[Kurona]

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

This is why we pay Kurona the big bucks*!

*: "Big bucks" are what I call the candies and gums that are included in SO-DO boxes.

Still waiting on that shipment...

[Kamen Rider Die]

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Originally Posted by Kurona

Still waiting on that shipment...

I'm doing a box a day, so you should have what you're owed... let's say September? 2021-ish?

[DreadBringer]

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I mostly meant that teenage girls generally have an inner strength that makes them formidable, to a degree that may be daunting for most superheroes. Sometimes it's used for good, sometimes for evil. I'm just noting their inherent qualities, not ascribing a value to them. I don't think being a Mean Girl is something to emulate! One cutting remark from a snotty teenager can and will stay with you for decades! Decades!

And exactly, the bolded stuff there is me. Obviously it's not something to emulate, plus, "teenage girl having inner strength" to me, seems to trace into gender's society status where females are treated as innocent and male as savage, of which females' bad behavior are excused, forgiven, or blame-shifted into males, giving them more leeway and allowing them to do as they want freely (it's... dirty social tricks they employ! As a form of... power). but bringing that up because, many people in the fandom (on relief, not those on Rider fandom so far), downplays or cuts off morally ambiguous or downright villainous character's bad traits. A common example is if they had bad backstory (which is what Umi has), everything bad they do is excused by "do you know what they're going through?", "they only had bad upbringing, they aren't evil just misunderstood", etc. as if it somehow gives excuse to behave as any way you like.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I think Umi gets that intellectually, but it's hard for her to accept emotionally. From a detached viewpoint, we know that sometimes tragedies happen. It's sad, but there was nothing anyone could've done to save her family. But, emotionally, it's impossible for her to accept. If her family couldn't be saved, then there's no such thing as heroes, otherwise her family would've been saved. Kenzaki does the smart thing here by not just telling her to grow up, or make her peace with a bad situation. Her tells that, okay, maybe there aren't heroes, so maybe you should be one. It allows her to feel her grief, to treat her sense of loss as valid, while asking her to do something productive with it. It's that early-Blade thematic stuff getting reexamined, and I love it.

Yeah like above, for her being hard to accept emotionally, from it being impossible, it comes from tragedies and it explains how she turned that way, but having a tragic past doesn't make wrong behaviors right. Kenzaki was being humble that his failures haunt him and made him beat himself up by saying there aren't heroes (though he continued with trying to be a hero), which well, as I said before with the heroes being not omnipotent or omnipresent, they can't save everyone, they can't be anywhere at once, but heroes are also more likely to feel guilty over that like Kenzaki did.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Right away, there’s something where I was like I Don’t Know How I’ll Fit This Into A Larger Discussion, which is almost entirely the reason for this format. Tachibana and Undad are watching footage of Kenzaki powering up into King Form… but the footage they’re watching is from, like, an episode of Kamen Rider Blade.

Lol, breaking fourth wall joke?? Who knows if it's just Yoshito and Tachibana actually being one of the audiences, watching Blade together and discussing what happens in the episode they watch! Or it could be Kotaro secretly achieves more than writing in the show, to directing, creating the same Kamen Rider Blade show in-universe for others to watch, and for Yoshito and Tachibana to gain clues! Besides, yeah, the previous footages of anything happened in the past in-universe like Tachibana "kidnapping" Karasuma was recorded from CCTV footage.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Also, hey, Undad is here to tell us that Kenzaki’s numbers are going up! FINALLY someone on this show has their head on straight. Sure, Kenzaki has a glorious new suit, and sure, he can now obliterate foes with awe-inspiring displays of force, and sure, Hajime has indicated that this is a fearsome new power Kenzaki wields, and sure, Undad has told us the same… but that was all horsehit and conjecture because WHAT ABOUT HIS NUMBERS, SHOW?! ARE THEY GOING UP?! I need hard data in my superhero program about handsome men who use magical trading cards to do battle with monsters from eternity!

