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10-23-2020, 03:14 AM | #361 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2019
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And here’s my final new character intro of the first half
Eiki (Sharp Demon) is a character that was intended to join the regular cast, to the point the actor who voices him is the guy who reads the next episode titles (Kazuya Nakai). But I think you can guess what happened there. Anyway, for the next leg of the series, I’ve found my running gag for this thread (believe me, I’ve got ones planned for the next 4). I’m going to do my own song lyrics which vaguely describe the next episode (not to the point of being spoiler filled, since most of the choices are random) Everything changes, changes Changin' all the time Playin' with your mind Modified or rearranged Everything has got to change - Everything Changes, Pokémon 2.B.A Master |
10-23-2020, 04:45 AM | #362 |
The Immortal King Tasty
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Every diner you've ever been to.
Posts: 3,833
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There was a point where watching that last episode of Hibiki started to get me a little emotional, and, funnily enough, it wasn't even during the episode itself. No, it was just in the preview, where they made it a point to include Hibiki telling Asumu to run, and this huge wave of... nostalgia, I guess, suddenly hit me before I even realized why – it's the same dialogue Hibiki had in episode 2 the last time he fought a giant spider.
I went into the back half of the two-parter now understanding the gravity of it all. Why the monster is a Tsuchigumo again, and why Hibiki is on a quest to make a new drumstick, exactly as he was at the start of the show. They knew. They straight up knew this would be their final set of episodes to tell the version of Hibiki they wanted to, and that's why, like any good finale, there are loads of callbacks to the beginning of the series. This is, without a doubt in my mind, the final episode of Hibiki. It was such an obvious and conscious decision to have the entire cast in one room at the very end, especially, like everyone walking on-stage at the end of a play or something, that makes it all the more apparent. So yeah, like Die says, there are lots of fun things to talk about with the action, too. To sum it up, you can really tell Osamu Kaneda was the director, but man that is just not what's going to stick with anybody about these ones.
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10-23-2020, 04:52 AM | #363 |
take me to space
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,406
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If you knew nothing about what was to come, I wonder how it would have felt to tune into this episode and the whole thing carrying such a distinct 'finale' feel. It is a really nice and warm set of episodes regardless though, made all the sweeter (or maybe bitter) that this was basically the end for the current production crew.
I would say that Asumu's encounter with the shoplifter happening in flashback was one of the surest sign that the team knew this was going to be their last work, so they wanted to pick up on that thread again. Buuuut it also reminded me of how Kuuga's first battle with Daguva was presented only in brief, blurry flashbacks, so for all I know, it could have actually been a bizarre but conscious decision. |
10-23-2020, 09:52 AM | #364 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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Quote:
And here’s my final new character intro of the first half
Eiki (Sharp Demon) is a character that was intended to join the regular cast, to the point the actor who voices him is the guy who reads the next episode titles (Kazuya Nakai). But I think you can guess what happened there. Anyway, for the next leg of the series, I’ve found my running gag for this thread (believe me, I’ve got ones planned for the next 4). I’m going to do my own song lyrics which vaguely describe the next episode (not to the point of being spoiler filled, since most of the choices are random) Everything changes, changes Changin' all the time Playin' with your mind Modified or rearranged Everything has got to change - Everything Changes, Pokémon 2.B.A Master Also, can't believe I didn't notice this until now, but Eiki is the Sharp Demon. Sharp, like a musical note. Amazing. Quote:
There was a point where watching that last episode of Hibiki started to get me a little emotional, and, funnily enough, it wasn't even during the episode itself. No, it was just in the preview, where they made it a point to include Hibiki telling Asumu to run, and this huge wave of... nostalgia, I guess, suddenly hit me before I even realized why – it's the same dialogue Hibiki had in episode 2 the last time he fought a giant spider.
I went into the back half of the two-parter now understanding the gravity of it all. Why the monster is a Tsuchigumo again, and why Hibiki is on a quest to make a new drumstick, exactly as he was at the start of the show. They knew. They straight up knew this would be their final set of episodes to tell the version of Hibiki they wanted to, and that's why, like any good finale, there are loads of callbacks to the beginning of the series. This is, without a doubt in my mind, the final episode of Hibiki. It was such an obvious and conscious decision to have the entire cast in one room at the very end, especially, like everyone walking on-stage at the end of a play or something, that makes it all the more apparent. So yeah, like Die says, there are lots of fun things to talk about with the action, too. To sum it up, you can really tell Osamu Kaneda was the director, but man that is just not what's going to stick with anybody about these ones. Yeah, everything about these two episodes (less the Mister Douji and Miss Hime stuff) says that it's folks who are finishing their statement, for better or worse. Quote:
I would say that Asumu's encounter with the shoplifter happening in flashback was one of the surest sign that the team knew this was going to be their last work, so they wanted to pick up on that thread again. Buuuut it also reminded me of how Kuuga's first battle with Daguva was presented only in brief, blurry flashbacks, so for all I know, it could have actually been a bizarre but conscious decision.
