TokuNation - Kamen Rider General Questions

		TokuNation.com > TokuNation
Integration

Page 99 of 164

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

TokuNation (https://www.tokunation.com/forums/index.php)

- Tokusatsu Show Discussion (https://www.tokunation.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=20)

- - Kamen Rider General Questions (https://www.tokunation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70221)

GreenPsychoRanger

11-07-2016 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich (Post 647812)

Right, they always stuck out to me too. For as much of a fan of Wizard as I am, it always kind of slips my mind just how much I liked its monster designs in general. The aesthetic for pretty much all of them just really clicks with me.

Yes!! IKR?!

vin13ish

11-07-2016 01:20 AM

How can you tell if that character is SPOILER?!

Like most comic book movies especially Marvel often included a character that audience cannot talk about to person who haven't see the movie yet.

Annuga

11-07-2016 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 647823)

How can you tell if that character is SPOILER?!

Like most comic book movies especially Marvel often included a character that audience cannot talk about to person who haven't see the movie yet.

If they appear late into the show and affect the plot in a major way

RODAN

11-07-2016 04:41 AM

is there like a series ranking of best to worst. if not id like to see some peoples

xiiliea

11-07-2016 05:21 AM

Best series by popular opinion: W (I haven't watched that)
Best series by my opinion: Blade or Fourze
Worst series by everyone's opinion: Wizard

Annuga

11-07-2016 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xiiliea (Post 647852)

Best series by popular opinion: W (I haven't watched that)
Best series by my opinion: Blade or Fourze
Worst series by everyone's opinion: Wizard

From what I've seen, Wizard's just okay. Ghost is the one that people fight about

xiiliea

11-07-2016 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Annuga (Post 647858)

From what I've seen, Wizard's just okay. Ghost is the one that people fight about

I think Ghost is okay. It has a decent plot, which makes progress (though slow) throughout the series. For Wizard, you could delete every episode except the first few and last few episodes and the series still makes sense. I do think that Wizard has one of the best special effects though. The magic effects are really pretty.

Kiwami

11-07-2016 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RODAN (Post 647847)

is there like a series ranking of best to worst. if not id like to see some peoples

Quote:

Originally Posted by Annuga (Post 647858)

From what I've seen, Wizard's just okay. Ghost is the one that people fight about

Yeah and they fight about it because some people like it and others don't. It's a love it or hate it situation. You don’t see people fighting over Wizard very often because the vast majority of the fandom thinks its bad.

Of course both shows are still worth checking out to see if you personally like them, but as far as the worst show goes I think you will hear about Wizard a lot. Maybe some will say Ghost since the wounds are still fresh but I still think Wizard is overall worse than Ghost.

Annuga

11-07-2016 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiwami (Post 647865)

No there isn't since as far as I know not every show is even subbed yet. Showa still needs some work. And even though I have my own list it’s highly individual, it’s just my opinion. There’s no official ranking or anything.

But from the shows I've seen so far I recommend V3 and Black for Showa, Kuuga, Agito, Ryuki & Kabuto for pre-Decade and almost everything post-Decade. With the exception of Wizard and Ghost, I didn't really enjoy those.

Shows I haven't seen myself but people say it's good: Amazon and Stronger for Showa, Blade for pre- and Fourze for post-Decade.

But to be honest you can just watch whatever you want, I wouldn’t really base my selection of shows on what other people say. Just look at some images or videos from a show and if you like what you're seeing give it a go.

Yeah and they fight about it because some people like it and others don't. It's a love it or hate it situation. You don’t see people fighting over Wizard very often because the vast majority of the fandom thinks its bad.

Of course both shows are still worth checking out to see if you personally like them, but as far as the worst show goes I think you will hear about Wizard a lot. Maybe some will say Ghost since the wounds are still fresh but I still think Wizard is overall worse than Ghost.

