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08-22-2022, 07:30 AM | #901 |
本当のクロスセイバー
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Himitsu
Posts: 168
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Everyone is talking about how great Fukuzoe was that they forgot my boy, Yamashita. It's only after my second rewatch that I started to appreciate the amount of gag and comedy that Yamashita brought and also elevated Fukuzoe's moments. Fukuzoe and Shesta giving dogeza was nice, Yamashita also GAVE dogeza was perfection. He is firmly my favorite 'underrated' side character for me.
That aside, I agree with everyone's opinions on how great this as an penultimate episode. In the late stage of Zero-One, it's pretty hard to see a build-up and plot progression episode like this with such a concise precision and an enjoyable pacing. From the Fukuzoe Co. dogeza, Yua calming the Humagears protestants, Gai giving back AIMS in Yua's responsibility, Williamson's satisfied smile, and so on. Even with my critic for Fuwa a few episodes ago, undoubtedly it's fitting that Fuwa was the one who tried the hardest to bring Aruto back. If there's one nitpick here, I don't like how they used Ikazuchi to stop Horobi. By the time, Horobi said what Ikazuchi would do if Subaru was killed by humans, Ikazuchi basically got a memory overheat after that. A bit of shame from an otherwise satisfying episode. It would be better if Horobi and Ikazuchi could engage in one last par, akin to Fuwa and Aruto. That could be used as a testimony for Horobi's Ark-Scorpion power later. I wish I could put more images on my posts like Die did but it was a bit of hassle. This episode gave some engaging and acrobatic shots here and there. I LOVE the fight between Zero-Two and Vulcan here. It was less a fight and more of Aruto swatting a fly when he was trying to walk away. It was only after Aruto was fed up by Fuwa's constant meddling that the show used Ark-One's dark room visual. Seeing Aruto in that dark room with sparks were genuinely terrifying and heartbreaking. Kudos for Fuwa to be the ONLY one to land a clear hit to Zero-Two and even Aruto was a bit astounded that Fuwa's fist did land on him. Even small details like Zero-Two didn't move an inch when Vulcan was trying his best to give one final punch; Aruto had already read Fuwa's final fist won't land on him a second time. One of my favorite shots in this episode was the shot when Azu was hugging Aruto from the back. That basically described Aruto's mental health that time. I think the biggest reason why Aruto perfectly accepted Azu's temptation was simply because he NEEDED Izu. The reason why Aruto donned the Ark-One's suit was simply to feel the presence of Izu, or at least someone similar to her. If anyone read Ark-One body parts on the Wikia, there's a part called Ark Signal One somewhere in the helmet. That part gave the user somewhat a calm and relieving sensation even if we saw how aggressive Ark-One was on the outside. That shot of Aruto and Azu might perfectly describe the sensation of Ark Signal One. Aruto could NOT move on from Izu's death and he let himself to be drowned in basically ecstasy just to feel Izu was on his side no matter how fake it was.
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08-22-2022, 09:34 AM | #902 |
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Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,290
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I don't know if Horobi has an "utter hatred for humanity"? This part of his character arc is about when you've been steeped in a hateful culture for your whole life, and now you have the opportunity to make up your own mind. He was never really wronged by humanity. No one has a grudge against him that he isn't responsible for. (Like, people hate Horobi, but it's because he's a genocidal terrorist, not because he's a Humagear.) The Ark was the one who turned him against humanity, but the Ark's gone now. The rest of MetsubouJinrai is using this new chapter in their lives to find fulfillment in self-determination. Horobi's terrified of making his own decisions, charting his own course, so he regresses back to the simplicity of the Ark's bullshit, but now with the veneer of his own desires. It's not, though, and that's why it's not helping him.
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I'm not sure I like this story better than Gai's? Horobi's depression and derangement has already had more severe costs than Gai's, so I'm not super inclined to feel pity for the guy. I'd love for him to find some self-awareness and regret for his actions, like Gai (well, regret anyway), but until that happens I'm not gonna be real He's Been Through A Lot about our homicidal/genocidal purple Rider.