This is something to make an Ultimate Form more compelling story-wise; they had to have drawbacks. A reason to not use it. Otherwise, there was no reason to not use it over their base form, which some Rider series can suffer. It gives the high stakes part to keep things interesting. And when the hero gets access to a powerful new ability that has no drawbacks, the normal form becomes obsolete. It also gives an actual logical reason for the producers to keep the earlier suits around as a way of pimping toy sales.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

That Blade/Joker fight is a blast, though. I love that Kenzaki lets loose his most powerful form just so that he can withstand Hajime’s animalistic rage. It’s all defense from Blade, with him just trying to tire Joker out enough to reach the man inside. It’s not the Power vs Power blowout that another show would do, since Kenzaki really doesn’t think Hajime’s gone for good. He wants to give him every chance to come back. That’s such a fun idea.

Oh, man, how great is that golden-hued flashback Kenzaki has when he’s deciding whether or not to seal Hajime? I like that it’s one mean thing (backhanding Kenzaki), one nice thing (letting Kenzaki care for him?), and then Kenzaki telling Tachibana he’ll put Hajime down if he goes rabid. It, uh, it definitely paints a picture of their “friendship”! The music is very sweet, though, and it sells the weight of Kenzaki’s indecision.

Jo has stated it herself though, King is someone on par with Joker, which is shown in the fight that Kenzaki has to use King Form to match him, really cementing Joker as the ultimate Undead, one that threatens the world, and being feared by other Undeads. Though he had no choice to finally use the finisher at the end. Blade King Form's finisher so far, has only been used on Trial Undeads, which completely destroyed them (and them being unable to be sealed). I do wonder what will happen if an Undead is just hit by finisher, but left out and not being sealed, would they eventually wake up like a human being KOed, or their body going limp? Dunno if Joker is probably different one as he's special within an Undead, transforming to other Undeads, and it seems that being defeated reverts him to Hajime form, but Kenzaki did hand out a card, which probably means Joker probably can be sealed that time, thus, with Joker waking up later... Undeads are truly immortal then, they truly cannot die and had to be sealed. Well, there's one-sided friendship, and Kenzaki with Hajime can be that.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I just… I find Undad impossibly dull. Every plan is just Here’s A New U.N.D.E.A.D. Every interaction with Tachibana is Tachibana trying to make a case for calm discussion and Undad being detached and horrible. It’s… there’s no way in to Undad, as a viewer. There’s no part of his character that I can relate to or understand. He’s all smooth surfaces, with no purchase. He’s just a void where an antagonist should be, and I don’t find him intriguing or mysterious like I’m probably supposed to. He’s bland, and he’s completely not working for me.

Hmph. "Undad". If only I could talk about this further with your nicknames that it is a spoiler. Kenzaki at this moment had Rider related problems, just like Tachibana up to ep. 15. Kenzaki's approach to him is obviously, gently processing his grief though that is constantly dismissed. While Yoshito's approach is sending monsters after Kenzaki to prevent him becoming a Rider. With both times Tachibana working for BOARD masterminds (Yoshito is part of BOARD still), Isaka at his arc and Yoshito at Kenzaki's arc. And well... Kenzaki at Tachibana's arc can feel relegated in story for you, and your comment regarding Yoshito is like this.... I guess, other solution can be better if Yoshito listens to Tachibana and, if Tachibana has a plan, work on that?

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

On the one hand, I really like that it’s Kenzaki who figures out that Hajime just needs more cards to get his shit together. I like when that sort of solution can generate from within the core cast, through discussion and problem-solving. It’s not a given! But, man, an email from Karasuma is maybe not great writing to kick off that discussion. He’s only really giving them info that exists in the story that they weren’t privy to (Kenzaki fusing with 13 Undead is not supposed to be possible, even for very sweet boys), but it’s still so dumb that I did an out-loud Oh Come On when Hirose mentioned it. Karasuma’s narratively-variable usefulness is not something that got better with a new writer!

I absolutely love how the show pushes the idea of destroying the rampaging monster, the one that could end the world, as moral weakness. Tachibana and Mutsuki are both quick to disregard any plan other than defeating the Joker, while Kenzaki would risk anything to help him. Kenzaki has the strength of his convictions, while Tachibana and Mutsuki resign themselves to cowardice and easy outs. It’s that core concept of the franchise, that empathy is a Kamen Rider’s greatest power, and I’m always a fan of it.

For Blade yeah, Joker situation at this time is not totally hopeless, so a plausible solution can be found (solution founding is also depending on the writing, other than email, it can't be a total turnover from nowhere that it ends up as an asspull even if internally generated). Mutsuki is corrupted, so Spider Undead would, concludingly, beat other Undead, especially if they're Joker. And finally? The "just kill the threat" approach that most audience find to be the most logical and reasonable approach, something they want heroes to turn brutal like that (turning them into anti-heroes) because of the "just kill the threat" way turning them into more "effective" hero, is portrayed as weakness here? Most audience would label Kenzaki's approach to risk helping someone perceived as a threat as a weakness unfortunately, which just make them hate and bash on traditional hero character types like Rider leads with their compassion (which they read as weakness), but it can be unfair as, actually, this choice of "kill or let the bad guys go" creates dramatic tension, which makes the story/show interesting thought-provoking to read or watch. Audiences are left thinking "if I am the hero, should I kill or risk letting the bad guys escape?" Good stories make you think and ponder over such questions. Also, in some stories, it often requires clever, tactical and/or skilled application of those powers to make a non-lethal stopping possible. It's indeed hard to argue against "sparing bad guys when bad guys has 0.001% chance of repentance, and after being spared they will cause even more destruction".

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I give Tachibana a lot shit (deservedly!), but I love seeing him back with Team Blade, even if it’s just a cameo.

Oof, some traces of Tachibana's self pre-episode 15 is resurfacing, him just dead set declaring about killing Joker and Kenzaki being foolish. Him being tactless to just drink Kotaro's milk. With Hirose on Kenzaki's side of not killing Joker, I wonder what Kotaro (who hates him, and also chastises Kenzaki for caring too much for him) thought to Hirose regarding that. And him trying to prove himself right in a very sad way... that by default isn't genuine, and can negate anything good about that action, as it's egocentric.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Not as into the new Chalice King Form, though. It’s got a lot of the same problems that Garren’s Jack Form has, where the red/gold/green palette is too much, visually. I like it better than Garren Jack Form, but not as much as Chalice’s base suit or any of Blade’s suits.

Yeah... Blade and Garren's mid season upgrade are named Jack Forms... but for Chalice... in a subversion, not named the same way. As already mentioned above, it's Wild Chalice. Other than that, it fits Hajime figuratively too, Hajime is a Wild Card character. Aside from nobody knowing his motives at the beginning of the series and switching on and off between being a normal hero/anti-hero, he's the Joker Undead (which is the card usually called the wild card).

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

And exactly, the bolded stuff there is me. Obviously it's not something to emulate, plus, "teenage girl having inner strength" to me, seems to trace into gender's society status where females are treated as innocent and male as savage, of which females' bad behavior are excused, forgiven, or blame-shifted into males, giving them more leeway and allowing them to do as they want freely (it's... dirty social tricks they employ! As a form of... power). but bringing that up because, many people in the fandom (on relief, not those on Rider fandom so far), downplays or cuts off morally ambiguous or downright villainous character's bad traits. A common example is if they had bad backstory (which is what Umi has), everything bad they do is excused by "do you know what they're going through?", "they only had bad upbringing, they aren't evil just misunderstood", etc. as if it somehow gives excuse to behave as any way you like.

Uh, I think we are wading into some waters here, stuff that is probably outside the scope of discussing Kamen Rider Blade, so I'll just mention a couple three things in the hope of each of us having said our piece and putting a pin in this part:

-Teenage girls can say hurtful things, but I can vividly recall something a teenage boy said to me years ago that still gives me anxiety. All teenagers are capable of saying hurtful things. No gender has a monopoly on it.

-If you think teenage girls having inner strength is somehow connected to people (not just one gender!) being awful, that's a bummer.

-I don't think anyone's excusing what Umi's doing when she acts poorly, but we can all try and understand or address why she's doing that. It's not in the best interests of appreciating a story if we're going to look at troubled characters as complicit in their own flaws 100% of the time. Sometimes folks got motivations, sometimes folks only have justifications. Talking about them and trying to understand their perspective isn't an endorsement.

