[Kamen Rider Die]

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Originally Posted by DreamSword

So uh, you ended up calling Akane "Akiko" multiple times in both of these past write-ups. Made me think I'd accidentally watched the wrong episodes or something.

Thanks for catching that! Their names are so similar (A-K-three more letters) that my brain didn't retain what the teen girl's name was, and Akiko being nowhere in this story didn't help me remember it.

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Originally Posted by DreamSword

You claim it's the subplot, but really, with how everything is structured, I'd argue that Kirihiko is the main spotlight for both episodes as a whole, to the point he's the one who leads off the first part proper. Even the Kids Doing Drugs PSA is there primarily as a vehicle to get him to not only show some initiative in figuring out just what the heck is going on with the Sonozakis, but also actually taking the time to observe how Kamen Rider handles the city and its people.

I suppose, and it's not like deciding which is the plot and which is the subplot is going to keep me up at night, but I think the bulk of the first part is about Double tracking down Akane, while the bulk of the second part was about Kirihiko's conscience. So, it depends on which episode we're talking about?

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Originally Posted by DreamSword

Which in turn makes the lesson less "drugs are things only bad people use" and moreso "Use drugs responsibly if you're gonna use them at all." Which in turn is a very mature message not just for a kids show, but for Japan as a whole, given how anti-drug Japan is in general.

Maybe? I'm not sure I see this show -- at this point in the run, anyway -- as viewing the distribution of Gaia Memories as anything other than a societal evil that Double needs to vanquish. While there's maybe something to be said for Shotaro "riding with the devil" by using the Double Driver, an ode to Kamen Rider's franchise-wide usage of evil to fight for justice, I just don't know if the first 18 episodes really bother to parse that nuance. Certainly this story doesn't go out of its way to discuss things like moderation or age limits or whatever, nor does anyone suggest giving Akane a Driver.

[Androzani84]

Fun Japanese language pun: The kids in this two parter intend to become a superman (Choujin), but the Memory they bought makes them a birdman (chojin).

And also, one thing that occurred to me on one of my first two watches? The reason the Sonozaki family had a spare super-powerful Memory lying around that they tested on the dupe of a husband? It was meant to go to Raito, before he was “adopted” by Shotaro.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

And also, one thing that occurred to me on one of my first two watches? The reason the Sonozaki family had a spare super-powerful Memory lying around that they tested on the dupe of a husband? It was meant to go to Raito, before he was ?adopted? by Shotaro.

Maybe? They definitely wouldn't've tested it on Raito, but I can maybe see them giving Raito the finalized version.

[DreadBringer]

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Sure, but the point in this episode is that Kirihiko has a perspective that's not that dissimilar from Shotaro's; both men care about Fuuto. Kirihiko is more than just a sneering villain or haughty foil, he's a gigantic nerd that designed the city's mascot. That's arguably tougher for Shotaro to overcome than Nazca!

Bruh I already stated well-intentioned extremist, his atrocities are done for what he thinks is best for Fuuto, but cool motive still massacre.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER W EPISODE 18 - “FAREWELL TO N - FRIENDS IN THE WIND”

I can see why – I mean, this is the last Kirihiko story, so you’re better off using it to inform the remaining antagonists for this series. While it’s neat to see Kirihiko realize the limitations of his need for power and authority, albeit in service of what he deems to be the greater good, it’s more compelling to use Kirihiko’s burgeoning conscience and/or awareness of consequences to get a better look at Wakana, Saeko, and Ryubei.

W is a series where you can't criticize any aspect of it, so this'd be may be a hot take, but I'd think that either Kirihiko's redemption is the usual rushed type to only take some inspiring speech/tips/reminder from others, or that Kirihiko isn't really redeemed - he'd still agree on his philosophies like sacrificing some people like corrupt adults, albeit not supporting Museum and Gaia Memories anymore, but he'd also do something that benefits Fuuto if the option is available to him. Drawing some line in doing atrocities (not targeting children, "don't make children cry"... but adults are ok) doesn't equal them being good. Kirihiko just doesn't live long enough to showcase this, and I always think newfound goodness is more prevalent when they live rather than getting a redemption equals death.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

The Wakana scene is the best one, both for its easy charm (Kirihiko is rightfully surprised that Wakana treats him with any affection whatsoever) and the fun twist of Wakana spreading her introspection out to other people. She’s starting to see herself outside the structure of the Museum, and she wants to give Kirihiko the chance to do the same. It’s this nice moment of someone in the Sonozaki family actually treating Kirihiko as something other than an inconvenience or an entertaining failure, and it’s terrific to see that person end up being Wakana.

