Kamen Rider Revice Episode 46- "Courage To Face Each Other!" Discussion
 

Vice struggles against Giff, George delves into new research and Sakura seeks to bring out Lovekov's true power.

I mean the Sakura and Lovekov stuff was neat, but I'm 100% ready for this show to end, I don’t enjoy watching it anymore.

I laughed really hard at Hiromi's dramatic archer moment.

Love how George is like "Here's a bow, become Hawkeye" all suddenly. Then next thing we know, Hiromi's out here being like Hawkeye.

For an episode with such an important event, I was so disinterested it's comical.
I am so done with this show the only thing keeping me going is the simple fact that you can count the remaining episodes on one hand :lol

It's Episode 46!

-Uh. This episode is kinda........? Well, let's get into it.

-Look man, I adore Sakura, would probably go to bat for her in nearly any dicussion/debate her character, but like. This little miniarc for Invincible Jeanne, it's...Weird? Like on paper it's an excellent idea (Although Sakura and Lovekov are the pair that always got along, it seems Sakura is not exactly treating Love as an equal like the brothers do for their demons.) But exceuted, it very much gives the vibes of "oh yeah we sorta added this form/plotline as an afterthought, enjoy ig!" (Which technically was, as IJ was also unplanned lol) I mean, it's cool that we got a female rider's final form not only in a show and not tucked away in a v-cin, but wins her fights and gets an insert on top of that? But like....I wish it got the proper honor (and most importantly, time!!!!) a final form arc deserves? (And personally, I could make my own argument about when Lovekov wanting to protect Sakura came into frutition past these 2 eps (or even made the argument that it's been a sentiment since the beginning), but at that point......I feel like I'm giving the writers a bit too much credit and making connections where theyre aren't any?)

-Oh. Tamaki Over Demons happened. As much as cries of "Finally!" or "Deserved!" will outcrop from this, and I might've joined in too, but like....why do I feel a bit empty about this? Is it because I already knew he'd be transforming in Battle Familia? The window period of "yeah seems like a good time for him to henshin." being long past imo? The fact that I thought they were leading up to him joining Hiromi in providing alternative, non-Rider support? (I mean, if apparently a single arrow can down a Gifterian, then is there any real point in becoming a Rider other than the added armor buff when engaging in close combat?) Hikaru unceremoniously exiting the plot after wrappping up his singular plotline also feels a bit strange. ( I know his actor hasn't recieved his flowers but he's not anywhere in the final episode's scans, I think he's quitely fading into the BG after this )


-Oh right, Gifu died this episode. Honestly, is there anything else to say about that?

-But do you know who we can talk about? George. I..........honestly don't know what's going on there. The producers' notes urged folks to go watch Battle Familia before the 47th episode, so I guess that's tough luck for all of us? I assume he's gonna get possessed by that Chic guy. What.....what is even the point of this, really? Like a mad scientist going overboard with his desire, and his demon as a result comes out and threatens the world...Cool idea for a final boss i guess, but I'd think it'd land better if they didn't keep shuffling George's character around every dozen and a half episode? (And not sticking to Gifu for so long...)


Overall I........ Look, I get it's cute reference and all, but does this show really need 50 episodes? I'm kinda just...Tired of this show, and how it handles its story, and ready for Geats to take its shot. I'll still watch the last 4 episodes of course, but I'm probably not going to say anything in dicussions other than a few lines.

It genuinely feels like not even the show is interested in Giff because his death felt like an afterthought (also it kinda NGL Feels like George being the final villain feels incredibly phoned in like IDK WHAT felt more phoned in this or Storious becoming the final villain, just please don't give George a motivation that was a joke on South Park (NO South Park did NOT reference Rider as far as I know but there was an episode where Butters/Professor Chaos wants to destroy the world because he found out all his evil plans were things the Simpsons did first), I'd say Revice is an ok show overall it ironically enough has the OPPOSITE problem of Saber where it starts off really good only to turn into a mess

this is where I'm at RN like it REALLY Feels like the show should be winding down at this point not revealing the obviously evil mad scientist was the bad guy all along

Nah, Storious had consistently been shown to scheme and collect pieces for his master plan, he just never pushed himself into the foreground. Storious as the final bad guy made a lot of sense, George feels like a 180 once more after they already pulled that with his character.

