Kamen Rider Saber Episode 38- "The Galaxy Sword Unites The Seiken!" Discussion
 

Touma seeks an ancient legendary power to prevent his friends' sacrifice.

Ahhhh! That was great! Shibasaki did not let down or Xross' debut! I just need a more higher quality video to enjoy it even further!

SHF Xross Saber when? XD

Also, according to the website Xross Saber is based on Stronger's Charge Up form.

This is from the website:
Xross Saber is meant to be a throwback to Stronger Charge Up, which changes color only.
Due to transforming with a different Seiken not different Book so it is natural that Xross Saber is a Brave Dragon recolor instead of an entirely new suit.
The star pattern on Xross Saber cannot be painted on, so craftsmen have to do that manually.

Okay so yeah the logic makes sense because yeah, utilizing a new Seiken wouldn't grant an entirely different form.

Nice to see it being compared to Stronger Charge Up though, since that was my first thought seeing it.

Also dang, that was an honestly beautiful debut, I loved every second of it. I also love how we got a Caladbolg Army of giant robots too.

More stuff from the website.

-Heisei final forms are the all-in-one style
-Zero-One started the final form era with its simple design
-Saber arrived with a different colored base form (but the sword and horn is changed)
-Xross Saber is the ultimate of simple final form!
-Based on Charged Up Stronger
-The Seiken is based on a Kamen Rider's individuality and the book is just an interchangeable item, so it is natural that Xross Saber's Brave Dragon only changes his color
-The craftsmen had to handpaint the suit entirely
-It is difficult to use him in green screen
-It looks Simple but Complicated, but Complex and also Simple

I uh... is it weird I wanna take a bite out of that?

Looks like a delicious gummy candy.

wrong thread

Ouh, my bad

Petition to have Xross Saber's jingle replace the opening theme song? Not that the opening's bad in my opinion, but that jingle's way too good to be a jingle.

That makes a lot of sense. Stronger IS probably one of the simplest 'final forms', and Xross Saber exemplifies that a lot. I guess this means that the idea that we'll get a new WRB for Xross Saber is edging closer to being a 'dead' theory.

A lot of respect to the painters for handpainting all of the stars since a machine couldn't do it. It might make maintaining the paint of Xross Saber really, really hard, though.

It's been dead since details of the DX toy came out.

Haven't watch the episode yet, but already saw Xross Saber debut.

This form might be a repaint, but the debut is probably the craziest final form debut i have seen in a while, surpassing Zero-two, Grand Zi-o and Genius (wait, Genius doesn't count cause that's a low bar)

Like this form is like a Kiwami arms on crack, it has a really cool henshin sequences, crazy debut fight and how Touma get Haohken is like something out of Dragon ball (At'least from what i saw on how the sword was created)

But even though the form is pretty LIT! I still don't like that the form is a repaint though.

(Can we get a new form that's not a repaint where Touma use the Wonder story book in the final episode please? No? Okay...)

Premium Bandai is still a thing

Given it seems Saber's default form is now Xross.

My theory is final episode we get either Almighty or Wonder Dragon which allows him to swap between both blades, and then the finale form is a super charged Brave Dragon looking form.

The magazine scans have Touma dual wielding Rekka and Juusaber (that the name?), so Touma can still default back to Brave Dragon if he wants to.

In or out of suit? If it's in suit then it's probably just a function of the Juusaber.

In suit, yeah. But whether or not it's a function of Juusaber, Touma can probably permanently re-summon the Seiken so they can transform again. Tategami teams up with Saber next week anyway.

Edit: I'm dumb or didn't see in the live stream wit the video quality, but everyone still had their swords lmao

Xross Saber's jingle kind of reminds me a JAM Project Garo theme.

I still find it wild how like... call Xross Saber whatever you want but... you can't call it lazy after the stuff we've just found out.

The fact that they couldn't just auto paint the suits like they usually do, they had to manually paint the suit in order to get that level of detail. Plus all the stuff I've been seeing about the Sodo figures just being like trying to overcome the hurdles this suit brought. This is taking a lot of work on like all teams I feel. And it's so interesting they chose to do this.

And yet I still find it sad that most people will see it and go to the quick assumption that it's a lazy repaint/loss of budget. When the website already implicates Xross and his form changes caused them to go over budget. Oh well.

It was either one all-new suit but without the cosmic colors and the context surrounding the cosmic look, or Xross Saber. And I feel that the latter is much more interesting in both lore and in visuals.

Really helps appreciate these shows when you read the production notes.

https://i.imgur.com/dp12sYi.jpg

Xross Saber is GOAT.

One of the best episode in the series so far.
Xross Saber is just COOL!