In this scene, I guess this does prove Philip's evalaution of Wakana becoming "kind again" by the influence of her younger brother, because for this case, her behavior change isn't fully restricted to only Philip, with Wakana aiding the hated black sheep of the family. As Kirihiko noted, he thought she hated him before, but is now gone due to Wakana showing concern to him after saving him. Kirihiko gains an inspiration from Wakana by his question to know what she would do if she got betrayed by someone she had faith, which is to know what her true self wants, and for Kirihiko, it's to take care of Fuuto, thus he decides to help W, before bidding farewell to her and tell her that he loves her radio show, keeping all of his potential demise secret from Wakana (though she'd probably find it later in newspaper). Wakana does give good impression and buildup from ep. 13-14 two parter to this, but unfortunately IMO this sets up for a disappointment.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

The Ryubei scene ends up being a bit more exposition than character work, with Kirhiko learning about the source of the Gaia Memories (the Earth itself – I mean, it’s right there in the name, guy) as well as his own role in the schemes of the Museum. He’s been a patsy from the start, just a useful idiot that can maybe be coerced or cajoled into unlocking the Nazca Memory’s abilities, nothing more. Now that he’s topped out his potential and is almost dead, he’s got nothing left to offer the Sonozakis. Ryubei tries to murder him, but in a gleefully half-hearted It’s The Least I Can Do For My Pointless Son-In-Law kind of way.

It's confirmed too that, the family purposely bend the rule to get children using Gaia Memory, due to getting more comprehensive data, giving accelerated evolution. Ryubee also has good intentions, but would give no regards to those children's death for achieving Museum's goals. thus has lower scruples than Kirihiko, who would be ok doing that to adults but not tolerate children, and his conscience defies Ryubee here, but it's a reckless action, despite that Ryubee still explains the way to save Akane, due to another truth that Kirihiko was just a pawn to the Museum as well to peel the secrets of Nazca, that while he reached level 2 in Nazca, it's his limit and he'll die soon, and him changing to the Dopant here shortens his lifespan further, thus they'd just dispose Kirihiko, especially that he's now a thorn on their side.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Saeko, however, goes the full Femme Fatale on him, shrugging off his pleas to join him on the run by pointing out that she never loved him anyway, and also here is a giant ball of energy as an alimony settlement. (She even personally sold the Bird Memory to Akiko, twice.) It’s the final nail in an episode-length coffin, and it comes with the tease that Saeko is not content to be a lieutenant for much longer.

Kirihiko is fully nonchalant throughout his last moments yeah, but I don't know if Kirihiko somehow can see the possibility of Saeko following him while he feels Wakana hates him before. Sure before ep. 13-14 Wakana had nasty traits, but Saeko had even more so and openly shows disdain to him for his 'failures' which he tries to make up, or he's making one final chance even if he knows that he won't get it, but it's worth trying (he started his plead with "if you love me"). Not to mention, Saeko was the one doing something Kirihiko disapproves of giving Gaia Memory to children. Kirihiko's death is made in such a contrast, where he's someone who loves Fuuto and enjoying its winds, a departure of a character, replaced with a new one who declares his hate for Fuuto instead for the nasty winds.

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Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

DIE-A MEMORIES

-Meanwhile, there was also a Gaia Memory story happening, and I could not have cared less about it. It never really connects thematically with what’s going on with Kirihiko, and it’s just there to be a line that the Sonozakis crossed. Akane's addiction to enbirdening is hilarious for how unsubtle it ends up being, and none of the cast of kids felt completely fleshed out. (Touma's just A Jerk, and the other two... existed?) I definitely preferred what was going on with Kirihiko to what was going on with Akane and her need to become a bird again.

