Onore Decado!
 

Since the introduction of Kamen Rider Decade Complete Form, I've been partially curious as to what are considered proper final forms for the riders of the current generation.

For the original Heisei-era we have:
Kuuga - Rising Ultimate
Agito - Shining Form
Ryuki - Survive
Faiz - Blaster Form
Blade - King Form
Hibiki - Armed
Kabuto - Hyper Form
Den-O - Super Climax Form
Kiva - Emperor Form

So the question is this... for W, OOO, and Fourze... do movie only forms count or should final forms be relegated to tv only appearances?

Even in the latest MegaMax film, Kamen Rider W only went up to Cyclone Joker Xtreme... a form consistent with the TV shows. Cyclone Joker Gold Xtreme, though appeared twice, may be considered a special loaned power deal?

With Kamen Rider OOO people debate between PuToTyra and TaJaDoru Combos. I don't think I can consider Super TaToBa Combo to be his final form, considering the medals were sent from the future.

Kamen Rider Fourze, at this point, would have to definitely be Cosmic States. I don't think there's been anything shown to disprove this.

Leaving Kamen Rider Decade. It seems as if Complete Form just allows him to summon the strongest forms of other Kamen Riders, but his strongest form is Violent Emotion right?

Lastly, I just wanted to throw out there that I love how Toei's been trying to make an effort in a unified Kamen Rider continuity since Decade. First you have the original Showa riders roaming around (like depicted in Kamen Rider Spirits), all the Heisei riders merged into being alternate universes as shown with Kamen Rider Decade, and the 'neo-heisei' riders all being in continuity with each other. Fantastic.

I consider CJ Xtreme to be W's final form. Gold Xtreme I look at as being more like Kiva's weird bird thingy form. Besides, Shotaro and Philip couldn't use it at will like regular Extreme.

OOO's final form is PuToTyra. It fulfills every single criteria for being one, including having potential drawbacks, which only Kuuga and Blade have really done a lot with before. I really can't understand how anyone could not see this as the final form.

Also, I'd argue that Climax form is more of Den-O's final form than Liner, although the show itself was always kind of vague on this. Climax seemed generally more powerful, though, especially when it got upgraded with Sieg.

Super Climax was used as Den-O's final form in the first Movie War - just like Kuuga Rising Ultimate was used there instead of Ultimate - so I think it's safe to say that movie-exclusive forms aren't out of the question.

I would have to say Double's final form would be CycloneAccelXtreme, unused though it may be. Switchblade does bring up a good point with his analogy between CycloneJokerGoldXtreme and Kiva Emperor Form Flight Style, so if we are going to only use forms that made it into reality. However, movie forms should count, as despite the fact it's a movie, a Rider Form is a Rider Form. Therefore, Den-O's final form is Super Climax (as was also established in Movie War 2010).

I prefer Den-O's final form to be Super Climax, but I'm biased because I like Sieg and Wing Form. :P

Anyway, as you were talking about the conjoined continuities, they also established Den-O in the same universe as Kiva and Decade too ^^

Hmm I think it's because at the end of the day... Tajador was the final form used in the series. That could mean that it was the most powerful, though PuToTyra is just more of something like FangJoker. I dunno, I can't really decide fully myself. In MegaMax even, PuToTyra wasn't used... probably because the purple core medals just stopped existing?

Yeah, I forgot about Super Climax... but here's where it may get interesting. I forget which movie it was, but there are basically three Den-O's now. Liner Form being Ryotaro's final form... Super Climax being the Imagin's final form... and New Den-O Strike Form being his final.

EDIT: I just watched Super Climax's one and only time, and it wasn't really called into play by Decade. The film he showed up in was pretty early on, making it happen earlier than Decade's Complete Form appearance.

How can Cyclone Accel Xtreme be a final form when it's not even Kamen Rider W. That's the combination of two different people, making it a completely different rider.

Bah, besides whatever happened in the Heisei-era, it could all just be looked at as a bunch of criss crossing alternate universes that Decade just cleaned up (as vague as it can be). I'd also be interested in watching a short bit with New Den-O teaming up with Aqua.

