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08-19-2022, 11:56 PM | #871 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
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But there needs to be a balance between Same Old Bullshit and This Character Is Caught In A Loop Of Hollow Behavior. Having a line-up of random Humagears and old Magia suits... it's no fun to watch? Like, maybe there could've been a different way to get at Horobi's inability to see beyond his lifetime of hatred? Some less dull take on his limited perspective? I feel like this show had options (definitely could've used a MetsubouJinrai scene, if only Naki and Ikazuchi hadn't booked that couples hot stone massage) and it went with the least enjoyable one. It was! The first scene with the two of them was great, and everything I would want in a story that's trying to figure out Horobi. Then she starts running in front of cars, basically, and I wonder if the Singularity obliterated her sense of self-preservation. It's only the second part I have a problem with.
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08-20-2022, 12:00 AM | #872 |
Some guy. I'm alright.
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,465
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It's a boring point, I guess? Beyond being an illustration of Horobi's lack of enthusiasm about his plot to exterminate humanity... why would a show think spending an episode with a homicidal/genocidal villain who's just going through the motions would be compelling drama? Why wouldn't you tell a story that makes Horobi less of a limp presence?
I think Izu showing up to try and talk sense into Horobi is a good thing. I think two Humagears deserve to have a conversation about the direction of their species and culture. I think Izu trying to have the same conversation mid-murder spree is, much like Jin's attempts to stop Vulcan from murdering a currently-murdering Horobi in an attempt to de-escalate tensions, pretty stupid. I am okay with characters making poor decisions because it makes sense to their characters. I am less okay with characters acting stupidly to further the plot.
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08-20-2022, 08:08 AM | #873 |
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I'd hugely disagree with this. Horobi's more dangerous in that his vision for the future is less nihilistic than the Ark's, and his power is in the strength of his convictions. The Ark was an easy villain to defeat because it was two-dimensional. Horobi's going to be harder to defeat because he has a point.
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KAMEN RIDER ZERO-ONE EPISODE 42 - ?AS LONG AS MALICE EXISTS?
So much of what happened in this episode felt barely thought-through and flimsily explained. In order for the twist of Aruto being Ark-One to land, it takes almost an entire cast of characters (I guess Naki and Ikazuchi took a spa day?) to act like idiots. We need Izu to decide to skip out on telling Aruto about Horobi?s plan, which the entire Humagear population knows about, so she only manages to delay him by a scene. We need Izu to continuously place herself in mortal danger to prove that a genocidal terrorist in the midst of genocidal terrorism is willing to entertain an opposing viewpoint. We need three separate members of Team Zero-One to allow Horobi to walk out the door after killing Izu. (This is the big one. Why do people keep treating Horobi?s departures like the toku equivalent of saying Good Game? Why in the world would you let him wander off after executing Izu?!) We need Aruto to be so overcome with grief that he?ll take up the mantle of the same villain he worked to detonate over the last dozen episodes. Quote:
(It's also flattening its main themes of combating racism and bigotry by doing a dull revenge plot, but that seems like a minor flaw in comparison. But since we're talking about it: I dislike that larger conversations about how different groups integrate into society gets abandoned for a fridging and dull solo villainy. We're so far off the beam from discussing Humagears as a group of disparate viewpoints, and that sucks.)
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And even outside of all of that, to see that Horobi?s big plan to liberate Humagears is the exact same shit he was doing in Episode 1? Jesus, why bother? I don?t know if the point is to satirize Ark?s boring strategies or Horobi?s complete lack of creativity, but the only way I can see including a MetsubouJinrai revolution this half-assed is as a joke. Horobi finally has a reasonable argument and an actual dream, but it?s the same old horseshit on the battlefield. Incredibly disappointing.
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Except unlike Phoenix, Horobi actually has a sense of morality and misguidedly believes that committing genocide of humanity is necessary to bring justice to HumaGears, which makes his motivation more similar to Heart Roidmude. Horobi is thinking critically now after reaching singularity and it just happened that he came to the same conclusion as Ark's will, but out of fear instead of hate. He's experienced firsthand the evil in humanity and he only sees Aruto as the exception to the rule. Horobi wants to destroy the hierarchy created by humanity and he doesn't have faith in Aruto's diplomacy to do that.
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08-20-2022, 08:23 AM | #874 |
本当のクロスセイバー
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Himitsu
Posts: 168
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One of my favorite moments during Die's entire journey on watching the 1st Phase Heisei Riders was when Die was a bit surprised and taken aback by Takumi's revelation as an Orphnoch in Faiz. Kudos for everyone who insisted Die to NOT watch Paradise Lost first so as not to spoil the twist. Die's line : "Takumi , though. I mean, goddamn" in that episode still rings in my head now. That basically, more or less, summarized how my feelings are for this episode.
Die might not know now but during Zero-One's airing, there was so many speculations regarding Ark-One. I still fondly remembered everyone discussed whether it was Horobi, Gai, Azu, or an entirely new character like Williamson, who would become Ark-One. My money would be on the show basically revived the Ark(-Zero) back and upgraded it to Ark One. That would be so lame and inconsequential to last episode but that's basically the most mainstream storyline that we have gotten up to this point in the franchise. Takahashi himself loved to bring back characters here and there in Ex-Aid. Aruto as Ark-One, though.... Man, goddamn... I need to disagree a bit with Die on how he viewed most characters suddenly became idiotic in this episode, especially Horobi and Izu. I don't think Horobi and Izu's actions in this instance was idiotic or boring. For Izu, it was easy to argue because she basically had just seen Aruto died again with her own eyes. Of course she wouldn't want to worry and bring Aruto to this mess which could claim the single important person in Izu's life. I hugely criticized the interaction between characters outside their faction a lot. Aruto and Izu, though? They were the two characters with the strongest bond in the series that I would buy Izu didn't consider her own safety and life if it was for Aruto's sake. For Horobi, remember he's more or less like Jin in the first quarter of the series. Of course Horobi would return back to his daily routine to exterminate humanity. Like it or not, that's the single lesson that was indoctrinated by Ark to Horobi. Even with the Ark gone, it's undeniable that Horobi could only do the same thing because THAT was the single lesson that he kept learning from the get go. I'm sure if Horobi was more earnest like Jin, he would answer that he attacked humans because that's the ONLY way he knew to ensure Humagears' safety. Like Aruto said before destroying Jin in ep 16, had Horobi didn't learn malice from the Ark, all of the conflict in this episode would have been avoidable. Even I'm buying Aruto's fall in Azu's temptation and became Ark-One. Izu was not just a simple person for Aruto. She WAS the only person in the series that kept being in Aruto's side no matter what, high or low. No matter how you see Aruto and Izu's relationship, losing such an important person would hurt tremendously. I had wished in ep 40 that nothing would break apart Aruto and Izu. So, it crushed my heart to see Izu exploded right in front of Aruto's eyes and it was deafening to hear Aruto's anguish. If I were Aruto, I would not just stare into nothingness, I would become a crying mess and rolling in the ground till dawn. Poor guy... If only there's someone who could give Aruto a hug... Oh yeah, if there was an idiot in this episode, I firmly say it would be FUWA! I was gritting and face-palming myself whenever I saw Fuwa in this episode. Firs of all, he basically ruined Izu's conversation with Horobi. As shown by Horobi's hesitance later, some of Izu's word DID reach out Horobi's heart. It was only because Fuwa's arrival and provocation that lead Horobi tool an action there. If only Fuwa and Yua wasn't there, I was sure Izu could reach out Horobi in some way shape or forms. Don't even mention that Fuwa was shoving aside Jin later, who tried to ease the tension and stop this needless bloodshed. And then there was the scene where Fuwa PREVENTED Yua to comfort Aruto. Like, DUDE! Aruto needed a hug and a huge support in that time! I couldn't do that for him so if you don't want to comfort him, at least let Yua do the stead! I know it was cultural difference where most Japanese person will usually leave grieving people, like Aruto, alone to process his grief. But, come on, Fuwa. I thought you WERE Aruto's friend, beside Izu! Aruto DID so many things to pull out Fuwa from his hate and revenge, helping you finding a dream, and made a therapy bot for you! After all of those things, the only thing that you could do was letting Aruto ALONE!? No wonder Aruto fall into Azu's grasp; Azu was the single person who volunteered to comfort Aruto at that time. Because of that moment, I dare to say I HATE Aruto and Fuwa's relation as Main and Secondary Rider. Just ask any other Secondary Riders before Fuwa: If they saw the Main Rider in the position like Aruto, I'm sure they will do something other than leaving the Main Rider alone. Geiz was shocked and felt bad for Sougo after witnessing Another Kiva's death, Banjo would beat up Sento to get him out of funk before cheering him up a bit, Hiro DID give some nice wisdom to Emu after Kiriya's death and so on. Fuwa? Do nothing and prevent Yua from cheering up Aruto. I don't care whether Horobi was still out there or Fuwa didn't expect Aruto to become Ark. For certain, Aruto DIDN'T need a room alone, he needed support at time like this. I'm feeling bad because Aruto is TOO much of a nice guy to Fuwa, the so-called friend who didn't even give back all of Aruto's token of friendship in all of its earnest.