Toku gotta being toku to have Monster/Victim of the Week and stick to a simple formulaic format. Straying from that can be controversial even. Other than that, what can I say is that, for targeting Akane's rival in track and field, it's a bad consequence of genuine friendship to treat non-friends as lesser beings you can harm for friends' gain. The connection would be about Museum's intention for accelerated evolution, where it's shown that even as human, Gaia Memory users would receive some buff in physical stats, improving Akane's track and field capabilities. Shotaro shows more tolerance to the kids, by blaming the ones who gave her the Bird Memory utilizing youth's cluelessness with Akiko consoling her as well, then pitying her as she sleeps in the bed (with her boots taken off, good as usual for Japan media, unlike for something much later on you'd watch).

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Bruh I already stated well-intentioned extremist, his atrocities are done for what he thinks is best for Fuuto, but cool motive still massacre.

Where did I ever say otherwise? I can definitely stop responding, if you think I'm intentionally misconstruing your statements.

[Kamen Rider Die]

KAMEN RIDER W EPISODE 19 - “I WON’T STOP - HIS NAME IS ACCEL”



Nothing about Terui’s debut should work.

He arrives as the coolest cat. He knows everything about the cast, and belittles them constantly. He’s hard-boiled in exactly the ways Shotaro pretends to be. He’s a leather-clad badass that everyone in the supporting cast swoons over, and the show never stops giving him opportunities to be awesome, mostly at the expense of Double.

And yet!

And yet, this is such a relentlessly fun debut for one of the best Rival Secondaries in all of Kamen Rider. Terui’s consistent highlighting of Team Double’s many, many failings ends up just making them more endearing. (Philip picked a perfect time to wear a Saint Bernard onesie, and I can understand Shotaro’s frustration.) He’s a perfect foil for Shotaro, in a way that Kirihiko maybe never could be. Kirihiko was, at heart, an incredibly earnest dork that had no sense of morality; he’s sappy and sentimental, just like Shotaro. Meanwhile, Terui is grim and focused, with a psychotic aversion to being questioned and a bloodthirsty vendetta to pursue. He’s there to understand Team Double, and harness them into a weapon that he alone can and should wield. Terui is Not Here To Make Friends, and he is amazing at it.

It’s an episode that’s almost entirely about seeing how Terui fits into the dynamic – mostly by being an unhinged, spiteful lunatic, but in a good way – but it still manages to craft an intriguing mystery. It’s one that leans heavy on assumptions and circumstantial evidence, which is sort of the perfect case to run alongside Terui’s debut. Team Double gets judged unfairly by Terui, and Terui is afforded an amount of leeway due to his presence and credentials that turn out, by the end, to be a huge miscalculation. Y’know, what with him about to murder a normal human being.

Before that, though, we get the requisite Showcase Battle for a new Rider or Form, and Accel’s is pretty great. Terui has one of my franchise favorite pronunciations of Henshin (“Hen…” he gives himself a hernia “...shin!”), and Accel’s design is absolutely gorgeous. The “A” on the helmet does a lot to tie his design into Double’s, even if Motorcycle Man is not the natural visual partner to Half-and-Half Crimefighter. (Even the Acceldriver misses the letter template of the Lost Driver and Double Driver! It’s just a handlebar!) I love the glossy red of that suit, and Accel has one of the most relentlessly badass victory catchphrases imaginable. (I’ve seen it parsed a bunch of different ways from a variety of subbing groups, but OZC-Live has it as “Despair is waiting for you on the other side of the finish line.”) The whole sequence of him becoming Accel and demolishing the Dopant is as good as it should be, considering the hype to get to it.

This whole episode is a colossally fun payoff to the Accel hype train. Terui both negs the hell out of this series, and manages to show us why he’s only the secondary. He’s the thing that Shotaro pretends to be, and even wants to be, but Shotaro’s inherent empathy and kindness are why we’re following his story of justice and protection, instead of Terui’s story of isolation and vengeance. Terui's incredibly cool, but he’s not our guys.