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Who knows if it's just Yoshito and Tachibana actually being one of the audiences, watching Blade together and discussing what happens in the episode they watch!

It's nice that they can get together when a new episode airs. I've been very critical of that plot, but it's good to see them share interests.

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

I do wonder what will happen if an Undead is just hit by finisher, but left out and not being sealed, would they eventually wake up like a human being KOed, or their body going limp?

Good question! I assumed that, when the belt breaks open, that puts them in Weakened state, so they can be sealed. If they don't get sealed, they can probably get up and escape, but they'll be stuck in that Weakened state until they're sealed. I don't think the belt can get fixed!

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

And well... Kenzaki at Tachibana's arc can feel relegated in story for you, and your comment regarding Yoshito is like this.... I guess, other solution can be better if Yoshito listens to Tachibana and, if Tachibana has a plan, work on that?

I just don't know what Undad wants, or, if I do know, I'm not sure why he wants it. The show seems to have decided on portraying him as Aloof And Mysterious, but it leaves me with a villain who does the same thing, every week, and nothing fun in the performance to paper over it. He's just repetitive and boring, so I would've liked it better if one of those things was different. Either give him more fun schemes, or make him a more entertaining character. Boring Guy Does Same Thing Every Week is... I don't know if that's the choice I'd make if I was writing this!

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Most audience would label Kenzaki's approach to risk helping someone perceived as a threat as a weakness unfortunately, which just make them hate and bash on traditional hero character types like Rider leads with their compassion (which they read as weakness), but it can be unfair as, actually, this choice of "kill or let the bad guys go" creates dramatic tension, which makes the story/show interesting thought-provoking to read or watch.

And, I mean, that's why I love it: it makes things harder for the heroes. Stories where dudes fight every threat they encounter leads to uninspired storytelling. Having a solution where the hero has to put themselves at risk for something that know could backfire but believe it's still worth it... Yes. Every time, yes.

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

With Hirose on Kenzaki's side of not killing Joker, I wonder what Kotaro (who hates him, and also chastises Kenzaki for caring too much for him) thought to Hirose regarding that. And him trying to prove himself right in a very sad way... that by default isn't genuine, and can negate anything good about that action, as it's egocentric.

I think Kotaro has come around on Hajime. Or, at least, he's willing to defer to Kenzaki and Amane, since they want to save Hajime more than Kotaro's wary of Hajime. I think he'd be described as Agree To Disagree for the whole idea of welcoming Hajime. Like, sure, if everyone would be happier with Hajime back, that's great. But he's going to feel a little relieved if that doesn't happen, even though he might be mad at himself for feeling that way. It's complicated!

Less complicated is Tachibana's need to prove himself, which, yeah, mostly egocentric. It's always his story that everyone else is participating in, after all.

[Switchblade]

Finally got power back, so I’m going to try to catch back up with the thread. Not having internet or TV yet actually helps here.

[AkibaSilver]

I'm surprised I've not seen you mention much of Mutsuki's super cool new hang-out. Presumably he spends all his free time now no-one cares about his plot just hanging around and preparing to enjoy the greatest movie of all time, Spider-Man 3.

[Kamen Rider Die]

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Originally Posted by Switchblade

Finally got power back, so I’m going to try to catch back up with the thread. Not having internet or TV yet actually helps here.

Oh my gosh, welcome back! Sorry to hear that it's taken this long to even get your power restored. I can't imagine what that's like in the summer during a pandemic. Glad to see you back on the boards, hope you're hanging in there okay.

As for the thread, yeah, looking forward to your thoughts!

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Originally Posted by AkibaSilver

I'm surprised I've not seen you mention much of Mutsuki's super cool new hang-out. Presumably he spends all his free time now no-one cares about his plot just hanging around and preparing to enjoy the greatest movie of all time, Spider-Man 3.

It's really appropriate that, when he embraces his villainy, he does it in the most ridiculous and cartoonish way possible. He definitely practices his various card-fans in the mirror to decide which looks the coolest. He learned all of his Cool Guy Who Is Dangerous aesthetic from David Blaine, which is why no one cares about his plot anymore.

EDIT: Real question, though. Did he buy all of that spider furniture, or did he hunt for a spider-themed club to take over?

[Switchblade]

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Oh my gosh, welcome back! Sorry to hear that it's taken this long to even get your power restored. I can't imagine what that's like in the summer during a pandemic. Glad to see you back on the boards, hope you're hanging in there okay.

As for the thread, yeah, looking forward to your thoughts!

Eleven days. That’s like the entire lifespan of the average kobold. At least I can use my phone without having to charge it off my car now. This thing has the battery life of a Sega Nomad.

So, I’m caught up to episode 32 (skipped the movie because backlog). I’m firmly entrenched in the new era of Blade, which I will freely admit is my preferred part of the series. After what seems like a hundred Mutsuki focus episodes we have a main plot again (finally?). I love how the show just kicks into high gear at this point and almost every episode has some kind of major plot reveal or twist. The show really doesn’t slow down much from this point and it becomes really engrossing on a level it never quite reached before.

The other thing I really love is how much of the early plot points suddenly come back into focus. Remember how Hirose had a dad and he’s the guy that unsealed the Undead? Yeah, here he is, being all villain-y. Here, have a Sayoko reference for good measure. The part that really impressed me is how this is all with a new writer. You can tell that Aikawa really took a long look at the show and its lore before taking over, then carefully worked as much of it into the story’s resolution as he could. That is not something that you’ll see with the other two shows that lost their writer.

[Kamen Rider Die]

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Originally Posted by Switchblade

So, I’m caught up to episode 32 (skipped the movie because backlog). I’m firmly entrenched in the new era of Blade, which I will freely admit is my preferred part of the series. After what seems like a hundred Mutsuki focus episodes we have a main plot again (finally?). I love how the show just kicks into high gear at this point and almost every episode has some kind of major plot reveal or twist. The show really doesn’t slow down much from this point and it becomes really engrossing on a level it never quite reached before.

The plot is definitely in full swing, and there's a much more consistent hierarchy of characters. Before, you'd get a bunch of Mutsuki episodes, or a bunch of Tachibana episodes, or a bunch of Hajime episodes. Now, it's Kenzaki's show, and his reactions to what those other characters are doing is the core of the storytelling. It's way more about How Is Kenzaki Going To Deal With whatever, instead of the previous era's nearly anthology format. It's definitely a more consistent, plot-oriented effort than before.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

The other thing I really love is how much of the early plot points suddenly come back into focus. Remember how Hirose had a dad and he’s the guy that unsealed the Undead? Yeah, here he is, being all villain-y. Here, have a Sayoko reference for good measure. The part that really impressed me is how this is all with a new writer. You can tell that Aikawa really took a long look at the show and its lore before taking over, then carefully worked as much of it into the story’s resolution as he could. That is not something that you’ll see with the other two shows that lost their writer.

Yeah, and, weirdly, there's not really anything he threw away? It's not like the new era started and Kotaro and Mutsuki were gone and there was a brand-new team dad or whatever. (Well, Undad, but he's only the team dad of Team Tachibana, the world's first self-negating team.) It's just a slight reorganization, largely invisible. Like, I don't know that I'd've picked up on there being a new writer if no one had told me? Quality-wise, I don't find it noticeably better or worse. It's got strengths and flaws, and they're different strengths and flaws from before, but it's still an imperfect show. And I think that's actually nice for the cohesion of the series? It doesn't feel I'm watching Aikawa's Kamen Rider Blade, but I'm watching Kamen Rider Blade by Aikawa, if that makes any sense.

[AkibaSilver]

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

It's really appropriate that, when he embraces his villainy, he does it in the most ridiculous and cartoonish way possible. He definitely practices his various card-fans in the mirror to decide which looks the coolest. He learned all of his Cool Guy Who Is Dangerous aesthetic from David Blaine, which is why no one cares about his plot anymore.

EDIT: Real question, though. Did he buy all of that spider furniture, or did he hunt for a spider-themed club to take over?

I do love how his possession and fall to evil are the running plot for like a good 12 episodes, and then once it happens big drama starts going down with Hajime and Undad and he just has nothing to do but brood and occasionally try to prove how strong he is. I can't tell if I joke love him or seriously love him because of this stretch, but Emo!Mustuki is great.