Not to mention it was on screen for little more then 20 seconds. Hell, the only time we see the form in action is in Climax Heroes.

Regarding Den-O...given that Decade turned Den-O into Climax Form during one of the Movie Wars, I think Toei considers Climax Form to be the true ultimate form. Although with Kuuga, you could argue that it wasn't even the original Kuuga that was turned into his Rising Ultimate Form.

Rising Ultimate shouldn't count. It's a terrible design, it never really did anything, and its existence makes no damn sense if you've seen Kuuga.

Super Climax was used in Movie War 2010...


It utilizes the Double Driver. Just because Takumi used the Delta Gear instead of Mihara doesn't mean he was still Kamen Rider Faiz. He was Delta.

Does it really matter? CAX never actually existed.

Switchblade I know that you hate Decade Kuuga and I can understand it. But as someone else who likes the original Kuuga I don't see the big problem with the Decade interpretation of it. I think it's fair to say that Rising Ultimate is the Final Form of Kuuga. But if you really need to justify that it's then just consider Decade Kuuga to be a Secondary Rider for Decade instead of an actual main series AU Rider.
Here's my personal breakdown of all of them:

-Kuuga Rising Ultimate
-Agito Shining
-Ryuki Survive
-Faiz Blaster
-Blade King
-Hibiki Armed
-Kabuto Hyper
-Den-O Super Climax (I go with this over Liner because Liner requires Ryutaro and he doesn't really become Den-O anymore. It's basically Momotaros as the rider now)
-Kiva Emperor
-Decade Complete
-W Cyclone Joker Extreme Gold (iffy on it though)
-OOO TaJaDoru or Super TaToBa (This is really a tossup seeing as the Super Medals are all more highly evolved versions of the normal TaToBa medals resulting in, obviously, Super OOO)
-Fourze Cosmic

I don't hate Decade Kuuga, per say (although lord knows he earned the fan nickname "Yuuseless"). I just hate Rising Ultimate form. Ultimate was a gorgeous suit and it's one use was an awesome moment that was the culmination of Yuusuke's journey as a character and his resolve to help others. Rising Ultimate makes no sense because the Rising powers were developed by accident and, if anything, kept Yuusuke from having to use Ultimate form. Amazing Mighty was the ultimate version of the Rising powers, and even that paled in comparison to Ultimate. Basically, the Rising powers were an unexpected but surprisingly effective way of powering up the Arcle, but Ultimate form is still the - pun unavoidable - ultimate expression of what Kuuga can be. So the idea of a "Rising Ultimate" form makes no sense to me.

And it's really damn ugly. Like Super TaToBa/Masked Form Sasword level ugly.

Also I'm a self-admitted Kuuga snob.

My mistake. I rewatched the scene and Super Climax is the form.

I understand that. That's a damn solid argument and your 100% right. I guess I've just always been a sucker for super power-ups that are absurd. So the idea of going beyond the strongest, beyond ultimate, has always intrigued me. I can't help but love things like this or other one-off forms that are absurd like Super TaToBa, Rocket States, Diend Complete, New Den-O Vega etc.

And no worries. I'm a Den-O snob :lol No way Liner Form is the final one over Super Climax. Ever.

And I acknowledged that (mostly. It's unused, not non-existent). However, it was designed to be Double's alternate form. If we're onky talking about forms that extend beyond the blueprint, then yes, I would say CycloneJokerGoldXtreme would be Double's final form. Otherwise, I'm just going to go with Shroud's word. But if you want to disagree, go ahead. Your reasoning is understandable (in my opinion). And since we're on the topic of snobs, I'm a Double snob.

I'm sorry, but without seeing CAX in action, there's no real way of gauging just how powerful the form really is.

Word of Shroud. Shroud created the tech for Double and Accel, so she should be able to figure out Double's most powerful form. She said it was CAX, so I'm taking her word for it. CJGX only really has wings and a new color-scheme.