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KAMEN RIDER ZERO-ONE EPISODE 44 - “THERE’S ONLY ONE PERSON WHO CAN STOP YOU…”
Mostly, though, it’s a story about how Hatred and Hope are each others’ antithesis, and how one can only exist in the other’s absence. Aruto spent a year fixing his friends (and some foes), helping them see the pointlessness of anger and hatred and intolerance and bigotry. His work let them dream of better futures, and hope for a better world. They can be the force for good that Aruto used to be. It’s a role Aruto can’t take on, because he’s chosen hatred instead of hope. He’s given himself over to anger and self-deception, defined himself as someone who wants to destroy someone else, and left himself no room to hold onto a dream. He can’t leap towards a dream when he’s rooted by hatred. Quote:
Because it’s kind of the entire point this show’s trying to make about people, you know? It’s that we’re constantly divided by things, despite being so fundamentally the same that it’s ridiculous to hate one another. The humans and Humagears have different origins, but they both want to be free and safe, while fearing that someone might prevent that. We all just, deep down, want to know that we’re safe to be ourselves. That’s it. The loss of that, or the denial of that, is what makes us turn on each other. The ways we hate each other is one of the most common things about people, just like how Aruto and Horobi’s rage and shame are identical. Being able to see the same dream in one another might be the answer to so much pain.
Williamson is in the wrong here regarding his leadership traits, and this shows that what matters more isn't winning a war, but how to prevent a war. Kindness can be detrimental on battlefield, but bloodshed is better avoided altogether (if the goal is to ensure safety, rather than actually evil warmongers wanting to prove superiority or such, Williamson does want to protect people) and kindness would accomplish that better. Which Yua demonstrated here. Yua was also someone who is previously cold, aloof, and ruthless, and was more open and relaxed after leaving Gai, and gaining more compassion here is what solved the problem here. Beating someone senseless, or forcing them into submission may keep you safe, but it will only fuel the racial tension which is the root of the war, as it just proves their suspicion of humans. Empathy has more chance of reducing racial tension as other than making it easier for them, it also defies negative expectations, including not immediately retaliating with force the part it seemed to fail. Though Yua's approach is risky like Izu's to Horobi, there should be more protection gears even if she doesn't intend to retaliate with force. Fortunately, Williamson is reasonable enough to see the error of his ways. Quote:
I sometimes forget to talk about these shows on that level, but, HOLY SHIT. The fight between Aruto and Fuwa was beautiful and heartbreaking, as Aruto grew more and more enraged at Fuwa’s attempts to stop him. We got a little of last episode’s silent dismissal, until Fuwa’s emotional attacks started making contact. Then, Aruto just started pummeling him. It’s hard to watch, because the fight isn’t tokusatsu action, really; it’s a beating. Fuwa’s two-headed wolf form (so great to have Naki back in the plot) is janky and almost inoperable from the start. He can’t hope to stop Aruto, but Fuwa can at least weather enough punishment to maybe talk some sense into him. It doesn’t work, because Aruto can’t let go of his mix of denial (none of this is his fault, he just needs to defeat Horobi) and depression (it doesn’t matter if he’s hated, it doesn’t matter if he hurts his friends). It’s the saddest fight Aruto ever won.
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My favorite scene from this episode is close to the start, where Jin interrogates Horobi's belief, as they stand with the clotheslines between them. It's pretty rare for KR to have the final villain murder the female lead and then depict the villain as someone to pity rather than hate. While I mourn Izu's loss with everybody else, I can't bring myself to hate Horobi for killing her, cause deep down, he's already hating himself enough. He's refusing to listen to his heart (like Onari always advised) cause he doesn't want to feel even more suffering and he'd rather keep going with his misguided genocide than admit to himself the painful truth that he did something terrible he can never take back. It's a different spin on Gai's arc and just as tragic and it makes Horobi one of the most complex villains in KR.
