[Switchblade]

There was something about these episodes that I really didn't like at the time. I cannot remember what it was, though. What did you say back then, past me?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

Yeah, Tsukoyomi felt really off in this episode. It's not like the show has ever done a good job of developing her personality, though, so it doesn't bother me as much as it probably should.

I liked the whole set-up with Rento, though. It's an interesting concept for a show and he felt much more fleshed out than the last two fake Riders. He really fits into the pattern of Zi-O's guest characters being more interesting than the main cast.

Valid, but not especially helpful. I want to say my beef was something with the nature of how Sougo traveled to the future. I don't know what it was, but that feels right to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreamSword

Kikai is the best Future Rider, fite me.

He's probably the best one so far, but he's not my personal favorite. That's a conversation for awhile down the road, though.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosmicrescend0

Love everything related to the "Sougo tries to cheat on his exams using his future sight, backfiring terribly" gag. The bit where Geiz chastises him on the dangers of flunking? Too good...

The funniest part to me was Geiz trying to impress upon Sougo the absolute seriousness of having to repeat a year in school.

Geiz is a Time Orphan from the Misery Fields of 2068! I didn't think he came from a place with a strong educational system? Maybe that's just one more way Oma Zi-O is a Nice Tyrant: encouraging kids to study hard or else.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchblade

I want to say my beef was something with the nature of how Sougo traveled to the future. I don't know what it was, but that feels right to me.

I sort of like the implication (or, at least, possibility) that Sougo is creating these alternate future timelines with his premonitions. I'm sure that's not where the show is going with it (feels like more of a Kiramager move?), but it works for me.

[GrandComplete]

So I forgot mention this but I love "Izanagi" the OP and I hate how progressivly shorter it gets each time. Speaking of the music the Special has it own original BGM not just stock music or reused from something else. Not only that it shocklingly do you know who composed the BGM? The same band that sang the OP!
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=...6LykRPIwyxD_d8
I've never seen that happened where the band that sang a op would also compose thr BGM or at the very least never in toku.

So one minor nitpick I have with this special and it not a knock aganist the actor but I wished that the actor who played Icchi/Hattari was the same guy Rentaro was trying to protect in Episode 17. That way it would help build off the two relationship as well as connecting back to ZI-O.

I love how we just simply reused the Dustards from Fourze no changes made! Not even simple repaint I think adds to the low budget charm of this special. Speaking of monsters the Dark Ninja is fittingly enough a retool of Another Shinobi

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrandComplete

I love how we just simply reused the Dustards from Fourze no changes made! Not even simple repaint I think adds to the low budget charm of this special.

Maybe Kamen Rider Shinobi was doing a stealth 10th Anniversary tribute to Fourze?

[TheRaizin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER ZI-O EPISODE 23 - ?IT?S KIKAI! 2121?

We?re back in Future Rider territory, and it?s a bit of a mixed bag.

Ah yes, Proto Zero-One! Or Zero-One: Bad End! Satellites, corrupted robots, a yellow Kamen Rider with red eyes? This must be the Bad End for Reiwa: The First Generation. I like his design, a really clever retool of the Guardian suit, and the gold is so nice to look at.

Now to more important things. It is very weird, coming off of the ZI-O II episode where I was all in on where ZI-O will take us, but then the next I had this bitter taste in my mouth on how they handled it. Suddenly because Sougo has new time powers, this makes Tsukuyomi doubtful and proceed to go rogue, taking Geiz with her.

??? Did she not hear what Sougo said as he transformed? It's so weird for her to do this. It kind of makes sense as to why she's wary, Sougo is growing in power and is looking very similar to Ohma ZI-O now. But it just feels odd. But oh well, it shan't take long.

Edit: slightly offtopic to the episode, but prior to a certain plot line down the line, I... may or may not have mistaken Tsukuyomi and Geiz to be siblings. They sure do act like they are!

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRaizin

Suddenly because Sougo has new time powers, this makes Tsukuyomi doubtful and proceed to go rogue, taking Geiz with her.

Yeah, it's... like I said, there's a way to do this story that I'd be into. A story where Tsukuyomi feels the walls closing in, while Geiz is the voice of caution, that could be very cool! But doing that story means building out Tsukuyomi's perspective, and finding a path to logically move her from It's Okay If Sougo Gets More Powerful all the way to Sougo Is Too Powerful And We Need To Kill Him. This story shortcuts the part you 1000% cannot shortcut, though, and it critically wounds this plot. There's just no attention paid to Tsukuyomi's viewpoint; all she does is yell at Geiz to stop believing in Sougo, and all the show does is focus on the boys' anxiety.

[Androzani84]

The one in which an emotionless superhero beats up an old person (insert Captain Marvel screenshot for comic effect)

Anyway, this week’s MiRider is a homage to Rider’s “younger brother” Kikaider, which has gained something of an inverse reputation (by which I mean, Rider is remembered as a silly show, despite being dark, while Kikaider is remembered as a dark show, despite being pretty silly).

