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08-14-2023, 01:11 PM | #11 |
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08-14-2023, 01:53 PM | #12 |
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08-14-2023, 02:12 PM | #13 |
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I know this is a little late as the reset happened before this episode, but what was the point of Keiwa's wish to revive those who died in the DGP? Sure, we got a few new Riders and the re-death of Keiwa's parents, but literally every Rider that had some significance around their death was nowhere to be found. Shirowe, Ginpen, Letter, and even Michinaga's friend (who's death by the way, was literally the entire basis for Michinaga's motivations), literally are not even mentioned. Why didn't Buffa have at least a small portion of an episode dedicated to finding his friend? Why didn't Ginpen show up to illustrate some contrast with the way Keiwa was at the start of the series versus the way he is now? Letter and Shirowe kind of just showed up to die, so they didn't have a whole of relationships with the others in the show, but to not show up in any capacity?
Seriously, this arc was a bit of the breaking point for me in the show. Why would a bunch of gangsters immediately attack and kill someone after being revived? Like, even if they were revived with memories of what happened in the DGP up until that point, there was literally no reason for them to attack anyone yet as the DGP specifically had rules about attacking anything other than a Jyamato. Even weirder is how they would have had the means to attack anyone, as they would be regular people without belts. Except, if they were brought back with their belts, wouldn't literally every other Rider who died have them as well? Given the reaction to both Danpan and a lesser extant Merry, Riders who would outright attack another player was a rare occurrence, and would have been disqualified before having the change to get killed in the DGP, so how could any actually murderous rider have any odds of overcoming literal hundreds of other Riders who, you know, don't want to die? Plus, the Gang Riders would be completely unarmed (who knows where they got weapon buckles), but if they were revived with their previous gear, Letter would have Propeller, Shirowe and Ginpen would have Arrow, and Togetchi would have Zombie. A lot better odds than just Armed Hammer or Armed Chain Array. |
08-14-2023, 02:33 PM | #14 |
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I know this is a little late as the reset happened before this episode, but what was the point of Keiwa's wish to revive those who died in the DGP? Sure, we got a few new Riders and the re-death of Keiwa's parents, but literally every Rider that had some significance around their death was nowhere to be found. Shirowe, Ginpen, Letter, and even Michinaga's friend (who's death by the way, was literally the entire basis for Michinaga's motivations), literally are not even mentioned. Why didn't Buffa have at least a small portion of an episode dedicated to finding his friend? Why didn't Ginpen show up to illustrate some contrast with the way Keiwa was at the start of the series versus the way he is now? Letter and Shirowe kind of just showed up to die, so they didn't have a whole of relationships with the others in the show, but to not show up in any capacity?
I wrote about this in another thread: the time limit and the desire to set a record for the number of riders in the franchise (and keep it as long as possible). If anything, this is not an excuse, but an explanation. Quote:
Seriously, this arc was a bit of the breaking point for me in the show.
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08-14-2023, 03:13 PM | #15 |
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I know this is a little late as the reset happened before this episode, but what was the point of Keiwa's wish to revive those who died in the DGP? Sure, we got a few new Riders and the re-death of Keiwa's parents, but literally every Rider that had some significance around their death was nowhere to be found. Shirowe, Ginpen, Letter, and even Michinaga's friend (who's death by the way, was literally the entire basis for Michinaga's motivations), literally are not even mentioned.
Michinaga never going to find his friend more or less has to do with the fact that he's always accepted that Tohru was gone. He moved on from the past, and only sought to stop the DGP from continuing to trample on other people. It would've been a bad regression of his character if he went and searched for Tohru. Quote:
Seriously, this arc was a bit of the breaking point for me in the show. Why would a bunch of gangsters immediately attack and kill someone after being revived? Like, even if they were revived with memories of what happened in the DGP up until that point, there was literally no reason for them to attack anyone yet as the DGP specifically had rules about attacking anything other than a Jyamato. Even weirder is how they would have had the means to attack anyone, as they would be regular people without belts. Except, if they were brought back with their belts, wouldn't literally every other Rider who died have them as well?
So they could've easily made it so that the wish gave only the criminal and more antagonistic DGP Riders their memories and gear back, and the DGP could've just told them that they could've gone on a riot with what they got (and heck, Beroba had to go out of her way to give Kanato his gear back, so it wasn't instant for all of them). And that any of the more law-abiding DGP Riders were just not given back their memories or gear. Like I'm pretty sure that resurrected Sara before she died referred to Turbon as a "guy in a weird mask" rather than a "Kamen Rider", so she wasn't brought back with her memories. As for meta reasons as to why we don't see previous other Riders from earlier coming back. Simply scheduling issues, the fact that they've retooled helmets pretty heavily (especially the Mary helmet), and just the fact that it would just be too many actors to bring back. Hell, I didn't even think they were going to bring back Kanato/Da-Paan until they did. Quote:
I wrote about this in another thread: the time limit and the desire to set a record for the number of riders in the franchise (and keep it as long as possible). If anything, this is not an excuse, but an explanation.