You can't really gauge a rider just based on word of mouth...Cosmic States is suppose to be Fourze's most powerful form, yet it still got it's ass handed to him by Leo Zodiarts.

Another example:

They kept going on about how powerful the Zangyaku were in Gokaiger, but they never did a damned thing to show for it.

Just cause they say something is ZOMG TEH STRONGEST EVAR! doesn't nessicarily mean it is...for all we know, Terui and Phillip could've been totally incompatible with one another, thus rendering Shroud's word useless.

They never even attempted to bring CAX Into play, so there's really no point in debating about this.

Who's to say Leo isn't more powerful than Cosmic States? Besides, CAX is technically more powerful, but only in the the sense that attacks like those of the Terror Dopant would be ineffective on CAX, as the users would be immune. W established that quite nicely. I see where you are going, but I think I'll trust Shroud's judgement.

I never watched Gokaiger…

And actually, they did attempt to bring CAX into play, after Shotarou was unable to be Double. Besides, Philip has all of the knowledge of Earth in his head (more or less). He'd probably find a way :).

Isn't that the same judgment that determined Shotaro wasn't physically strong enough to be Philip's partner?

Nobody's perfect. But Shroud is allowed that miscalculation, as she created the tech. It does nothing (major) to my opinion and faith in Shroud's judgement. Besides, it's probably only maternal reflex.

I understand your nitpicking KRX, but Shoutaro exceeded their expectations to begin with and proved to be the most ideal partner for Phillip. If Terui was that candidate, they certainly would have shown it by now. It's almost like saying that the maker is 100% right and that their creations are not capable of doing things beyond their comprehension. There are plenty of fictional and non-fictional cases of this happening... it's a story trope that happens all the time. So unless proven otherwise, it really isn't anything significant other than a good "what-if" situation.

We have established that Ryu is as capable as Shotarou. Shotarou may have exceeded expectations, but CAX would still be slightly more functional. I realize I may sound like the creator is 100% right, and I know it's not always true. But let's face it; Shroud had every right to underestimate Shotarou after working with Narumi Soukichi for years. Shotarou's good, but he has a long way to go before he's Soukichi good.

I fail to see how any of this is Decades fault.

Decade's lack of a FINAL KAMEN RIDE: D-D-D-DOUBLE card has left us debating on whether CycloneJokerGoldXtreme or CycloneAccelXtreme is Double's final form.

There is nothing saying that. You're placing CAX on a slightly higher pedestal based on one (And only one) line. Shroud considered CAX to be the better form. Until we see CAX in action, there's nothing to support her word on whether she's right or wrong.

Shroud said, and Philip and Ryu proved, that CAX would be more functional because they would be immune to attacks like those of the Terror Dopant's.

Again, to repeat what Matrixbeast said...there is NOTHING to prove that Shroud's word was the correct one...and in the end, it does not matter cause CAX never made it to the screen. And again, i'ts impossible to measure how strong a form actually is based on words alone.

You walk up to a person, claim you're the strongest person in the universe. But for all we know, you're actually weak as hell. You can't claim that something is so powerful without evidence that it is.

I think I can see where KRX is on this one. According to Shroud CAX would be the strongest form. That statement carries ALOT of weight due to her involvement in developing Skull, W, and Accel. Better than anyone she should know W's true potential. Just because it never happened in show and Shoutaro was able to stay Phillips' partner, it doesn't mean that CAX would be weaker than normal Extreme.

And I know that game appearances don't count really but CAX did appear in at least 2 games if I recall because it's weapons are the Prism Bicker and Engine Blade that it uses simultaneously. Based on actual appearances by normal Extreme, and the lack of one by CAX, we can never really know but I think for now it's safe to say we should stick with normal CJX or Gold for W's final and most powerful form.

Actually, yes there is; Ryu and Philip have both demonstrated an immunity to Terror's fear attacks throughout the series. You can think that CJX/CJGX is Double's final form. Both are equally viable. I'm just trying to show CAX's side of the arguement.