Before my usual things, I’ll list off specific Kikaider references you might not get. (Beyond this being the same crew who did the reboot move).

Kikai’s first finisher, Kikai Da Hakai Da (lit. Kikai Will Destroy), references Kikaider’s iconic nemesis Hakkaider.

His second finisher, Fullmetal The End, references Kikaider’s main finisher, Denji End.

The bad Future setting and concept of the hero going bad are lifted from the 90s movie “Mechanical Violator Hakkaider”, albeit with none of the overt religious symbolism (the movie WAS an Inoue script).

Another Kikai being made of wood references Pinocchio, the book that inspired Kikaider to begin with (insert Aquaman screenshot for comic effect)

And last, but not least, the next show after Kikaider was Zero-One
And now, on to….

Miridewatch Playlist: I Am Justice Mix

“A metal body with a burning heart. Kamen Rider Kikai”

And the song I went with was the obvious choice of Go Go Kikaider, specifically the version from the reboot movie.

And as a bonus, a translation (I’m not aping Fish’s last comment, I planned to do this for a while)

Switch On! 1! 2! 3!

Electrical sparks rush through his body.

Jiro, change! Kikaider

Lure the DARK Robots into a trap

Jinzō Ningen Kikaider

Change, Change, Go! G-Go Go, G-Go Go



Switch On! 1! 2! 3!

He has come in his Side Machine.

Jiro, change! Kikaider

Give chase to the DARK Robots

Jinzō Ningen Kikaider

Change, Change, Go! G-Go Go
, G-Go Go



Switch On! 1! 2! 3!

The aircraft does a great swing.

Jiro, Change! Kikaider

Send the DARK Robots flying

Jinzō Ningen Kikaider

Change, Change, Go! G-Go Go
, G-Go Go



Switch On! 1! 2! 3!

Justice and evil marked by blue and red.

Jiro, change! Kikaider

Break the DARK Robots into scrap

Jinzō Ningen Kikaider

Change, Change, Go! G-Go Go
, G-Go Go

And for Another Kikai, I went with the equally obvious choice of Hakkaider no Uta

As for the compare and contrast, Rento is a machine who fights for humans to be free from their oppression at the hands of the Humanoise. Meanwhile, the stick insect is a mindless machine going around attacking people, while Heure is someone working to create a future where people are oppressed by a Demon King.

[Sh Ranger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER ZI-O EPISODE 23 - ?IT?S KIKAI! 2121?

I liked the stuff with Kikai, the same as probably everyone else. They went for a terrifically goofy late-Showa vibe to everything (Rento?s all-denim outfit! With bell bottoms!) and it was the right move. Rento himself is a stalwart defender of humanity and a friend to children, with a charming lack of guile. And as much fun as it was to see Rento walk stiffly and smile slightly unnervingly, it was equally entertaining to watch Kamen Rider Kikai full-on punch an old lady in the face. I mean, it was a killer robot old lady, but it still looked pretty funny. Really good time hanging out in 2121.

Since nobody else has brought up which Sentai actor is portraying this arc's Mirider, I guess I'll do it. Machina Rento's actor is Irie Jingi, who was previously Lupinranger's arch enemy Zamigo Delma. And when I say "previously", I literally mean last week. This episode aired on the same day as the premiere of Super Sentai Strongest Battle (a miniseries designed to push Sentai premieres from February to March), following the finale of LupinPatren. Which means Irie finished his work on that show and was then immediately cast for this role. Like sure, there's Sento and Ryuuga in Zi-O and Kaito in Donbrothers, but those are more deliberate examples. Zamigo and Rento are totally different though. Don't you think that's weird?

Regarding my opinion of Kikai, I honestly don't think he's that great. My observations in this thread tell me that's an unpopular opinion, but I'll explain so people can understand why I think that. Firstly, he's not a ninja. Secondly, the suit. The crossed wrench and screwdriver on his face and Driver look stupid, like he's some kind of robot pirate or something. Which is kind of appropriate within his story where he's a criminal to the other Humanoiz, but I maintain that it's poorly executed. Thirdly, while I could see Shinobi and Quiz as being protagonists in their own setting, I don't feel like Rento has that same protagonist quality.

2121 marks the 100th anniversary of Kikai Sentai Zenkaiger, which also has "Kikai" in the title. It also marks the 150th anniversary of Kamen Rider, hence the Showa references.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

(I don?t 100% believe in Tsukuyomi?s turn on Sougo ? she?s scared, I get that, but she is all WHY HAVEN?T YOU MURDERED SOUGO YET GEIZ in basically every scene here, without bothering to sketch out why she?s so insistent ? but I kinda loved how she?s the new Grim Executioner to Geiz?z Time Dad this episode. Geiz trying desperately to get Sougo to take his education seriously, while Tsukuyomi schemes to kill Zi-O? it?s a cute switch-up, even if half of it lacks explanation.)

