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03-20-2022, 10:58 AM | #261 |
The Immortal King Tasty
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Every diner you've ever been to.
Posts: 3,833
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(Fish Sandwich also watched Kamen Rider Zi-O - EP09)
I feel like I was a bit unnecessarily hard on this one at the time. Like, I guess I was just particularly burned out on Genm back then or something. I imagine this is another early Zi-O episode I'd only enjoy more on a rewatch. Looking back, I also genuinely appreciate how out there the premise of Sougo apprenticing himself to an egomaniac is? There's something I've come to very consciously value about Rider shows over the years, and it's basically whenever I can see the show going "what's something only this particular show could do?" This is a story that makes Sougo look completely insane to a degree that risks feeling like a bit of a stretch, but at the same time, the fact that you can stretch Sougo's character that far to begin with is a testament to what makes him stand out as a protagonist.
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03-20-2022, 03:08 PM | #262 |
New Member
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Evanston IL.
Posts: 95
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Shunpei is one worst side characters in the entire franchise along with Onari.
That man boy shtick pissed me off. |
03-20-2022, 06:18 PM | #263 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
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Quote:
This is a story that makes Sougo look completely insane to a degree that risks feeling like a bit of a stretch, but at the same time, the fact that you can stretch Sougo's character that far to begin with is a testament to what makes him stand out as a protagonist.
...because you normally make your title character the head villain, not the henchman.
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03-20-2022, 08:14 PM | #264 |
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KAMEN RIDER ZI-O EPISODE 10 - “HAWK, TIGER, AND GRASSHOPPER 2010”
I sort of saw what Sougo was going for last episode, so this one didn’t surprise me a lot with its motivations or reveals. He wants to learn what not to do as an overlord, so he decides to spend time with Kuroto. The surprises were in how they’d walk back some of Sougo’s more villainous activities, and how the Time Orphans would forgive him. I was definitely surprised by how bad the answers were? Like, last episode let everyone see that Sougo’s goal-oriented mindset is maybe more immediately problematic than everyone feared. Geiz and Tsukuyomi thought they had a lot of time before there’d be any warning signs that Sougo might be on the wrong path; they were not expecting it to be in the fifth story of the season. Sougo was acting as the (hilariously) cheerful henchman to a (hilariously) bombastic villain, and real people were getting hurt. This isn’t just something Sougo could say My Bad to, and it wasn’t something that Tsukuyomi and Geiz could just overlook. So, naturally, Sougo says My Bad, and the Time Orphans overlook it. I wouldn’t say it squanders the intriguing character work of the previous episode, because Sougo’s explanations have such specificity and flavor to them that it’s hard to call this chapter a failure. His definition of Good Despot as someone who’s, like, an elected king (ridiculous!) is a little bit more reasonable than some warlord who everyone likes. He’s talking about the Magna Carta, but for Kamen Riders who control time and space. The idea that he’ll know he’s being a good person as long as he can take criticism and guidance is a pretty neat one. It’s a way of talking about history as something that doesn’t have a static value, but becomes good or bad based on people’s insights. That’s a nicely thematic way of framing things for Sougo. (If anything, I think Eiji’s role as Man Of The People is more crucial to his role in this story than the OOO catchphrases or whatever. The thing that Sougo’s talking about being, a kind leader who serves at his subjects' request… that’s an elected official! That’s someone in representative government! Just run for office, kid!) But the details of this episode are DUMB. They’re so dumb! The big two problems are in Sougo’s defense, and the Time Orphans’ forgiveness. Sougo commits a whole bunch of terrible acts in the past two episodes – injuring Geiz, assisting a man who is turning innocents into monsters, imprisoning dissenters – and yet he keeps assuring his friends that he hasn’t done anything wrong yet. HE HAS! HE COMPLETELY HAS! We’re well past some hypothetical moment where Sougo could possibly maybe do horrible things in pursuit of his goals. He did them! Last episode! And he doesn’t really seem to think they’re worth more than a Mea Culpa! We don’t get some huge realization that he’s in over his head, or a stern rebuke from any of the other/actual good guys in the story. He’s just like Changed My Mind, and smiles his way through everyone’s incredulity. And that incredulity is frustratingly short-lived, especially in Tsukuyomi and Geiz. They’re both acutely aware of Sougo’s possibly villainous future, but they seem to think this brief moment of adjacent villainy was some weird bump in the road… while we’ve been told from Episode 1 that it’s the path they’re most afraid he’ll take. I don’t – for a single second – understand why this wouldn’t be the breaking point for the two of them. I get why Sougo would behave the way he does, mostly, but I don’t understand why Tsukuyomi and Geiz would think he’s worthy of another chance. It makes for an episode that has a few really fantastic scenes (Sougo’s speech at the end to Kuroto; Sougo excitedly running to meet Geiz so Geiz can kill him; Hina using her super-strength multiple times, just for me), but makes its characters view really big moments as small, insignificant blips. I liked the way it expanded Sougo’s character, but I wish it didn’t come at the expense of the Time Orphans’ believability. — KAMEN RIDER ZI-O COMPLEMENTATION PROJECT EPISODE 10.5 - “MOURI VS SHIMOYAMA” Ha ha ha, MAN, I was apparently not the only one who thought this story didn’t work out great for the series-long arcs of its characters! This one basically goes It Was A Guest-Writer, and just throws that dude under the bus. I was, weirdly, kinder to the last two episodes than the cast and crew of this .5 episode? I thought it had some interesting moves for Sougo’s character, with a troubling lack of repercussions, but this short starts with Sougo going Why Did I Do Any Of That. That is… man! Cold blooded! I mean, not totally out of hand, though? If it’s by a guest-writer, I can see him not totally getting the boundaries of Team Zi-O. He gets Sougo pretty right by the end, but Sougo interning for a warlord should probably have been a red line for the Time Orphans. Things get a little too zany, and it hurts me to say that. I may not’ve loved all of Episode 10, but I appreciate 10.5’s honesty.
