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02-17-2021, 04:04 AM | #11 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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I don’t see any of this at all. Every recent Rider show has had an ‘endgame’ event before the new years break as tradition now (at least as far back as OOO — Mezool and Gamel’s combination and subsequent demise; 01 defeating Jin, Lazer friggin dying, etc). Fukuda’s shows certainly tend to do a lot more with it, making the stakes higher and feeling like the end to a whole era of the show; but to me that’s a positive in the favour and speaks to the idea that he knows very well how to write a weekly kid’s show that’s going to be off the air for two weeks over new year’s break.
In regards to repetition or running out of steam... no, I don’t get that either. Both Ghost and Saber clearly have new things going on after that rather than repeating the same beats. If anything it’s Takahashi who runs out of plot very quickly with how much he stretches things out and doesn’t have a clue what to do with his characters. I’ve got criticisms with how things are going in Saber right now but it’s far better than what a lot of Rider seasons manage at this point; the writers know what they’re doing.
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Last edited by Kurona; 02-17-2021 at 04:09 AM.. |
02-17-2021, 06:15 AM | #12 |
The Immortal King Tasty
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Every diner you've ever been to.
Posts: 3,833
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It probably goes without saying that I also don't think Ghost and Saber's overall plot structure are too different from the usual Rider show either (a lot of them could very easily be argued to do the same thing), but I'd definitely hesitate to lay the credit/blame for that entirely on Fukuda. Everything I've learned lately about the behind-the-scenes creative process for Rider shows suggests the Chief Producers have a ton of influence on that sort of thing, and both Ghost and Saber seem to intentionally pass the scripts around between their three writers a lot more evenly than most recent Rider shows do.
I mean, it's literally the exact same producer and writers, so any overall point you want to make about the structural issues both shows have can still apply; it's just that it's probably important to note that it's unlikely every decision someone might have a problem with was all made by the one guy.
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02-17-2021, 06:20 AM | #13 |
Reiei
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 3,691
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Quote:
It probably goes without saying that I also don't think Ghost and Saber's overall plot structure are too different from the usual Rider show either (a lot of them could very easily be argued to do the same thing), but I'd definitely hesitate to lay the credit/blame for that entirely on Fukuda. Everything I've learned lately about the behind-the-scenes creative process for Rider shows suggests the Chief Producers have a ton of influence on that sort of thing, and both Ghost and Saber seem to intentionally pass the scripts around between their three writers a lot more evenly than most recent Rider shows do.
I mean, it's literally the exact same producer and writers, so any overall point you want to make about the structural issues both shows have can still apply; it's just that it's probably important to note that it's unlikely every decision someone might have a problem with was all made by the one guy. I think Fukuda's improved a bit. He's more willing to hand key plot elements to other writers, instead of disappearing along with the material, leaving the other writers little to work with. |
02-17-2021, 10:34 AM | #14 |
Standing By
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 2,114
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This time last year, most of us were struggling through the workplace competition arc. Saber doesn't have a workplace competition arc, therefore it's currently on track to become my favorite Reiwa Rider show.
Kamen Rider Ghost is my fourth favorite Heisei Rider show, mostly due to how the theme of heroism is explored through the different perspectives of the Parka Ghosts and I specifically remember Robin Hood's line about how justice means something different to each person. Takeru is already a pretty heroic guy from the start, but the wisdom he gains allows him to reach out to people and connect them. Since connections is a part of the theme of death, with how death isn't the end, everything people do has an effect and the power to leave a legacy behind to help others in the future. However, I credit most of my enjoyment to Mouri, the same way I credit him for his work on Zi-O. He and Hasegawa gave more focus to Onari and Akari, treating them as important characters while Fukuda only used them as comic relief, similar to how he writes Mei in Saber. Fukuda was absent a lot while he wrote Ghost's summer movie, which as I mentioned before, is the third worst summer movie I've ever watched. I can only hope that Fukuda has improved and Book Of Ruin will be better. What I will praise Fukuda for is the high stakes. I mean, Ghost Episode 1 ends with Edith telling Takeru he can only live as a ghost for 99 days and now he only has 98 days left.... That's a pretty damn big deal! Especially with how the first 12 episodes occur close to real time 99 days. Every single episode, I'm thinking "Is Takeru going to obtain the Eyecons in time?", or "How the hell is Takeru going to revive now that he sacrificed himself for Kanon?!" There was so much suspense in that first arc. Of course, the fact that Toucon Boost exists took away some of that suspension of disbelief, but actually, things just get more extreme from there! Now Takeru has another 99 days except he's not just trying to revive but to save his father's afterlife as well. Can you imagine that? I can totally relate to Edith saying how crazy Ryu was, staking something that important. Something even more important than life. That's a crazy burden that Takeru has to carry for the rest of the show. Then the last episode is literally 1 day left and I'm thinking "Damn, if Takeru fails, he dies and Ryu's soul fades away!" and Episode 33 does a great job at emphasizing how terrible that would be by showing the partial destruction of Takeru's soul before his friends' emotions bring him back. Anyway, I've yammered way too long about Ghost. I should talk about Saber now. I have the same appreciation for Saber, perhaps even greater. Kento doesn't even get a "Toucon Boost". He just dies, that's it. And his friends have to carry on without him. That's a pretty big deal. But just like the Masters and Nada in Ryusoulger, his spirit lives on in his fellow Swordsmen, who carry on his will to save the world and protect the people. Even ignoring the characters and story for a moment, Saber is such a spectacular show from the start. The pacing is a little rushed, but honestly I prefer that to something slow like Gaim or Amazons which take a while to get to the good stuff. Saber doesn't waste time on exposition, it gets right to the action and the character drama. Somebody mentioned EX-Aid doing something similar but with more clear-cut arcs. However, I contest that it's not a good thing. I can jump in to EX-Aid in the 1-23 episode range and feel like I know what I'm watching. But everything after has a different feel to it, like it's not the same EX-Aid anymore. I think it's to the merit of Ghost and Saber that Fukuda has such competent secondary writers in Mouri and Hasegawa to pick up his slack and Takahashi didn't have that in EX-Aid. Ghost and Saber have a consistency to what they're about and where they're going which I think EX-Aid lacks.
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02-17-2021, 12:34 PM | #15 |
Showa Girl
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 9,064
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I mean. Unless you're counting Zi-O vs. Decade it doesn't exactly have a lot of competition!
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02-17-2021, 08:04 PM | #16 |
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,534
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For me, I'll always say one of my biggest problems with Ghost was that they rushed through the initial conflict between Takeru and Makoto, and by extension, the "99 days" time limit as a whole.
If any Rider vs Rider conflict should have been a little bit more drawn out, it was that, because it's one where miscommunication and secrecy actually isn't at the forefront of it all. Makoto still had his issue with being trapped in the Ganma world, which added in more tension. But really the reason they fought against each other was because they both needed the same things in order to serve different, but similar goals. And in a nice inversion of what would we expect from these character dynamics, the aloof Secondary Rider has a slightly less selfish goal than our idealistic, all-loving hero. And there was definitely enough there to make it an ongoing conflict throughout at least the first half of the show. But it got resolved far too quickly and it became clear the show didn't really know how to pad itself out for another 30+ episodes. Outside of Alain's character arc, everything from that point on up until maybe the last 5 episodes of the series felt like filler. Sure, maybe important plot-related stuff happened in that time besides that but I don't feel like the stakes ever truly raised during that time period. The plot had already reset Takeru's time limit so he has the same goal as before. And now the genuinely interesting conflict between Takeru and Makoto was replaced with....basically nothing. I loved the stuff with Alain in that middle portion, but while it was great character development, it ultimately didn't move the plot enough for me, especially since Necrom kinda stopped doing stuff at that point in the story beyond being another Rider for fight scenes. All of this is to say that I think that Saber does this a lot better because it feels like there's an actual progression to this story. We had the initial plot with the Sword of Logos vs Calibur and the Megid. And it's deceptively simplistic because it seems like there's a clear good vs evil conflict going on here, which is why the first couple of episodes are the Riders all buddied up and fighting like a Sentai team. But then as we conclude that plot thread, we're given more information that not only throws the status quo completely out of whack, but also fundamentally changes our established character relationships and the mystery surrounding this organization has been carrying us at least into the 20s. I think inversing the Rider formula a bit has worked in this show's favor. I don't think it's as good as Gaim, Build or Zero-One at creating an ongoing plot thread that keeps the viewer invested, but I definitely CAN say that the show's been doing a competent enough job at not totally stalling in place.
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Last edited by MaskedRiderAsakura; 02-17-2021 at 08:14 PM.. |
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