[Mesnick]

Quote:

Originally Posted by r4bbitdragon

I think people have generally tried to be hopeful about Reiwa, about it being an upgrade for Rider's female characters? How true that is series to series under close examination is it's own matter, but at least visually: hey! It's basically standard the tertiary rider is a Girl now! Big win for Women, right?

I really think a lot of viewers overestimate the importance of the belt to women and characters in general.
Firstly, there are now more rider characters than civilian ones, so the belt is not of particular value.
Secondly: the fate of the tertiary rider, starting with Gills, is a series of suffering, and most often even without much reward in the final. In principle, Kento is a vivid example of this (if I don?t spoil the Saber finale).
Thirdly: the best female characters in the franchise were either not riders (Akari, Ozawa, Sawatari, Hirose, Akiko, the entire Fourze Rider Club), or they were loved for things not related to being a rider (I don?t think many here can name a favorite fight Poppy, right?)
And fourthly, no matter how ridiculous it may sound, for the first time we got a woman of a tertiary rider back in Faiz. In fact, it seems to me that at the beginning of the 2000s, the situation developed quite well for female riders, slowly, but in the right direction. And then something stalled on Kabuto.

[weedle013ZiO]

I made Sokichi Shotaro’s dad for my adaptation, thus making Akiko Shotaro’s sister. XD

[Sh Ranger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Ryoga is also someone who has unyielding loyalty to SoL though. So I guess, what'd make Rintaro's a heroic quality is his conscience that he follows, while Ryoga has none of that to be devoted to SoL's cause no matter how dark actually it is. He'd follow their darkest goals without second thoughts, making him someone who can't be reasoned or bargained with.

I think the main difference between them is that Ryouga is loyal to the letter of SOL, while Rintarou is loyal to the spirit of SOL. Ryouga follows orders without question, as he believes that Master Logos' will is inherently just and doubt is weakness. Rintarou was also conditioned by his upbringing to believe that, but as brought up in Surprise Future, it's a contradiction to think that having no doubt is the same as believing more. That's merely subservience. Rintarou's doubt gives meaning to his belief, since he cares about SOL for the principles it stands for and that makes his actions more honest.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesnick

My people have a saying: "If you see the word "sex" in the questionnaire and just indicate your gender, then everything is okay. If you have other thoughts about this, then the problem is not in the questionnaire, but in you." But yes, the media has a long history of flirting with shippers, including very deviant ones. But, again, this indicates a problem in society (or even humanity as a whole) rather than in a particular work. Do not bring such topics money, they would be remembered once in a hundred years, and then by accident.

I agree that some fault lies with the viewers who infer however they want through their own biases. We're probably all guilty of that, to varying extents. However, the work also has a responsibility to depict characters and morals carefully, to prevent spreading misconceptions about things that could be potentially harmful IRL (which I think Kinoshita is especially problematic for this). Of course, yeah, when it comes to deviant shippers, they're probably going to do it regardless, if they already have the bias for it. Nevertheless, the work inadvertently validating that behavior doesn't help though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER SABER EPISODE 30 - ?FOREVER CONNECTED, EVEN WHEN APART?

And, y?know, your mileage may vary on how successful this episode is at digging into the toxicity of these types of stories. It?s indulging in tropes specifically to dispute them, but it?s still indulging in them. I really appreciated how it tried to say something about how much we should valorize the men who bravely reorient narratives onto their emotional suffering, though. It?s easy to feel bad for Rintaro, which, sadly, makes it easier to forget about Mei.

Yeah, my experience with the Neko episodes is kind of similar to what you're describing here. Like, what you said before about the Yeti episodes, where the best MOTW plots are those that impose a choice on their hosts, I think that's even more noticable here now that it's one of the main characters and one who is otherwise very proactive in how she forces herself in to SOL's business and proves to be an invaluable asset to the team. Honestly, how did Zooous even get in to the Northern Base infirmary to throw a book at her?!