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10-23-2020, 10:51 AM | #365 |
Standing By
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 2,108
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I thought it was pretty humorous how Todoroki thought he was being clever with the Eiki pun until he found out Eiki did it first. Todoroki was so disappointed. It's a shame Eiki is only a minor Oni, he has a really cool suit and his brown color with turquoise accents is unique!
It's also a nice parallel to Shounen losing his spirit after getting beat up by the bully with a vendetta. This unfortunate encounter may not have shaken him so much before but after his many interactions with the Oni and slowly building his confidence around them, it's a long way to fall down and it's easy to feel weak and purposeless after an experience like that. He looks up to the Oni who exterminate Makamou every week but his failure to defend himself against a mere human has increased his self-loathing more than ever. It was only thanks to Hibiki's definitely-not-mentoring that he could salvage from that experience and pick himself up to try again next time. You can't expect to go from zero to hero without failing a lot on the way and Shounen losing a fight doesn't mean he'll lose them all. Well, good thread, Die. See you for Kabuto! Just kidding. The best may be behind now but there's still a lot to talk about for the rest of the show. It's not all bad, there are some genuinely cool and emotional moments to look forward to. I believe the quality of Hibiki's second half is comparable to Agito's first half.
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10-23-2020, 11:26 AM | #366 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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Quote:
I thought it was pretty humorous how Todoroki thought he was being clever with the Eiki pun until he found out Eiki did it first. Todoroki was so disappointed. It's a shame Eiki is only a minor Oni, he has a really cool suit and his brown color with turquoise accents is unique!
(Also, speaking of Todoroki and pride, I'm just going to toss in here that I loved that the show had moments where both Hibiki and Zanki tossed towels to their kids when they came in from the rain. That parallel of parenthood, I thought it was subtle and affecting. This show's all little moments, you know?) Quote:
Well, good thread, Die. See you for Kabuto! Just kidding. The best may be behind now but there's still a lot to talk about for the rest of the show. It's not all bad, there are some genuinely cool and emotional moments to look forward to. I believe the quality of Hibiki's second half is comparable to Agito's first half.
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10-23-2020, 08:46 PM | #367 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,290
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The drumming training, something Asumu finally had in common with Hibiki that he can at least teach (and even whistling is brought up too), and pointed out by Hinaka that he can potentially become Oni by drum training, but this one part dude...
terrible. BTW, sorry for bugging for this part, but can you reply to the part about, again, my further reply about the Asumu/Hitomi feelings with the show vs audience reaction? Quote:
KAMEN RIDER HIBIKI VOLUME 26 - “PASSING DAYS”
KAMEN RIDER HIBIKI VOLUME 27 - “PASSING DOWN THE BOND” It’s nice to see the monster stuff take a big step up. The mythology is still pretty light, all things considered. Black and White Clockamous, Doujis and Himes… it’s not a lot, you know? It’s a very slim framework to the Oni’s mission. Here, there’s both a little bit more specificity to what’s going on with all of the seasonal monster stuff (very much appreciated), and also an increased level to the threat. Quote:
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It’s layered in well to Asumu’s story. Once again, there’s no big decision to Asumu and Hibiki’s relationship. Tsutomu is just another path that Asumu could end up on. Not a cautionary tale or anything, Tsutomu isn’t destroyed by this, but something for Asumu to consider as he keeps defining himself. Similarly, Zanki’s questioning of Hibiki gets the mentor side some screentime, with the two dads warmly joking about how awesome it is to be a dad. (Zanki’s so proud of Todoroki! And he always has been! And he’s so bad at hiding it!) Hibiki wants to be something more than just an Oni mentor to Asumu, in the same way that Asumu doesn’t feel the need to be an Oni apprentice just to learn from Hibiki.
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10-23-2020, 09:12 PM | #368 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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And, for what you say, the monster threat being escalating, it's probably like, the most mainstream trope that happens in an action-driven show, and yeah I know it's done to push the heroes harder and harder and adds more challenges after the previous one is passed.
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Oh, the standard "overprotective" parent to forbid. It doesn't need to be explained, probably the parents would think that Oni job is dangerous so they forbid him but still. The show didn't address on it, but this should be given as a lesson for parenting, you can be concerned for your child, but don't let that ruins the child's life instead like giving them issues like this (being haunted, which can be overlooked, issues that aren't about life or death, by parents too). I feel like Tsutomu is being victim here, and that thought doesn't cross you? (that you seem ok with this).
On the other hand, if I'm the parent to a 15-year old who wants to train to fight spiders the size of houses? You are goddamn right I'm yanking them out of that program. Tsutomu's parents are 100% in the right on this one. Takeshi is... I don't know if they should be allowed to have high school-aged apprentices! That seems astonishingly dangerous and legally actionable! Quote:
Wow, so Tsutomu is trying to be a lifesaver (not as an Oni, but still). I thought from his looks, as well as like you said, him trying to hit on Hitomi, he'd be a delinquent or something (and he still seems so to me with his questions to Asumu). It seems that he more resembles Zanki in his demeanor.
