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07-22-2021, 05:39 PM | #1 |
TokuKnight89
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Central Louisiana (Cenla)
Posts: 2,558
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Since many over in the Revice thread think that the revelation surrounding Subaru Kimura's blackface controversy needs its own thread, I think it's a good idea to make a thread about any and all tokusatsu scandals regarding cast and crew and how that can affect people negatively and whether our love for a show involving multiple people can be affected by the misdeeds of one person.
Let's be clear: What Kimura did is NOT OKAY!!! There is no justification for being that damn stupid! Many are saying that watching Revice will not indicate support for Kimura's actions nor put any money into Kimura's pocket. There is a certain amount of truth to that, but there is also something to be said about loving a show and NOT calling out someone's misdeeds! I don't think we can ever truly forget this fact nor should we. It happened, and Kimura needs to realize what he did wrong in order to make-up for it. Toei should also recognize that if they intend to push Kamen Rider in the West, then scandals involving the people who work on these shows could affect how these shows are received and whether someone's financially-detached love of a scandal-involved show will affect how much financial support is given to further the Western distribution of that show! I myself am not happy with this Revice revelation, but I also haven't made a final decision regarding Revice The Show either! I won't demonize a fansub group who opts to sub Revice, but I also won't complain if another fansub group opts out of subbing Revice either. I'm also not going to complain if people choose to watch Revice and comment on it. However, I will not hesitate to remind anyone that THIS HAPPENED and that it SHOULDN'T BE IGNORED NOR FORGOTTEN!!! Love the designs and the show, but not the VA! I'll also admit that I've recently been re-watching Kyuranger and this affects that too! I'm not ready to totally say no to Kyuranger yet, but I have no immediate desire to emulate the vocal stylings of the Seiza Blaster either! In a perfect world, Toei would issue a statement saying that they take this seriously and while the show will start with Kimura's voice, the character of Vice will be re-cast prior to completion and that Blu-Ray, DVD, and Streaming will be delayed so that they can re-dub all of the earlier episodes with a different actor who can approximate whatever voice Kimura will use for Vice. Again, I see this as the best of a bad situation, but I'm not all that optimistic about it happening either. The best we can really hope for is that Toei will be more conscientious regarding the hiring of actors and VA in the future. It should also be noted that the misdeeds of Kimura are not the only time such matters happen either! The guy from Gaim comes to mind. Does the Revice scandal affect your early affection for Revice? Will you watch the show, or have you not yet made a decision? Have similar scandals in the past affected your love for older shows? Do you hope Toei is paying attention and will make changes in the future? Share here. Last edited by TokuKnight89; 07-22-2021 at 05:45 PM.. |
07-22-2021, 05:46 PM | #2 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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… this is an extremely loaded thread title, wow
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07-22-2021, 05:53 PM | #3 |
Banned
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 667
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nope
I'm not so fucking delusional that I'm incapable of enjoying an actor's work without condoning their actions. there are so many worse scandals even in toku alone and they never affected my enjoyment or the enjoyment of many others. Last edited by Chasing; 07-22-2021 at 06:13 PM.. |
07-22-2021, 06:37 PM | #4 |
WONDER RIDER
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,730
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Yes and No.
Yes in that when someone does something I don't agree with, I tend to get a bit riled up sometimes. No in that I am still capable of enjoying someone's work despite the unfortunate things they have done.
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07-22-2021, 06:58 PM | #5 |
Bat Hero
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 296
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I'm a bit mixed.
I won't be watching the show, but I still wanna keep up with it because I'm curious as to how it will do with all the 50th anniversary stuff. Currently thinking of watching henshins and keeping up with toy reviews and scans, but not watching the show. I have a hard time separating actor and character. I can sometimes do that for the shows I really love. But for the most part I struggle with that. If Vice gets dubbed over, which is unlikely given Kimura's popularity AFAIK, I'll consider watching the show. If someone from Ex-Aid/Ghost/Saber/(insert another show I like) was revealed as lgbt-phobic or racist, of course I'd take issue with it. Would that affect my enjoyment of the show? Kinda. But would I still like the show? Of course, though it might be knocked down a few places, maybe. And yet this is a show I haven't seen because it's new and hasn't aired yet. With a problematic actor in a major role, and who voiced a changer from a show I absolutely love (even though I'm only on episode 7). So I'm a bit confused on how to handle all this. I get that people take umbridge with people boycotting Revice because of this. And yet it doesn't really affect the show or sales or anything. Toys will still be bought by online stores to sell. The show will still be aired and will make ratings. So it really just comes down to personal preference, same as any other show aired in the past. Except a wrench was thrown in this time. I'm happy for those who can separate characters from their actors (i.e. "Vice is played by Vice, Kimura who?"). But for me? I struggle to do it sometimes. Especially since I was looking so much to Revice. I feel like what I plan on doing might be a good middle ground. I dunno. I'm so confused. |
07-22-2021, 07:49 PM | #6 |
Fangirl-Type Humagear
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 703
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I feel like for a work of fiction, I'd be more affected if it was the writer who did something bigoted, because then I'd be constantly wondering if their bigotry was leaking into the story. Like if Revice's writer turned out to be a racist, I couldn't watch the show without thinking "is this character a racist stereotype? Is this conflict racially coded? Is this show subtly teaching kids that racism is okay?" because fiction can have a lot more influence than we realize on how we think and I don't want it to influence me in a bad way.