I can enjoy him as a villain more (at least more than Die), but personally I too don't think he deserves pity at this point, and people like him are the ones who should be condemned for hypocrisy, instead of mostly clean heroes that rubbed the wrong way in certain aspects (with that being deemed as 'hypocrisy'). Complexity fleshes out a character and makes them better written, but that shouldn't affect their overall heinousness (characters of any morality can be complex). I'd think him not listening to his heart and hating himself for having it is part of his misantrophy of refusing to become like humans and adds into his complexity, but that's the very thing that escalated his villainy further (pointing this out got Izu killed), or feeding his inculpability to hypocritically shift the blame to anyone else. Horobi (or MetsubouJinrai.net under Ark before, he's the leader) very much resembles real life cults, and cult leaders in podcasts also come up with all sorts of justifications for immoral actions. Quote:
It was a good episode for the side characters, you get to see Raiden almost get through to Horobi, you get to see Fuwa and Naki try and get through to Aruto, Yua steps up, Gai even helps out a little bit. This is really their episode to shine while two characters are just steeped in hatred. I wouldn't even call Aruto and Horobi straight up villains at this point. They're basically two people consumed with grief and hatred who only want to hurt each other despite the fact that their feud could very well shake the world to it's core. So at best their antagonists.
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The most complete non-wiki encyclopedias for Kamen Rider series (currently only found Ryuki and OOO's). Last edited by DreadBringer; 08-22-2022 at 10:46 AM.. |
08-22-2022, 11:43 AM | #903 |
Standing By
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 2,113
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I'll have something to say about that Soreo scene when we get to the next/last episode.
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I'm not sure I like this story better than Gai's? Horobi's depression and derangement has already had more severe costs than Gai's, so I'm not super inclined to feel pity for the guy. I'd love for him to find some self-awareness and regret for his actions, like Gai (well, regret anyway), but until that happens I'm not gonna be real He's Been Through A Lot about our homicidal/genocidal purple Rider.
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I'd agree with Horobi's complexity, though his character journey starts really late in the series, and that he had tragic aspects like being enslaved by Ark for 12 years, but claiming to depict a villain as something to hate/pity/etc. is still subjective. Actually, villains are often the most well-liked characters, regardless of how depraved (actually, KR's one of the franchises where I've actually seen widespread hate for someone depraved like Micchy or Gai-pre ep. 38), because they are seen as cool, charismatic, plot-movers, or sufficient power fantasy (not only being strong, but also be wild and free with those), o̶r̶ ̶b̶e̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶s̶e̶x̶y̶ ̶l̶i̶k̶e̶ ̶A̶z̶u̶ ̶(̶H̶o̶r̶o̶b̶i̶'̶s̶ ̶a̶l̶s̶o̶ ̶n̶o̶t̶a̶b̶l̶y̶ ̶g̶o̶o̶d̶-̶l̶o̶o̶k̶i̶n̶g̶,̶ ̶a̶c̶k̶n̶o̶w̶l̶e̶d̶g̶e̶d̶ ̶a̶m̶o̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶Z̶e̶r̶o̶-̶O̶n̶e̶ ̶c̶a̶s̶t̶ ̶t̶o̶o̶)̶. So yeah... how much hate someone get doesn't determine their heinousness (G̶a̶i̶ ̶h̶a̶v̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶g̶o̶o̶d̶ ̶i̶m̶a̶g̶e̶ ̶p̶r̶e̶-̶e̶p̶.̶ ̶3̶8̶). Annoying characters are those that tend to be hated the most, and heroes too can be viewed in lower regard to the villains (annoying also heavily depends, like even being boring or 'weak' can also count). If there'd be a dislike for Horobi, it'd more because of him being dull and wooden, instead of his actions.
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08-22-2022, 06:03 PM | #904 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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She really did, in probably my favorite part of the episode. (I even used it for the screencap!) Yua's seen Humagears as tools, she's been seen by others as a tool, and she's seen herself as a tool. She understands the self-loathing and rage those views can create. There's maybe no one better in the cast, save for Aruto, to make a grand speech that attempts to both apologize to Humagears and draw parallels to humanity. All-time great moment for AIMS' leader.