—

DIE-A MEMORIES



-I’m pretty sure I had the opposite reaction to Terui’s debut originally. I’m fairly confident I found his wall-to-wall negativity and stern rebukes of having fun to be an eye-rolling buzzkill, much like Shotaro and Philip do. Now, I don’t know… I think he’s got a point? Like, Team Double are a joke, and he doesn’t find it particularly funny. I’m now a fan of the this new dynamic!

-Terui is the one guy so far where I wasn’t like They Were All So Young Once. He kind of looks the same in Revice as he looks here, which is unreal. Dude has to share his skincare regimen!

-Hey, Shroud makes her first appearance. I’m… really hoping I like Shroud better on a rewatch.

[DreamSword]

Accel's' eye lens should be green.

[DreadBringer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Where did I ever say otherwise? I can definitely stop responding, if you think I'm intentionally misconstruing your statements.

I guess the "Kirihiko is more than just a sneering villain" part, with it emphasized by "both men care about Fuuto" before, sounds like it to me, sounds like painting me as diminishing him as "sunday cartoon villain" or such, but dunno if I also got it wrong and too accusing - it can often happen that to call those not doing something for the sake of malice as bad means diminishing them as "sneering villain" or its synonym.

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreamSword

Accel's' eye lens should be green.

Disagree!

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Originally Posted by DreadBringer

I guess the "Kirihiko is more than just a sneering villain" part, with it emphasized by "both men care about Fuuto" before, sounds like it to me, sounds like painting me as diminishing him as "sunday cartoon villain" or such, but dunno if I also got it wrong and too accusing - it can often happen that to call those not doing something for the sake of malice as bad means diminishing them as "sneering villain" or its synonym.

I'm honestly not sure what we're even talking about anymore, but I'm just going to say this: the point of 17 and 18 as a story is to play off of noir storytelling -- that good people can do bad things, and bad people can do good things. Kirihiko's a complicated guy, and that's about it.

[Enchilada645]

So I'll comment on the next two episodes once we get to them... but...

Let's talk about Kirihiko's Swan Song episodes, because they really were a fantastic closure to his character (in which I'll be very annoyed later on for certain reasons) and while I wish we could've spent more time with this version of Kirihiko, it's still a incredible end point for him.

This really is our major turning point in the show, even more so than the Arms/Fang episodes. We see Kirihiko while part of the Sonozaki family, is still sort of just there when it comes to the more intimate matters. So him slowly discovering things, like Shotaro as W alongside him trying to "earn his place" was fun to witness build up. And of course we get the climax of that where we see him confront Ryubei.

It also really says a lot on how Wakana seemingly didn't care for Kirihiko, and yet they probably have one of my favorite conversations in the show. The two leave on rather well-liked terms! There's just something so nice about him telling her that he loved her show and her just genuinely smiling after that.

I am sad that Kirihiko had to go so soon. My thoughts aren't even on a 'Kamen Rider Nazca' as everyone was one to jump for back in the day and even now. I just thought it would have been fun to see Kirihiko as Nazca appear occasionally every now and again while being a Dopant ally. He'd only show up sporadically, whether it be hiding or the fact that his body's failing him, before he'd end up more than likely succumbing to Nazca's side effects. Nazca's such a good suit, and it's a shame that it gets shelved this early given it's my favorite of the Sonozaki commander Dopant suits. Smilodon's a close second though.

The Bird Dopant plot was rather nice, while it didn't grab me as much, it was the main connecting tissue for this story about Kirihiko. But also it's incredible to see just how more wild Gaia Memories are able to get. We've seen it with Virus, but now we get something wilder with Bird and its multiple users alongside evolution mid-battle. The emphasis on Gaia Memories being drugs though does let me bring up a point I never brought up but thought was a cool thing. And that's how usually when a Gaia Memories ejected, the user has shadows underneath their eyes as if they haven't slept in weeks. Always thought that was a neat touch.

That being said, it's time, well, not to ask questions but to witness our Secondary's Debut. And speaking of him I honestly forgot at how built up he was. Like not even taking into account Movie War 2010's cameo, we get the Kabuto Phone, which I forgot existed, alongside mentions of a new hotshot joining the police. It's small little hints, but it's honestly fun to see.