[Layton13]

That... That was it for the "Shoma knew Hanto's mom"-plot? He saw her escape attempt and watched her die because she tried to help him?

This feels incredibly underwhelming. There is like nothing to this, no new complications, no new information beyond a bit how Dark Candy was made before the press and I hardly call that really important information. It also cuts a good bit of Hanto's narrative threats, minus the Granuto who kidnapped his mom.

This just resolved far too cleanly for the amount of times this was build up.

Gavv kinda confuses me.

I think it's very well written, its cast behaves in-character, and they act very naturally from what is established of them, but... I think that may be a bad thing? At least for me?

There is so much interesting opportunities the show just never really capitalizes on because it takes the logical and clean way out.

Aka, nothing interesting really happens.

It's basically the best show I have been utterly bored by, and it is such a weird position to be in.

[Sh Ranger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eclipyon

They're not dead. In fact, that place is implied to be where Sae has escaped from. Otherwise, why would she assume that this is where Shoma is from? Based on Lango's comment about how they need to figure out a new storing method, this is most likely how captured humans are held before the Hitopress method are invented.

Yeah, there's no way they're dead at the time. Sae, who we can believe to be a good mother, wouldn't bluntly ask a kid she just met to identify a dead body that might be the kid's mother.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eclipyon

Dude, she was clearly shown to be dissolving...

I have to wonder how they even extract the human protein from the acid vat. Dark Snacks sound pretty gross.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiwami

Oh so we're getting multiple Bitter Gavv'? That's a fun idea. I kind of wanted to see one adapting, learning and gaining a personality, but that can happen still, we will just cycle through a few for now I guess.

Reminds me of the Makoto doppelgangers from Ghost.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

It turns out that Sae was captured during Hanto's childhood and, and not eaten, thus she was also converted into Dark Treats. Shoma was also a child who, without realizing it, stopped Sae in her tracks, leading Shoma to blame himself for Sae's death. He witnessed both main Riders' mothers die?his own and Hanto's. Sae was trying to be noble by attempting to help what she believed was another kidnapping victim escape, but she rather ditched Shoma upon discovering that he was their sibling.

And Shouma continued to live in the same mansion as his "Lango nii-san" for 18 years after watching him coldly murder Sae. Sachika's right, he escaped from Hell, just like Makoto did.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Additionally, there is a reveal regarding the origin of Dark Treats. Dente's older brother, Zomb, is responsible for collecting the ingredients for Dark Treats, while Dente works with what is provided. Zomb sees an opportunity to rule the world with the Dark Treats, clearly the bigger baddie, whereas Dente likely didn't realize that humans are the ingredients and eventually quit. Although Rakia initially reacts violently towards Dente for obvious reasons, he seems to act more rationally compared to even Hanto afterwards, as someone naturally calm and collected.

Seems like Dente also feels guilty about his accidental role in human trafficking and provoked Lakia in to attacking him to get what he feels like he deserves. Makes me wonder if Bouche only took over the business to limit the threat to humans. Unfortunately, his sadistic first son Lango became the next Zombu.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich

Not that he actually is, of course. Far from any kind of sidekick, Lakia is an independent character with his own strongly held motivations and beliefs, and just like Hanto, that's what the gap that forms between Shouma and him comes down to. Less "amusing", because it'd be nice to see all these people just get along smoothly, but definitely very entertaining, because watching all these well-developed characters intertwine with one another always gets me excited to see where things will go next.

Hanto's former prejudice was a domestic problem but never really an obstacle to his fights as Valen, since all the Granutes he fought were actually bad guys. Whereas Lakia's apathy towards humans, in a world dominated by humans, is totally an obstacle for Gavv's and Vram's synchronization. His heart has been thawed enough to care about humans in his situation like Mitarai, but not enough to care about them in general, which he'll need to work on. At least for now, he needs to accept that Shouma will always put saving people first, revenge second. If Lakia wants a chance at the latter, he needs to co-operate with the former.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Layton13

Gavv kinda confuses me.

I think it's very well written, its cast behaves in-character, and they act very naturally from what is established of them, but... I think that may be a bad thing? At least for me?

There is so much interesting opportunities the show just never really capitalizes on because it takes the logical and clean way out.

Aka, nothing interesting really happens.

It's basically the best show I have been utterly bored by, and it is such a weird position to be in.

That's a common reception for Komura shows. She's great at writing dynamic consistent characters, but her plots aren't so memorable. This worked out for Zenkaiger's formula though, due to each episode having a unique flavor in addition to the main plot.

[DreadBringer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich

Meanwhile, in typical Gavv fashion, Shouma introducing Lakia to Dente immediately has consequences beyond the simple reason he actually went to see him, raising questions both about how Lakia will act on what he learned here and how those actions might contribute to further development for Dente himself. And then on top of that, of course, in the fight at the end, the show makes a point of how Gavv's values as a hero don't line up with Vram's, and demonstrates very clearly how that can present problems in its own right, which I think means I've looped right back to where I started with this post.

This one's clearly just about how Rakia, even though he turned away from the dark side, isn't as virtuous/righteous as Shoma. He's still morally grey/questionable anti-hero as a good guy. The usual conflict when one has to deal with a worse person as their ally, which often happens for Riders outside of the primary one. This one requires either Shoma or Sachika to be a good influence to him. I rather hope Sachika knows Rakia's villainous stint before tbh by this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich

As an episode that's about setting stuff up, it's pretty much overachieving? Every ally Shouma has is put in a position that challenges the status quo, with even Sachika promising to become more directly involved in other parts of the story now that she's fully in the loop. Although of course, Sachika being Sachika, that one isn't a threat to the stability of the status quo the way some of the other stuff is, which makes for a much appreciated reprieve from the drama elsewhere. At least something went right for Shouma this week, you know?

I'd think, most of the human experiences Shoma's in went right. All the food he ate was really delicious, and the people he met were mostly kind to him, not limited to Sachika, but to the other victims of the weeks too like the Nakamura family who'd be also willing to take him in if Sachika's not there. I wonder if he'd also know that there can be those who are put through hell by other humans like he got from the Stomach family, oh that'd be another "humans are the real monsters" trope (perhaps if Suga's villainy would fully resurface and others know his true identity).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Layton13

I think it's very well written, its cast behaves in-character, and they act very naturally from what is established of them, but... I think that may be a bad thing? At least for me?

I guess I understand about your issues here that, while this doesn't sit well with you, for the same reason, this makes Gavv very well-received by others; Gavv seems to be made as a really safe show, where it gives to the audience what they generally would want or expect, fulfilling the stereotypical view they have on how media or humans (for no miscommunication) are supposed to work, without bringing up anything controversial (not dark) that would turn them off, even if it's not actually bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

And Shouma continued to live in the same mansion as his "Lango nii-san" for 18 years after watching him coldly murder Sae. Sachika's right, he escaped from Hell, just like Makoto did.

About Shoma escaping from hell, this'd be something people encourage to not just something as depraved as the Stomach family, but just any people/group who just drains them (e.g. unpleasant or energy vampires), that one should just better cut them off, rather than staying and "fix" them. Perhaps this can apply to good influence Riders, where they often deal with the asshole supporting casts (even though the viewers would know their depth better than real life person acting like that), and also sometimes outright villains, where it'd be likely better if the Riders just cut them off, deeming them as lost causes for their own health, and just replace their companions with the fully supportive ones like Kuuga or Ghost's cast. Like if they're aware that they're in a darker show, and act to move to a lighthearted show. But major & supporting casts would stay for the entire show as a principle...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Seems like Dente also feels guilty about his accidental role in human trafficking and provoked Lakia in to attacking him to get what he feels like he deserves. Makes me wonder if Bouche only took over the business to limit the threat to humans. Unfortunately, his sadistic first son Lango became the next Zombu.

Dente being unaware of the extent of his crimes would make the audience accept him better, as all the blame only goes to Zomb and only he has to get the bad fate that he deserves. It's clear though that Lango and the other siblings don't like Bouche either, and seem to be glad that he died, at least in how they can finally murder Shoma and Michiru. The mystery is how Bouche died. Dunno about implying sympathetic traits for Bouche here when he seems to be the most hated figure in the entire Stomach family, even though the other siblings wouldn't hate him for the right reasons, and that the audience also may hate Bouche more than the other siblings, in how his crimes hit close to home (domestic/child abuse), and that Bouche might be an even bigger source of misery to Shoma than even the other siblings by trapping Shoma in said mansion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

That's a common reception for Komura shows. She's great at writing dynamic consistent characters, but her plots aren't so memorable. This worked out for Zenkaiger's formula though, due to each episode having a unique flavor in addition to the main plot.

In this case, maybe it's the bad side of being perfect instead. For now, Gavv achieves much while having no bad episodes, no bad points, no controversial traits, which perhaps makes the show feel sterile and inorganic instead for them. Perhaps like how people don't like overly perfect such as mary sue characters, but this is applied on a show rather than an individual. Though dunno if I also miss something out from here, as even I noticed flaws from shows like W and OOO (I agree with some of the grievances pointed out by Die, such as Tsukuba's plot twist), which seems to be regarded as perfect in fanbase.

[Hiikomori]

1 episode: I believe in you.

Next episode: I dont wanna see you right now.

geez poor Hanto. what a roller-coaster of emotions.