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Fukuzoe's scene was amazing though, I haven't spoken about him but he's one of my favorite side characters. He was initially presented as this sniveling guy who wanted the company, but was revealed to be someone who actually wholeheartedly supported it for all the right reasons in service of Granpda Hiden, he just personally didn't like that he got Nepotism'd (lol).
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Williamson is in the wrong here regarding his leadership traits, and this shows that what matters more isn't winning a war, but how to prevent a war. Kindness can be detrimental on battlefield, but bloodshed is better avoided altogether (if the goal is to ensure safety, rather than actually evil warmongers wanting to prove superiority or such, Williamson does want to protect people) and kindness would accomplish that better.
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As such, I also don't remember when I was supposed to pity Souji, and why I didn't? I will take your word for it, though.
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08-22-2022, 09:07 PM | #905 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,093
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I always just find Williamson amusing because he comes in all mysterious, out-of-nowhere, and ominous...and he turns out to be surprisingly reasonable and understanding.
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08-22-2022, 09:10 PM | #906 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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His arc is just "You have all let this situation spiral woefully out of control, and I'm here to get things back on track" > "Oh, you guys have this; carry on." Sort of ridiculous to even bring him into the show, but I guess they already paid the guy or something?
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08-22-2022, 09:18 PM | #907 |
Kaiju or Hero?
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Even I Don't Know Anymore.
Posts: 1,398
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You know what?
I'm just going to wait for the Finale to round up my thoughts on the past few episodes. But glad to hear you're enjoying it!
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08-22-2022, 09:19 PM | #908 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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I'll see you in about half an hour!
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08-22-2022, 09:52 PM | #909 |
Kamen Ride Or Die
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Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,159
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KAMEN RIDER ZERO-ONE EPISODE 45 - “EACH ONE’S FUTURE”
Solid effort. The thing I liked the best was the idea that, when it comes to breaking a cycle of violence, it doesn’t matter who breaks it. Looking for who’s most at fault was dooming Aruto and Horobi to horrible futures for them, and probably the rest of the world as well. Aruto killed Jin, but Horobi killed Izu, but humans created the Ark, but MetsubouJinrai blew up Aruto’s dad. It’s blame all the way down the list, but that can also be their liberation. Everyone’s at fault, and everyone’s angry, and everyone feels sorrow, and everyone feels regret. If we can see ourselves in the people who wronged us, or that we’ve wronged, maybe there can be an escape from things like vengeance and hatred. The heroic thing is to be the one to make the first move. Other than that… I mean, it’s an ALL ACTION FINALE, which was a blast to watch, but I’m sort of at a loss to talk about. It’s just Aruto and Horobi, and their reconciliation. That’s it. That’s the plot of the episode. There’re little data points around the edges – Jin’s two-stage regeneration, which mostly works as a Greek chorus for the fight – but this isn’t a story that anyone else can participate in. It’s up to Aruto and Horobi to fix their/society’s core issue, or die trying. Once that’s done, it’s just epilogue stuff for the cast, including teases for what look to be 800 pieces of post-show content. (Like, I think everyone in the credits sequence gets a dedicated post-show movie or special?) It's little snapshots that form grace notes for a group of weirdos, and I'm sure I'll want to dig into them more when I hit those other projects. Well, except one thing. I’m sure we’ll be seeing more of Izu’s journey/resurrection in REALxTIME, but I thought the scene she has with Aruto here was very sweet, for a couple reasons. The first is that Izu was the one who was there for every step of Aruto’s journey from terrible comedian to hero of Humagears -slash- terrible comedian, and now he can be there for every step of her journey from blank slate to best friend. The opportunity to pay back help, to let the lessons you’ve learned be passed on to others, that’s such a core philosophy of this show. No one succeeds by themselves. The other is that, like, Aruto’s her dad now. This episode’s overwhelmed with the trauma of lost children and lost parents, so the nice conclusion to that is Horobi having a future with his kid, and Aruto becoming a father to Izu. It’s a chance to let go of previous generations’ guidelines and outlooks, and an opportunity to start a different cycle: one of respect and individuality, where everyone gets to jump towards their own dream. Like, this was a story about inherited biases and generational trauma, but here’s an ending where people are trying to atone for that and create a generation that doesn’t have to carry their baggage. Yeah, that’s a good way to end this series.