Tsukuyomi is a practical person. She's more concerned with the growing threat of Zi-O's power, disregarding how Sougo chooses to apply that power for good. While Geiz is more emotional. He's had the opportunity to get to know Sougo as a person through their conflict, so he's more inclined to judge Sougo as a person. Tsukuyomi is affected by that conflict, but she's mostly an observer, so she doesn't have the important personal perspective that Geiz has. All she had was a fragile faith, which she has now given up on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

(wood is the opposite of metal, I guess)

The 機 (ki) in 機械 (kikai) is pronounced the same as 木 (ki) which means wood.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

(Woz at the end pointing out that emotionally isolating Sougo and trying to destroy him is a pretty great way to make a genocidal despot!)

Especially when you consider that Oma Sougo in his youth would have been ostracized by default, due to the lack of Geiz and anybody who would take his dream seriously.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

(feels like more of a Kiramager move?)

.... Huh, you watched Kiramager?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rei

Edit: slightly offtopic to the episode, but prior to a certain plot line down the line, I... may or may not have mistaken Tsukuyomi and Geiz to be siblings. They sure do act like they are!

I didn't think it in a literal way, but yeah, I agree they act like siblings. They may as well be, considering how their families are pretty much all dead in the future.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

And as a bonus, a translation (I?m not aping Fish?s last comment, I planned to do this for a while)

I love it! Thanks for sharing!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Thirdly, while I could see Shinobi and Quiz as being protagonists in their own setting, I don't feel like Rento has that same protagonist quality.

He'd probably need a more robust supporting cast than a typical Rider, but I think there's still potential there. Maybe some kindly brother and sister could take him in, help understand the value of protecting humanity? Maybe Rento was the name of the brother's dog? I don't know, I'm just spit-balling here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Tsukuyomi is a practical person. She's more concerned with the growing threat of Zi-O's power, disregarding how Sougo chooses to apply that power for good. While Geiz is more emotional. He's had the opportunity to get to know Sougo as a person through their conflict, so he's more inclined to judge Sougo as a person. Tsukuyomi is affected by that conflict, but she's mostly an observer, so she doesn't have the important personal perspective that Geiz has. All she had was a fragile faith, which she has now given up on.

I don't know that I see here as a particularly practical person? She's always felt like a more naturally empathetic person, as compared to Geiz'z brutal pragmatism. Like, that was always the Time Orphan dynamic: she was the Time Mom, he was the Grim Executioner. She was the one who wanted to help shepherd Sougo towards a more just and caring application of power, while Geiz was the one screaming at Sougo to destroy his Driver before it was too late.

Like, in the last episode she was telling Sougo that they weren't afraid of him becoming Oma Zi-O, even as he was accruing the very power that defined Oma Zi-O's rule. (She never seemed particularly nervous about Sougo obtaining the powers of past Riders?) I don't think Tsukuyomi's story has ever been about viewing Sougo as some Time Mission or whatever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

.... Huh, you watched Kiramager?

I've picked up bits and pieces, but it's not a show I've really sat down with.

[Sh Ranger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I don't know that I see here as a particularly practical person? She's always felt like a more naturally empathetic person, as compared to Geiz'z brutal pragmatism. Like, that was always the Time Orphan dynamic: she was the Time Mom, he was the Grim Executioner. She was the one who wanted to help shepherd Sougo towards a more just and caring application of power, while Geiz was the one screaming at Sougo to destroy his Driver before it was too late.

Like, in the last episode she was telling Sougo that they weren't afraid of him becoming Oma Zi-O, even as he was accruing the very power that defined Oma Zi-O's rule. (She never seemed particularly nervous about Sougo obtaining the powers of past Riders?) I don't think Tsukuyomi's story has ever been about viewing Sougo as some Time Mission or whatever.

Like most things, practicality is only good in moderation. Tsukuyomi's ability to express empathy is part of social aptitude, a means of keeping the peace. In her case, it's a necessary skill for steering Sougo in the right direction, in much the same way Sougo uses his innocent image to manipulate people. But her whole presence here was to prevent a bad future. She didn't befriend Sougo for the sake of being his friend.

When Tsukuyomi was telling Sougo she wasn't scared of his power, I think she was trying more to convince herself. I mean, you said yourself that she is scared. The whole moral of that Ryuki arc was accepting that everybody's capable of doing bad things. She can't plausibly claim that Sougo could never hurt a fly when she's already seen how future Sougo killed half the planet. The difference between the Time Orphans is that Tsukuyomi is concerned with what Sougo can do, while Geiz is concerned with what he will do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

I've picked up bits and pieces, but it's not a show I've really sat down with.

Cool! Take your time. There's a lot of seasons.