[algo448]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tokumonkey

That latter sentence is a good summary of my problem: I don't like how it's handled its plotlines or characters. Yuri and Megumi initially freeze up, unable to transform into Ixa for no! Apparent! Reason! The sexist implication isn't lost on me. Yuri goes from disdaining Pepe LePew to falling in love with him, and it feels in no way organic or earned. For the first half of the series, there's a complete disconnect between Wataru's behavior in and out of the Kiva suit. People keep working for the Wonderful Aozora Organization despite their total inability, prior to 2008, to kill any Fangires. Mio never tries to use her Fangire-killing power to, for example, kill any of the Fangires that essentially hold her hostage. Nago keeps failing to show new dimensions as a character. Frankenmonter and Lagoon Boy are barely sketches of characters, and they didn't have to be.

All of that gets worse after the 30s, you've seen the best part of Kiva, you are just missing more underused characters, forced drama, incredible derailment.
If you are not into it by now, you probably never will.

[Tokumonkey]

Belatedly: I really appreciate all these responses, positive and negative!

[Suzu]

Personally, I have watched it from beginning to end. Twice. Like every other Kamen Rider show, no matter how much I liked or disliked it. I think every show should be given a chance as a whole, even if the last episode might make the impression more positive or negative.
While I did stop watching other anime and drama, I never did for any Toku, basically because Tokus are so dear to me. Also, I think as a fan who discusses opinions with others, you should know what you're talking about and I think that works best if you've seen the whole thing.

Kiva doesn't really get better or anything, but it is at least worth getting the full picture for that show.

[Matrixbeast]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suzu

Kiva doesn't really get better or anything, but it is at least worth getting the full picture for that show.

That mentality made me finish Kuuga.
I've never regretted watching a show until that came into my life...

[Switchblade]

I'd argue that Kiva wasn't worth starting, but if you're hoping that it's going to get better and less melodramatic, then no. No, it's not.

[Tokumonkey]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

I'd argue that Kiva wasn't worth starting, but if you're hoping that it's going to get better and less melodramatic, then no. No, it's not.

I don't know if "mess melodramatic" is the goal. I mean, Kamen Rider Gaim was melodramatic as hell, and I loved it. I just want the characters to act more like people and less like plot devices.

Also, I want Tatsulot to be crushed underneath a 200-ton weight.

[GoseiWonder]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tokumonkey

I don't know if "mess melodramatic" is the goal. I mean, Kamen Rider Gaim was melodramatic as hell, and I loved it. I just want the characters to act more like people and less like plot devices.

Also, I want Tatsulot to be crushed underneath a 200-ton weight.

There's issues yes, and once the Kivathon starts I'll probably see what in-universe justifications I can find if any before calling them major flaws (see my reasoning on why Wataru being a wuss and Kiva being a badass is actually brilliant).

And Tatsulot is a mixed bag. You will either love him, loathe him, or be entirely indifferent to him.

I like him. If you don't, I understand.

[Guyver Spawn]

Maybe it's just me, but I did felt like Kiva was head of it's time. I would have like the show better if it had a stronger cast of characters and if the show didn't get so boring after episode 30.

[Kiryu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tokumonkey

That latter sentence is a good summary of my problem: I don't like how it's handled its plotlines or characters. Yuri and Megumi initially freeze up, unable to transform into Ixa for no! Apparent! Reason! The sexist implication isn't lost on me. Yuri goes from disdaining Pepe LePew to falling in love with him, and it feels in no way organic or earned. For the first half of the series, there's a complete disconnect between Wataru's behavior in and out of the Kiva suit. People keep working for the Wonderful Aozora Organization despite their total inability, prior to 2008, to kill any Fangires. Mio never tries to use her Fangire-killing power to, for example, kill any of the Fangires that essentially hold her hostage. Nago keeps failing to show new dimensions as a character. Frankenmonter and Lagoon Boy are barely sketches of characters, and they didn't have to be.

Nago takes a complete 180 from the badass to the sidekick and it just comes from out of fricken nowhere....yeah needless to say, I liked him better as a button crazed douchebag.

Kiva isn't a bad show by any stretch, there's certainly things to like about it but as others have already stated it's an incredibly flawed show, its a lot like watching a train wreck.

[GoseiWonder]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiryu

Nago takes a complete 180 from the badass to the sidekick and it just comes from out of fricken nowhere....yeah needless to say, I liked him better as a button crazed douchebag.

Kiva isn't a bad show by any stretch, there's certainly things to like about it but as others have already stated it's an incredibly flawed show, its a lot like watching a train wreck.

I'd compare it more to Apollo 13. The mission starts out pretty good everything going the way it should, but then some unforeseeable error happens (in this case the base Kiva suit being a detriment to the suit actor's health) or an oversight occurs (like introducing and ignoring the Buroon Booster, ShuDoran, Ramon and Rikki's character and weapon modes, Fake Fuestles) and the crew work to try and get everything running correctly again, but some things are too late to remedy and you have a trip that was very bumpy but everyone survives and there is still a grand success to be had.

It takes some headcannoning and a level of "Yeah... But who cares? It's still a kids show made to market toys, take it seriously but not THAT seriously" to get past it. Note my constant bringing up of Wataru probably having severe self-loathing issues and an identity crisis as part of his character or me honestly not caring about stuff like there being a time portal that the old King could have used to kill as infants all those who want stop him.