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08-22-2022, 09:55 PM | #910 |
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Join Date: Mar 2022
Posts: 89
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So, we're here, the final episode, I'll start right off the bat by saying that this is a pretty good episode, not my favorite in the series, but still good, I can't say I was too disappointed with it, but it makes you wonder what they could've done without the Covid delays. Now onto the actual episode, Aruto and Horobi begin their fight and it looks pretty good, I've complained quite a bit about fights in this series, but for this episode, I'm fine with them. Aruto and Horobi argue with each other's points while fighting, with Aruto even agreeing with some of Horobi's points (yeah, Aruto, maybe you shouldn't be agreeing with the villain who you are also trying to stop/kill). The other three riders try and think of a way to stop the fight, with Yua trying to restore Jin to see if it could stop Horobi, which really just proves how pointless Jin dying really was, when he's able to be brought back in such a short span of time that he'll be back before the fight ends. We then find out that Aruto apparently wants Horobi to defeat him. So I guess Fuwa did somewhat get through to him, but apparently not enough for Aruto to not still go and fight Horobi and start an entire war, but I guess it's fine since Horobi is supposedly the only one who can stop him (clearly he still has some control of his body, so couldn't he just throw away the Progrisekey?) Horobi manages to defeat Aruto (and destroy the Ark driver too), and we see that Aruto is doing this to try and 'show Horobi what the heart is' which is a sentence that doesn't really make much sense when you think about it, and also sounds very cheesy, but it does sound like the kind of thing I'd expect to hear from Zero-One, so I guess it's alright? We then get to see Aruto's father saying a lot more sentimental stuff, so that's cool, I guess. Zea also makes Aruto a new driver (is this the final form of Zero-One? Is Zero-Two the final form? Is MCH the actual final form because it was the last one on the actual Zero-One driver? These are questions that will plague your mind so don't think too hard about them). Horobi then realizes that he's being hypocritical, since he is really furious at Aruto for killing Jin, when he's no better for killing Izu. The two of them then proceed to sort of argue, even though they both believe in the same thing, they then proceed to transform, with Aruto going into his new 'Realizing Hopper' form (which is possibly the greatest and stupidest name to come out of this show), and as I said before, don't question whether this is his final form or not. They then punch each other for a bit, as you do when your entire worldview has been shifted in a Kamen Rider show, they use their finishers on each other and it's pretty cool. Then everything is good again, yup, no war happened, everyone's doing good, and there's nothing to be worried about. You'd think that's joke, but nope, everything's good now, no time is needed to see even just the HumaGears realizing (I don't ever want to say that word again) that Aruto didn't betray them, but nope, there's no time for that, though that's not really anyone's fault, considering Covid, but it's still a bit too rushed for my taste. Wait, Gai now has 5 dogs, and we get to see Thouser again! I was kidding this is an amazing finale and a terrific way to close out on Zero-One. Oh, right, there's still time left in the episode, we now see what everyone's up to, Yua and now Naki are doing A.I.M.S work, Fuwa is helping people and I guess doesn't have a job? That's a strange future for him, Horobi and Jin are doing the same thing, but it makes sense that they wouldn't have jobs, since they were both previously terrorists and are HumaGears. Then we get.. some incredibly obvious movie bait, which must've been very annoying when watching this weekly and having to wait several months before the movie would come out. We finally end off with Aruto making a new Izu, who has none of the memories and merely looks the same and acts the same as pre-Singularity Izu, which I know some people really don't like, but I personally don't mind it. And that's it for the show, it's a bit weird to know that it's over, I've left messages here since episode 17 and so even though there's still more side content left, it's a bit melancholic to see the show go. All in all, my final thoughts on this episode, it's pretty good (aside from the Thouser scene which was perfect), and my thoughts on the series as a whole, it's pretty great, a few shortcomings and Covid definitely didn't help the show, but I can't help but love the show either way. |
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