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Kamen Rider Revice Episode 26- "The End Of Darkness & Light!" Discussion
The Igarashis learn the terrifying powers & secrets of Kamen Rider Vail.
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Honestly disappointing for me. It's like if they speedrun Dezast and Ren's development and fight, leaving none for Kagerou and Daiji to actually work with. The dented helmet was a neat detail, like how the splatter on that section was different, but it really did nothing for me. The whole fight felt awkward, especially when it had George and Ikki watching and also having Ikki fight Demons. It should've been an isolated battle.
Kagerou says the last time we saw him, he was getting stronger, so how come for the most part in this episode he was just stumbling around. If he was losing on purpose, that'd be pretty disappointing on Daiji's part. They did this flashback scene, showing everything Kagerou has done until this point, and it really did nothing for me. He really hasn't done anything for Daiji to warrant that scene lol. And now he's gone. |
I think the problem with this Episode is We don't spend enough time with Kagerou , So while the context is correct i feel like we don't know enough Kagerou as individual unlike Vice so the result Kinda feel flat... as result is like Daiji got plug in sponsored from Bandai lol...
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Never cared much for Evil/Live even early on so the drama was lost on me to begin with, all things considered it was okay I guess, but I do agree this needed more time. Feels very sandwiched in between Vail's first appearance and the next upgrade for Revi and Vice which is just around the corner.
Also Vail is back inside the Demons Driver - why exactly? That makes no sense to me. At this point I feel like they badly needed to announce the spin-off but couldn't until the suit was used inside the actual show. I mean this also gets us more Demons which I'm more than fine with, but this whole episode was just weird. Good stuff, but weirdly stitched together. Not really the aftermath of the big reveals I wanted, but not bad either. And SIC Demons is kinda sick. https://i.imgur.com/iT1nw29.jpg |
They really like using Anomalocaris in Kamen Rider. :D
How about next time using Opabinia, Hallucigenia or Tamiscolaris... :D :D :D |
So, since I didn't post in any the threads between Evil showing up and Volcano Rex's debut, I've never had the chance to say this outright, but I freakin' love Daiji. I feel like I'm the only one around here who really does? Right from the show's very first episodes, I've felt his actor does a fantastic job implying a certain level of depth to his character, even when the scripts aren't throwing him into the spotlight. And his ability to do that is also aided by how strong the fundamentals of the character are. He's got such a definitive Middle Child thing going on, with how much he's constantly pushing himself to compete with Ikki, and you can draw a ton out of him from that. Ikki's busybody habits are a skill that comes naturally to him, and in contrast to that, Daiji always comes off like he's under this immense mental strain at all times, that's mostly there because he keeps putting it on himself. Ikki acts with his heart, but Daiji moves with his brain, and that head of his gets real overtaxed sometimes. Daiji strives to be the most disciplined, most responsible, and most upstanding person in the series, and as such it's only natural that his demon is even more far off from him than usual. Because he represses the negative side of himself harder than anybody. We've seen Ikki and Vice learn to accept the complexity of their relationship, and the shades of gray that come with it, but for Daiji and Kagerou, at the end of the day, it really is black and white.