Considering the prominent knight motif of Kamen Rider Saber, I guess it's not surprising that the stereotypical Save Princess From Castle trope would come up eventually, with Neko being the figurative castle. While it's definitely doing some smart things with Rintarou, like how he's approaching the task of saving Mei with the same obsession that Kento approached defeating Kamijo and how he's ignorant to how much Mei values his life that he considers so expendable. The downside is that Mei doesn't have much autonomy here. Not a totally bad episode, but yeah, could've been handled a little better.

Weirdly, the Nekomata episodes of Ninninjer were some of the worst in that show as well. I love cats, but damn, Tokusatsu's really trying to make me hate them sometimes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by r4bbitdragon

Which ends up not looking great for Saber, the notable exception. And it's not just lacking a female tertiary that clouds Saber's handling of women, but the actual female characters are largely... well. When we finally get Reika as a female rider, she immediately gets derailed to (weirdly) fawn over her brother. Sophia gets kidnapped (due to actor obligations, but) with barely an impact on the narrative for ages. Luna... is not a character! She really just exists as motivation.

I mean, would I like Mei to be a Rider? Sure, I was always hoping for MeiEspada to be a thing. But before being a Rider, I agree that it's more important to be a good character. Which is why, despite being the exception to the Reiwa Rider heroines, she's still my favorite. Being a Rider is more like a bonus, but what she contributes to SOL as the brave and resourceful Sudo Mei, that's what I care about the most.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

In all honesty, the most I remember from this episode was the whole ?Mei turns into a Cat Megid? beat. To the point I actually wrote a one shot for it which soon devolved into its own AU. I should really finish it sometime.

Mei-gido

There's always a risk of decanonization when it comes to writing fanfic for ongoing works, but you know, I think it's a risk worth taking!

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by r4bbitdragon

Mei, at least, breaks the doom and gloom by being generally a delight. She's got energy, she's got spunk! Love to have her around!

A lot of it is that Mei's actor is just incredibly clever, though. There're times with the show where Mei's contribution to an episode is Asking The Doctor To Explain The Plot (to put it in terms of another franchise), rather than anything that highlights her skillset or perspective, but the actor manages to give it enough fun angles that you don't really notice how unnecessary the character's inclusion is. Like, she's got this great way of cheerfully asking for clarification, when she really wants to be yelling at some of these dopes for their unhelpful rules and lack of cohesion. She's an actor that's consistently finding fun stuff to do to plus up her scenes, and it's a shame that this episode sort of left her out to dry for a big stretch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Androzani84

Mei-gido

Terrific pun!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesnick

And then some viewers may perceive it as a satire, while others directly, depending on their preferences. Perhaps there is something similar here.

Yeah, I think it depends on how much of the benefit of the doubt you want to give the producers. I choose to think the writers are hanging a lantern on how much Rintaro makes this dilemma about his own need to improve, but I can understand if others just see it as the episode falling prey to some disappointing stories about women as prizes/goals/objects.

Quote:

Originally Posted by weedle013ZiO

I made Sokichi Shotaro?s dad for my adaptation, thus making Akiko Shotaro?s sister. XD

Ha ha, I love it! Akiko works way better as Shotaro's sister.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh Ranger

Honestly, how did Zooous even get in to the Northern Base infirmary to throw a book at her?!

The last time we see her in this episode before she's a Megid is when she's at the bookshop, which isn't covered (I believe?) by Sophia's shield. I assume that Zooous just nabbed her there.

[Sh Ranger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

The last time we see her in this episode before she's a Megid is when she's at the bookshop, which isn't covered (I believe?) by Sophia's shield. I assume that Zooous just nabbed her there.

I just verified it and yeah, you're right. I must've got those two rooms mixed up, as I don't recall seeing Fantastic Kamiyama from that angle before, so it kind of looked similar to the infirmary at first glance.

[Fish Sandwich]

Fish Sandwich also watched Kamen Rider Saber Episode 30

Rintarou is like, the absolute least Rintarou he's ever been in this episode, and that made it a pretty interesting chapter as the thing right after he's finally joined back up with everyone. There are a lot of really clever things this episode does with how much it deliberately calls back to earlier versions of the status quo, only to emphasize how things are still very different right now anyway. Yuri bails on the story early on, seemingly making way for a classic Saber/Blades team-up that just is not happening today, and of course the whole Megid plot is right out of that period early in the second quarter. Which, you know, was the formula they started busting out when they wanted to slow things down and really take their time making it clear where everyone stands at a given moment, which I think was well warranted here. I appreciated how Rintarou reintegrating himself into the dynamic doesn't just happen overnight, and the very inward-focused drama combined with Ishida being the director meant this episode about an agitated, screaming Blades ended up being shockingly enjoyable for me.

