TFW2005HisstankThundercatsTokuNationToyark
Go Back   TokuNation.com > TokuNation
Reload this Page

Integration

Rules Register Community Today's Posts Search
TokuNation
Page 352 of 653 « First 342350351 352 353354362 Last »
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

TokuNation (https://www.tokunation.com/forums/index.php)
-   Tokusatsu Show Discussion (https://www.tokunation.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=20)
-   -   Kamen Rider General Questions (https://www.tokunation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70221)

Yellow Ranger 09-24-2016 03:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 636693)
Which Kamen Rider show that killed the dark tone of Heisei Kamen Rider?

If you watched Kuuga, Agito and Ryuki. Those 3 show were darker than recent Kamen Rider show but how come we don't get those dark tone anymore?

Because FAIZ KILLED IT! Faiz is the most boring show ever because I couldn't watch it! I even don't know if Blade was dark Kamen Rider show but I know Faiz was the reason of why Toei decides to make Recent Kamen Rider show a more kid show like Super Sentai!

Hibiki was a confusing mess because apparently I think Hibiki was original to be a dark Kamen Rider but NO! Toei decides to mess around because they wanted more toy! and they didn't want to waste their money on location! Even Hibiki's actor was complained about Toei changing the PLANNED SERIES FINALE of Hibiki! Apparently Toei didn't learn a lesson from Batman & Forever aka Toy Commercial film!

Sure, Gaim was a dark show but the ending was more happy one than most of Gen Urobuchi's project! It got over-the-top moment with Bravo!

Toei always care about MONEY! They don't care about story-telling but lot of money!
...Kamen Rider has always been a kids show made to sell plastic toys also Kiva,W,Drive and Gaim all happened after Faiz so no it didn't kill "dark" Rider series.

Sunred 09-24-2016 03:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 636693)
Toei always care about MONEY!
You do realize that they don't make shows as if they were the free doughnuts from Krispy Kreme's right?
Most of them got mouths to feed probably and rent to pay.
And most importantly a studio to run to make said shows and air them on TV.

Kamen Rider Lolita 09-24-2016 09:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 636693)
Which Kamen Rider show that killed the dark tone of Heisei Kamen Rider?
If you want something dark and gritty, may I recommend GARO (assuming you don’t already watch it)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 636693)
Sure, Gaim was a dark show but the ending was more happy one than most of Gen Urobuchi's project! It got over-the-top moment with Bravo!
What’s wrong with having a happy ending?

Rider may be a tad darker than Sentai, but its primary target audience is still children so unlike, say, Madoka Magica, things can only go so far. There has to be restrictions.

Switchblade 09-24-2016 10:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 636693)
Which Kamen Rider show that killed the dark tone of Heisei Kamen Rider?

If you watched Kuuga, Agito and Ryuki. Those 3 show were darker than recent Kamen Rider show but how come we don't get those dark tone anymore?

Because FAIZ KILLED IT! Faiz is the most boring show ever because I couldn't watch it! I even don't know if Blade was dark Kamen Rider show but I know Faiz was the reason of why Toei decides to make Recent Kamen Rider show a more kid show like Super Sentai!
Dude, have you seen Faiz? That show was dark and bleak as fuck. One of the main character's storyline begins with her being physically and emotionally abused to death by literally every person in her life and ends with her being tragically murdered after finally realizing that she's been hanging out with her secret pen pal/crush all series. It's also a show that regularly showed x-rays of people's hearts dissolving and had multiple people disintegrate into dust on-screen. I'm not sure what constitutes children's tv where you come from, but that sure ain't what I consider kiddy fare.

No, I think we canpeg the big tonal shift of the Heisei era squarely on Den-O. That's the show where comedy really became front and center. Obviously, some of the other shows had comedic moments and characters, but Den-O is the show where drama officially took a backseat to wacky hijinks.

Fish Sandwich 09-24-2016 11:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Switchblade (Post 636727)
Dude, have you seen Faiz? That show was dark and bleak as fuck.
I think the point was that Faiz was so s***ty they decided never to make another show like that.

And yeah, I've always felt Den-O was the secret first Neo-Heisei show, right down to a second Rider who goes the entire series without picking a fight with the protagonist.

Switchblade 09-24-2016 11:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich (Post 636728)
And yeah, I've always felt Den-O was the secret first Neo-Heisei show, right down to a second Rider who goes the entire series without picking a fight with the protagonist.
Oh, absolutely. I think things started loosening up with Gaim, but W-Wizard very heavily followed Den-O's basic pattern:

- Goofy main Rider and serious secondary Rider (inverted in Wizard)
- Big focus on two-part victim- and monster-of-the-week plots
- ... with relatively few overarching story arcs, most of which have pacing issues
- Nonhuman partner who directly helps the Rider fight (Philip, Ankh, Kengo, Belt-san, Koyomi in theory)
- ... who subsequently dies (or at least seems to die) in the finale
- Extremely over-the-top comic relief
- Wacky older male who serves as some form of advisor/mentor for the main Rider

There are variations, sure, but you see most of these elements in modern Rider shows and you can trace pretty much all of them back to Den-O.

