[EnerPrime]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suzu

While I'd agree here on the technical side, this wouldn't work on a story base. Mach and Drive both decided they wouldn't use density shift anymore.

I figure that's mostly becuse density shift gives no tactical advantage against Roidmudes, so for them it only serves to freak out humans. Against a foe that isn't immune to density shifts, do you really think Gou would hold back from using one?

Quote:

Originally Posted by AgileSiamang7

When exactly was it stated that other speedsters couldn't just power through a Density Shift? I mean, wasn't Drive solution to that bullshit Heavy Density Shift to just get faster? ( and by the way, we've never seen the Roidmudes use again, even though Mach doesn't have that immunity, so they could upgrade another Roidmude (now that Chase switched sides) and target Mach with that). Booster still has the advantage of flight, and Trial still has access to the sword, so any extra damage he may need he can use one of his finishers using Engine to even the fight.

No, it's the shift cars that let Riders negate density shift. They don't just speed through them. Yes, Accel Trial would still be able to move under density shift, but he would lose his speed advantage. He would not be able to keep up with Mach's ability to go the speed of sound. And without his speed, Accel Trial is explicitly said to be weaker than Accel in all other aspects.

Booster doesn't even factor in once density shift is in play. It has no super speed, so using it just makes him an easy target for Mach. Same with the Engine Blade. What use is a sword against someone who is faster than you and using a gun?

[Suzu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnerPrime

Against a foe that isn't immune to density shifts, do you really think Gou would hold back from using one?

Considering that they decided not to use it because they don't want to be like the Roidmudes: Yes, I think he wouldn't use it.

[AgileSiamang7]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnerPrime

I figure that's mostly becuse density shift gives no tactical advantage against Roidmudes, so for them it only serves to freak out humans. Against a foe that isn't immune to density shifts, do you really think Gou would hold back from using one?



No, it's the shift cars that let Riders negate density shift. They don't just speed through them. Yes, Accel Trial would still be able to move under density shift, but he would lose his speed advantage. He would not be able to keep up with Mach's ability to go the speed of sound. And without his speed, Accel Trial is explicitly said to be weaker than Accel in all other aspects.

Booster doesn't even factor in once density shift is in play. It has no super speed, so using it just makes him an easy target for Mach. Same with the Engine Blade. What use is a sword against someone who is faster than you and using a gun?

Drive has the Handle Ken, which he can use without inserting a Shift Car to let it move uninhibited by a Density Shift. He's done just fine against Roidmudes with laser fingers when just using his sword, and Engine Blade has ranged attacks thanks to Jet and Steam. As for beating a speedster in general...



Speedsters tend to be cocky bastards, if using speed is their default. Let's not pretend that is most of the fights we seen Mach actually uses his speed that much, in comparison to Trial. Terui's just got to wait till Gou chooses to get up close again, since he does like getting physical as much as does blasting his opponents, and then stab him.

Also, it's not been shown just how badly Density Shift would affect Trial, though I'll give you that if Mach went Dead Heat, he'd definitely out-speed Terui.

This is all of course assuming Gou uses such a cheap tactic to begin with. Even when he was acting like a ass, recently, he didn't use this to try to get the jump on Chase or Shinnosuke.

[vin13ish]

I am fanfic writer and i might write Kamen Rider Fanfic where the concept is Kamen Rider Riders meet Men in Black/Kingsman but my question is what's would their secret headquarter look like?

[EnerPrime]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suzu

Considering that they decided not to use it because they don't want to be like the Roidmudes: Yes, I think he wouldn't use it.

You're assuming Gou actually listened to Shinnosuke. We havn't really seen Gou in another situation where a density shift would help him but he refused to use it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AgileSiamang7

Speedsters tend to be cocky bastards, if using speed is their default. Let's not pretend that is most of the fights we seen Mach actually uses his speed that much, in comparison to Trial. Terui's just got to wait till Gou chooses to get up close again, since he does like getting physical as much as does blasting his opponents, and then stab him.

Also, it's not been shown just how badly Density Shift would affect Trial, though I'll give you that if Mach went Dead Heat, he'd definitely out-speed Terui.

The thing is, once you can outspeed (or even equal in speed) Trial it's all over for Terui. The whole point of Trial is that it's weak as hell, but the speed makes up for it. Seriously, if you believe the 'official' strength stats from the series websites, a Kurokage Trooper packs more of a punch in a single blow than Trial. Even if Accel Trial did manage to lend a blow on DeadHeat Mach with superior thinking, it wouldn't be anywhere near enough to knock Mach out of the fight. And let's be honest, Terui's not a tactical thinking kind of fighter, he's a 'get angry and try to hit harder' kind of fighter.

Quote:

This is all of course assuming Gou uses such a cheap tactic to begin with. Even when he was acting like a ass, recently, he didn't use this to try to get the jump on Chase or Shinnosuke.

Chase is a Roidmude and Shinnosuke carries shift cars wherever he goes. Using density shift on them would do nothing but give them advance warning and/or make Shin angry at him for using it. Again, I've seen nothing in the show that makes me think Gou would hold back on density shift if he was in a situation hwere it would actually help him.

[Suzu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnerPrime

You're assuming Gou actually listened to Shinnosuke.

Ehhhh, yes? Because aside from the whole "I don't like Chase"-thing, that's what he did for a fair amount of episodes?

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnerPrime

Chase is a Roidmude and Shinnosuke carries shift cars wherever he goes. Using density shift on them would do nothing but give them advance warning and/or make Shin angry at him for using it. Again, I've seen nothing in the show that makes me think Gou would hold back on density shift if he was in a situation hwere it would actually help him.

At which part of the show are you again?

[SanoBaron]

we all are forgetting to mention that Terui was able to fight off the Trigger dopant without being able to turn into Accel, along with the fact that he used his sword that you know, is so heavy that it breaks up the pavement under it when he drags it on the ground.

[Kamen Rider Vega]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SanoBaron

we all are forgetting to mention that Terui was able to fight off the Trigger dopant without being able to turn into Accel, along with the fact that he used his sword that you know, is so heavy that it breaks up the pavement under it when he drags it on the ground.

Truth actually why is his sword so heavy to begin with? Kiva's zanvat sword was about the same length and was made by fangires yet wataru could hold it without turning into kiva.

[ElConvoy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Vega

Truth actually why is his sword so heavy to begin with? Kiva's zanvat sword was about the same length and was made by fangires yet wataru could hold it without turning into kiva.

The way it is presented in the show and given its name is Engine Blade it was probably made out of an engine and weighs around the same.

[Suzu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Vega

Truth actually why is his sword so heavy to begin with? Kiva's zanvat sword was about the same length and was made by fangires yet wataru could hold it without turning into kiva.

Lighter material, I guess? Also fantasy sword vs. technology sword?