Turns out that Giff is someone that got beaten before the series ended too. With George's demon Chic as the actual final threat in, another past Kamen Rider reference of Kamen Rider (K)Juuga, saving that for the next.

Though Sakura's someone who despised Ikki's treatment of her previously and to a lesser extent, her other family members for preventing her going to the battlefield, turns out that she herself can invoke similar treatment, to Lovekov. This can be a reminder to be careful about evaluating others, before evaluating yourself (many'd be guilty of this, like me too), and probably in subtle way, is shown in the part where Ikki tells Sakura to leave the fighting into her 2 older brothers as she resolves her problem with Lovekov, and Sakura noting that it's been a while since she felt Ikki's busybodiness, which she's pulling on Lovekov herself. And other than that, to be hellbent on protecting Lovekov, other than preventing to make use of her abilities as weapons, Jeanne ended up becoming a liability herself just like Lovekov, with Aguilera noting that others have to focus on protecting Jeanne as well like what Jeanne does to Lovekov.

Extreme obsession can lead for them becoming what they don't want to be after all (protecting the "weak", becoming as much as the protected), and now Aguilera's the one to help Sakura again, to remind her about how others want to protect their loved ones too, not only Sakura, leading for her to finally get to know Lovekov better than her representation of weakness who she babied. Like Ikki to others earlier on, even though it's something you cherish (as Sakura accepted her weakness to become Jeanne), not believing in them can be an unintentional insult to them, Lovekov being viewed as weak and ineffectual by Sakura, even if it's well-meaning (protecting the weak instead of degrading them). Due to that Lovekov wants to prove herself as well as protecting Sakura herself, which is something Sakura needs to acknowledge instead of "Lovekov lives". Sakura's overprotectiveness also led for her to make irrational assumptions that Lovekov was hurt, when it was her molting for growing up, now as her new upgraded form Invincible Jeanne (Muteki name AND a long hair weapon? Blatant reference not only in name)

Though it's a nice idea to have Sakura solve another problem with Lovekov, yeah, this feels shoehorned in (or commercial based to have last minute upgrade form based on that) tbh, to have this problem come out of nowhere just to fill stories in, after being neglected. Similar to Daiji's character screentime being lacking before, but suddenly was realized later. I guess even Sakura's not free from Revice handling too many things at once.

Speaking of Daiji, it's good that he shows here (as a difference to him without Kagerou), being jaded and pessimistic isn't necessarily being more intelligent, actually being intelligent (and some optimism added in) is the drive to try finding solutions against problems, instead of resigning to the cynical perception of reality. Even when Giff becomes more of a threat in their eyes after discovering more of its powers, he still thinks through the ways to deal with him, and he succeeded in that to figure out that that the dimension Giff is in isn't merely another dimension, but rather akin to his stomach, which can be dealt by destroying the statue to remove Giff's invulnerability. I gotta say too that it's this late, but here they highlighted Daiji's tactical self well, he's a standout compared to his siblings here like he's portrayed as.

So it requires patience to see Tamaki fighting as a Rider, as Hikaru was actually someone whose role was to just make use of Over Demons until he's out of commission, handing the belt to Tamaki for that. Still not a good role for a member of another established family though. Actually like expected, I wouldn't expect Tamaki becoming a Rider to have that much of an impact IMO, only being an extra muscle, but it seems that unlike Sakura with Lovekov before, the setup of Tamaki being another non-Rider supporter to Hiromi and them relating is dropped, like how in previous episode Aguilera stated the Weekend wanted Tamaki to stay alive. Her response here is unrelated to that.

For the final fight with Giff, it certainly lasts longer than Anomalocaris Deadman and Akaishi/Giffdemos, but it's not that overwhelming of a threat, which actually I liked that Ultimate Revi/Vice lived up to the claim of it using the same power as Giff, and proving Kagerou-less Daiji being wrong and irrational before. I'd also admit that the fight did have decent speeches relating into humans' flawed nature and the cast's development of making up with their inner demons, but Giff's potential seem to be just wasted, despite him being 'free' after Orteca's defeat at ep. 28, he still only acted for 4 episodes (ep. 43-46), and only about explaining his motivations at that. He's just a bit more than the likes of Arch Orphnoch or Sigma. Aguilera didn't get a proper chance to settle things with Giff after his betrayal, or how Giff felt about the Deadman cult isn't shown, etc. The idea of Giff being only an idea for multiple faction's motivation to fight is good on paper, but if he's intended to be a more active antagonist, then he's handled badly.