[DreadBringer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

KAMEN RIDER SABER EPISODE 30 - “FOREVER CONNECTED, EVEN WHEN APART”

The beats of the story… not that great? We’ve got our reformed SoL (minus a wandering Ren), complete with Sophia at her post, and it all gives an air of Q1 storytelling: the Book Club are doing some vague scheme, Touma and Rintaro are buddying up for the potential save, the Southern Base is nowhere to be found, and Zooous wants to brawl with Blades. It’s a little formulaic, basically mashing up an early episode’s weightless Megid plot with a more recent Megid Has A Grudge Against A Swordsman plot. There’s a little bit of additional juice from how much the cast is firing on all cylinders, but the structure here is nothing to rave about.

When Rintaro rejoined the cast, actually I'd hope that the cast forgives Rintaro by explaining that they want Rintaro to see the light but they're glad now he listens to it, as they try to explain the truth of SoL for his own well-being, not to win arguments or something. Ren continues to display his terrible trait here by attacking Ogami who convinces him to join them, and his rejection shows that he doesn't really care about SoL's spirit, only about Kento. The Megid plot has a chance for the remaining 2 for getting better story treatments, unlike Legeiel who already died. But well, there's a new incoming villain in Master Logos.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

The thing that makes it work, though, is how it’s both a story about two dudes needing to save some lady, and a subversion of that type of story. It’s about Rintaro Needing A Win, to the detriment of Mei’s actual personhood, but it’s also highly critical of stories about men needing to salvage their self-confidence while a woman is in peril.

Like, the thing I love about this otherwise-problematic story (Mei’s more or less off the table as a character after the opening, which, as a Mei fan? NO THANKS!) is that it’s hyper-aware of the optics on this, and leans into it in order to subvert that trope. The point of this story is that Rintaro, for all of his caring about Mei, is only thinking of himself here, and therefore can’t possibly be the hero this story needs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by r4bbitdragon

But... she /is/ in that more traditional supporter/helper role. And then times like this, when she gets damseled to further Rintaro's despair during this arc for him... Eh. Even Saber's Best Gal can't quite escape, huh...?

Yeah, this kind of story mei have toxic implications, but sometimes, the view to counteract that is a woman being portrayed as anythlng less than the impossible image of "strong" where they can't ever show any kind of weakness or vulnerability (Reika pre-Ryoga, and many other female Riders tbh) is the only way of portrayal that acknowledges their worth as equal. Thus I'd think that, any kind of character should be permitted in story, including the ones who are more normal thus can't contribute more (outside of this too, there are handful who deem Mei as useless).

The idea that a female character (or any character period) that aren't physically strong and does not physically fight means they're treated like shit should stop. The notion that women should never need saving, even in war and crime fiction is ludicrous, it swings the pendulum too far in the other direction and creates the problem of only showcasing women who are physically fit, or butch, or masculine.

The “damsel in distress” trope is only harmful when that aspect of the character is all there is to the character. If the writers take into account for their backstory, feelings, struggles, and development, that doesn't mean she’s a faceless prop just being used for male empowerment. she’s still a person who happens to not fight. People come in all shapes, sizes, temperaments, and ideologies.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Rintaro, from the first scene, is completely in his own head. He feels ashamed at his actions that inadvertently supported villainy, and longs to prove himself to his friends. He needs to prove himself. When Mei’s in danger, he needs to save her. When he begs Touma to save her, he needs to feel the worthlessness of not being able to save her. This is a story where Rintaro reframes Mei’s peril as a story about his own redemption and/or suffering, which keeps him from being either effective as a swordsman, or helpful as a friend.