But with actors I can usually separate them from their characters, especially since Vice won't even have Kimura's face. Just like how nice actors can play evil villains, jerkish actors can, unfortunately, play heroes. And since I doubt the actors and writers have much say in who they're cast to work with, I don't fault anyone else for working on Revice except whatever casting director picked Kimura for the role. I also (and this might be weird) think whether or not you enable an artist who does bad things to keep doing said bad things matters a whole lot more than whether you actually support their views, because you can claim to disagree with someone all you want but if you're still giving them money and a platform you're still helping them keep doing whatever it is you claim to be against. And none of us here matter enough to Toei for us to enable Kimura one way or the other. So I won't feel any guilt at all for watching Revice and (hopefully) enjoying it. I'll probably avoid complementing Vice's actor and just direct any praise to Vice himself, but that's as far as I think my responsibility goes. I also think being able to enjoy and criticize something simultaneously is a necessary skill. Because if you can't enjoy anything with problems, soon you'll find yourself with nothing to enjoy at all. BUT if enjoying something blinds you to its problems, then people can slip all kinds of toxic ideas into your head without you even noticing. While I'm rambling, I do think a lot of the fear and outrage about cancel culture/political correctness/witch hunts/whatever they're calling it this week is overblown, and without getting too tinfoil-hat about it, I think some of it is intentionally cultivated. People do legitimately bad things that they really should face consequences for, then instead of admitting they screwed up they start crying "there's an angry mob out to get me! They'll come after anyone these days! YOU could be next!" to make themself seem like the victim and get innocent bystanders on their side. But that's not super relevant to the Revice situation so I'll stop now.
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The mask you wear by choice shows more about you than the face you were given by chance. |
07-22-2021, 08:29 PM | #7 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: CA
Posts: 2,499
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Let me start off by saying that there's absolutely no way this topic doesn't eventually get locked.
That being said, while I personally have no issue separating the art from the artist, I see nothing wrong with somebody not wanting to support the work of people who do crummy things. People want to see others held accountable for the crappy things that they do, and when the powers that be don't hold them accountable, people take things into their own hands. In fact, I find the outrage against "cancel culture" to be far more annoying than "cancel culture" itself. I wasn't planning on watching Revice either way - I hate watching shows as they air, and I have far too many other things in my life that take priority over it. edit: As others have said...the rest of the cast and crew have done nothing wrong, so if you're on the fence about whether to watch it...watch it for their sake. Also, I fixed a typo.
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Last edited by EpsilonX; 07-22-2021 at 11:49 PM.. |
07-22-2021, 08:51 PM | #8 |
I have a problematic type
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,430
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It probably should, but I'm kind of jaded by this point. There are only so many times that you can find out that someone involved in a piece of media that you care about is a scumbag before you just have to swear off media in general. If it was someone more directly involved in the creation than a voice actor or if the prejudice was worked into the story, then that would be a different situation. The voice actor isn't the only person involved in the show and it's not fair to punish everyone involved just because one of their castmates is an asshole.
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07-22-2021, 09:30 PM | #9 |
Kaiju or Hero?
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Even I Don't Know Anymore.
Posts: 1,398
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Okay... I wasn't intending to get involved in this, but just to clear any misconceptions about me looking forward to, and potentially enjoying Revice, I'm going to say my piece.
Now, I don't like getting into these kinds of discussions, one of the reasons I'm avoiding social media like the plague. Just hearing anything about controversy and cancel culture is depressing, and that's something I have enough of, but I feel I need to get this off my chest. Just as FairyKing said, at least it's not the writer or any other high ranking executive who supports acts like this. Should I come out of Revice and Vice ends up being my favorite character, it will be for Vice and Vice alone. I do not support his inappropriate acts, but that will not prevent me from enjoying this show, or any other piece of media. I'm going to end this with a famous line: "Nobody's Perfect." Last edited by Daikaijuman54; 07-22-2021 at 10:04 PM.. |
07-23-2021, 01:40 AM | #10 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 761
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Lol @ “Cancel Culture”…. that’s Projection. It’s actually CONSEQUENCES for your actions Culture..
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