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10-23-2020, 09:19 PM | #369 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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KAMEN RIDER HIBIKI 1-29 WRAP-UP
"Won't you sleep with me every night for a week Won't you just let me pretend this is the love I need" -Waxahatchee, "Swan Dive" I honestly don't know if I like Hibiki, or if I just want to like Hibiki. There's a ton of quality in this series. The characters are phenomenal, with so much depth and dimension. The arcs are real, honest, important. Every actor elevates their part, adding clever notes to make a richer, fuller world. The stories this show chooses to tell are so much more grounded and relatable than anything I've ever seen on a Kamen Rider show. It takes parts and stories that would normally be mortar, the home lives and school troubles and tiny indignities, and makes them bricks. Except, I fundamentally don't know if they're right to do that. The things this show is great at are things you can watch in a hundred other shows, in genres that more fully support those ideas. If I wanted a warm family dramedy, I'd just go watch a warm family dramedy. I'm watching a superhero show, and the superhero parts of Kamen Rider Hibiki are almost infuriatingly weak. Like, the formula in place of Camping > Douji And Hime > More Camping > Makamou, it's so goddamn boring at times. Most times, if I'm being honest. More than once I've mentioned how weird it is that the monster plots seem like they distract from the drama, and that honestly shouldn't happen once, let alone on multiple occasions. Compelling monster plots are a necessity in a superhero show, and Kamen Rider Hibiki treats them as perfunctory, as afterthoughts. There's something positive to be said about the ways the show uniquely makes the mythic elements, the superhero elements, mundane. In fact, I've said exactly that! But it substitutes Being Clever As A Concept for Being Fun To Watch, and that's maybe not a great trade. Kamen Rider Hibiki... it's like going to a steakhouse whose best dish is the chicken. Even if the chicken's great, wouldn't you be better off going to a chicken place? And shouldn't the steakhouse excel at serving steak? There are moments in the first 29 episodes of Hibiki that I adore, and every single one of them is a non-superhero moment. That's not incredibly out of character for me or anything, I'm usually less dialed into the superhero stuff, but the level to which I feel like this show undercooked the superhero parts... it's not great. It is not a great look. This is all sounding maybe more negative than I thought it was going to come out. I really connected with the characters, and I enjoyed spending time with them. It's just, I feel like I haven't been watching a Kamen Rider show, you know? The things I want out of a Kamen Rider, it's not saying Henshin or collectibles or motorcycles or anything. Hibiki skipping out on that stuff, I don't think it's a dealbreaker. But there's a specific kind of arc, a specific kind of storytelling, that this show opted out of in the first 29 episodes. It wanted to do something different, and it had a clear vision on how to do that, but the differences made it too little of a Kamen Rider show for me at times. It's the lack of any spine to the Makamou story, if I had to point to one exclusion that seems especially problematic. I guess there's a little more to it now, in the back 40% of the show, but it's too little, too late. The Makamou are animals, but they feel like natural disasters in the narrative. The Oni that are fighting them, there's no real intricate strategy or anything to the individual stories. Little variations, maybe, different weaknesses or hunting grounds, but the basics are the same. It's simplistic in a way that I thought this franchise had left behind, and it hamstrings any sense of progression that'd give new weight to a stale formula. (I really sound like I hated this show! I didn't think I did, but these are the words I'm typing so maybe!) The monster plots... it's like the Oni are fighting fires. How many different stories can you do about fires getting started? And once the fire needs to be put out, how many versions can you do of it needing to be put out? I know there're shows about firefighters, but I also know I've got zero interest in watching them. And I've got a huge interest in watching Japanese superheroes detonate monsters! I don't know. This is all coming off real down on the show, and that's maybe not what you'd expect after a generally positive thread so far. (I think?) But as I'm trying to think back on the last month or so, I'm finding myself more and more disappointed in how little entertainment I found in the Oni stuff. The non-Oni stuff, great, front-to-back, with precious few exceptions. The Oni stuff? Largely forgettable. All of which is to say, you know, not going to suggest that this show maybe didn't need a different take for it. If the current creative team was unable or unwilling to course-correct, maybe it was time to bring on a new one. I might end up missing some of what the first team valued in storytelling, but there's definitely room for improvement.
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10-23-2020, 11:09 PM | #370 |
Master Procrastinator
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 367
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Alright, I've been waiting for a while to pop and say this, but there goes.
A lot of people, including Die it seems, really did like this first part of the show, but we already know it would change after this. But some of the people who worked on this first part of Hibiki got a second chance and later made another show called Daimajin Kanon. If you liked Hibiki so far, you should check it out. Both shows share many of the same themes and ideas: an emphasis on music, a young person at a critical part of their emotional development gaining a mentor who is a secret warror that protects humans from monsters, an emphasis on personality and drama over action, etc. Unlike Hibiki there is was no interference from the higher ups. The show got to run its course and finish as intended. No pressure to conform to the expectations of a long running franchise. No being forced to distract from the stories just you can have the customary fighting scenes. IMO it's all of the best parts of Hibiki without most of its flaws. Anyhow, my shameless plug is done. Please return to your regularly schedule discussion. |
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