Maybe a weird thing for me to care about, but this is the best showcase of a new merch on debut I've seen in a long while! It's something I feel is really inherent to these merch-driven toku which I genuinely look forward to in these shows.

Like, a spectacular fight where the new sword's scanning and combining features get neatly shown one after another? I had almost given up on such things after Zi-O and Zero-One would go as far as to never show certain features or standby music from its gimmicks and weapons! :0 Last time I could recall anything close was Build going through each of the FullBottle Buster's finishers one after another, though that one was considerably less impressive since in practice he was just standing in one place and shooting a gun over and over again until the last finisher with the Tank legs.

That aside, episode is okay. I'm waiting/hopeful for that cool insert to kick in agian when Kento finally transforms into Espada again, prooooobably two episodes from now?

Great debut all around. The visuals during the process of Haouken's summoning was stellar (heh) and the suit looks even better in action. It's a shame it's still a Brave Dragon repaint, but the context behind it and just visual looks is good enough and I'm excited for Dragon Lion Alangina!

Solomon's suit, however, does NOT look good in the dark, I can see the foam texture on his suit and it makes it look like a cosplay suit.

Back to Xross! There's a lot of neat details that was foreshadowed all the way back in episode six I think. You can see it in the link below, specifically on "bottom of page 2" part.

And this part too "Becoming the King of Power requires someone who can endure and draw out that power. And the sword that can handle the power."


The Haouken is that sword and putting even basic WRBs unleashes that books true power.

https://twitter.com/ZacEnzr/status/1318112411040288771

Xross Saber is also likely based on the Night of the Galactic Railroad Train, one which Kento and Touma acted on during, well, Kento's introduction.

That's enough for Xross Saber, we're finally at the point where Kento picks up Ikazuchi! Great stuff. Not sure on Hayato's presence here, but I'm assuming it's just a ghost-turned-glowing-butterfly by Tassel just to assist Kento. Souls and stuff like that aren't too wild for Saber. He was gone as quick as he returned. Though, this means Kento's now hanging around with two swords. Fine with me, I guess, it's sort of like Aruto having both Zero-One/Two drivers and dual-wielding riders are considered an upgrade in Saber, I guess. Dragon Alangina being ranked higher than Dragon Arthur in strength I think was something in a magazine.

As for Bacht, hmm... I don't think that was enough for me. Touma gave a speech, hit him, and he's gone. Touma basically told Bacht to "Move on! Stay positive!" which I find a bit iffy, since Bacht's been around for 1000 years according to him. And he was most likely was wallowing around in his lil book up till the "movie" and his revival. Same kind of issue with Touma's speech with Kamijou about trusting his friends, especially now that we know what Kamijou was going through. So, that was weird.

The Shindai Siblings, because I have to keep mentioning them since I like these two, Ryoga's fine here. He's piss mad which was amusing. I do wish Reika had one or two more lines, though. She was only "Okay, Onii-Sama" and "It's our duty!" here. She needs an episode for herself, which I'm hoping we get some of that next week. Since Ryoga seems to fall there, and Sabela has to go and get Touma's other books to get Crimson Saber (should've been Azure Saber, though).

Ren's cool, I hope more interaction with him and Dezast now that the latter has Kyomu. I also love how Dainshji is the most hype during Xross Saber's debut.

And that insert song...! Man, I already want to hear it! It sounds great so far!

https://i.imgur.com/b5q2j17.png

This was decent I guess.

Standout moments for me were Kentou's dialog with his dad (I'm glad I watched Sword of Logos-special before this) and Touma's lecture for Bacht. Forget swords, the fire chicken got murdered by words. Touma had some really great points to make, damn that was good. I'm a bit sad Bacht is gone, but his successor should prove interesting as well.

Now, the thing most people understandably got hyped for this week: Xross Saber.

...

Meh?

I'm 100% with their decision to make final forms simpler looking, Zero Two was brilliant IMO, but this doesn’t quite work as well for me. The paintjob is very nice, but it just doesn't interest me much. The powers are as generic as they could be; it's just another "all powers combined" final form with lots of CGI nonsense. For now at least, there is more coming, but the sword definitely just does "all the swords".

So yeah, this episode had its strong points, but none of them were directly related to the final form itself sadly.

I can't help but get Diamond is Unbreakable vibes from the contrasts of Haouken Xross Saber and Caladbolg. Like how one focuses on creation for Haouken, the other on destruction with Caladbolg makes me think of Crazy Diamond and Killer Queen and their contrast with each other with CD being creation, KQ being destruction.

I think the most excited I was this whole episode was when Brave Dragon managed to finally squeeze in an appearance in the 30's when Touma struck Bacht down. I know that sort of line is usually a setup for calling everything else boring, but all I'm saying here is that I really like Brave Dragon and that was a very nice surprise.

It's also just the punctuation on a really dang good scene. Even once he finally showed up on TV, I really didn't expect Bacht to have more than a quick guest villain appearance, but they looped him so thoroughly into the themes of the show and made it pay off fantastically here. It's pretty simple to describe, but it's super satisfying to see Touma look at how resigned this dude is to his own pain and suffering and just be like "well maybe if you tried doing something about it...?" A lot of Saber has been about the need to trust in the best of things, whether it's your friends or the future or whatever else. It's been pretty unsubtle about that ever since Kento came back, obviously, and as such, it feels deeply on the mark for the big final form debut to have a scene where the titular hero calls out fanatical nihilism as nothing more than stubborn self-indulgence. Centering the drama here on their confrontation was a smart move.

And right there, you might have realized I'm indirectly saying Master Logos is not an interesting enough character to hold dramatic weight, but, kind of against all odds, at least for this one episode, they honestly made that work in the story's favor. You wanna talk punctuation, how perfect is it to have Touma write off Solomon's sword as being weightless while blocking a massively oversized version of it? Again, the show has spent a ton of time, including with Falchion literally right here, building this idea of the feelings and convictions these swordsmen put into each swing of their blades, so this is basically the show's way of explicitly saying that Solomon is, entirely by design, little more than a poser. He's just some jerk messing with everyone for extremely shallow reasons and now Touma is going to shut him up with his new friendship sword that came raining down from the heavens like a shooting star. I love this show so much, you guys.

Not that it's perfect, or anything. I definitely think having Kento's dad come back to push his son in the right direction is an unnecessary step in that arc, and it probably would've been far more satisfying to see Kento deciding to move forward all on his own, but at the same time, I didn't find it was executed in a way that was too grating, either. I do especially like the callback to Hayato affectionately running his hand through Kento's hair, which is very specific reference to make.

It's worth noting that this episode was written by Hiroki Uchida again, and with each one he writes, I just want to see more and more from him. It's legitimately impressive how little disconnect there is with his scripts even though he was brought onto Saber when it was already in full swing.

And then you top all that off with Xross Saber's debut? I mean, dude -- forget about it. It's a shiny blue Brave Dragon that flies around just destroying the special effects budget! Shibasaki is evidently a madman, and I'm glad he was the director here, because I feel like something gunning for this level of spectacle might not have worked as well coming from someone else. The entire sequence is absurd, and I adored every second of it. Especially the seconds where it turns out that sword can also work like Gridman's Fixer Beam, as though Xross Saber wasn't already everything I could possibly want from Saber. Fantastic debut in a fantastic episode.

Thought that name sounded familiar

https://tokusatsunetwork.com/2021/05...-writing-team/

I appreciate the work that went into Xross Saber's suit, and that it wasn't simply a matter of 'easy recolour'... but this ain't it. I don't think it justifies that complex starry pattern that's giving every toy designer and suit painter trouble nor the 'base form again' thing, and I would have just preferred a new, streamlined suit. At the end of the day the design just comes off as lame to me.

Which is a great contrast to how EVERYTHING ELSE ABOUT THAT DEBUT WAS AMAZING!! I haven't enjoyed Saber this much in... uh... ever, actually! This was far and away the best episode between every single thing about the final form debut being amazing and bombastic in a way few final form debuts can match (and that is an exceedingly difficult category to compete in); how strong the character moments and resolutions were; the use of music and the nailing of dramatic moments; how so many elements in this episode were juggled in a way that so easily could have been a mess and yet were balanced -perfectly- to the point that everything feels like it got the right amount of time it needed yet the most important thing - Xross Saber - was still the absolute focus. I really enjoyed this one and I wish this is the level of quality Saber had been able to aspire to all along; it seriously feels like an entirely different show now!

I am hoping we get Hybrid Saber with King of Arthur in the final episode. I really doubt it, though.

They liked showing of Dragon Arthur with Haouken, much like how they liked to show putting Elemental Dragon with Nagare, my guess is he'll use King Of Arthur sometime but it either just summons KingExcalibur or they just slap on the King Of Arthur armor parts on Xross without any change to the overall look. I'm fine with that, it's blue anyway.

I'm a bit irked that the Mumeiken Kyomu wasn't included in the Haouken Xross Saber. Like, there was clearly 11 swords in that pattern thing that created the sword. You could clearly see the Mumeiken Kyomu in there. WHY?!? Would it have nullified the powers of the Xross Saber or something?

https://i.imgur.com/b2Af9g2.png

Kyomu probably still has a special role left to be fulfilled, given that Desast gets his hands on it. Marketing seems to purposefully exclude it, too.

We'll find out.

I don't particularly have a problem that basically the sword of creation doesn't include void, kinda the complete antithesis.

I mean, Kyomu has the ability to negate the powers of the other Seiken, right? Maybe the fact that the Xross Saber was able to reverse all the damage that Solomon caused is sorta like that?

I hope they never acknowledge Kyomu being 'missing'. Don't want this to be another Drive Ridewatch thing again x_x

I assume Kyomu was needed to start the ceremony but it wasn't needed in the creation of the new sword. If that makes sense.

I forget if I've spoken on this episode, but HOLY COW THAT WAS A GOOD EPISODE.

I can't help but feel that Touma telling Bacht to move on feels slightly like telling a depressed person to "get over it". I get what Touma was trying to say to Bacht; dude's essentially given up and Touma's just like "maybe don't give up?". It just feels odd.

Touma's sick burn to Isaac is awesome. "Yeah your sword's basically a feather, bruh. Mine's a boulder, though. Get rekt."

Onto the debut.

Holy cow.
I love that insert. I love the sword. I love the circle digital glowy stuff around the blade when it does the slidey thing. I like how you can stack powers and boom boom boom boom. The suit looks cool, especially knowing the work that went into it.
I hope this brings back final form weapons (having said that, it seems to be final form drivers). I just love the suit. It's flashy.
The debut showed off the full capabilities of the sword. Usually, we'd see a finisher or two. But no. Gotta show everything. It's glorious.

If you want to pretend Kyomu is part of the Xross Saber, you can always go with the logic that not being counted at all is the most appropriate possible "presence" for a sword that represents nothingness. I mean, there's a reason the Bladriver goes "____ Battou!", right?

Anyways, I just realized something about Xross Saber that makes me love it even more. It and Elemental Primitive Dragon have a similar thing going on to Grateful and Mugen in Ghost that I loved there, where they each represent different peaks for the character rather than just being a progression on a single straight line of More Powerful.

In Saber's case, the whole tagline of the show is that he's a master of both swords and books, so each of those gets its own thing. Elemental Dragon is literally a story Touma created using his power as an author, while the Xross Saber is a direct product of the experience and resolve he's gained crossing blades with all these other swordsmen. I'm sure he'll still end up with a new Book or two somewhere down the line, but considering how hard it is to top Elemental Dragon's origin, going in a completely different direction for the final form was a pretty smart move.

As poorly written as Bahato was, I have to agree with Touma here; Bahato wasn't doing himself any favors by stubbornly sticking to his nihilistic ideas that human nature can't change for 1000 years. Yes, his family died and all, but that's all he has going on for his character. There's really no further 'depth'. So his friend betrayed him. Okay, sure, tragic. But why make the stretch that ALL of humanity is twisted? I don't recall seeing any others betraying this guy. And considering how Bahato vowed to protect the world (according to Yuri), I just don't find it believable that he does a sudden face-heel turn from the death of his family. Surely he knew there was good and evil people in the world beforehand?

And even if we do accept that his mental breakdown pushed him over the despair event horizon, it sucks that he had absolutely NO character development. I mean, yes this was called out by Touma when he said that Bahato persistently held onto despair, but that's really not an excuse for a lack of character depth.

A tragic event is a good way to give character depth, but not when it is poorly explained and is literally a SINGLE tragic event. A tragic event is different from a tragic backstory, which fully fleshes out and build up a sequence of events that shows how someone got pushed to the edge. Bahato's role can be summed up as "opponent for Saber and friends to defeat." If it wasn't for his sacred sword (which was important for creating the Xross Saber), I swear the guy could be replaced by a generic mook.

And this is honestly my biggest gripe with Saber. The designs and action are great, but that does nothing to make up for characterisation. The show puts too much focus on some characters while leaving others with minimal or no development. Touma keeps telling Ren that he could get stronger, but the show doesn't DO anything with it! All we see is Ren brooding around instead of training with Desast like I hoped he would when he decided to go with Desast. At least Bahato's poor characterisation gets called out (even though it's not an excuse to justify poor characterisation), Ren's brooding habits aren't corrected at all! I really feel bad for Ren's actor for having to show up on set just to 'brood'.

And while I hope Desast becoming Falchion would push either him or Ren into SOME development, I'm not exactly counting on it either at this point.

Scanning Charge literally gave me all the OOO's feels and then some. It's like Zi-O's ability to use other riders, but in an intelligent way. I have no qualms with suits being repainted when they're done for the sake of doing awesome back end of the season type stuff like this.

The production quality has ramped up, and I have to believe it's because of the crew's ability to get people in and make sure they stay safe.

Pretty much what everyone else has said, this has become a great season. I just kind of hope it doesn't become a Touma is too OP kind of thing and macguffin moving forward.