Again, the general impression I got from Wizard was that it's okay, not bad

Also I forgot Decade exists. THAT is the worst season. Period

Fish Sandwich

11-07-2016 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Annuga (Post 647866)

Again, the general impression I got from Wizard was that it's okay, not bad

That's its whole problem. It's in the perfect zone of mediocrity to be completely and utterly boring to most of the fandom, which is the worst thing a show can be. Totally forgettable. At least with Ghost the general consensus from people seems to be that it was at least trying.

As probably the single most staunch defender of both those shows around here, it's honestly a lot easier to argue why Ghost is good because it kind of gives me more to work with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RODAN (Post 647847)

is there like a series ranking of best to worst. if not id like to see some peoples

But if you're asking this because you want to know where to go when you finish Agito, my advice is the same as always. Whatever looks good to you probably will be.

I maintain there's no such thing as a truly bad Kamen Rider show. There are definitely some that I feel are pretty unarguably more solid than others, like Agito, for example, but they all have their qualities and they all have their fans. Even the show I consider to be the "worst" Heisei series, Kiva, is higher up on my list of favorites than shows I openly acknowledge have way more going for them.

Annuga

11-07-2016 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich (Post 647888)

I maintain there's no such thing as a truly bad Kamen Rider show.

I wanna see why you're claiming Decade isn't trash in general. Story kinda went nowhere, most, if not all characters were unlikeable and if you look carefully, the suit actors are struggling with their stuff (I remember Ryuga not being able to use a card properly)

Guyver Spawn

11-07-2016 10:41 AM

Ghost was truly bad to me. Going from what I've seen, the show does not get better.

Fish Sandwich

11-07-2016 11:02 AM

Guys I'm not sure you got my point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Annuga (Post 647889)

A.I wanna see why you're claiming Decade isn't trash in general. B.Story kinda went nowhere, C.most, if not all characters were unlikeable and D.if you look carefully, the suit actors are struggling with their stuff (I remember Ryuga not being able to use a card properly)

A. Because I enjoyed it.

B. Definitely, but I maintain the week to week plots were a lot of fun, which, in my book, makes up for the poor overarching plot.

C. This is super subjective so all I can say is I liked everyone a bunch. Tsukasa is still great to me and I found Newsuke to be a likable foil.

D. That was like one time and the same stuff happened in Ryuki itself, occasionally.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guyver Spawn (Post 647890)

Ghost was truly bad to me. Going from what I've seen, the show does not get better.

And this one is self-explanatory. It's what I was getting at. A big list of what people consider the best or the worst Rider shows is useless when opinions on them vary so much. I think Ghost is one of the best, a lot of people think it's one of the worst, none of us are "correct". It's all just a matter of taste.

ZeoRangerV

11-07-2016 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Annuga (Post 647889)

Because opinions are wonderful things that not everyone shares?

I thoroughly enjoyed all the characters in Decade, thought the suits/action were great and only thought the show lost the plot during the tail end. As someone who massively digs AUs, I found Decade to have a lot of good ideas that was sadly just not executed in the best ways.

Annuga

11-07-2016 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZeoRangerV (Post 647893)

It's just that today is the first time I remember someone saying something good about Decade other than the music

Matrixbeast

11-07-2016 11:36 AM

Still think Decade is hot garbage.

Castellan Zilla

11-07-2016 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich (Post 647892)

Maybe, but hiding behind the opinion argument is a poor one. You can look at something critically and acknowledge how terrible it is, while still enjoying it. I love Wizard, but it's bad. Very bad. And while Drive is my favorite series thus far, I feel Gaim is the best overall (from those that I've watched).

People can like Ghost, for example, all they want. It doesn't negate the fact it had so many problems. It's writing probably being the biggest one.

AkibaSilver

11-07-2016 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matrixbeast (Post 647904)

Still think Decade is hot garbage.

It may be, but the garbage at least contains something that, at some point, was good.