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03-20-2022, 08:37 PM | #265 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
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Also! Episode 10 had maybe my favorite Legend Rider appearance to date:
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03-20-2022, 08:38 PM | #266 |
Some guy. I'm alright.
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,399
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Watching this episode with a friend who's seen seasons I haven't has been a great time so far, as it helped to highlight things that I'd obviously miss out on. For example, having Dan be Another OOO is surprisingly smart, as from what I gather Dan is basically the exact opposite to Eiji in just about every regard. Add onto that the cool fights, the raised stakes due to Geiz and Tsukuyomi delaying their mission, and the far better justification of our main character's' actions(and the casts reactions thereof) than what Decade ever did made for a great time.
Oh right, speaking of which, there was one other thing I was happy to see, even if it did end up being minimal. Eiji Hino, or as my friend likes to call him sometimes, Hobo Rider. Eiji is one of the few main protagonists in this franchise who ended up being my favorite character of the season they came from. While I found the overall plot of OOO to be rather dumb, his personal journey alongside the rest of the cast of OOO(Ankh, Hina, Goto, etc), swiftly made OOO my second-favorite season the moment it ended, only bolstered by every extra bit of OOO content I've seen being something I've really enjoyed, these Zi-O episodes included. (I also ended up relating to him far more than what I probably should) And on a personal note, OOO deciding to highlight the beauty in just how deep platonic relationships can go is also something I'll always appreciate, and is why I feel the relationship between Eiji and Ankh continues to be THE big thing alot of people remember about the season. And it's all the better that way, I think.
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03-20-2022, 08:45 PM | #267 |
take me to space
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,406
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The .5 makes it sound like this episode was such a wacky diversion from the norm so far, but it just seemed like the usual to me! But if someone thought that maybe the characters were possibly out-of-character, maybe like, bring that up to the writer to do something about it, instead of noting it down for skit material??
Anyway, I want to just mention the designs of the suits again since the OOO Armour reminded me just how silly (I mean that affectionately) the whole incorporation of the words are. Like all the suits and weapons and their feet have these handy labels on them, and just imagine how much stupider they all look if Japanese was your native language. Or rather, imagine if on their faces and weapons and everything were English words in a bold, upper-case, wacky font. Also yeah, it was mentioned already but I have a grudge against the Genm Armour because it was the only of his armour times they made a SHFiguart of. Ghost Armour would been ideal but I would have taken Ex-Aid, or even Geiz's own version of Build. |
03-20-2022, 08:57 PM | #268 |
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Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: World of Ataru
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I want to note that Nobuhiro Mouri is less of a guest writer and more or less secondary writer filling in for our main writer several areas of the show. And this is his first outing I feel like he gets better eith understading the cast dynamic as the show goes along and by the end I'd even conisder the guy one of favorite writer for Kamen Rider.
I'd also like the fact that Geiz goes away after this which does set up some consequence for Sougo actions and what happens next. And the fact that Eiji has a red feather and a Tajador Watch with him break my heart man. In general I think Diet!Eiji maybe favaorite time altered Legend becuase it shows that the people have done their homework Eiji flashback, to his background as his parents are acrual politician in a timeline where he never becomes OOO this is something I can see him doing.
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03-20-2022, 09:29 PM | #269 |
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Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 685
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Quote:
Anyway, I want to just mention the designs of the suits again since the OOO Armour reminded me just how silly (I mean that affectionately) the whole incorporation of the words are. Like all the suits and weapons and their feet have these handy labels on them, and just imagine how much stupider they all look if Japanese was your native language. Or rather, imagine if on their faces and weapons and everything were English words in a bold, upper-case, wacky font.
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03-20-2022, 09:38 PM | #270 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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Quote:
Quote:
Anyway, I want to just mention the designs of the suits again since the OOO Armour reminded me just how silly (I mean that affectionately) the whole incorporation of the words are. Like all the suits and weapons and their feet have these handy labels on them, and just imagine how much stupider they all look if Japanese was your native language. Or rather, imagine if on their faces and weapons and everything were English words in a bold, upper-case, wacky font.
He does, but it mostly plays like Geiz is running away from home because he's conflicted about his feelings for Sougo. Like, dude is muttering to himself that he is DEFINITELY not Sougo's friend, which... I don't know if it plays so much like Sougo ruined things. Feels like a different vibe!
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