[Locke]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

I suspect some of that is down to the previous show's reputation. Wizard was deeply unpopular (which is a pity as, while far from being a great show, there were some very good elements in it), so the chance to have something new and, most importantly, different in every way is considered fantastic. To be fair, some of these are very welcome and needed changes, but there's a definite feeling of "not Wizard = awesome," especially looking back at early responses.

I think that can also extend, in part, to why Tokkyuger already seems unpopular. Yeah, most of the negativity is based on the designs, which are, in fairness... let's be charitable and say "odd." At the same time, though, a lot of what we've seen about the show looks really, really unoriginal. The characters seem to be old archetypes we've had before and the production staff is entirely made up of people who've done past Sentai series (hell, it has the same writer as Go-Busters, and that was just a year ago). It's hard to imagine that there will be anything new or creative this year and when you combine that with unpopular designs, it's hard to get excited by anything, especially coming off of a season that was pretty popular for a lot of viewers (who aren't me).

That is exactly what I assumed, I wonder if anyone actually likes Gaim, or if the world is just spinning on Wizard being over. It doesn't help that general opinion seems to infect others, Wizard was the cool series to hate, so people who picked it up late in the game spent their entire watches looking for things that lived up to the expectations, rather than just watching it without bias, to make up their own opinion. It's hard when people watch something with their thoughts already planned in their heads before they've even started.

I personally really didn't like Kyoryuger, so I was excited for something new, but on the designs and what little plot we have Trainranger is doing nothing for me.

[Sentai Tamashii]

I don't entirely agree; while I didn't watch every single Kamen Rider show, so it's far fetched for me to say that it is the best show ever, I did watch Wizard in its entirety and loved the last 25 episodes and how the series wrapped.

I still think Gaim is an amazing show on its own, the entire premise how the show balances between serious/dark scenarios with well-timed comedy. Not to mention a group of wonderfully assembled cast. For me it is one of the top shows and quickly surpassing Fourze as my favorite.

[Switchblade]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

That is exactly what I assumed, I wonder if anyone actually likes Gaim, or if the world is just spinning on Wizard being over. It doesn't help that general opinion seems to infect others, Wizard was the cool series to hate, so people who picked it up late in the game spent their entire watches looking for things that lived up to the expectations, rather than just watching it without bias, to make up their own opinion. It's hard when people watch something with their thoughts already planned in their heads before they've even started.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that Gaim is only liked because it isn't Wizard. The show is kinda over-hyped, but it is still a good show and I can see it landing somewhere in my top 10 Rider shows - if not top 5 - if it keeps going the way it's going. I just think some of the praise is over-the-top for how early we are in the show's run.

[Baltan II]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

Where even low ratings can't seem to stop it, where they literally have no gaps between the shows - same with Kamen Rider - and it's just always been there.

In Kamen Rider's case, no, there's been plenty of gaps, and it's soon 15 series behind Super Sentai despite Sentai coming into the picture later. Long-time Kamen Rider fans could tell you all about the dark days of the 90s where little happened with the franchise. It's an amusing turn of events that fans onboard with the Heisei era think of Rider as perennial as it's become these days.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

Wizard was the cool series to hate, so people who picked it up late in the game spent their entire watches looking for things that lived up to the expectations, rather than just watching it without bias, to make up their own opinion.

I couldn't say for specific examples with Wizard, but usually I find that those who watch something after it's been around and had a lot of negative opinions thrown at it often find themselves more accepting of it than they may have been had they watched it new. Finding the media in question to not live up to the scorn of peers seems to happen often, just as shows can be oversold and overhyped.

Can't make heads or tails of the liking Gaim because of hating Wizard theory, but regrettably can't weigh in beyond this, as I've neither finished Wizard nor started Gaim, for reasons entirely unrelated to the quality of either Rider show (or Kyoryuger, Garo, or even Akiba 2...!). I fully intend to catch up on both Rider series eventually, once I no longer feel SHT-fatigued. And I actually really liked Wizard.

[SPLIT LIP]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

That is exactly what I assumed, I wonder if anyone actually likes Gaim, or if the world is just spinning on Wizard being over.

I'm gonna guess this isn't actually what you meant to say.

Because it sounds INCREDIBLY petty. Wondering if "anyone actually likes Gaim."

That's just... jeez man, be less sour grapes.

Quote:

It's hard when people watch something with their thoughts already planned in their heads before they've even started.

That's how human brains work.

Generally our actions and motives are based on what we've experienced.

Another factor is, because Gaim does so much so well, it's faults don't glare as much. A worse show with the same faults plus more, would get chewed out, but Gaim makes up for it. Also, it get's a lot of argueably important stuff right. Minor hiccups are much less scrutinised when the important aspects are clean.

Likewise a bad show with good parts will not see thsoe good parts praised as much becasue it is undeserving of such good graces.

[Locke]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baltan II

In Kamen Rider's case, no, there's been plenty of gaps, and it's soon 15 series behind Super Sentai despite Sentai coming into the picture later. Long-time Kamen Rider fans could tell you all about the dark days of the 90s where little happened with the franchise. It's an amusing turn of events that fans onboard with the Heisei era think of Rider as perennial as it's become these days.



I couldn't say for specific examples with Wizard, but usually I find that those who watch something after it's been around and had a lot of negative opinions thrown at it often find themselves more accepting of it than they may have been had they watched it new. Finding the media in question to not live up to the scorn of peers seems to happen often, just as shows can be oversold and overhyped.

Can't make heads or tails of the liking Gaim because of hating Wizard theory, but regrettably can't weigh in beyond this, as I've neither finished Wizard nor started Gaim, for reasons entirely unrelated to the quality of either Rider show (or Kyoryuger, Garo, or even Akiba 2...!). I fully intend to catch up on both Rider series eventually, once I no longer feel SHT-fatigued. And I actually really liked Wizard.

But even in the 90s they got movies - shit ones - but nonetheless content. With the world of American broadcasting where seasons can be decades apart, or axed before even the first half of the show is aired, Kamen Rider is certainly much more of a consistent force.

I generally find that most of the internet are sheep, it's sad but true. I wish more people would give Wizard a chance, it may not be the most consistent show in the world but it had lots of cool ideas, cool mythology, cool characters and cool action scenes. You just have to persevere through episodes focusing on a kid riding a bike and shit like that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

I wouldn't go so far as to say that Gaim is only liked because it isn't Wizard. The show is kinda over-hyped, but it is still a good show and I can see it landing somewhere in my top 10 Rider shows - if not top 5 - if it keeps going the way it's going. I just think some of the praise is over-the-top for how early we are in the show's run.

True. But I'm not sure anyone really knows how they feel on Gaim yet, and probably wont know until the hype train dies down. The fun thing about toku is due to their long lengths, many shows can make or break. Fourze and Shinkenger are two shows I loved going in, and was left soured by the end. OOO is a show I disliked going in but my GOD I was in love by the time I got out the other side.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPLIT LIP

I'm gonna guess this isn't actually what you meant to say.

Because it sounds INCREDIBLY petty. Wondering if "anyone actually likes Gaim."

That's just... jeez man, be less sour grapes.


That's how human brains work.

Generally our actions and motives are based on what we've experienced.

Another factor is, because Gaim does so much so well, it's faults don't glare as much. A worse show with the same faults plus more, would get chewed out, but Gaim makes up for it. Also, it get's a lot of argueably important stuff right. Minor hiccups are much less scrutinised when the important aspects are clean.

Likewise a bad show with good parts will not see thsoe good parts praised as much becasue it is undeserving of such good graces.

I apologise. I worked a sixty hour work week and then moved house, I can't articulate myself how I'd wish in this state of exhaustion. I think my response to Switch in this very post articulates best what I was trying to say.

I can certainly say I go into things excited or whatever, but I've never decided I like something before watching it as some people do around here.

[Switchblade]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

True. But I'm not sure anyone really knows how they feel on Gaim yet, and probably wont know until the hype train dies down. The fun thing about toku is due to their long lengths, many shows can make or break. Fourze and Shinkenger are two shows I loved going in, and was left soured by the end. OOO is a show I disliked going in but my GOD I was in love by the time I got out the other side.

True. Fourze was awesome at this point in its run when it was still assembling the Rider Club. Then Ryusei showed up and the plot ground to a halt until we got close to the end and they realized they still had half a dozen Horoscopes to get to.

[SPLIT LIP]

Thing is, regardless of what may happen, I like Gaim now. What I've seen, I've liked. I can't say for sure what each week will be like (which is also part of the fun) but I know what I've seen is good and I like it, and it makes me optimistic.

If next week sucks ass, I'm still gonna like these first twelve episodes.

[Baltan II]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

But even in the 90s they got movies - shit ones - but nonetheless content.

Two featurettes and one movie were the only things Kamen Rider got besides reruns for ten years. That is a literal gap. It's not a question of whether Kamen Rider is a "consistent force" or not because that's not what I was denying. I get what you mean, but Kamen Rider has taken breaks before, so the idea of it going on another hiatus is not in the same league as Super Sentai breaking its longstanding streak.

Calling ZO and J shit on top of that... you're playing with fire.

[Locke]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPLIT LIP

Thing is, regardless of what may happen, I like Gaim now. What I've seen, I've liked. I can't say for sure what each week will be like (which is also part of the fun) but I know what I've seen is good and I like it, and it makes me optimistic.

If next week sucks ass, I'm still gonna like these first twelve episodes.

Liking it is fine, I like it too. But the problem here isn't enjoyment, episode by episode, it's those who act like it's the second coming. And you can tell me I'm exaggerating or whatevs, but seriously read what some of the people have written in the threads, or the speculation threads BEFORE the first episode was even released.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

True. Fourze was awesome at this point in its run when it was still assembling the Rider Club. Then Ryusei showed up and the plot ground to a halt until we got close to the end and they realized they still had half a dozen Horoscopes to get to.

Exactly, if I was only up to Meteor's introduction, I'd be calling this the best toku series ever made! I certainly wasn't saying that by the end.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baltan II

Two featurettes and one movie were the only things Kamen Rider got besides reruns for ten years. That is a literal gap. It's not a question of whether Kamen Rider is a "consistent force" or not because that's not what I was denying. I get what you mean, but Kamen Rider has taken breaks before, so the idea of it going on another hiatus is not in the same league as Super Sentai breaking its longstanding streak.

Calling ZO and J shit on top of that... you're playing with fire.

True that. If Sentai took a break now...that'd be something else. Although didn't sentai just chuck giant robots into the mix when their ratings flagged in the early days? It'd be pretty cool if they add some new staple of the future genre next, although I couldn't say what that might be.