Powerman293 09-24-2016 12:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Switchblade (Post 636734)
Oh, absolutely. I think things started loosening up with Gaim, but W-Wizard very heavily followed Den-O's basic pattern:

- Goofy main Rider and serious secondary Rider (inverted in Wizard)
- Big focus on two-part victim- and monster-of-the-week plots
- ... with relatively few overarching story arcs, most of which have pacing issues
- Nonhuman partner who directly helps the Rider fight (Philip, Ankh, Kengo, Belt-san, Koyomi in theory)
- ... who subsequently dies (or at least seems to die) in the finale
- Extremely over-the-top comic relief
- Wacky older male who serves as some form of advisor/mentor for the main Rider

There are variations, sure, but you see most of these elements in modern Rider shows and you can trace pretty much all of them back to Den-O.
Den-O's DNA is pretty deep in Rider since W. It's not immediately apparent as one of the most influential Rider shows, but it is.

It makes me wonder what some of the other most influential Rider shows are, or aspects of them. Obviously not counting the original series since no duh, it shaped everything.

Kuuga would probably be up there, establishing a tone and astehtic for Rider's return in 2000 and following series. Besides that and Den-o, I can't really think of any.

Guyver Spawn 09-24-2016 12:33 PM
TV standers to change over time. Kuuga and Agito did had more violent moments compare to the newer raiders shows. I remember Kuuga and Agito did show blood when the new Raider shows rarely do.

It's not just Kamen Rider, other shows have tone down over the years. Dragon Ball Super is view as less violent and more light hearted compare to DBZ.

MarsHottentot 09-24-2016 01:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Powerman293 (Post 636738)
Den-O's DNA is pretty deep in Rider since W. It's not immediately apparent as one of the most influential Rider shows, but it is.

It makes me wonder what some of the other most influential Rider shows are, or aspects of them. Obviously not counting the original series since no duh, it shaped everything.

Kuuga would probably be up there, establishing a tone and astehtic for Rider's return in 2000 and following series. Besides that and Den-o, I can't really think of any.
As I understand it, Den-O sold a lot of toys and was a pretty big success. I loved the early episodes but, ultimately, it got a bit dull despite some strong performances.

Gaim has also sold a metric butt-ton (science!) of product. If I were a brain in a jar over at Toei, I'd be thinking Den-O humor mixed with Gaim super-melodrama / weirdness = unbeatable Rider profits!!

Annuga 09-24-2016 01:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 636693)
Which Kamen Rider show that killed the dark tone of Heisei Kamen Rider?

If you watched Kuuga, Agito and Ryuki. Those 3 show were darker than recent Kamen Rider show but how come we don't get those dark tone anymore?

Because FAIZ KILLED IT! Faiz is the most boring show ever because I couldn't watch it! I even don't know if Blade was dark Kamen Rider show but I know Faiz was the reason of why Toei decides to make Recent Kamen Rider show a more kid show like Super Sentai!

Hibiki was a confusing mess because apparently I think Hibiki was original to be a dark Kamen Rider but NO! Toei decides to mess around because they wanted more toy! and they didn't want to waste their money on location! Even Hibiki's actor was complained about Toei changing the PLANNED SERIES FINALE of Hibiki! Apparently Toei didn't learn a lesson from Batman & Forever aka Toy Commercial film!

Sure, Gaim was a dark show but the ending was more happy one than most of Gen Urobuchi's project! It got over-the-top moment with Bravo!

I feel Onari was added to Ghost because Toei wants over-the-top comic relief because they need a freaking clown to make little childrens laugh! I don't even know if they add a Comic Relief to Ex-Aid! I think a pink-hair girl could be that comic relief! I hope they don't make her OVER-THE-TOP!

Toei always care about MONEY! They don't care about story-telling but lot of money!
Faiz was darj as hell as previously stated and Blade was also really dark. The final episode has a very memorable moment for me Hajime is the last Undead left so the world will be destroyed, but he doesn't want that to happen, and tries killing himself
With Hibiki, the toys not only sold like shit, but the show went over budget and got low ratings (the show even scared kids I hear). Oh, and the reason the female lead in Den-O suddenly became a little girl and the plot revolving around that? Her actress quit due to illness or harassment, can't find a good answer, so they rewrote everything there
Deaths of beloved characters is a happy ending? And Oren being camp gay comic relief makes him stand out due to how different he is from the cast, the clear contrast can be appealing, I know I loved Oren

Japan LOVES Over the Top iirc, After all, Ace Attorney and Jojo are stupidly popular for a reason


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:20 AM.
Page 352 of 653 « First 342350351 352 353354362 Last »
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

 

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:20 AM.

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS