[DreadBringer]

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I mean, if you ever bring up a "contradiction" like this, where I praise one show for doing a plot I disliked on another show, my answer is always going to be the same: Execution Matters.

Long story short, Wataru feeling immense guilt over things his father did is more important story than Shiori feeling immense guilt over something her did. They have different weights to them.

Sure I know, the execution matters. I'm in general curious about the "contradiction" like this that frequently happens for various people, and I want to get to know, the elaborations of different takes of similar things at least at the surface. Particularly when I see, for a case example, people bashing a series or its aspect (especially when unfairly) but giving another one free pass (this one's usually bandwagon-based, and they'll stay irrational), like for example, criticizing a "mary sue" (read: overpowered) protagonist in one series but tolerates someone like that in other series. I'd say you recall the Blade part pretty well there, though there aren't actually much of Yoshito Hirose part.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER KIVA EPISODE 04 - “REVERIE: WILD BLUE”

I don’t know if the show really earned that ending, though? It’s the same problem I have with all of these I Forgive My Terrible Parent stories across the Kamen Rider franchise: the sense of scale.

What I wonder now is actually how's Wataru's childhood and his raise and growth to an adult, if he doesn't seem to know or meet his dad. I was thinking of Otoya being redeemed and in contrast to his playboy persona, stay faithful to 1 woman to marry and give birth to Wataru. And well, this is probably the opposite part of the talk before where the show downplays the horrible deeds of someone, especially after portraying it as big deal before. Though I don't know if the victims stop their rage because as they see Wataru trying to atone his dad's sins, they, likely overestimating it too much, see it as a hope for a turnover in Wataru restoring the situation (the problem is if he's able to do that or not).

Probably the show isn't going for this and this is a mistake based on the previous one, but yeah this is a case of protagonist-centered morality I talked before where where character or events being good or evil is based solely on their actions toward the main character or if they are the main characters; siding with your beloved ones being portrayed as good in story, in this case, Otoya is good solely because he (apparently) raises Wataru and is a good parent to him. This part of forgiving horrible deeds (or even not giving "appropriate" or excessive punishment) while treating it as a small matter also unfortunately has caused some hate towards any kind of sweet hero archetype, but I think this is a writing blunder not being morally white is bad.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Putting aside the main story, which has a genuinely sweet message that it absolutely did not deliver on (some beautiful images notwithstanding), the other interesting thing in this episode was the integration of Nago into the core dynamic, and I loved that.

Well, for Wataru at first mistaking Nago for his dad, and him taking up the "empathetic dad" role for this part, there's something about him and Otoya that would be similar. And especially, for both of them have been labeled as the Kusaka of this show, there's something likely not-so-coincidentally similar regarding that. I guess you still see Nago as paragon figure that is meant to be looked up to here... Nago has similar good image Kusaka and Yaguruma before did at first, reminder that he's hellbent on killing Kiva. Though at least for Nago being facade, I do agree that Nago's approach is of course more helpful to Wataru, and Wataru is, if Nago didn't actually have sinister side, right on Nago's side, as Nago's guidance would actually help Wataru develop, and I approve of Nago's idea of Wataru trying to atone for his dad's sins, while Megumi's behavior to Wataru like putting him down won't actually help, and people shouldn't blame all cases of the one getting this treatment as being "snowflakes" for being put on worse situations for scathing, insensitive comments, even if it's "for tough love".

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Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

So Otoya is definitely one of the most memorable and entertaining characters from the show for a lot of people, myself included, but I would also like to talk about my favorite 86 character, Yuri! Possibly my favorite heroine in KR. I was in a rush with the last post, talking about different perceptions of art and the connection between Wataru and Otoya, so I forgot to mention her.

I like that Yuri is consistently the most competent and least weird character and how she's good in combat even without a Rider System. As a waitress, she acts similar to Hiyori, with how she speaks rudely to Otoya, but she has no problem being polite and formal around most other customers. Even though it's good etiquette to show respect to all customers equally, I can't really blame her for making an exception with Otoya who totally deserves most of the bad stuff that happens to him. It's not like Master cares either, since his tolerance for Otoya is also limited. Yuri's respect is hard to earn, especially by people whose flaws are always in the foreground of their behavior.

Actually, I don't get where do you think that Hiyori is polite and formal to most other customers... the way she speaks rudely and grumpily is actually, afaik, is applied to most of the customers (and she had other issues like her clumsy traits, but she has excellent cooking skills to compensate). Though I would also say that, "speaking rudely" also depends on what reasons you have. If she speaks rudely to Otoya to legitimately call him out for what he did, then that's actually what should be done because not tolerating wrongdoings is the real respect and etiquette (for overall humanity to prevent others getting bad time). But if they're rude (Yuri isn't likely this as you said she's polite and formal to other customers) for the sake of being rude, then they're the wrong ones too, just that on occassions the victim is someone deserving. Also, though you said that she's good in combat, one of the complains about Kiva (I'm just saying complaint, because it's up to air if the complaint is legitimate or not) is her getting hit by the Distress Ball to become someone to be saved often, not living up to her reputations.