[DreadBringer]

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Originally Posted by Mesnick

But Ryuki also has ?bad guys existing to get beaten up?, and the most literal of all. Mirror monsters fit this description perfectly.

Not the villainous Riders like Ouja or Tiger. I mean by the protagonists. At least by Shinji, they're treated as humans he tries to understand of, rather than simply detonating them like Mirror Monsters (which resembles animals), Shinji never personally killed them.

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Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Not all villains would be redeemed in lighthearted shows though, like Isaac in Saber, or Kai in Den-O. Unconditional love for a TV show clashes with my value of critical thinking. Not even Faiz is above this, as I accept fair criticisms like DreamSword's about Kiba. I'll gladly praise what I enjoy and complain about anything I disagree with. I think that's fair. I get annoyed when some people use the "it's just a kids show" excuse to dismiss arguments. Nothing should be off-limits to criticism.

Then by this, I'd like to know what'd be the faults of shows like Ghost for people like you, because generally, Ghost is disliked/bashed for being lighthearted, and those who defend it typically brings up about light tone as its strength as well. I know that there are those who criticize Ghost for non-tone related problems like how it feels stretched out/stagnant, characters lacking presence after first half, or Makoto clone, but previously at least before this I thought Ghost being high up there means any fault of it doesn't matter for giving smiles out of warm and fuzzy feelings alone (like Saber and Gotchard). Wonder too about what I listed about criticism of Gotchard here that isn't related to its tone.

I get annoyed with that excuse too because it also implies as if, kids stuff are always inferior to mature/adult stuff, that the former means low quality (thus why being deep talking about it, it's just overthinking), and the latter is what can be taken more seriously. And yeah... there are a handful who defend Gotchard with "it's just a kids show" as well. While those who mock lighthearted stuff do so to give what they like better image, those who defend it with that excuse doesn't help the false notion I mentioned there.

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Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

However, the point is that it shouldn't be easy to keep the moral high ground, as Ishinomori wanted to show that the path of heroism is unclean. Ironically, despite Kobayashi deciding to stray from the Showa style, I think she shows even more of that idea, with Riders having their beliefs challenged and being pressured to change, or Ren wanting to change deep down, but feeling obliged to keep fighting and not having a right to doubt. As a story about humans, you can really see the flaws in humanity here, but the desire for friendship and righteousness is shown as well. Difficult, but certainly worth fighting for.

And, about flaws of humanity, that seems to be what makes darker shows considered bleak by those who like Showa/lighthearted Heisei/Reiwa, because they seem to want only the best of humanity represented, only all about their beauty highlighted, and never show any ugliness of humanity like those flaws. It'd be what's being hopeful, any other case is edgy. And for what I already said here, if there are no pitiful underdog figure like Shinji featured (e.g. not even perhaps a virtuous hero that isn't as much of a loser, for Ryuki, some still insist Tezuka only wants revenge), then the dark show would be labeled as dark fantasy, everyone is equally seen as depraved by fanbase, any characters getting blamed for any bad things for the narrative of "there are no real heroes here", even for something outside of their control like being unknowingly a part of bad organization (thus they're still "their accomplice" and "aren't blameless").

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Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Anyway, if people want to see Ryuki as a Sentai, they can watch the Hyper Battle where the main 4 are all best buds.

Yes, being actual best buds would be what people generally see as a display of power/magic of friendship. About them always sticking together like a glue at all times, and always has their friends in their mind 24/7, them being the main (even sole) driving motivation of their actions, or that thinking about them is automatic 'get out of jail'-card cop outs no matter how dire situation is (what power of friendship usually comes in people's mind for it being meme'd, giving random asspulls from flashbacks about them). Ryuki is generally the opposite (and perhaps other dark shows other than Build) so obviously it'd not be seen as one.