Actually, this is what's contradictory about Rintaro in previous part, where he chastises Kento for getting too emotional and thus he's not worthy to be an SoL member. You think that Rintaro's current state is conditional, but as Rintaro's someone who can't socialize well, Rintaro's also someone who can't handle or express his emotions well. Though at the very least, Rintaro doesn't buy on Mei-gido, a.k.a Neko Megid's gaslighting on him by playing Mei as someone who won't acknowledge the worth except for those who are perfect, I mean in his view of Mei, but it does make him view himself as a failure. Obviously for Mei herself, she doesn't like the fact that she's the one directly hurting people, and her not being ok is not due to her current situation, but what the situation makes her do something she's unwilling to do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by r4bbitdragon

Which ends up not looking great for Saber, the notable exception. And it's not just lacking a female tertiary that clouds Saber's handling of women, but the actual female characters are largely... well. When we finally get Reika as a female rider, she immediately gets derailed to (weirdly) fawn over her brother. Sophia gets kidnapped (due to actor obligations, but) with barely an impact on the narrative for ages. Luna... is not a character! She really just exists as motivation.

Yeah, it's a disservice about Reika being reduced to only Ryoga worshipper. But though, it seems that female Riders at this point are mostly only made up by the ones who exhibit stereotypical "tough" personalities like being cold, aggressive, aloof, ruthless, etc. Straight-up good females like Poppy and Tsukuyomi aren't significant Riders even if they're significant characters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by r4bbitdragon

Mei, at least, breaks the doom and gloom by being generally a delight. She's got energy, she's got spunk! Love to have her around!

Not dismissing her charms, but well dunno about if this'd seem as if that everything be very wild, wacky, overtop, larger than life, exaggerated, laugh out loud, in your face wide-angle lenses. Like, characters being more normal and grounded are also ok.

[weedle013ZiO]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamen Rider Die

Ha ha, I love it! Akiko works way better as Shotaro's sister.

I genuinely was not expecting that to work. I could have details on the next series In the OOO adaptation, the Izumi siblings (Shingo survives the first episode, and is changed to female for reasons) both get Rider forms, using two Medals each, and sharing the same belt design. (Ankh also has his full Greeed body from the start, and can take human form like the other Greeed can, without needing a host [I don’t know how the other Greeed take human forms that suit them tho])

The sisters both use a predatory animal for the top half, and a prey animal for the bottom half.

Fem!Shingo’s default is a fox and a rabbit, and is blue on a black bodysuit (With the addition of white, it would match the Rabbit Miraculous watch, amusingly enough)

Hina’s default is pink on white, but I have no idea which pair would be used for that one.

My clue is "Violent Predators and Violent Preys for Hina, Rational Predators and Rational Preys for Shingo"

Tsukuyomi is a Rider from the start of the Zi-O adaptation as well (I also introduced another female Rider for contrast, lol)

[Kamen Rider Die]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish Sandwich

I appreciated how Rintarou reintegrating himself into the dynamic doesn't just happen overnight, and the very inward-focused drama combined with Ishida being the director meant this episode about an agitated, screaming Blades ended up being shockingly enjoyable for me.

It's an episode where the entire cast is like PHEW and Rintaro's like UMM, which is bound to generate some compelling drama. Rintaro's warmth and stability is a thing the entire cast sort of takes for granted here, and the only one who'd normally pick up on Rintaro's emotional deterioration -- Mei -- is taken off of the board. This show really doesn't like shortcuts in its emotional developments, which is nice!

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadBringer

Ren continues to display his terrible trait here by attacking Ogami who convinces him to join them, and his rejection shows that he doesn't really care about SoL's spirit, only about Kento.

Yeah, it'll be interesting to find out what the show wants to say about Ren. Lot of different directions that kid could go in!

Quote:

Originally Posted by weedle013ZiO

I genuinely was not expecting that to work. I could have details on the next series In the OOO adaptation, the Izumi siblings (Shingo survives the first episode, and is changed to female for reasons) both get Rider forms, using two Medals each, and sharing the same belt design. (Ankh also has his full Greeed body from the start, and can take human form like the other Greeed can, without needing a host [I don?t know how the other Greeed take human forms that suit them tho])

The sisters use a predatory animal for the top half, and a prey animal for the bottom half.

Fem!Shingo?s default is a fox and a rabbit, and is blue on a black bodysuit (With the addition of white, it would match the Rabbit Miraculous watch, amusingly enough)

Hina?s default is pink on white, and I have no idea which two would be used for that one.

My clue is "Violent Predators and Violent Preys for Hina, Rational Predators and Rational Preys for Shingo"

Sounds very fun! Thanks for sharing!

[Kamen Rider Die]

KAMEN RIDER SABER EPISODE 31 - “THE STRENGTH TO BELIEVE, AND THE STRENGTH TO BE BELIEVED IN”



Secondaries, am I right?

It’s the toughest gig in Kamen Ridering, probably. You have power, and goals, and sometimes a touch of ambition, but the entire narrative is oriented to diminish what you accomplish. You’re a sidekick at best, a late-stage adversary at worst. The story is only about you to the extent that you complement the main character’s journey. It can never really be your story.

But, like, that’s life? We all feel like the main characters of our stories, but this is a world with billions of main characters. Sometimes our story is about helping other people, letting them attain their true potential, and giving the support necessary to excel. It’s okay to be the person in the background sometimes. Not everything has to be about us.

It’s a nice lesson, in this concluding chapter of what would otherwise be Rintaro’s heroic self-actualization. He’s a happier, healthier version of himself for acknowledging the strength of the other two characters in this story: Touma and Mei.

From Touma, he learns to never give up on himself, even when it seems like he’s pretty much there to eat shit while someone else gets the win. Setbacks don’t mean you’re weak; giving up after a setback means you’re weak. As long as you’re willing to put in the effort, there’s still a chance for victory.

From Mei, he learned that having a good attitude is a multiplier for any group. Everyone does their best work when they’re in the trenches with friends, so providing a friendly atmosphere is a strength that even a non-swordsmen member of the Sword of Logos can provide. Mei’s just as strong as the rest of the team, because she helps them all stay positive and happy. There’s strength in that kind of positivity.

It’s a very sweet little story about positive thinking, and accepting the support of people around us, which is a neat recurring topic for this series. This thing could’ve easily been a story where Rintaro gets strong and Finds His Conviction and single-handedly saves Mei while Touma cheers him on from the sidelines… but it just refused to take the easy way out. Instead, we get this fun three-hander about how the effectiveness of any team is down to how much they can lift each other up, rather than how strong each member is. Such a great twist on this sort of traditional Secondary story.

—

KICK JUMP TWIST



This stupid guy. Of all the villains that she could’ve been abducted by, it had to be the worst one.

Legeiel was a smug jerk, but at least he was sort of cool about it. Handsome, too. Sure, he was weirdly obsessed with Touma; and sure, he got turned into an immolating version of himself thanks to forbidden magics; but there was at least a professionalism about him in the early days. 3 out of 5 stars.

Storious… okay, the long strand of hair is not great. It’s super distracting, and it’s… it’s just sort of there? He could braid it, or put some jewelry in it. Just, something, instead of hanging there limply. Otherwise, he was fairly innocuous as apocalyptic villains went. Goal-oriented, which was easier to deal with mentally.

This guy, though. God.

Zooous was her least favorite, by a mile. Putting aside all the crap he’d pulled with Rintaro – which was a major mark against him, don’t get her wrong – he was just a complete tool. The stupid sleeveless vest, even in the dead of winter. The goofy hair. And the parkour.

God, the parkour.

He’d never take two steps forward if he could take two flips backwards and three flips forward instead. It was bad enough that she was being slowly devoured by a magic book, forced to live in eternal suffering as a link between the real world and an alternate dimension of storybook magic… but this guy was just making it torture.

He flipped through the alley again, after his most recent nonsensical threat (oh, he was also an idiot, she forgot to mention that), and she watched him cackle like a doofus at his own theatricality. It was a nightmare, hanging around this guy. He’d already destroyed her sense of optimism at being saved by Touma and Rintaro; now, he was destroying her will to live.

She hoped that she could be saved, but she was praying to be put out of her misery.

Zooous saw her pain, and did another backflip.