes him boyishly shouting out finishers or form changes. There's a baseline grim sensibility to the toku aspects of the show, even if the character work bordered on the ridiculous. So, yeah, hard to shoehorn that stuff in to the TV show.

I just miss it, though. Ex-Aid guy, you know? There not being constant exclamations from belts, from heroes, from monsters... it's like it's not Kamen Rider without those things. HBVs like this, for all their low goals, are maybe more Kamen Rider to me than the series themselves? Tricky. Tricky stuff!

Ask and ye shall receive

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Really, between episode 28 and the HBV, it's kind of a shame that Kobayashi didn't get to write more with Agito's cast. It seemed like she had a great grasp on the characters, based on the two short chances she got to prove it. This is a pretty definitive HBV, actually. Interactions between the cast that give you a good feel for how the series works (namely: Shouichi and Hikawa are hilarious, and Ryou desperately needs a hug), some token exclusive action, and some pointless trivia for the fun of it. I especially like how it treats the three Riders with such equal weight (the plot literally revolves around how hard it is to say one of them is for sure cooler and better than the others), which, as I'm sure I mentioned in this thread before, is the absolute core of what makes Agito special in my eyes.

Oooh, this was a Kobayashi one? Neat! (No credits on the ol' Rider Wiki, unfortunately.) A pretty fun prelude to Den-O, then, I guess!

My favorite thing about Shouichi and Hikawa is something she nails in this one. Hikawa's go to is A Thin Layer Of Pride Over A Deep Well Of Inadequacy, while Shouichi's thing is Goofy Deflection Of How Awesome And Cool He Is Because He Doesn't Want Other People To Feel Bad. You put those two things together, and it's like an ouroboros of You're Great/No, You're Great. This non-stop interaction of Hikawa's certainty that he's a failure and Shouichi's need to make other people feel good about themselves. It's Shouichi trying to praise Hikawa, which only makes Hikawa more certain that Shouichi is better than him. (why does that all sound so familiar) I love it? I love it.