It seems to me that Takahashi finally decided to test the boundaries of what was permitted in order to make a note to himself for the future. Geats is a popular show and it is unlikely that the absurdities in the ending will greatly change the opinion of the audience, who idolized it for a whole year. And the screenwriter will know what stupid things will be forgiven him, and for which he will be scolded. Last edited by MKDremare; 08-14-2023 at 03:15 PM.. |
08-14-2023, 03:26 PM | #16 |
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That seems like an awfully negative light to cast on Takahashi. Like I could say the same thing about Inoue and his writing. Like this is just kind of an unnecessary jab at his character. Like I don't like Inoue's writing (and if I'm honest, Donbrothers is in the same boat as Geats as being idolized for a whole year), but I don't feel like I need to jab it at it like this.
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08-14-2023, 03:42 PM | #17 |
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But I think otherwise. It's better than saying he's just bad at writing or giving weak endings. Most likely, this is even praise, because it is unlikely that the show is completely dependent on the scriptwriter and, most likely, many different people and factors influenced the plot twists. In any case, about Fukuda and the same Inouye spoke much more badly and unambiguously. If Takahashi was offended by this, I'm sorry, but that's up to him.
At least with saying that they're a bad writer, it doesn't feel like an implication of character, just skill. And even then, people argue back and forth over if Fukuda and Inoue are good writers or not. |
08-14-2023, 03:50 PM | #18 |
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I dunno, I think saying "I think this is Takahashi testing to see what stupid things he can get away with and what will get him scolded" is worse than just saying that they're a bad writer or write weak endings. Because it implies that they're not taking writing the story seriously, instead of just a lack of skill that needs to be improved on.
In any case, if somebody spoke about me like that, I would not be offended. |
08-14-2023, 04:23 PM | #19 |
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Keiwa's wish wasn't really something he fully desired, to be honest. What he really wanted was a safe and happy world with his sister, which is what Ace even questioned him about early on in the season. He only clung onto that wish because he never actually had any clearly stated goals before, and he just focused in on that by putting a lot of value into it for himself. When she died, he only clung onto the wish even harder.
Michinaga never going to find his friend more or less has to do with the fact that he's always accepted that Tohru was gone. He moved on from the past, and only sought to stop the DGP from continuing to trample on other people. It would've been a bad regression of his character if he went and searched for Tohru. They clearly pointed out that Jitt/Zitt was the Game Master of Bad Ends, and hinted that he had a hand in making Keiwa's wish go the way that it did. It was a wish that, while more specific than his first wish of world peace, was still vague enough that they could maneuver around it to make it work to their advantage. And it isn't like the DGP isn't necessarily above changing and adding rules, too. So they could've easily made it so that the wish gave only the criminal and more antagonistic DGP Riders their memories and gear back, and the DGP could've just told them that they could've gone on a riot with what they got (and heck, Beroba had to go out of her way to give Kanato his gear back, so it wasn't instant for all of them). And that any of the more law-abiding DGP Riders were just not given back their memories or gear. Like I'm pretty sure that resurrected Sara before she died referred to Turbon as a "guy in a weird mask" rather than a "Kamen Rider", so she wasn't brought back with her memories. As for meta reasons as to why we don't see previous other Riders from earlier coming back. Simply scheduling issues, the fact that they've retooled helmets pretty heavily (especially the Mary helmet), and just the fact that it would just be too many actors to bring back. Hell, I didn't even think they were going to bring back Kanato/Da-Paan until they did. . As for the rest, the problem is that none of that is stated. Could Jit have manipulated the wish? Possibly, but it is never shown, stated, or even implied that someone else tampered in the outcome somehow. I guess it's just a really odd choice (a lot of that in Geats). Kind of like if Revice had an event where Stamps got out to the general public for easy access/manufacturing but then literally nothing comes of it. Or if in Saber the Wonder World merged with the real world but somehow the worlds don't have any conflicts or actual interactions. Is that possible? Yes, but it would be poor storytelling. |
08-14-2023, 04:42 PM | #20 |
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Except, throughout the show (in the Mary focus episode, the episodes where the Jyamato with Tohru's likeness and memories) Michinaga didn't seem to move on at all from the past, just shifted his focus to ending the DGP. That and it seems strange that Michinaga knows the benefits of working with others (working with Geats, his interactions with Keiwa and Neon) so it's odd that he didn't try at all. Not a plot hole, but quite a bit out of character.
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We don't need to see Jitt manipulating the wish on screen, we know that it's possible for the wishes to be manipulated to the DGP's advantage because we've seen it with Girori influencing it so that only he and Tsumuri were now Ace's "family" with the wish in Encounter. If Ace's wish was fulfilled to the letter, every single staff member of the DGP should've become Ace's family. But it was only the two that he knew that on a personal level. By the fact that Jitt stated that he was the Game Master of Bad Ends and our knowledge of previous skirting around wish boundaries, we can make the simple connection that he most likely had a hand in what happened. It isn't poor storytelling as much as it is trusting the audience to at least remember a few details from previous episodes to make a reasonable connection, while also allowing them to make their own ideas as to what reasonably could've happened. |
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