I didn't know yet about the movie, but I thought regarding George being possessed by Chic, it'd be a return of the mad scientist KR fanboy George at the beginning of the series. As ep. 43, poorly handled as it was, probably explained George's amoral behavior at the beginning of the series was him being influenced by Chic. But like before, it's a plot hole at this point of why Chic can re-possess or let go of George (likely since ep. 25 Chic stopped possessing George for some reason).

He was very philosophical about the human condition for someone who just wanted to breed his own devil farm.

Uh.... Nope, that's all I got. See ya, Gif.

Same here. Sometimes I get sentimental when a season's about to end, but Revice? Not so much.

I agree. Once Storious actually reveals his backstory and motivation, he's definitely appropriate as the final villain and a contrast to Touma. Like, yeah, I think a little more foreshadowing would've been nice, but even his lack of grief over his friends' deaths could be a sign, as he was already so deep in nihilistic despair that he saw their deaths as inevitable and not worth crying about.

I feel like Hikaru was just warming the bench for Tamaki to become the true Over Demons. After weakening Akaishi enough for Ultimate Revice to deal the coup de grace, he had nothing left to prove to Tasuke. While he's still a meh character, I hope people can give him a little respect now, since it's clear that he considers Tamaki's feelings and trusts him as a successor, when nobody else saw his potential. #NiceHikaru (I don't expect that to trend though)

#NiceTamaki as well! Being a Rider suits him. I'm glad that Aguilera actually acknowledged him here and even treated him as an equal in combat. I wish he didn't have to share his big debut with a new form for Jeanne that I don't care about, but he totally held his own as Over Demons and I'm proud of him.

Now that you mention it, yeah, it's totally weird that Aguilera doesn't have any parting words to Gif. I'm not exactly surprised though, considering the show's record of focusing on the Igarashis at others' expense.

It's just so strange to me that we had Episode 40 be about Ikki and Daiji's differing views on Giff and the show had this thing about portraying him as more of a event/force of nature that all the characters had different ideas and interpretations of what he is or wants. And suddenly we transition to Giff just showing up at the finale of Genta vs Vail and essentially going: "Welp, I'm here to destroy humanity and rebuild it suit my needs I guess..."

They got two things right and wrong with Giff.

The first is... no Kamen Rider Giff, as far as we're aware. Honestly pretty great considering how likely I felt that was. That's what they got right.

Second is what they got wrong... I know people were asking for Giff to talk but idk I kinda liked Giff not talking tbh. Just have him be this scary destructive monster that can't be reasoned with, no need to have him have monologues. And just have the siblings come together at their strongest at this impending disaster.

Given the production notes said they added the Daiji arc to better align his development with the shows theme of humans and their relationship with their demons, perhaps the decision to make George the last boss was based on them feeling that would be a more fitting final villain for the shows themes?

Actually, I also think Hikaru's a meh character (just Ushijima family being badly handled overall especially Kimiko), but the moment I respect the most from him IMO was him standing up against Tasuke in ep. 40. Usually orders like Tasuke's are not questioned (and anything discourages you to do so) and viewed as absolute/right, and it's excused as only leader's job to give orders and call the shots, no matter what kind of orders. But sometimes in reality that can be just the leaders/authority figures being control freaks who imposes their decisions on others instead, and others (or third parties) had an appeal to authority approach against them which blinds their judgment and think leaders can't be wrong and always knows best. Hikaru's against that.

I don't know what they can pull in only 4 episodes left (just like... how Giff does his own actions after it's implied he's doing it on ep. 28). It'd probably feel more fitting for George to become the final villain if they kept George's mad scientist-KR fanboy personality at the beginning of the series. Since ep. 25 George was never like that again, with his lowest moment only being his grudge against Masumi (which isn't something malicious), but even if George is a mad scientist due to Chic possessing him, there'd be almost no build up for that anymore.

I feel like people are getting too mad at the reasons behind George's actions and stuff when like the second demon in the body was mostly to set up Chic for Battle Familia and ignoring like what's happening to him.

Dude finds out his dad's alive, has a strained relationship but works/talks with him, finds out some pretty messed up stuff and then doesn't get to have any closure with him while feeding into his mindset of "I've just been my dads pawn". At this point, George is letting his grief overtake him which is likely what's allowing Chic to influence him just slightly.

Add in the stuff with Daiji and your demon being killed, and apply that to George who get separated from Chic before Chic supposedly dies in the movie... and George still likely screwed up from Masumi's death and uh...

Yeah I don't really see this coming completely out of nowhere. Is it a swerve, yeah? But like, that's just life, it's not a neat script, it's likely him acting erratically in response to a lot of factors and who knows he might have some kind of higher purpose since we've yet to get a motivation given all we have to go on is Birth of Chimera and what little Battle Familia stuff we know.

Also Hot Take: George in the early episodes was not as much a "mad scientist" as people like to believe I feel. He was an eccentric dude who was rude and quite frankly a douche to certain people while overlooking a few things and that was about it.

And I feel that characterization got absurdly distorted in the Hiromi Episodes (19, 20, 21) which are what I consider the most detached and isolated episodes of Revice in where a lot of things don't make much sense and are mostly just there for Hiromi to have some closure before he departs the show for a bit, with his story barely factoring into any of the plot reveals in the long run.

You're not alone, Enchilada. Remember those three episode was written by Mouri and not Kinoshita himself. It's just like what happened in ep 39 and 40. I felt Mouri, while he did had a good grasp for its characters, didn't really grasp the whole intention that Kinoshita had envisioned for the series. Mouri seemed to set up Daiji to deepen his bond with Akaishi and further deepen his descend to darkness. However, in the next episode, Kinoshita just wrote that off and gave Daiji some resistance when Akaishi showed him some affections.

I'm a bit sad to see everyone's opinions about just wanting series to end now. I honestly love this episode. Not as much as Daiji's resolution two weeks ago but this is still a solid episode from top to bottom. From Lovekov and Sakura's deepening their bond, Tamaki finally had time to shine as Over Demons with Aguilera, and Ikki and Vice in their top game this episode. Don't make me start about Daiji and Hiromi, who is still by now my favorite characters in Revice.

I still think the show wants George to be more on the antagonistic side in the first place. However, because of some meddling, they wrote George to be on our good side. If you watch closely, there's a huge difference George from ep 1 to 24 and George from ep 25 up until Masumi's death. There's clearly a huge intervention here that hugely revamped George's character. Do they honestly think we would believe all of George's suspicious in the early Revice was simply because of Akaishi's orders? It kinda hurts a bit when the show now wants George to be back as the bad guy after this ping pong between good and bad.

I felt Revice is a series that it had a good vision of what path it's going to take but some meddling here and there really botched down the series a bit. If you want to count, Revice had a bit of weak link starting from ep 32 up until maybe ep 38. After that, I enjoy Revice from ep 39 until now. That's like less of a fifth of the series. It's a bit saddening that we judged too much of Revice when it's maybe only 6/7 episodes a bit of slump.

I mean, maybe you feel that only 6/7 episodes are a bit of a slump, but others don't agree with you there. Many see everything in the show's second half as subpar; if you ask me, the show always just sucked.

It's really a matter of perspective.

Not a bad episode at all, giving us a satisfying (enough) defeat for Giff.

Invincible Jeanne, as commented elsewhere, is a great form, and seeing it in action, I realize the leggings just looked odd in the pictures we initially got, but even if not, this was a nice form, though not as strong a debut as base Jeanne, if I'm honest.

Hikaru (still one of the handful of Hikaru fans) passes the torch to Tamaki, which I liked very much, though I admit, I'd have liked Tamaki to have his own form, but this is good too. He can now finally fight alongside Aguilera, fleeting though it may be.

The theme of accepting your demons is a theme that, while a little sloppy at times, shines through where it matters most, against the Final Boss, and though it wasn't as great as some other Kamen Rider boss fights, the Rider Kick was still fun to watch.

At this point, George has decided to reject demons entirely (guess they're taking a page from Daiji's not-so finest hour), which I understand, but I'll wait to see how it turns out before giving a final word for our true final boss.

Next Episode: George lives his Rider Fantasy (again).

Same

This is pretty much how I view Revice what it got right it did a VERY Good job with what it got wrong oh dear god did it screw the pooch with