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07-23-2021, 04:43 AM | #11 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,301
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Quote:
I feel like for a work of fiction, I'd be more affected if it was the writer who did something bigoted, because then I'd be constantly wondering if their bigotry was leaking into the story. Like if Revice's writer turned out to be a racist, I couldn't watch the show without thinking "is this character a racist stereotype? Is this conflict racially coded? Is this show subtly teaching kids that racism is okay?" because fiction can have a lot more influence than we realize on how we think and I don't want it to influence me in a bad way.
But with actors I can usually separate them from their characters, especially since Vice won't even have Kimura's face. Just like how nice actors can play evil villains, jerkish actors can, unfortunately, play heroes. And since I doubt the actors and writers have much say in who they're cast to work with, I don't fault anyone else for working on Revice except whatever casting director picked Kimura for the role. I also (and this might be weird) think whether or not you enable an artist who does bad things to keep doing said bad things matters a whole lot more than whether you actually support their views, because you can claim to disagree with someone all you want but if you're still giving them money and a platform you're still helping them keep doing whatever it is you claim to be against. And none of us here matter enough to Toei for us to enable Kimura one way or the other. So I won't feel any guilt at all for watching Revice and (hopefully) enjoying it. I'll probably avoid complementing Vice's actor and just direct any praise to Vice himself, but that's as far as I think my responsibility goes. I also think being able to enjoy and criticize something simultaneously is a necessary skill. Because if you can't enjoy anything with problems, soon you'll find yourself with nothing to enjoy at all. BUT if enjoying something blinds you to its problems, then people can slip all kinds of toxic ideas into your head without you even noticing. While I'm rambling, I do think a lot of the fear and outrage about cancel culture/political correctness/witch hunts/whatever they're calling it this week is overblown, and without getting too tinfoil-hat about it, I think some of it is intentionally cultivated. People do legitimately bad things that they really should face consequences for, then instead of admitting they screwed up they start crying "there's an angry mob out to get me! They'll come after anyone these days! YOU could be next!" to make themself seem like the victim and get innocent bystanders on their side. But that's not super relevant to the Revice situation so I'll stop now. |
07-23-2021, 08:10 AM | #12 |
The False Hero
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Mount Myoboku
Posts: 36
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If i'm not wrong Kimura has apologized to public shortly after the Blackface.
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07-23-2021, 08:39 AM | #13 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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I never saw any apology? From what i know he deleted it and blocked anyone who brought it up. Which could mean a lot of things
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07-23-2021, 10:11 AM | #14 |
Zenryoku Zenkai!
Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 372
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I've never seen any evidence of an apology from him, or even any acknowledgment it happened at all, just the classic delete and block
If im wrong and someone has a source of any apology or acknowledgement I'd be interested in seeing it tho |
07-24-2021, 02:22 PM | #15 |
Zenryoku Zenkai!
Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 372
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Only sort of on topic but I feel like this is worth mentioning
Recently people were bullying Taka of kotetsu-toys-japan.jp, calling him a racist for selling revice toys I feel like this shouldn't need to be said, but don't bully people over this stuff please If you want to send Toei politely worded emails, or calmly make others aware of the situation that's fine But bullying sub groups, toy sellers, or fans just for subbing the show, selling toys, or enjoying the show is super uncool Buying (and especially reselling) toys will not directly support Kimura financially, if you are choosing to not buy this line of toys because you don't want to show Toei (who do still make profit off the toys to my understanding) support in their casting decision, that is a choice I completely understand, but people buying toys they think they'll enjoy does not make them racist, and people continuing to sell toys that they rely on selling to make a living is certainly not racist However if you see people on social media saying stuff like "I support Kimura, why can't anyone take a joke anymore! I'm going to watch the show to support him!" that's obviously different, you don't need to support those people, but even then I'd say try to calmly disagree with them, then you can always mute or block them if they start bothering you, it is never okay to harass anyone This is also just not the situation with Taka... Taka is a super nice guy, he's very patient and understanding, and he doesn't deserve to be harassed (like I said nobody does) I've bought things from Taka before and he's been very patient with me when I've had trouble getting money together to pay for my pre-orders, he's a total sweetheart I know a lot of us are upset with everything going on but please do not harass anyone Last edited by TheJaz; 07-24-2021 at 10:38 PM.. |
07-24-2021, 02:53 PM | #16 |
TokuKnight89
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Central Louisiana (Cenla)
Posts: 2,553
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Quote:
Only sort of on topic but I feel like this is worth mentioning
Recently people were bulling Taka of kotetsu-toys-japan.jp, calling him a racist for selling revice toys I feel like this shouldn't need to be said, but don't bully people over this stuff please If you want to send Toei politely worded emails, or calmly make others aware of the situation that's fine But bullying sub groups, toy sellers, or fans just for subbing the show, selling toys, or enjoying the show is super uncool Buying (and especially reselling) toys will not directly support Kimura, if you are choosing to not buy this line of toys because you don't want to show Toei support in their casting decision is a choice I completely understand, but people buying toys they think they'll enjoy does not make them racist, and people continuing to sell toys that they rely on selling to make a living is certainly not racist If you see people saying "I support Kimura, why can't anyone take a joke anymore! I'm going to watch the show to support him!" that's obviously different, you don't need to support those people, but even then I'd say either calmly disagree with them, you can always mute or block them if they start bothering you, it is never okay to harass anyone This is also just not the situation with Taka... Taka is a super nice guy, he's very patient and understanding, and he doesn't deserve to be harassed (like I said nobody does) I've bought things from Taka before and he's been very patient with me when I've had trouble getting money together to pay for my pre-orders, he's a total sweetheart I know a lot of us are upset with everything going on but please do not harass anyone |
07-24-2021, 03:28 PM | #17 |
Comin' up OOOs!