Fish Sandwich

11-07-2016 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Castellan Zilla (Post 647905)

Maybe, but hiding behind the opinion argument is a poor one. You can look at something critically and acknowledge how terrible it is, while still enjoying it.

I'm not hiding behind it. I just said I think Kiva is the worst Heisei show and that I also really enjoy it. You make a good point. I agree with that notion, but the problem is that "objective" analysis of something's quality inevitably still comes back down to opinion.

For example, I think Gaim is one of the worse Rider shows I've seen because it had a sloppily executed story that couldn't seem to get its messages straight and really hit or miss characterization. There's a ton going for it, it's well directed, the acting's great, and it knew how to keep the tension up, but it failed at things I personally consider fundamental and because of that it's hard for me to just call it "great".

Wizard is another show I consider less good than my opinion of it suggests. I think in most respects it's basically okay, but it clicked with me and I enjoyed it a lot.

Basically enjoying something is an opinion, and thinking something is good is ALSO an opinion. It goes without saying that stuff has flaws, it's just a matter of how much the good points balance it out for you.

GreenPsychoRanger

11-07-2016 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xiiliea (Post 647852)

Best series by popular opinion: W (I haven't watched that)
Best series by my opinion: Blade or Fourze
Worst series by everyone's opinion: Wizard

Wrong. Not everyone thinks it's the worst. I LOVE Wizard. And yes, as per your other comment (that I didn't quote because I didn't think about at the time), it had some of the best special FX in RIder.

ZeoRangerV

11-07-2016 01:54 PM

Yeah, if there's one thing Wizard can't be faulted on it's style. That show was incredibly flashy.

Switchblade

11-07-2016 03:00 PM

I honestly kinda like Decade. The story is an unholy mess, but the action is generally really good and it was a lot of fun to see all of those old Rider suits back in action (you know, before that happened every April). Plus there were some legitimately great moments like the double Tetsuo Kurata transformation. For my money it's one of the best braindead popcorn experiences in the Kamen Rider canon.

Thessair

11-07-2016 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade (Post 647938)

I like Decade, too, for a lot of those reasons (plus, Narutaki). But I always felt like there were about ten episodes worth of story at the beginning and the end that we didn't get to see that would have both started the series and wrapped it up neatly.

henshinzero

11-07-2016 06:10 PM

To avoid budget problems, would you guys rather see KRs like W-Ex-Aid animated?

Thessair

11-07-2016 06:21 PM

No. Even with budget issues it's usually still awesome to see actual people doing this stuff. I think the human factor is important in Toku and I don't think it would be the same in animation. (Note: I am not denigrating animation here.)

GreenPsychoRanger

11-07-2016 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henshinzero (Post 647964)

To avoid budget problems, would you guys rather see KRs like W-Ex-Aid animated?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thessair (Post 647967)

I agree with Thess to a degree. The human factror is what makes it the wonder that it is. But I wouldn't mind seeing a couple of them animated so we could see just how much further they would take the designs.

MarsHottentot

11-07-2016 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZeoRangerV (Post 647893)

Because opinions are wonderful things that not everyone shares?

I thoroughly enjoyed all the characters in Decade, thought the suits/action were great and only thought the show lost the plot during the tail end. As someone who massively digs AUs, I found Decade to have a lot of good ideas that was sadly just not executed in the best ways.

I generally agree with this statement and feel like the bolded portion sums up the way I feel about "bad" Kamen Rider. Like, I'm not crazy about Ghost, but I'd happily watch that over Agents of SHIELD or Legends of Tomorrow because, as flawed as it is, it's still got a higher entertainment value than most of it's American counterparts. I just love Kamen Rider that much, I guess.

Quote:

Originally Posted by henshinzero (Post 647964)

To avoid budget problems, would you guys rather see KRs like W-Ex-Aid animated?

And miss out on great stunt work and toku sparks? NO WAY, JOSE!

Switchblade

11-07-2016 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henshinzero (Post 647964)

To avoid budget problems, would you guys rather see KRs like W-Ex-Aid animated?

Hell no.

Fish Sandwich

11-07-2016 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarsHottentot (Post 647986)

I just love Kamen Rider that much, I guess.

This quote = Every dumb opinion I have in one sentence.

vin13ish

11-07-2016 09:12 PM

Did they tone down the Comedy of Ex-Aid?

Like I don't see a character doing in your face thing like Chief Honganji and Onari!

I don't know if Ex-Aid have a Comic Relief character to lighten the show

I think Later Episodes of Ex-Aid will very tone down the much of Comedy because in order to keep it a dark tone and Use of Comedy wasn't well-received in Drive and Ghost.

IXRollOutIX

11-07-2016 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 647998)

Use of Comedy wasn't well-received in Drive and Ghost.

Not sure you know what you're talking about. Onari is apparently extremely popular in Japan.

Powerman293

11-07-2016 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henshinzero (Post 647964)

To avoid budget problems, would you guys rather see KRs like W-Ex-Aid animated?

Not really. The appeal of Rider to me is that actos are really there doing the cherography. Plus, I feel like Rider would become uber shonen and generic in its fight scenes if it became animated, rather than the creative things they could do in Live action. Like, in animation, they'd only be doing stuff that you can't do in live action, where as live action shows only doing live action stuff and the occasional cool move or finisher.

It would probably get more mainstream in the west if it was an anime though.

vin13ish

11-07-2016 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IXRollOutIX (Post 648000)

Not sure you know what you're talking about. Onari is apparently extremely popular in Japan.

But he got some hater from Western fanbase.

His famous hater is got to be SwitchBlade! He despise him! He love to hate on Onari!

Almost of his post included of his hatred toward Onari!

SwitchBlade is NOT a fan of Onari! HIM HATING ON ONARI IS ANYONE GUESS

IXRollOutIX

11-07-2016 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 648002)

But he got some hater from Western fanbase.

The western fanbase is the least of Toei's concerns, though. Nothing we say on this message board will change the outcome of their decisions from year to year. Our opinion doesn't matter.

GoldenXtreme

11-07-2016 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by henshinzero (Post 647964)

To avoid budget problems, would you guys rather see KRs like W-Ex-Aid animated?

As someone who used to despise live-action and only watched animated things, I have to say that toku just shouldn't be animated. There's so many things you can only really convey in live-action things, and working around the limitations of real life is part of what makes it so cool. You can convey a lot more emotion in live-action too. Just try and imagine your favorite emotional Rider scene in animation. It certainly lacks the same impact for me.

Switchblade

11-07-2016 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 648002)

:eyebrow

Fish Sandwich

11-07-2016 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vin13ish (Post 647998)

Like I don't see a character doing in your face thing like Chief Honganji and Onari!

It's sort of, mitigated, I guess, by how little the characters take note of her, but given how they're already having Asuna and Poppy Pipopapo act pretty much exactly the same as one another, I'd say she's pretty in your face. Not as much as Onari though, if only because she's kind of a minor character so far.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IXRollOutIX (Post 648000)

Not sure you know what you're talking about. Onari is apparently extremely popular in Japan.

And with me!

I was honestly buying into some of the Onari hate for a while but you know what, he's great. His antics were actually an important part of his personality rather than just the mindless comic relief he's frequently accused of being. I find his role as the bumbling fool with a good heart really endearing, and he helps out the gang WAY more than he's given credit for.

Guyver Spawn

11-07-2016 10:12 PM

Who was more annoying in your opinion? Onari or Shunpei?

GoldenXtreme

11-07-2016 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guyver Spawn (Post 648013)

Who was more annoying in your opinion? Onari or Shunpei?

I actually kinda like Shunpei... Even if I call him Stupei instead.

vin13ish

11-07-2016 10:24 PM

Quote: