[dreamcastegirl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

(One of an infinite number of laugh-out-loud moments was the joke in the beginning that Onyanko Club was beloved by middle schoolers, when it’s literally only two grown men that we’ve seen stan these girls on Kiva. It’s a joke that works great from what we’ve seen before, and then explodes later in the episode.)

I screamed the like two times Onyanko Club get mentioned in this show. Such moments were what really made me warm to the 1986 narrative, and I really think it's wonderful whenever they ground the story in the setting like this, and it makes me faintly regretful that these moments aren't more prevalent.

I say all this like I have this grand critique of the story, but really I just like Onyanko Club, and wanted them to get mentioned more, lol.

[Androzani84]

I’ll mention that there’s a deleted scene from this episode wherein Otoya discovers the internet. I haven’t seen it myself, but I’ve heard slightly glowing praise about it.

Also, a bit of a pun that might be lost in translation. When the old man passes out before he can reveal who Kiva is, he makes the sound of straining yourself, which is written down as “kivadearu”. I’ve no idea how well OZC gets that joke across.

And of course, we’ve got our main highlight of Koji Seto impersonating Otoya for the episode, even dropping spoilers for later ones (there’s a Kivat-bat the 2nd?).

Anyway, I’ve ranted long enough, here’s what I’m here for.

Ladybug Fangire

True name: Any Casino has a Drying Vanity (どのカジノも虚栄に乾いている Dono Kajino mo Kyoei ni Kawaiteiru)

Human identity: N/A

Class: Insect

Rank: Pawn

Actor: Ryusei Nakao (Frieza from Dragon Ball) (voice)

[Sh Ranger]

It was definitely humorous to see Jirou and Master get so excited about a fake autograph from a teen idol group. This episode was full of classic Inoue comedy like that though and I guess it's a nice break from the heaviness of the last few episodes. Otoya possessing Wataru isn't explained outside of the implication that the psychic summoned him, but who cares, it's perfectly chaotic!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

I’ll mention that there’s a deleted scene from this episode wherein Otoya discovers the internet. I haven’t seen it myself, but I’ve heard slightly glowing praise about it.

Oh, that's not a deleted scene. That's a scene from Episode 20.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamcastegirl

I screamed the like two times Onyanko Club get mentioned in this show. Such moments were what really made me warm to the 1986 narrative, and I really think it's wonderful whenever they ground the story in the setting like this, and it makes me faintly regretful that these moments aren't more prevalent.

I say all this like I have this grand critique of the story, but really I just like Onyanko Club, and wanted them to get mentioned more, lol.

It's a very Inoue joke, the Onyanko Club stuff. It could've just been some way for Jirou to insinuate himself into Mal d'Amour and, subsequently, W.A.K.E.U.P. Or it could've just been a way to ostracize Otoya at the start that little extra bit. But, like, no. Jirou is a legitimately card-carrying fan of Onyanko Club. He absolutely loses his chill when he thinks he's gotten an autograph from his bias. And it totally works? Hilarious, but also genuine and charming? And slightly humanizing?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

Also, a bit of a pun that might be lost in translation. When the old man passes out before he can reveal who Kiva is, he makes the sound of straining yourself, which is written down as ?€œkivadearu?€?. I?€™ve no idea how well OZC gets that joke across.

I think they get it across great? Like, it's this weirdly specific portmanteau that also serves as the linking tissue for the Otoya possession. Wataru is incredibly anxious about being Kiva right now. Kengo thinks Kiva is a rock god. Nago thinks Kiva is a mass murderer. Megumi thinks Kiva is a friend to humanity. But Kiva's really a young man who's afraid that his friends are going to find out his real identity and everything's going to change. What better time for the boy who wants to run away to have his soul literally escape his body?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

It was definitely humorous to see Jirou and Master get so excited about a fake autograph from a teen idol group. This episode was full of classic Inoue comedy like that though and I guess it's a nice break from the heaviness of the last few episodes. Otoya possessing Wataru isn't explained outside of the implication that the psychic summoned him, but who cares, it's perfectly chaotic!

See above, but also, I am totally fine with the explanation being A Wizard Did It. Why shouldn't a crazy soothsayer accidentally draw Otoya's soul forward 22 years? I don't really know how soothsaying works! That could happen on a twice-weekly basis! It might've been in the disclaimers when they booked on this guy's website!

[dreamcastegirl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Jirou is a legitimately card-carrying fan of Onyanko Club. He absolutely loses his chill when he thinks he's gotten an autograph from his bias. And it totally works? Hilarious, but also genuine and charming? And slightly humanizing?

This is what I like about the moment too, beyond the fact that I am naturally inclined towards Onyanko Club; I think it is a very fine art to add in these little human foibles to the portrayal of characters who are very notably inhuman, it grounds them and makes them believable in that we can see the connexion between us and them and that's a very powerful storytelling tactic.

And, yeah, you know, it's also really funny, agreed; it's unexpected and silly, and it works really, really well.

[DreadBringer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Oh, I see where the confusion is coming in. I was talking about the Wataru/Mami story, and you were talking about the Otoya/Mami story. Yeah, no, the Otoya stuff is zero percent Hibiki. If anything, it's more Ryuki, since I can see the exact same story happening with Kitaoka forced to teach some kid a lesson.

Yes, the 1986 story is like that part of Ryuki. "I don't like kids" and Kitaoka immediately jumped on my mind there. Both are also done by someone who constantly flirts with a hardass woman who mostly wears pants and ankle strap pumps as their primary footwear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Seems like a weird oversight from the production team. I think this is the first time Kiva's done a finisher without it being at night, either natural or supernatural?

Probably the root behind my disappointment of many KR finishers, likely budget played a hand in Kiva's finisher right here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER KIVA EPISODE 19 - “FUSION: AURA STORM”

(I am giving the Yuri And Megumi Freeze Up plot a pass in this story, even though the concept sets my teeth on edge. I desperately want to believe that they’re going somewhere worth going with this plot, so I’m holding off judgment until after 20. For this one’s part of it… I think there’s some value in showing a potential weakness for both women, especially if it’s a connection between them. I just wish part of that weakness wasn’t easy to read as Girls Shouldn’t Be Kamen Riders!)

No offense, but if you or anyone else is pulling this shit for shilling someone/something (Inoue in this case), I kinda will think that your credibility is reduced in your pursuit to give more "deserved" (if bias is involved, it can be kinda overboard instead, going likely to undeserved credit territory instead) credit to someone, not to mention of not knowing Inoue in side-medias (his TV contribution is kept on the leash by the TV production team). In this case, this is more regarding others not being given deserving credit where while what you said regarding Inoue may be right, this can be demeaning to the others instead, seemingly like personal agenda to degrade others to elevate who you defend instead of a defense (I like to hear plausible and nuanced defense of many things btw). This is something regarding clear bias before, which can happened on internet if someone has a love for something, where it can make someone be blinded regarding that, and those who had bias usually is not taken seriously (saying if you want for what you said regarding Inoue to be listened) for good reasons.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

It’s possible that my brain is too unbelievably jazzed at Otoya’s spirit possessing Wataru’s body, though. Because, THAT IDEA.

If there were no other great moments in this story, seeing Wataru play Otoya would make this episode unforgettable. The only real bum note in this episode is Otoya announcing his presence in Wataru’s body at the end, because Wataru’s actor nails Otoya’s delivery and mannerisms from the jump, and any announcement is unnecessary. The very first scene, where he’s swanning around the room and flirting with Megumi, it’s so on-point it’s deadly. I could’ve died watching that performance, and I wish the producers had been more careful in deploying it, so as to save lives. It’s as unexpected as it is excellent, and I did not know that kid had it in him. Seeing him hit those notes, after eighteen episodes of bashful anxiety, it’s epic.

The rest of the episode is full of tiny little moments of insanity, the overriding logic being What Is The Most Insane Thing That Could Happen Next. There’s a blinding pace to this story that never lets you dwell on the minor details (why were Kengo and Nago wandering through a forest?), because it’s always there to distract you with a terrific joke (Nago’s anguished plea to stop being called “Gramps” by Kengo, a man who is only one year younger than him), as well as some clever, character-based action.

I think, the new stuff of Otoya's hijinks that can be added by possessing Wataru is so far, him reacting to the new era of 2008, like being confused of people calling him Wataru, and realizing that Fangires still exist now. Otherwise it's him pulling womanizing moves so far? Like giving free pass to Megumi being accused as a thief in his house. Otoya not realizing that he possesses his son may be an indicator that Otoya... may not live long enough to raise Wataru. Before you ran into undeserved credit territory here, I'd say there are many other example in media where someone calls other who is much younger than they think as old people term like gramps or old man here, either because someone is rude or innocently insensitive. For the "dwell on the minor details", personally I'd clarify that I'm also into the part that didn't dwell on this, I think it's likely due to Nago and Keigo being more curious about Kiva that it ends with them on forest. What I don't like is spreading misinformation, and using joke as an excuse for it (like one of the ways meme is used).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

The action in this one! So great! Yuri’s multiple stand-offs with Rook (who is also back, at least in 1986!) were tense and beautifully shot, with his passive demeanor ratcheting up Yuri’s fear. Kiva’s quick take-out of the Moth Fangire, where he just walks away because the Fangire drops BUT WAIT now he’s being attacked from behind because Kiva completely forgot to do a finisher. (My assumption is that Otoya is Kiva at that point in the fight, and since no one in 1986 ever finished off a Fangire, he didn’t think he needed to do anything special to kill it.) The breathtaking (and rocking!) Megumi/Nago team-up; a fight that’s so badass that Nago completely forgets to Henshin, he’s so into kicking ass.

It's an unusual take that deserves appreciation yeah, for Otoya as Kiva walking away from a fight, but due to neglect and thus the Fangire can resume their rampage. And for Megumi and Nago teaming up, this probably relates to the fact of how Nago can stop a car with his leg. For Kengo to praise the moment as rocking... I get the vibe that Kengo is (dark trait) bloodlusted instead, thriving on violence, while refering to great moments for him as rock.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Even the stuff I was initially not too thrilled to see eventually won me over. Like, man, was not hopped up for another story where Yuri wants revenge and the boys don’t let her! Even if we can see more of Jirou’s reluctance to part with the IXA Knuckle as being about his own selfish need for vengeance (plus some paternalism), it’s still tacky to trot this plot out again. But then the episode swerves away from theat, having Otoya hilariously lift the IXA Knuckle from Jirou (while infuriating him as a bonus) to give it to Yuri so she can get her revenge. It’s a huge moment of growth from Otoya, with him letting Yuri do what she thinks is best, while doing what he can to support her. It’s a genuine moment of kindness from Otoya, and it’s best punctuated by Yuri thanking him for his help and then punching him in the stomach because he completely had that coming after knocking her out before. It’s these weird people finding little moments of empathy amidst hilarious and poignant emotional struggles.

Well, this is something not only you that isn't thrilled, and that this episode being enjoyable has to do with the opposite of it for Otoya offering Yuri to become IXA instead., I guess the Kiva being sexist claims that others do, you need to consider what they say regarding this if you think you're not thrilled. Though for the Jirou having selfish need for vengeance and becoming IXA, I guess it's rectified some time ago for IXA being incomplete and can put burden as the real reason, and that a monster is more suitable to test out IXA without it killing the wielder. Still wouldn't glorify the moral too much here for Otoya doing this to women, as womanizers care deeply about women (including them not letting woman being put on dangerous stuff, it's misguided but a form of care), but not for the rest.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

For Kengo to praise the moment as rocking... I get the vibe that Kengo is (dark trait) bloodlusted instead, thriving on violence, while refering to great moments for him as rock.

I mean, I don't think we need to read too much into it: it's two badass fighters coordinating brutal attacks on a monster. It does rock?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Though for the Jirou having selfish need for vengeance and becoming IXA, I guess it's rectified some time ago for IXA being incomplete and can put burden as the real reason, and that a monster is more suitable to test out IXA without it killing the wielder.

I think this one of those It Can Be Two Things situations. Is Jirou unwilling to give Yuri the IXA Knuckle because it could potentially kill her? Yes! Is Jirou unwilling to give Yuri the IXA Knuckle because he needs to get revenge personally on Rook for the death of his pack? Also yes! I'd argue it's a little more the former in this situation (Jirou is pretty in his own head during that scene, and it doesn't seem like he's trying to explain his views to Yuri more than he's just refusing her), but, yeah, there are a few motivations at play.

[Switchblade]

Well, this episode definitely solidified the idea that I'm in a different place mentally with this show than I was back when I first watched it. I have been low-key dreading this arc because I remember really actively hating Wataru randomly waking up one day possessed by his dad's ghost (as one so often does). I found it incredibly cringe-y at the time and I wasn't looking forward to seeing it again.

First of all, I clearly forgot some of the major details. The show actually did kind of justify it, so my big issue with the plot being completely random isn't really there. Not that this episode wasn't kind of random, but it's an Inoue comedy episode and those always have this kind of heightened reality around them to justify some of the more aggressive wackiness (side note: did that psychic die? Did Megumi and the others just leave his body there?). Second, the stuff with Koji Seto playing Otoya is mostly a lot of fun. I feel like the physical side of it is maybe a little exaggerated, but that may just be the difference in actors calling more attention to stuff that Kouhei Takeda makes look natural. Honestly, the only part of the episode that I still found kind of creepy was the maid cafe scene and that is 100% the fault of how fucking creepy Japanese fetish cafes are by nature.

The other part of the episode that stood out to me is something I had forgotten: Yuri and Megumi freezing up when they both finally get the chance to use Ixa. I can kind of rationalize it with Yuri: this is her mother's killer, she's fought him before and failed, and she was unconscious nearby both times he already proved capable of defeating Ixa. I can buy some "is this even going to work and what if it doesn't?" trepidation on her part.

Megumi is a harder sell for me. This isn't Rook or any other noteworthy Fangire, it's just some random Kabuto-ass nameless Fangire that appeared out of nowhere and has neither a human form nor personal story. And Megumi knows that Ixa works well enough that any unhinged, button-obsessed yahoo can use it to defeat a Fangire. This one definitely feels more like the show being unfair to the character.

Final comment: I will always enjoy how increasingly "Okay, I guess that kind of ties into the episode if you squint a lot" Kivat's opening trivia lines become over the course of the series.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

(side note: did that psychic die? Did Megumi and the others just leave his body there?).

Hilariously unclear! It wouldn't surprise me if a psychotic button-enthusiast, a hot-tempered fashion model/monster hunter, and a rock-obsessed Kiva fan didn't decide to just high-tail it away from a dead body. The only real variable would be Nago's whole No Sins Allowed lifestyle, but the soothsayer pretty much dropped dead of natural/"natural" causes. It's impolite to leave the dead body there, but it isn't a sin.

(Also, I love the way Nago invites himself along on the flimsiest of pretenses. Sometimes Psychics Solve Crimes is a hell of a limb to go out on, even for a superhero. I think he just wanted to hang out with the gang for this adventure?)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

Megumi is a harder sell for me. This isn't Rook or any other noteworthy Fangire, it's just some random Kabuto-ass nameless Fangire that appeared out of nowhere and has neither a human form nor personal story. And Megumi knows that Ixa works well enough that any unhinged, button-obsessed yahoo can use it to defeat a Fangire. This one definitely feels more like the show being unfair to the character.

I can see this plot being less about Megumi freezing while trying to take down a random Fangire, and more Megumi freezing while trying to use IXA to take down a random Fangire. This is where I'm really holding out hope that the conclusion to this story gives that scene some psychological context, because as is? It is not great. I want to see if there's going to be some aspect of Megumi's connection to her mother that spells out why she couldn't pull the trigger on the IXA Knuckle. I am prepared to be let down, though!

[Fish Sandwich]

This episode is where the music picks start heating up rapidly, but please try not to pay too much attention to the mysterious(?) figure on that album cover for now, Die! Because today we're talking about the Arms Monsters' theme songs, starting with the one played in this episode, Basshaa's tribute, Innocent Trap, which is, uh, a jam!

...Yeah, my descriptive powers are miserably failing me here, but this one meets all the usual criteria for a sweet Kiva song. I'd try to analyze the lyrics, since that's the one thing I ordinarily could do, but I can only kind of figure out what they're on about, which I promise is a compliment! Usually these types of insert themes are just talking up how cool whatever toy is, but Innocent Trap does it in a weirdly not straightforward way, and I appreciate how overachieving it is.

(And that piano that bookends it is obviously just amazing, of course.)

Moving on to the episode itself... is what I would say, if I weren't moving backwards here!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich

I don't know why it was looking back at this particular episode that convinced me of this, but I'm starting to guess Kiva's whole thing about connections is something I would appreciate significantly more on a rewatch in a post-Ghost world.

I remembered why! It's that the entire two-parter both starts and ends with Otoya's influence on the people who help Wataru. Before the theme song even starts in 17, we see Jirou reminding the other Monsters they can't just eat Wataru because of an unspecified promise to Otoya, which a barely conscious, injured Wataru ignorantly interprets as a dream, and the very last thing in 18 is Wataru wondering who it was that said the thing about listening to your heart, ignorant of the fact that this too was thanks to his dad. I meant to directly mention how much this bit of structure impressed me, but it slipped my mind somewhere in gushing about the show as a whole. Again, really nice set of episodes!

Actually moving on to 19, yeah, Kouji Seto makes a surprisingly killer Otoya. I think what's most impressive is how much he sounds like him simply thanks to his delivery; you'd almost expect his voice to dubbed over by Kouhei Takeda all Den-O style, and I respect that they trusted both Seto's acting and the audience's intelligence enough not to do that!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Oh, that's not a deleted scene. That's a scene from Episode 20.

No, no, rest assured, there was totally a deleted scene with Otoya using a laptop in that cafe.



(Honestly, it's not anything important or funny enough to be a huge loss, but thanks to Androzani for calling attention to it, because I might not have looked at those deleted scenes otherwise. There's also an extended version of Kiva thinking he killed that Fangire where he gives the body a little tap with his foot before walking away. It's pretty cute!)