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: A place where imports are impossible to find, NY
Posts: 2,431
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When it comes to scandals and issues like with Kimura's past actions, the way I see it is as follows:
It shouldn't be ignored and should be pointed out as an issue. Especially if Toei wishes to expand the brand out to other countries more heavily. It's something they should acknowledge as problematic for their potential overseas viewerbase. While some issues western fans have with JP media get super over-blown to the point where I don't even blame JP creators from ignoring them outright, stuff like this shouldn't be ignored. THAT SAID...You're not doing a disservice to anyone if you still decide to watch the series or purchase and goods. Kimura's paycheck comes from Toei. We pirate the stuff, thus no money goes to the show. We buy the merch, but that goes to Bandai. If someone chooses not to support Revice for any reason connected to Kimura and his actions, that's 100% respectable and understandable. If someone acknowledges the issues but still wishes to watch Revice and purchase any goods because they're able to look at the show on its own, again that's 100% respectable and understandable. But if you suddenly think that either people aren't watching it over something trivial or meaningless OR you think that anyone still watching or buying Revice merch supports the problem and is racist or anything, you're completely out of line and need to sit down, shut up and re-think the situation and people's threshholds. I acknowledge that Kimura is problematic and would be more than okay if he were replaced at some point. I also know that I will be watching Revice and buying the Figuarts because I'm able to detach the actor from the show (Even moreso since he's just a voice). Does that mean I'm racist? No. And neither is anyone else with that same mindset. It's one thing to spread awareness. It's another to try to force ideals on others and witch hunt those who don't respond the exact way you do.
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07-25-2021, 11:11 AM | #18 |
New Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 13
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Quote:
Only sort of on topic but I feel like this is worth mentioning
Recently people were bullying Taka of kotetsu-toys-japan.jp, calling him a racist for selling revice toys I feel like this shouldn't need to be said, but don't bully people over this stuff please If you want to send Toei politely worded emails, or calmly make others aware of the situation that's fine But bullying sub groups, toy sellers, or fans just for subbing the show, selling toys, or enjoying the show is super uncool Buying (and especially reselling) toys will not directly support Kimura financially, if you are choosing to not buy this line of toys because you don't want to show Toei (who do still make profit off the toys to my understanding) support in their casting decision, that is a choice I completely understand, but people buying toys they think they'll enjoy does not make them racist, and people continuing to sell toys that they rely on selling to make a living is certainly not racist However if you see people on social media saying stuff like "I support Kimura, why can't anyone take a joke anymore! I'm going to watch the show to support him!" that's obviously different, you don't need to support those people, but even then I'd say try to calmly disagree with them, then you can always mute or block them if they start bothering you, it is never okay to harass anyone This is also just not the situation with Taka... Taka is a super nice guy, he's very patient and understanding, and he doesn't deserve to be harassed (like I said nobody does) I've bought things from Taka before and he's been very patient with me when I've had trouble getting money together to pay for my pre-orders, he's a total sweetheart I know a lot of us are upset with everything going on but please do not harass anyone |
07-27-2021, 07:27 AM | #19 |
New Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 32
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To answer the question: Context matters.
I don't know the full context on everything the guy has done. First thing I've seen of these "allegations" was that linked tweet. That one seems totally on par with the dark humour I see. I don't know whether the guy actually was attacking any people or culture actively with malicious intention. I've grown up watching different shows on TV where there's a lot of "blackface" done with all the motifs of "Beware of those who you call ugly back in high school". Usually ends up the "mocked" character becomes "the result of doing good plastic surgery with whiter, fairer skin and all and now the one your lover(s) wants to f*** instead". Who knows... I'm totally blind with all the stuff he did. He probably committed actual physical acts of discrimination or assault against people from different ethnicity and culture. One of pure malicious intent. That's actually where I draw the line and start protesting. If everything he has done was just on the level as the one from that tweet. I really don't see any reason to go full ham with the "cancelling". Protest is understandable and encouraged to voice discontent but going beyond the line is just a big no-no. Taka's getting involved too so I'm truly worried. While we should not dismiss all the horrible things a person has done, the domino effect of voicing complaints against one guy to involving figures whose work is to sell toys with harassment is just outrageous. For me, this isn't the same level as with Monica Rial and Sabat where actual harm is fully done.
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07-27-2021, 07:43 AM | #20 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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Can someone please tell me what they mean by “””cancelling””” already it’s thrown around so much as a scary word but as far as i can tell means fucking nothing
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