...It just occurred to me I'm not doing a very good job getting around to the episode, so, to try and sum it up. I like Daiji. Everybody else loves Kagerou, it seems like, and he's great too, but I always did think of him as a character who benefitted Daiji first and foremost. I'm a bigger fan of Live than I am of Evil. Like, come on, that sweet clergyman aesthetic and the militaristic close-quarters gunfighting style are *way* cooler than Mr. Paint Splotch Face and his dinky knife. As soon as I heard him say "shirokuro tsukeyou ze!" for the first time, he pretty much became my favorite character in the show, if he wasn't already. (And he was already!) And after a lengthy stretch where my guy was taking backseat to Revice (understandably, given the title of the series), what better present could I ask for than for Daiji's next episode in the spotlight to also be the first episode of the show directed by Hidenori Ishida? I ended up liking this one a lot more than I thought I would. Getting the negatives out of the way, the exposition about Genta wasn't my favorite thing ever. It's not very exciting for a TV show to tell us about exciting past events without showing them at all, and the knowledge that we ARE getting to see all this in a spinoff doesn't make it any better. It made those scenes feel like a glorified recap/trailer for another project entirely. Which, you know, bit of a harsh way for me to put it. It's still totally functional for the narrative. I just wish it were portrayed in a way that was a bit more exciting. Beyond that though, the whole Evil/Live showdown really exceeded my expectations. There were a couple particular things that worried me about that concept, and I was delighted to see the episode not falling into those traps. A big thing, upfront, was that Kagerou hasn't been legitimately threatening in a very long while. Ever since they established a Rider Kick can just flip him on and off like a light switch, much of the real menace he had in his debut arc was straight up gone, and I was concerned we'd suddenly be asked to pretend all that goofy curry stuff and whatnot never happened. But no, instead, the episode makes that into a strength, by making it a point that even though Gifu is making everyone's demons stronger, Kagerou has also become weaker, specifically because of his connection to Daiji. And then the episode avoids the other thing that had me worried, when it further implies Kagerou is, to do some degree, actively hoping to see Daiji become stronger through his connection to him. The entire idea of duality like that is so utterly central to everything Revice is about as a series, and it would've been very very odd to suddenly have Daiji simply defeat his other half, so I massively appreciated the writing making it more complex than that. I like the idea that Daiji has to learn from Kagerou's personality to become even stronger. The idea that there's something of value in there, like a refusal to hesitate, that Daiji can apply to his own much more moral goals. It's all really nice, super thematic, and the kind of drama that's particularly well suited to Ishida's style. I mean, I don't even remotely understand how Kagerou uses his Vistamp that way, or how there are double Two SiDrivers, but it'd just be such a waste to look at this episode that literally. It shines so much in the atmosphere, with how everything is framed and lit, and in the emotions of the performances, like how Daiji is noticeably shaking throughout the fight, exactly like Kagerou says. Throw in some more solid material for Sakura and Aguilera, plus a great reminder of how much Ikki has grown when he's only barely tempted to interfere with the Evil/Live battle, and I'd say you have a pretty dang strong episode overall. Part of me wishes it didn't end when it did, because I'm hyped to see Holy Live in action some more, but then, that just shows how much I liked what they did here, doesn't it? |
I'm a middle child. Even if he isnt particularly high on my favorite Revice characters list, I understand Daiji's struggle deeply, and was looking forward to the resolution.
What we got.........I'm not sure to feel about it at all? To be fair: I dont think the two would ever reach an amiable relationship such as Vice/Ikki or Sakura/Lovekov. but at the end of the day, its a bit warped and cracked, but Kagerou's still a reflection of Daiji, yknow? For me, I've always felt as if the two's dynamic was bulit on suppression. His bitterness, his jealousy, his anger....they're all things that Daiji wants to suppress and hide, right? The show's gone out of its way to show how doing so cannot only cause harm to you(daiji being the only sibling to be physically affected by gifu's pusluations) but also others (Kagerou's birth and the initial evilive arc) So how do we resolve such things? On paper, it seems fine enough. Kagerou takes Daiji to the warehouse for one final showdown. Obviously, him attempting to kill Daiji wouldn't make sense, we already know killing a human will destroy its demon), so there's an ulterior motive here. Kagerou is trying to make Daiji stronger, by embrace the aspects that make up Kagerou that he'd normally shy away from. Upon defeating Kagerou, it seems like by embracing the emotions he'd normally supress, he's become free, and those emotions give way to our new powerup, Holy Live. So why seeing it executed makes me feel so......unimpressed? That it's lacking in some regard? I was honestly way more tuned into the Aguliera/Sakura fight(which is perfect btw !) when watching both the raws and subbed version. Maybe it's because I feel the Kagerou/Daiji dynamic feels a bit too shallow for the fight to have any kind of emotional impact? Or that Kagerou dying(?)/getting assimilated back into Daiji permanently(?) seems a bit unfair, as our other siblings have accepted the (sometimes negative) emotions that make up their demons, and can still have them around. Overall, okish episode? In between advertising that TTFC special, and the Evilive fight missing its mark for me, there's not a lot I was actively engaged in. |
I was expecting a teamup and finally resolve. Who knows, maybe Kagerou can come back as a final episode form as Kamen Rider HOLY EVIL. All in all a 6.
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The secondary rider is what I feel is Revice's weakness. After Daiji got his Rider form, he hasn't really done anything substantial, instead it went to Sakura. The same goes for Kagero, if this is really the end for him, then it's disappointing. Now that he has his standard secondary rider upgrade form, I fear this is it for his development.
