[Kamen Rider Die]

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Originally Posted by Switchblade

There's one other big change with this episode. This is the first appearance of a Horoscope as the Monster of the Fortnight. Cancer wasn't around as long as I'd remembered, but it was still several weeks. From this point on, the Horoscopes are going to basically replace regular Zodiarts because Fourze had an episode limit (as it turned out; I may reminisce about the rumors of Fourze season 2 at some point during this retrospective). I was always disappointed to see what had been major event enemies get turned into regular weekly monsters. This is the big place where Fourze had pacing issues for me.

I'm sort of okay with this? Beyond just the basic power creep of Zodiarts being the new Dustards once you've got Cosmic States and Meteor Storm, there's also... like, I'm not sure how many more original takes there were on high school drug addiction metaphors? 29/30 were as close to an archetypal Fourze as you can get, and it just did not feel like there were a ton of moves on it for me. At least with the Horoscopes, there's more intention behind it, and a sense that Club is being proactive in eliminating the scourge at its source, rather than reactively waiting for someone to get high on cosmic collectibles.

[Androzani84]

I don’t really have issues with Cosmic States or the Barizun Sword, there are worse looking visual upgrades and weaker conceptually weapons.

Conversely, I’m not keen on how after all the build up regarding Meteor and Aries, the latter gets taken out by Fourze, leaving Cancer as the latter’s most personal foe. It’s like if W had Phillip and Shoutaro finish off Isaka, while Terui took out some comparative nobody.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

Conversely, I?m not keen on how after all the build up regarding Meteor and Aries, the latter gets taken out by Fourze, leaving Cancer as the latter?s most personal foe. It?s like if W had Phillip and Shoutaro finish off Isaka, while Terui took out some comparative nobody.

I don't know? While Meteor's been hunting Aries for his whole run, it's not like Aries did anything to Jirou; he's a means to an end. Standing up to Aries as Ryuusei -- where he has no powers -- in order to rescue the KRC is arguably more important than defeating him, since it's all about Ryuusei the KRC member, rather than Meteor the Kamen Rider.

(Also, it'd mean Tachibana turning back on the Meteor System, and that would feel pretty fast! Not much of a punishment!)

[Sh Ranger]

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

All I'm hearing is that I should not get my hopes up for a Kamen Rider Meteor 15th Anniversary film.

Sad but true. Could've had an Interpol x CODE crossover or something. Of course, I'm glad Yoshizawa has such a successful acting career, he totally deserves it (Fukushi Souta as well), but man, it hurts when you don't get to see your favorite characters return.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunred

But since we're talking post-rider careers, there's also another movie starring Yoshizawa which was fun that I stumbled upon a while back.

He plays a man who aspires to be a Shogi master, but a twist of fate has him give up and end up coding an AI Shogi program and take on his rival once more. Oh yeah, Fumika Baba, aka Medic, and Kanna Mori aka Natsumi Hikari, are in this as well. Baba plays the role of the sister to the AI club guy who helps Yoshizawa's character, while Mori plays the role of the rival's wife.

Sold!

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

I agree with this part, though Ran may feel like a reharsh of Utsugi before, of which she seems to have the first two part (albeit her kick didn't really hit people). Thus it seems to be the insensitive to the friend's feeling part that is the big factor of her unlikability.

Even for the first two parts, Utsugi is better. She complains about her problem loudly and openly and like you said, her kicks are for intimidation only, never causing harm.

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Maybe Gentaro can still fit said sacrifice mentality, as it can seem that he's sacrificing his life by only dedicating himself to others by becoming their friends and acting as true friend to them, preventing any personal gain. What's seen as real friend by people would involve sacrifice (not being fair-weather friend), like suffering or dying together with them, bearing all their predicaments and becoming their punching bag. He also became a teacher at the end, a profession that has hero label (like doctor or firefighter), only about dealing with other people.

Except Gentarou sees friendship as personal gain as much as gain for those he befriends, it makes him happy, so what others may see as his sacrifices are more like investments to him. Even when he gets murdered, he comes back to life and befriends the guy who murdered him.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I see Ohsugi as being a faculty advisor to an afterschool club: he doesn't fit into the hierarchy, because that's only for students, and he exists more as an additional resource for the club, but one that's entirely optional. Like, he's just there to monitor them and make sure they're safe

If only Ohsugi had come with them to Subaruboshi, so he could keep everybody safe from Ryusei, including Ryusei himself.

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Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich

How would you describe him flipping out and punching Gentarou despite trying to keep up a tactical false persona then? Unless I'm forgetting something about the full context of that scene, I feel like part of the point of it is to demonstrate that in spite of his best efforts to be cold and calculated, Ryuusei has very passionate emotions that can still get the better of him and make him act in ways that won't end up helping his mission.

Heck, there's even sort of a poetic symmetry going on there, for the back half of his introductory two-parter to have him hitting Gentarou like that, and then having the first half of the two-parter promising a resolution to that storyline end with him hitting Fourze, but scaled up to more climactic consequences.

Exactly. This is Ryusei's most prominent flaw brought to its most tragic conclusion. Even though the best case scenario is right in front of Ryusei, it requires him to put his faith in Tachibana and KRC for something that has no guarantee, when he already knows for sure that Aries can wake up Jirou right now. Aries, to his one and only credit, followed the script, while Ryusei brought sufferring to himself and his friends the moment he strayed from it.

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

The attack that killed Fourze is the one-inch punch, not classified as a finisher by Rider system, but wonder if it's stronger than the Limit Break before as it gives explosive power by concentrating all the force from the body in short burst of movement.

Strong enough for a Rage Art anyway.

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Though Zodiart is about actually corrupting the user, Yamada's the most evil of all Zodiarts, the one that is more vile than Makise.

Fortunately, Yamada is a transfer student at Subaruboshi, so Gentarou has no self-determined obligation to befriend him. Which means that Gentarou can sleep on this one, haha.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER FOURZE EPISODE 32 - ?THE SUPER SPACE SWORD?

Along those lines, I was happy enough with the Ryuusei plotline, even if it wasn?t my favorite part of the episode. I like the tragedy of it, that Ryuusei got exactly what he wanted ? Jirou?s revived by Yamada, who I guess also likes tragedies enough to let this thing play out, knowing how devastated Ryuusei will inevitably be ? but at the cost of his friendship with Jirou. It?s Ryuusei finally realizing that becoming a friendless loner in the name of friendship is kind of an incredibly screwed-up thing to do, and it?s a plan that?s doomed to failure. Seeing Ryuusei immediately contend with his accidental selfishness and villainy, dressed up as dedication and self-sacrifice, is pretty great.

It's a fitting conclusion to Ryusei's arc for sure. He has lied consciously to many people, but the biggest lie he told himself that he didn't care about his new friends, since he believed that truth was inconvenient to his mission. I love the part where Ryusei comes back to save the KRC and tells them he's not doing it for them or even Gentarou, but to do right by himself instead of letting the mission dictate how he should live. I think that line really shows what Kamen Rider Meteor is all about, as someone who wants to protect what's important to him.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I hate Cosmic States as a costume. The face looks like a cheap Fourze popsicle, and the chest looks like a Ben Cooper costume. The numbers on the chest are dopey, since they?re just two-dimensional stickers, instead of the gloriously tactile and operable Switches. The angelic choir of the sword is a step down auditorily from the addictively robotic Fourze Driver. The sword is overly complicated, with a deployed-position that looks like a space banana. I hate this thing so much.

While I'm not going to say that Cosmic States is one of my favorites or anything, I like it for what it is. I'll defend it the same way I defend Decade Complete (OG, not 21). Not as good as the base form, but good enough on its own merits. Also, I love that space banana, the Barizun Sword! These days, we're lucky to even get a Final Form weapon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

Conversely, I?m not keen on how after all the build up regarding Meteor and Aries, the latter gets taken out by Fourze, leaving Cancer as the latter?s most personal foe. It?s like if W had Phillip and Shoutaro finish off Isaka, while Terui took out some comparative nobody.

That analogy doesn't work, since Isaka was the cause of Terui's problem whereas Aries is the answer to Ryusei's problem. Sure, Yamada was oppressing Ryusei's old school buddies, so there's motive for beef (uh, mutton?), but Ryusei seeing the error of his ways and trusting Gentarou to take care of Aries instead of doing it himself seems to me like character development. Their friendship was the last ingredient for Cosmic States.

[Kamen Rider Die]

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Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

If only Ohsugi had come with them to Subaruboshi, so he could keep everybody safe from Ryusei, including Ryusei himself.

I love the use of Ohsugi in this story: begging the Principal to be allowed to send three students to Subaruboshi, and doing it so pathetically that the Horoscopes who definitely should be wary about exposing Yamada's plans to random students when the Chairman is already barely stifling police investigations are like Jesus Fine Yes They Can Go.

[Fish Sandwich]

Die's distaste for the design of Cosmic States is practically one of the running gags of these threads, so now that we're here to specifically talk about Fourze, I gotta say, I really love Cosmic States. In fact, judging by the way he seems to think the suit itself is under-designed, based on the comparisons to cheap Halloween costumes and frozen treats, I even get to frame this in Die's favorite way -- by actively agreeing with the basic concept and then drawing a completely different conclusion.

To me, a lot of the beauty of Cosmic States is that they didn't overthink the look. The simple approach works as a contrast against how complex Fourze's other form changes were, making it stand out in a different way from usual, but the details that are there still give it that impression of being the most powerful, without having to make his shoulderpads too huge or anything. I forget if anyone in this thread ever brought up the well known anecdote about how Fourze's eyes deliberately lack the common teardrop lines meant to symbolize the sorrow of being Kamen Rider, but what's a lot less well known is the part two to that story, which is how the yellow lines of Cosmic States deliberately invoke that imagery to suggest how Gentarou is now sort of carrying with him all the feelings of the many people he's gotten to know so far in his quest to make friends with everyone. That's a pretty good suit in my book!

More than anything though, I was honestly just really happy they made it such a pretty shade of blue? Like, that was a first for a final form, and I've mentioned before how Fourze was the first Rider I was able to actively follow from the trademark being filed. I had literally never had the experience of wondering what the ultimate powerup for a Rider was going to look like before (I think I knew about PuToTyra by the time I was caught up enough to care with OOO?), so it turning out to be a fresh main color that was way up my alley felt like another in the long list of reasons it just kinda seemed like this show was made for me.

As such, actually getting to these episodes was an even greater joy than usual at the time. You've got Sakamoto directing, you've got that great cliffhanger with the hero dying, you've got a plot that makes room to focus on the secondary Rider just as much as the main hero (because it's a show about friendship!), heck, you've even got a new insert theme with May'n signing again. It's pretty much everything you could ask for out of this whole genre of Rider episode; a lot of things in these two are things I immediately think of when I think Fourze.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich

Die's distaste for the design of Cosmic States is practically one of the running gags of these threads, so now that we're here to specifically talk about Fourze, I gotta say, I really love Cosmic States. In fact, judging by the way he seems to think the suit itself is under-designed, based on the comparisons to cheap Halloween costumes and frozen treats, I even get to frame this in Die's favorite way -- by actively agreeing with the basic concept and then drawing a completely different conclusion.

You are, as always, the Tendou to my Kagami.

[Sunred]

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Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Sold!

Fun fact, Yoshizawa had his Fourze reunion a while back before AWAKE when he did the live-action BLEACH movie with Fukushi and Mano, where Fukushi was Ichigo and Mano was Orihime.