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08-20-2022, 09:08 AM | #875 |
Reiei
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 3,691
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This episode soured my views on Humagears particularly because they just chose to side with Horobi, the robo-terrorist, immediately just because he said 'human bad'. Aruto is right there in being the sole guardian of the Humagears' innocence but they join up with the one that furthers anyone's claim that Humagears are dangerous at the drop of a hat. Really super strange!
I find it also odd during the time Fuwa just stopped Yaiba from comforting Aruto and the two just LEAVE HIM THERE?! Fuwa of all people should know what leaving someone to their misery and rage does. At first I swept it under the rug since I was captivated by the episode, but now it just looks dumb to me. This was set up just so Aruto can turn. And speaking of Aruto turning, it's... actually a brilliant idea! This is genius move especially when you take into consider Aruto's upbringing. He was born with his biological parents not being there for him, his robo-dad wasn't there for most of his life spending little time with him and more so as a Kamen Rider, Grandpa Hiden didn't even bother to check on him and just dumped the company on him, his social life is an absolute wreck with his only friend being an old comedic partner leaving him because of their differing views, his comedic career just being in the absolute dumps, and his emotional support being only really Izu, it is understandable that he would absolutely MAD when that support is gone. Fuwa was a good friend to him but no one was absolutely as close and supportive as Izu was, so this is completely understandable for him, especially when we've already seen and also had Gai pointed out this hidden darkness within Aruto a long time ago. I really like the shot when Aruto saw the Ark-One key and we see him let out a grin as he takes it, he wasn't controlled or whatever, he took it 100% by his own volition. Aruto was never a mentally sound person! (please don't take it the offensive way ) I also like to think this episode is what made Fumiya Takahashi's acting career go up through the roof. He's been featured in other roles depicting this exact demeanor Aruto displayed and I've watched those shows he starred in and he always absolutely kills it portraying a really insane person. With that, I'd like to link another one of 10pperance's doujins, this one putting a bit more into Aruto's thoughts inside the Ark-One suit. https://www.facebook.com/bakanki/pho...72779232761992 |
08-20-2022, 11:12 AM | #876 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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I need to disagree a bit with Die on how he viewed most characters suddenly became idiotic in this episode, especially Horobi and Izu. I don't think Horobi and Izu's actions in this instance was idiotic or boring. For Izu, it was easy to argue because she basically had just seen Aruto died again with her own eyes. Of course she wouldn't want to worry and bring Aruto to this mess which could claim the single important person in Izu's life. I hugely criticized the interaction between characters outside their faction a lot. Aruto and Izu, though? They were the two characters with the strongest bond in the series that I would buy Izu didn't consider her own safety and life if it was for Aruto's sake.
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This episode soured my views on Humagears particularly because they just chose to side with Horobi, the robo-terrorist, immediately just because he said 'human bad'. Aruto is right there in being the sole guardian of the Humagears' innocence but they join up with the one that furthers anyone's claim that Humagears are dangerous at the drop of a hat. Really super strange!
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08-20-2022, 11:33 AM | #877 |
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Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 2,556
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Oh hey, Keuhne’s back. It’s been a long time (40 episodes. Can you believe it?)
And this is why my video for the Ark-One Zetsumeriskey was simply the RKF figure. To avoid this spoiler (which was probably unnecessary, since I did mention it once in a certain other thread when discussing HEROEZ you may have a MEMORY OF) So basically, at this point, the show was running on fumes. They could only salvage two things from their original plan (Williamson and Ark-One), most of their suit actors (the ones for Vulcan, Valkyrie, Thouser and Jin) had gone on to work on Saber (as Saber, Kenzan, Espada and Blades respectively). But they still wanted to do Nawata vs Takaiwa for their final battle, hence why the plot is slightly contrived to make Aruto want to murder Horobi (but it does have some thematic resonance with several of Zero-One’s upgrades having an increasing connection to the Ark). And since I forgot about this, I’ll just put this here. Progrise: I am a younger brother to assist a satellite, There. Astronaut: Uchuyaro Subaru. |
08-20-2022, 11:49 AM | #878 |
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Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,100
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But there needs to be a balance between Same Old Bullshit and This Character Is Caught In A Loop Of Hollow Behavior. Having a line-up of random Humagears and old Magia suits... it's no fun to watch? Like, maybe there could've been a different way to get at Horobi's inability to see beyond his lifetime of hatred? Some less dull take on his limited perspective? I feel like this show had options (definitely could've used a MetsubouJinrai scene, if only Naki and Ikazuchi hadn't booked that couples hot stone massage) and it went with the least enjoyable one.
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It was! The first scene with the two of them was great, and everything I would want in a story that's trying to figure out Horobi. Then she starts running in front of cars, basically, and I wonder if the Singularity obliterated her sense of self-preservation. It's only the second part I have a problem with.
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08-20-2022, 02:28 PM | #879 |
Standing By
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 2,119
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Like Is, inspired by Aruto and believing so much in his dream of humanxHumagear coexistence risking herself for that dream by trying to get through to Horobi like Aruto would...only for it too be too late or not matter in the end. But I still found that brave in its own right.
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It's true that, Phoenix is an irredeemable bastard, but while Horobi at first glance sounds like Heart, he's not really like him, he's quite depraved too in his villain stint. Someone that's more like Heart in Zero-One, would be Jin at his revival, before ep. 36. He actually took care of Humagears (even if there's some misguided way in breaking off their relationship with humans) and would at least tolerate humans who'd be benefical to them. Heart sees all Roidmudes as his friends, is enraged at their deaths, mourning and avenging them instead of labeling them as failures... Horobi claims to want a better future for Humagears, but he didn't put that into practice other than his misantrophy. By that, it's not only humans who are threatened by Horobi, fellow Humagears aren't safe from Horobi either. He 's full of hypocrisy and willingly destroys any Humagears who do anything to slight him and dragging them into needless conflicts, mainly humanity-related. Heart and Jin (at the start of revival) actually earned the anti-villain status, but not for Horobi; he develops without changing his morality spectrum.
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Because of that moment, I dare to say I HATE Aruto and Fuwa's relation as Main and Secondary Rider. Just ask any other Secondary Riders before Fuwa: If they saw the Main Rider in the position like Aruto, I'm sure they will do something other than leaving the Main Rider alone. Geiz was shocked and felt bad for Sougo after witnessing Another Kiva's death, Banjo would beat up Sento to get him out of funk before cheering him up a bit, Hiro DID give some nice wisdom to Emu after Kiriya's death and so on. Fuwa? Do nothing and prevent Yua from cheering up Aruto. I don't care whether Horobi was still out there or Fuwa didn't expect Aruto to become Ark. For certain, Aruto DIDN'T need a room alone, he needed support at time like this. I'm feeling bad because Aruto is TOO much of a nice guy to Fuwa, the so-called friend who didn't even give back all of Aruto's token of friendship in all of its earnest.