EDIT: Anyway, was there a Rider Showa monster with a Anomalocaris in it. |
I feel like this episode was written as if there was a substory featuring Kagerou that got cut.
We've gotten moments of Daiji and Kagerou, with him even popping up every now and then when Daiji gets bonked on the head hard enough, but this episode is acting like we've had a prolonged arc involving him. Daiji stating he was thinking he and Kagerou could live like Ikki and Vice when Kagerou's only heroic act was saving Sakura once. The montage of moments involving him as he died. Kagerou having any sense of interest in Daiji growing stronger. The waffling on whether Kagerou was getting weaker or stronger? Like, I honestly feel there was another Kagerou story arc that we just...Didn't get. The elaboration on who Buu really is was nice, as well as the fact that apparently Ikki's mother is fully aware of Genta's past and what happened. Otherwise, I wasn't feeling it this episode. |
Yeaaaaah, I like the concept of this one but it didn't really work in execution. Fundamentally the problem isn't with what the episode itself did, but with how incredibly underdeveloped Daiji and Kagerou are. It is hard to have any emotional investment in what is otherwise a very well done fight when the previous episodes could barely be bothered to do anything besides a few minor scenes with each of them. I don't want to sound too harsh, but Daiji and Kagerou really remind me of Makoto from Ghost in how mishandled a secondary Rider they are.
On the other hand, Holy Live is very cool looking and the fights were great. I feel like I sound like a broken record, but Sakura and Aquilera's untransformed brawl and discussion was absolutely the highlight of the episode for me, and it worked because both of them have had lots of screen time to let the viewers get to know them and their dynamic! I'm telling you all, Sakura is the real secondary Rider in my book, she really steals the show! |
The secondary Rider getting upgrade and an episode centered around the heroes getting stronger while the villains getting weaker....
I too felt like the Daiji/Kagerou plot here wasn't as well executed as the Genta/Vail twist previously, because of the previous events preceding it. For Vail part, the buildup is consistent and smooth, with Hiromi becoming a Rider despite him failing to henshin as Revice before, then Hiromi's physique deteriorating, then the Demons Driver revealing that he's devouring his life force, then the Demons Driver showed to have more independence as he lent Olteca more of his power, prefering a sociopathic bastard using Demons, then the Demons Driver revealed as Vail and even Olteca wasn't his first choice at that time and he only wants Genta, revealed to be his former partner who had yandere-ish obsession to him to reunite. For Daiji/Kagerou here? The events in this episode seem to contradict the previous episodes, as the minor scenes that featured Wataru Hyuga had Kagerou's influence growing stronger and stronger and Daiji worrying about it. But the fight here had it being 180 that it's Daiji blatantly stronger, Live having constant upper hand, not even using finisher attack to dispatch Evil (also cracking his helmet before), with the problem that he's shaking instead. The turnabout here is quite sudden, like this should be extended first before the eventual Livevil showdown like how Daiji prefers for peace between them (even giving more Kagerou other than just gag scenes), or had different setting altogether before.... like Kagerou whining about Daiji's power before (though this'd upset Kagerou's fans). Otherwise, Kagerou's demise here reminds me of the previous dark clone, like Ghost's Makoto Copy, which died 'making peace' with the original version (but only at that time they 'get along'). I don't know if Kagerou knows that killing the human host would kill the demon too or not as he claims to fight Daiji for his freedom, but if he knows then yeah it's a cruel to be kind approach to make Daiji stronger then. Still shows that cruel to be kind approach only prolongs the problem; all of the previous Daiji and Kagerou feud in instance, though of course other than to Sakura or eventually Daiji, Kagerou is still overall cruel and tried to corrupt Daiji in the name of making him stronger, as someone who prides being evil and looking down on virtue. Regarding how Daiji and Kagerou can be separated like that, it's further shown that Akaishi for some reason wants to groom up Daiji by letting George give what Kagerou needs, though he shows more vileness of not caring if its Daiji or Kagerou who survives, he treats his men as tools, like how he views Hiromi before. While George here showed clear concern to Daiji, trying to stop both Kagerou and Akaishi on getting the Crow ViStamp and the 2nd Two SiDriver ('two side'). It seems that both Akaishi and George value Daiji more than Hiromi here, though in twisted way for Akaishi, I wonder if the reason of Daiji being somewhat 'precious' here would be shown later, so far he's been criticized for lacking presence in the series, and Daiji's conflict with Fenix hasn't been touched yet. And Akemi appeared again here, but she's here acted as sorta of damsel-in-distress for Kagerou. So she's not a combatant. So what Buu-san told Ikki was that Genta also had even different identity back then, Junpei Shiranami. And more origin for something in the series, that the Deadmans originated from a military research organization called Noah that tried to weaponized demons, where Buu-san and Junpei met, and Junpei worked as Noah's executioner against failed demon experiments. So Genta was the one in control and he truly fought as a Rider back then, not Vail (or that it's both of them), and (I don't know yet about the spin-off) he didn't act as a super soldier or such. Junpei/Genta didn't seem to do morally questionable thing there by fighting off rogue demons but he still felt hollow (he was still pretty much a killing machine but against deserving target) until he met Yukimi and decided to escape, helped by Masumi to atone. Guess while Masumi is still an extremist, he had limits and he did have remorse for Junpei/Genta. Of course as Sakura noted, it wasn't enough to compensate for Masumi's deeds. But what happened had happened and, Masumi's still gotta be given a chance to atone even if it's not enough (like Rolling ViStamp) especially with his scientific abilities, just like George at ep. 23 before. After Junpei/Genta left Deadman was formed by the group stealing Giff coffin to create said cult. Well, Noah seemed already evil anyway before, being a warmonger. Buu-san does tell about Genta here, but, what did Buu-san do that time? Said Vail chose to go back to Olteca's Demons Driver again due to him wanting to have fun by helping Olteca for now. Vail still values sociopathic bastards like Olteca much better than Hiromi even if Genta is his first choice. Or that Olteca wants to fight off Igarashi family thus it served Vail's desire too. But like Sh Ranger said before, Olteca can't find a way to get him out of the trouble before despite being self-proclaimed genius other than Vail choosing to come back... Olteca had clear shortcoming here (and the next episode preview is about his schemes again). Missed chance for Aguilera before tbh, who's still a Giftex, to put Olteca down for good. Olteca's role here is smaller but in-line, he'd cause trouble for the heck of it and to test Demons' power as Vail complies. Here, the main focus is instead the weaker Evilive, and the side troublemaker is the much stronger Demons (as well as Ikki fighting as Jack Revice); again no wonder Hiromi's debut as Demons almost upstaged Evil despite Vail not liking Hiromi, Demons was the real top dog. Other than that, this shows further that Ikki's growing out of his busybodiness to not interfere despite that Vice insisted him to help Daiji. So that'd mean, while Ikki and Vice are buddies now, Ikki shouldn't comply to Vice's rather corrupting ad-vice to stay the way he is; Ikki's busybodiness can cause trouble instead of helping, and Ikki's growing out of it here. Now unfortunately for Aguilera (well she's despairing already), Sakura now surpassed her even when they're fighting in human form, shown that while both are still standing, Aguilera's the one that was bleeding from the mouth. I guess this episode had Sakura overall losing her patience that she wasn't angered (for understandable reasons) only at Masumi but also at Aguilera here who she had symphatized. Though obviously she won't know anything about Aguilera and that she doesn't know her weakness, she claims Aguilera had her reasons of fighting in front of her eyes already that she pretended to be blind of. This probably shows Sakura knows Aguilera more than she thinks... I'd look forward into this on more Aguilera depth that isn't figured out yet, or probably to make it more convincing about her redemption or such. About Sakura herself claiming Aguilera made her stronger.... technically it did came from Aguilera owning her and mocking her weakness that finally had Sakura accepting that she's not the strongest which made her able to henshin into Jeanne, which had Aguilera being proud later. She wanted to use Sakura as a sacrifice though and likely she wanted strong sacrifices, but of course... making one of the heroes stronger as a method can backfire like this that they're out of the villain's grasp now. |
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Daiji's never been super great for me and he's going to be even less so now that Kagerou is gone (for now). I'm going to be looking at Holy Live with annoyance until Evil gets something too, and I mean in the show proper and not some v-cin or extra thing. I'm aware that could never happen and I'll just be annoyed with Holy Live forever, but that's just how it is!
Though personally, what I think bothers me more is seeing people (not just on this forum but elsewhere) harp on him because of his status as 'secondary rider'. Not only is that, and always has been, totally arbitrary, but like... is the implication that it'd be better if Sakura was the one completely lacking in screen time and development instead? (The answer is 'probably' because it'd have been expected, I guess...) |
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I don't think people mean ill will towards Sakura or any other Rider in Revice when talk about Daiji's lack of......everything(??), they just want better things for Daiji. I think it's fine to talk about how Daiji feels underutilized or straight up ignored in the story, regardless of his status as a secondary Rider. |
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I think it ticks me off the most in shows like a lot of Riders (so like, all of them as of late) because I feel like every year there's always numerous discussion along the lines of 'why hasn't the guy who i've arbitrarily decide is the second most important guy done anything for five minutes and why is the guy who i didn't assign that role on screen instead or talking to the main character?'. Didn't mean to suddenly rant at you, sorry! it's just been something bubbling in me for a while now... |
Honestly, I like Daiji but I prefer Sakura?s storyline and I wouldn?t mind to have more Sakura x)
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I'm honestly so confused by Kagero's motives here that the drama kind of falls flat for me. Is he attempting suicide by Kamen Rider or something? A final desperate ploy to defeat Daiji and take control of his body before he disappears? A bit of a shame as Kagero was an interesting character that didn't get too much screen time.
Honestly, the real drama I got out of this was that Kagero disappeared without a chance to eat Sakura's curry again. The part where Evil bleeds paint was a nice touch though. |
Ok. I suppose I need to get back to this series given the backstory of Dad.
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I'm back! Now if only I could find Zenkaiger's finale...
Vail seriously reminds me of Yongo, from the military style suit (mainly the pants) to the coloration, and the helmet looks like a gas mask, it's really cool! I also see from the flashbacks (or maybe I'm going crazy) that this isn't even his final form? Even better, if so! Once again, this show proves me wrong on everything. Sure, I was on the right track with the dad, but just about everything else is not what I expect, and that's great, for the most part. I'm still wondering exactly what was with Ikki disappearing from the photos (maybe he's not in those photos because he wasn't actually there for them? I don't know, I don't want to keep speculating when I've been proven wrong at every juncture, so I'm just going to sit back and enjoy), but I like how Papa-San is like an alternate version of Ichigo, and Buu-San (what do you know, I was half-right on him as well!) being a secret support was great. However, I do feel like the Live Vs. Evil fight could have been maybe better? I mean, it was good, had some great cinematography, lighting, and action, but it is a shame Kagerou is likely gone for good, as he made for one of the most interesting arcs of the Reiwa seasons so far. That's not to say I don't like Daiji, I love him, but I also liked the Two-Face dynamic he had with Kagerou. Holy Live is a massive improvement from regular Live (Jin, is that you?), but I can't unhear "Wings ready to fry!" another instance where the standby is not something I want to hear on loop. On an unrelated note, I just can't stop loving Demons' Genomix gimmick, and can't help but imagine a videogame (probably based off Revice and its Riders) where you could just mix and match the Genomes to plow through enemies. Olteca may be a despicably twisted villain (which I love), but I honestly like his dad less. And now it's official Aguilera wants to be the Igarashi siblings' new mom, and I hate that I had to be the one to make this joke... Anyway, Next Episode: More wings to fry! |
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It's strange though, to see George show concern for Daiji. I guess even George has moral standards above Akaishi. I don't think this means that George didn't care about Hiromi though, I feel like he was always intending for Hiromi to give up the Demons Driver before it killed him, so he could have a chance to recover. The Crow Vistamp caused a life-or-death scenario, which was more immediately dangerous, so George's response was proportionate to that. Quote:
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If Gif is the Igarashi siblings' grandfather, then that means Aguilera wants to be their grandmother. Probably better not to think about it too much. |
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Honestly, I kinda read it as intentionally ambiguous? I THINK Kagerou did genuinely want to defeat Daiji, but was well aware that he was growing weaker as Daiji was growing stronger. I guess he figured that if he was destined to lose to Daiji anyway, he could go down swinging and his death would serve to benefit his other half. The very definition of a love-hate relationship. Quote:
I think the Secondary Rider thing is more aesthetic than anything. They usually share a belt, usually have similar design elements, and their motif/theme is almost always the opposite of whatever the main Rider is (such as the beetle bros in Kabuto and Blade, Fire/Water in Saber or the Red/Blue duo that exists in 90% of Rider seasons). There's exceptions, though. |
I thought for YEARS Chalice was Blade's secondary rider (TBF if Hajime didn't debut until around around episode 25 (in general not just as a rider) I'd not buy it)
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