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08-20-2022, 10:45 PM | #880 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
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Location: Chicago, IL
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KAMEN RIDER ZERO-ONE EPISODE 43 - “THAT IS A HEART”
Of all the things that I never expected to see again in Reiwa, the biggest one has to be the remix summer movie. You know, the frequently-Inoue ones, where it would do a truncated version of the main series, but with a different ending. The characters are all there, and the relationships are the same, but there’d always be just enough changed to make it feel ancillary: some new random character in a position of power, a different final boss, etc. The big thing would be a kind of slimmed down version of the show’s themes. It’d usually be more personal, a Versus thing rather than an exploration of larger concepts. That’s what this final batch of episodes feels like. It feels like the remix movie version of the Zero-One TV show. Those movies could be fun, for sure. This episode has some outstanding fight scenes (I love the shots of Ark-One in darkness, referencing Aruto’s misery), and some beautiful staging. It’s consistently entertaining to look at. But there’s a narrowness to what the episode’s talking about, and it’s reductive in ways this show largely avoided in the past. We’re not really talking about how society decides which people have value, or how working classes view their necessity to capitalism, or how marginalized people balance utility and independence within oppressive systems. We’re talking about the poisonous nature of revenge, and how violence begets more violence. It’s fine, as a concept to explore with these characters. It’s just the Dig Two Graves lesson, but that’s got a ton of inherent drama. Doing a story where Horobi denies his own emotional needs to the detriment of his support system, while Aruto demolishes a year of goodwill to try and stave off despair, that’s a story you can tell in this world. But it’s simple, you know? It’s straightforward in the way 70-minute summer films frequently were. It’s about two forces in opposition, so everyone outside those two forces is relegated to the sidelines. Naki and Ikazuchi are back from their spa day, but they only get a single scene to tell Jin things are getting out of hand without actually, uh, helping him. Thouser and the Shotrisers (18+ show this Monday at the Metro, doors open at 9pm) spend most of the episode going to different rooms and expositing. (Good fight scene with Ark-One, though, for real.) The Humagears as a culture don’t get a say in what’s happening, other than it sounding like Horobi’s accidentally driving more of them crazy. It’s just a story about Horobi and Aruto. In that shrunken spotlight, though, it’s actually pretty good. Treating this group of episodes as more of a tangent than an epilogue frees it from the narrative weight of the proceeding themes, and lets it work as basically a two-hander. Both actors turn in series-best work (not exactly a high bar for Horobi to clear, but credit where credit’s due), and elevate what’d otherwise be a fairly standard revenge story. The escalation of hostilities feels sickeningly inevitable, with Horobi’s steadfast refusal to admit culpability running up against Aruto’s enraged loss. It’s not exactly fun to see Aruto this hollowed-out and grim, but it feels earned to a degree that had me anticipating the next scenes. There’s energy to Aruto’s terrifying mission, and it nicely compliments Horobi’s deteriorating confidence. The two of them have spent the past couple episodes switching between who has the moral high ground, and the irony is that neither of them do by the end. They’re both killers, and they’re both villains. Hatred’s turned them both into vessels for destruction, with nothing to show for it but more hatred – directed inward and outward. They’ve both lost people close to them, and are becoming a living rejection of those victims’ dreams in the name of vengeance. I liked this show better when it was about how society did that, but there’s still some artistry to a story applied to the individual. — KAMEN RIDER ZERO-ONE SO-DO AI 10: KAMEN RIDER ARK-ONE The thing I like best about this suit is how the breastplate looks like a screaming Humagear face. The red eyes, and the open mouth… it’s a million miles away from a happy grasshopper, you know? There’s an anger to so much of this suit, and I love that. The harsh black/white coloring is a worldview without compromise or empathy: us vs them, victors vs victims. The red cuts through blocks of color to indicate that while the facade may be cold and unfeeling, underneath it’s all rage and fear. Gorgeous villain suit design. The figure nails the design, too. Only maybe ten stickers across both boxes (they painted the inner arms, which is way above and beyond), and the inclusion of closed fists to make sure your posed toy is capable of inflicting horrifying violence. Real pretty to look at, and maybe be afraid of.
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